HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Are the Oilers tough enough?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-17-2013, 09:23 PM
  #51
alanschu
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,224
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by harpoon View Post
No. harpoon wants to discuss team toughness, the topic of this thread.
And harpoon wants the back to back to back TOI leader on this team to not skate away into a corner anytime there is a physical confrontation going on.
Discussing upgrading our 2nd line center to inject additional toughness into our top 6, since the person was concerned about the toughness in our top 6, seems valid.

Perhaps Harpoon has an axe to grind and was trying to deflect attention away from the actual topic being discussed because he's tired of a player he likes being picked on and would rather redirect it back to the old faithful target? Since that's what you did.

Unless you think Horcoff being tougher in the bottom 6 makes the top 6 tougher, it was just the same crap in a different thread.

alanschu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 09:34 PM
  #52
dnicks17
Moderator
.
 
dnicks17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,485
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
Why cant we run 2 skilled lines and have a 3rd line that just oozes toughness? I don't want to move Hall or Eberle to the second line just to add toughness.
Ideally I think our top6 stays mostly the same, but we have a 3rd line with some mean SoBs.

Which kind of sucks because our current 3rd line might be the softest of the four.

dnicks17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 09:36 PM
  #53
Moonlapse Vertigo
Katz n' MacT BFFs
 
Moonlapse Vertigo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,071
vCash: 500
When I read the SUN's "The Oilers promise that they won't get pushed around anymore" article I thought that I was just reading a re-print from last year.

Moonlapse Vertigo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 09:37 PM
  #54
Mr Forever
The Oilers :(
 
Mr Forever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: COLLEGE
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,907
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
When I read the SUN's "The Oilers promise that they won't get pushed around anymore" article I thought that I was just reading a re-print from last year.
I think Kruger will definitely give Eager and Hordichuck a longer leash this year. He's going to actually use his players to their strengths.

Mr Forever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 09:56 PM
  #55
guymez
The Seldom Seen Kid
 
guymez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,557
vCash: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
I think Kruger will definitely give Eager and Hordichuck a longer leash this year. He's going to actually use his players to their strengths.
The problem remains though...these players simply aren't good enough to play against the other teams top 2 lines.
How are the Oilers going to punish the other teams top players when they have no one on the roster capable of doing it?

guymez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 09:58 PM
  #56
Eddy Oiler*
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 291
vCash: 500
The biggest disappointment to me last year was when Taylor Hall almost got his head taken off against Calgary. The response was absolutely unacceptable. I don't care who it is, Hordi, Eager, Fistric, the word MUST get out to the rest of the league that if you run one of the Edmonton Oiler kids your star will get run too. I don't care who it is. Could be someone like Jamie Benn just for an example. If any Dallas player runs any of our guys, Benn is getting rocked next time he is on the ice. End of story. Goon vs goon does not work. I don't want Hordi fighting the other team's goon. I want Hordi crushing whoever hits our guys or better yet, one of their stars.

Eddy Oiler* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 10:11 PM
  #57
Moonlapse Vertigo
Katz n' MacT BFFs
 
Moonlapse Vertigo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,071
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brownsrug
The biggest disappointment to me last year was when Taylor Hall almost got his head taken off against Calgary. The response was absolutely unacceptable. I don't care who it is, Hordi, Eager, Fistric, the word MUST get out to the rest of the league that if you run one of the Edmonton Oiler kids your star will get run too. I don't care who it is. Could be someone like Jamie Benn just for an example. If any Dallas player runs any of our guys, Benn is getting rocked next time he is on the ice. End of story. Goon vs goon does not work. I don't want Hordi fighting the other team's goon. I want Hordi crushing whoever hits our guys or better yet, one of their stars.
Fistric has got to be in the line-up on most nights. If he was here last year he would have taken a number without being asked.

Moonlapse Vertigo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 10:20 PM
  #58
harpoon
FOB
 
harpoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,612
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanschu View Post
Discussing upgrading our 2nd line center to inject additional toughness into our top 6, since the person was concerned about the toughness in our top 6, seems valid.

Perhaps Harpoon has an axe to grind and was trying to deflect attention away from the actual topic being discussed because he's tired of a player he likes being picked on and would rather redirect it back to the old faithful target? Since that's what you did.

Unless you think Horcoff being tougher in the bottom 6 makes the top 6 tougher, it was just the same crap in a different thread.
I disagree with your reading of this thread, but that's really nothing new.

I think if we are going to call out Gagner for not being tough enough (which he obviously isn't in spite of his willingness) then its worth mentioning the even greater problem which would be the TOI leader (and captain) being one of the wimpiest players in the NHL.

harpoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 10:23 PM
  #59
DousedInOil
Registered User
 
DousedInOil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Katy <3
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,816
vCash: 500
How about Gagner for Dubinsky? Dubsinky likes to hit and has some decent size.

DousedInOil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 01:22 PM
  #60
guymez
The Seldom Seen Kid
 
guymez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,557
vCash: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
Fistric has got to be in the line-up on most nights. If he was here last year he would have taken a number without being asked.
Fistric was a good addition to the bottom pairing. However unless the other teams top 6 is on an extended shift he wont get an opportunity to punish the other teams star players.

MV is right...its starting to sound like the same rhetoric we heard last season.

guymez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 01:38 PM
  #61
AvOiL
Registered User
 
AvOiL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 395
vCash: 500
Passing on Boone Jenner in favour of David Musil is going to haunt us. I was upset when it happened; and with the way he has progressed, I've become furious. It seemed like an obvious selection to me because it addressed the Center position and our lack of grit in the top-9.

AvOiL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 01:54 PM
  #62
Moose Coleman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 4,016
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by guymez View Post
The problem remains though...these players simply aren't good enough to play against the other teams top 2 lines.
How are the Oilers going to punish the other teams top players when they have no one on the roster capable of doing it?
How do the Wings do it?

Moose Coleman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 01:56 PM
  #63
oilersfan11
Registered User
 
oilersfan11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,524
vCash: 50
Are the Oilers tough enough?




What is this?

Of course their not.

oilersfan11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 02:00 PM
  #64
oilersfan11
Registered User
 
oilersfan11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,524
vCash: 50
The Oilers need a power forward in the top 6 or a big 2nd line centreman that brings the sandpaper.





When the Oilers are serious about winning a cup,one of Hemsky or Gagner needs to be moved.

oilersfan11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 05:00 PM
  #65
guymez
The Seldom Seen Kid
 
guymez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,557
vCash: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
How do the Wings do it?
Players like Franzen help a great deal. Big bodies...something the Oilers simply dont have in their top 6. Franzen isn't a banger by any means but he creates space with his size and strength.

I think the Oilers need a banger in the top 6 but failing that some size would certainly be beneficial. The Oilers top 6 is very small.

guymez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 05:51 PM
  #66
Blue And Orange
Kevin Lowe Must GO!!
 
Blue And Orange's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,433
vCash: 500
I'm not too worried about our lack of size on the top 6. Sure we lack size there, but there is something the Oilers have in their top 6 that most teams would kill to have on their top 6...sheer skill.

Build an identity based on sheer skill. Win on sheer skill.

Blue And Orange is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 06:24 PM
  #67
guymez
The Seldom Seen Kid
 
guymez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,557
vCash: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue And Orange View Post
I'm not too worried about our lack of size on the top 6. Sure we lack size there, but there is something the Oilers have in their top 6 that most teams would kill to have on their top 6...sheer skill.

Build an identity based on sheer skill. Win on sheer skill.
History suggests that the teams rosters require balance to win.

Winning on the basis of 1 element rarely if ever happens.

guymez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 08:14 PM
  #68
BadMedicine*
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 444
vCash: 500
We are an offensively catalysed hockey club and will need team toughness by committe,our PP will need to defend our flag,we need to be running up scores to make teams think twice about giving us a PP and wasting a game in a shortened season,there will be hard NHL play but teams who play to rough or trap to much will be eliminated early via penalty trouble costing critical games,and everyone knows you ice you tough lines against teams out of the playoffs so the regular season shouls be relatively fast paced and cleaner than usual.The playoffs however will be tough as nails because everyone will be peaking because its a short season ,no one will be burnt out from an 82 game schedule,it will be exciting if the refs call dirty overly rough play consistantly and if they call interference consistantly on teams who try to trap their way through this shortened year.

I dont think we need to worry about toughness at all till we lock our playoff spot up in 6th place.Then we will need to begin to filter toughness into our lineup in preparation for the playoffs.

BadMedicine* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 08:19 PM
  #69
Moonlapse Vertigo
Katz n' MacT BFFs
 
Moonlapse Vertigo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,071
vCash: 500
Damien Cox said some frustrating things last night ("...like the Oilers caved with Taylor Hall." - with regards to P.K. Subban's contract talks) but he generally seemed high on the team. He mentioned that he's pulling for the Oilers to succeed as an offensive force so that emphasis for success will revert back to pure skill over muscle. I guess that he wasn't a fan of the Kings' run.

Moonlapse Vertigo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-18-2013, 11:41 PM
  #70
Kevotron
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Edmonton
Country: Hong Kong
Posts: 210
vCash: 500
Im not a believer that you necessarily need a ton of "grit" to be successful
Pitts top 6 is Crosby, Malkin, Neal, Kunitz, Kennedy, Sutter
NYR top 6 is Nash, Richards, Gabby, Stepan, Callahan, Hagelin
these 2 teams are cup favorites, and of the 12 players listed i see 3 maybe 4 players that have "grit"
lack of grit can be offset by skills, and with the Oil's top 6 I think we have got that, our bottom six with Smyth, Jones, Eager, Harski, Horcoff can definitely grind it out.

Kevotron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2013, 09:49 AM
  #71
BadMedicine*
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 444
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevotron View Post
Im not a believer that you necessarily need a ton of "grit" to be successful
Pitts top 6 is Crosby, Malkin, Neal, Kunitz, Kennedy, Sutter
NYR top 6 is Nash, Richards, Gabby, Stepan, Callahan, Hagelin
these 2 teams are cup favorites, and of the 12 players listed i see 3 maybe 4 players that have "grit"
lack of grit can be offset by skills, and with the Oil's top 6 I think we have got that, our bottom six with Smyth, Jones, Eager, Harski, Horcoff can definitely grind it out.

Grit is what covers shine,if you are trying to add grit your are covering up what little shine you have before everyone else sees how little you have of it.

Hockey is an offensivly catalysed sport,and it is beautiful when played that way and ugly when it is diluted into defensive stagnant crap.Soccer is the same and games should be 6-5 all the time,but a lack of talent and skill and managment ability has ruined another beautiful sport exactly like hockey has been ruined for many years.

You dont need grit at all,you need a system that is supported by your entire organisation,if you have a solid system its construct doesnt matter if you have 100% organisational committment,if you have a superior system you can get away with less than 100% organisational committment and still be sucessful.But sucess and failure are inextricably connected to the quality of system and quantity of organisational committment to that system.

If you have been playing hockey your whole life you already have grit,ha ha ha ha,you arent going to suddenly find it in the NHL,grit is rquivilant to desire,desire manufactures grit as needed,you dont inject grit into your lineup to become a winning team,you inject desire and the desire produces the correct amount of grit.Grit is simply willingness to scrifice skin,bones,blood and teeth to win at all costs.Nothing more and nothing less.All the grit in the world isnt going to help you if its nearing the end of the season and i want to win bad enough to take out four of your teeth with my stick,thats called desire not grit,what you spit out of your mouth is grit,ha ha ha.

Having the desire to engage in a terminal fight has nothing to do with grit and everything to do with desire,how much desire your team has is dependant on the organisation and coaches you work for.It all comes back to managerial evaluation,even grit,ha ha ha.

The Oilers have plenty of desire and we will see how much of that translates into grit when we are in this years playoff fight,as we take those steps we will begin to see desire transmuted into grit as we find sucess.its not the size of the dog,its the size of the heart in the dog.Personally for example I would have taken a 5 or 10 or 20 game suspension if I had the skillset to recover my career afterwards to have taken out Boogard years ago when he was abusing the Oilers,a stick to the chops no dount and a trip to the ER,because thats what desire produces,grit,ha ha ha.Grit is simply the price you will pay in the moment and that is dictated by the level of desire you are personally experienceing.

BadMedicine* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2013, 12:08 PM
  #72
guymez
The Seldom Seen Kid
 
guymez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,557
vCash: 0
Interesting analysis from Jason Strudwick over at Oilers Nation regarding his #1 concern for the Oilers.

http://oilersnation.com/2013/1/19/sh...their-hopes-up

Quote:
1. Grit

Skill is needed to win games. Sometimes skill just takes over a game. It is a beautiful thing to watch when that happens. We all love it. Then there are games that are wars. Battles all over the ice, the corners, in front of the net and along the walls. These are rough games to play in and the hardest to win. You need to be able to win these types of games. You will find these games the last twenty percent of the season when teams are fighting for every point and during the playoffs.

When I look at the top two lines for the Oilers I have a hard time seeing the heavy lifters in that group. There is great skill in all six spots - but are there any Andrew Ladd, Brad Marchand, Ryan Kesler, Mike Richard, Johan Franzen or Ryan Callahan type of players?

On the line of Gagner, Hemsky and Yakupov who is going to separate the defencemen from the puck? Who will backcheck? They will be great when they have the puck but will they be as great when they don't?
Excellent points and legitimate questions regarding the Oilers top 6.

guymez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2013, 12:19 PM
  #73
67penny
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 183
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey Moss View Post
In the top 6, no. But Hartikainen and Fistric hit everything. Petrell is a strong checker and Eager can play tough as well.

The Oilers will have to address the grit in the top 6 for next season IMO, and it's obviously going to be a center or winger replacing either Gagner or Hemsky. Getzlaf/Perry would be ideal, although maybe unrealistic. Clowe is realistic and the Oilers should target him as well.
Agreed, Clowe should be priority 1 for Tambo next year. Would love Perry however unless Hemsky and Gagner are both adios its highly unlikely.

67penny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2013, 12:24 PM
  #74
CorpseFX
Registered User
 
CorpseFX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Milwaukee
Country: Slovakia
Posts: 7,736
vCash: 50
go get Corey Perry out of ANA.... and bloat your cap space.

Clowe is overrated.

CorpseFX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2013, 12:36 PM
  #75
Philly85
Moody'
 
Philly85's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,367
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by guymez View Post
Interesting analysis from Jason Strudwick over at Oilers Nation regarding his #1 concern for the Oilers.

http://oilersnation.com/2013/1/19/sh...their-hopes-up



Excellent points and legitimate questions regarding the Oilers top 6.
That's basically it. Some tough decisions to be made over the next year or so. They badly could use someone like Ryan Clowe, Franzen or heck even Corey Perry (I think he's a RW too though, which would mean Yakupov's transition back to his natural position would be finished as well) someone to flank all these guys on the right. Heck I'd even suggest they go after Getzlaf if at all possible. Hopefully Hartikainen can also top out as a guy who can play on the 2nd or even first line at times to add the big body toughness they are so desperately and obviously lacking. None of Gagner, Hemsky, Horcoff, or whoever else have been good in corners. Hartikainen is a beast in the corners and is exactly what they need, question is whether he can keep up with the speed. He's got good hands and is decent defensively. Eberle and Hall are both good in corners and at winning puck battles despite any size or grit "deficiencies".

Problem is simple, it's clear as day they need a bigger 2nd and 3rd line C, and preferably one more big body LW who has some scoring touch. I don't think these issues can be resolved via the draft anymore. Given the nice young, highly skilled and generally speaking talented core group of players, Tambellini is going to have to make some trades and part with future picks and prospects (maybe even one of the stars) to augment the roster NOW. Can't wait another 3-4 years for a draft pick to come in and fill the void. The roster lacks balance and size. The time is now to make the moves and this shortened season will reveal what is exactly needed. God I wish the Oilers could get there hands on Backes or Ladd or a player like that. It is going to be extremely difficult.

I think that 2nd line in particular could get eaten alive this season.


Last edited by Philly85: 01-19-2013 at 12:47 PM.
Philly85 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:11 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.