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P.K. Subban Thread - Mk III - Unsigned Edition

View Poll Results: Who should break first
Bergevin 61 25.00%
Subban 183 75.00%
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01-18-2013, 08:31 AM
  #176
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Originally Posted by waffledave View Post
Man, those PK quotes on twitter really pissed me off. Talking about how much he cares about the fans...Just shut up, don't even pretend.
so because he cares he should do us a favor and sign for less than he's worth....comon man. How do we know the habs are not lowballing him?

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01-18-2013, 08:31 AM
  #177
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I would have no problem giving him10 years at 7 million if he signs a 1-2 year contract right now and continues to progress. Blowing the bank after two very good seasons (not OUTSTANDING) by the way is premature in my opinion. Obviously you made up your mind and I wont change that but that's what I think would be more appropriate. He also needs to prove he's the #1D on a Habs healthy lineup (which he did not yet) or that he could be a#1D on most other team in the league but I guess that does not matter to you either. It's like the Leafs paying Tyler Bozak Crosby money because he's their #1C....
PK Subban is not the #1 dman by default...he earned it with his play. Yes, Markov's injury did pave the way for him to take on a bigger role, but the coaching staff and the organization did keep him in that role.

So does he deserve to be paid like Drew Doughty? No...I wouldn't say, and I don't buy that's what he wants either, but he DOES deserve to be paid as the best dman on the Habs, or at least, close to it

and that means 5M per IMO

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01-18-2013, 08:33 AM
  #178
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Can you find me a #1 dman on another team that plays as much as Subban and in as tough situations, that is making 2.5M to 3.5M?
And for the record, I think a 1-2 year contract at ~4 million would be fair for Subban right now. 2.5-3.5 is a little low.

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01-18-2013, 08:33 AM
  #179
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Marc Stall and Girardi of the NYR both make less than 4 mil. Letang makes 3.5. Is that enough?
All deals signed when the cap was lower...with inflation today, that's about 4.5M to
5M per season.

It's really not that unreasonable...

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01-18-2013, 08:34 AM
  #180
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And for the record, I think a 1-2 year contract at ~4 million would be fair for Subban right now. 2.5-3.5 is a little low.
IMO...signing Subban to a 1-2 year contract is really setting yourself up to get abused by Meehan 2 years from now when he's up for a new deal again.

With the way the Habs use Subban...2 years from now, he'll really ask for the moon.

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01-18-2013, 08:37 AM
  #181
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
All deals signed when the cap was lower...with inflation today, that's about 4.5M to
5M per season.

It's really not that unreasonable...
Don't forget the cap is lower next year so this needs to be factored in. I just posted that ~4 for a short term deal would be fair for PK. We are not that far. I'm just knocking off 500k because he's an immature annoying brat sometimes and needs to act more like a professional before busting the bank.

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01-18-2013, 08:37 AM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
First season for the GM of a bottom-3 team. Bergevin can afford to wait a bit. This could take a few days...
No he can't, every game this season is important. We don't have a tough schedule to start the year so if the team has any hope in making the playoffs these are the games they need to win, and it'll be pretty damn tough to do without your top defenseman who logs huge minutes.

We finished bottom 3 last year but with returning veterans like Plekanec, Cole, Gionta, Markov etc and signing veterans like Prust, Bouillon and Armstrong it is clear that Bergevin was aiming to make the playoffs and not to rebuild this year.

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01-18-2013, 08:39 AM
  #183
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
IMO...signing Subban to a 1-2 year contract is really setting yourself up to get abused by Meehan 2 years from now when he's up for a new deal again.

With the way the Habs use Subban...2 years from now, he'll really ask for the moon.
It all depends how well he doesI guess. If he continues to improve he will cost more. If he does not progress he will not cost much more. At least you know what you will be getting.

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01-18-2013, 08:40 AM
  #184
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Originally Posted by onebighockeyfan View Post
Don't forget the cap is lower next year so this needs to be factored in. I just posted that ~4 for a short term deal would be fair for PK. We are not that far. I'm just knocking off 500k because he's an immature annoying brat sometimes and needs to act more like a professional before busting the bank.
You don't know that to be true...that's just a perception based on a rigid hockey mentality.

IMO, the Habs would be wise to pay a bit more now for an ascending player...as opposed to paying less now, and having him dictate what he makes 2 years from now.

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01-18-2013, 08:42 AM
  #185
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
All deals signed when the cap was lower...with inflation today, that's about 4.5M to
5M per season.

It's really not that unreasonable...
The inflation excuse is crap and always a lame argument. Letang signed two years ago. Bergevin and Subban should take a look at this deal and copy/paste it.

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01-18-2013, 08:43 AM
  #186
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IMO, the Habs would be wise to pay a bit more now for an ascending player...as opposed to paying less now, and having him dictate what he makes 2 years from now.
I don't know how to make the cap work this year and next year, but everything I have seen said about Subban's importance to the team on an analytical / statistical / possession-based level has convinced me this is absolutely the case.

We've lost out on too many good players throughout history being too concerned about whispers about locker room or off-ice personality, so I'm happy to just focus on the objective metrics related to the job at hand.

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01-18-2013, 08:43 AM
  #187
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It all depends how well he doesI guess. If he continues to improve he will cost more. If he does not progress he will not cost much more. At least you know what you will be getting.
PK Subban has been in constant progression since he was drafted...do you guys remember when we drafted him? Everyone said he had NO CLUE on how to play defense

Last year, he played as one half of a shutdown duo on the Habs and finished as a +9 despite playing very difficult minutes.

Barring injury, there's no reason he shouldn't continue to improve AND mature over the next few years...hell, he's not even reached his prime age.

Do you want to have to re-sign this guy when he's entering his prime? Or would you rather have him signed at 4.5M or 5M DURING his prime?

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01-18-2013, 08:44 AM
  #188
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You don't know that to be true...that's just a perception based on a rigid hockey mentality.

IMO, the Habs would be wise to pay a bit more now for an ascending player...as opposed to paying less now, and having him dictate what he makes 2 years from now.
Several of his teamates commented on that so at least for some of them he needs to smarten up. I agree this could be overblown though.

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01-18-2013, 08:45 AM
  #189
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The inflation excuse is crap and always a lame argument. Letang signed two years ago. Bergevin and Subban should take a look at this deal and copy/paste it.
Letang signed his extension 3 years ago...the cap if i'm not mistaken was around
54M (not entirely sure).

The inflaction 'excuse' is not crap...it's quite relevant actually and must always been takent into consideration.

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01-18-2013, 08:46 AM
  #190
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Caring about the fans and getting compensated for what he thinks is fair are two different things.

Each and everyone of us would do the same in his situation..
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Originally Posted by Kingbobert View Post
so because he cares he should do us a favor and sign for less than he's worth....comon man. How do we know the habs are not lowballing him?
He just should have not said anything.

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01-18-2013, 08:48 AM
  #191
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Several of his teamates commented on that so at least for some of them he needs to smarten up. I agree this could be overblown though.
Mathieu Darche was on RDS the other night and said that PK has a great attitude and that he should never change and that the minute he changes, he won't be the same player. His enthusiam is infectuous and he LOVES hockey.

He did say that he needs to mature...but he's also 23yrs old...who here didn't need to mature at that age?

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01-18-2013, 08:49 AM
  #192
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Originally Posted by skule123 View Post
I don't know how to make the cap work this year and next year, but everything I have seen said about Subban's importance to the team on an analytical / statistical / possession-based level has convinced me this is absolutely the case.

We've lost out on too many good players throughout history being too concerned about whispers about locker room or off-ice personality, so I'm happy to just focus on the objective metrics related to the job at hand.
The same people who want PK to accept a 'bridge deal' today...are the same one's who are going to be up in arms 2 years from now when PK Subban is asking for the moon.

Print it!

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01-18-2013, 08:50 AM
  #193
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PK Subban has been in constant progression since he was drafted...do you guys remember when we drafted him? Everyone said he had NO CLUE on how to play defense

Last year, he played as one half of a shutdown duo on the Habs and finished as a +9 despite playing very difficult minutes.

Barring injury, there's no reason he shouldn't continue to improve AND mature over the next few years...hell, he's not even reached his prime age.

Do you want to have to re-sign this guy when he's entering his prime? Or would you rather have him signed at 4.5M or 5M DURING his prime?
I'm not concerned about paying PK more if he becomes one of the best D in the league and gets nominated for the Norris. I would have no problem giving him Webber money for 10 years if he does. It's not about getting a cheap deal. It's about paying a player according to his current worth, not what he is projected to be worth. That's why I favor a short, 2-3 year contract of about 4 million a year.

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01-18-2013, 08:52 AM
  #194
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The same people who want PK to accept a 'bridge deal' today...are the same one's who are going to be up in arms 2 years from now when PK Subban is asking for the moon.

Print it!
Read my previous post. I will not have a problem with that IF he's got the stats and play to be the highest paid D in the league in two years so be it.

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01-18-2013, 08:54 AM
  #195
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Mathieu Darche was on RDS the other night and said that PK has a great attitude and that he should never change and that the minute he changes, he won't be the same player. His enthusiam is infectuous and he LOVES hockey.

He did say that he needs to mature...but he's also 23yrs old...who here didn't need to mature at that age?
That's why he needs a bridge contract IMHO.

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01-18-2013, 08:56 AM
  #196
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Mathieu Darche was on RDS the other night and said that PK has a great attitude and that he should never change and that the minute he changes, he won't be the same player. His enthusiam is infectuous and he LOVES hockey.

He did say that he needs to mature...but he's also 23yrs old...who here didn't need to mature at that age?
Yet some people around here want to trade him because of his "attitude" for Jamie Benn who said before he wants to stay as far away from Canada as possible to play..

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01-18-2013, 08:58 AM
  #197
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Originally Posted by onebighockeyfan View Post
I'm not concerned about paying PK more if he becomes one of the best D in the league and gets nominated for the Norris. I would have no problem giving him Webber money for 10 years if he does. It's not about getting a cheap deal. It's about paying a player according to his current worth, not what he is projected to be worth. That's why I favor a short, 2-3 year contract of about 4 million a year.
Have you followed sports and contracts oh I don't know...the last 20 years?

There is a laundry list of athletes, in ALL sports who get paid based on potential and promise and not entirely on what they've proven.

I've seen several posters mention the same thing...and it's comletely baffling to me

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01-18-2013, 08:58 AM
  #198
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That's why he needs a bridge contract IMHO.
Ok so give him a bridge contract for 2 years at $4.5 million and then after that have to pay him $7-8 million after he's even more improved?

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01-18-2013, 08:59 AM
  #199
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Yet some people around here want to trade him because of his "attitude" for Jamie Benn who said before he wants to stay as far away from Canada as possible to play..
Trading PK would be a bad idea, he's a keeper. A tad immature for a long term big money contract hence the problem we have right now.

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01-18-2013, 08:59 AM
  #200
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That's why he needs a bridge contract IMHO.
So he needs a bridge contract because he's like 99.5% of the population?

There are very, very few fully mature 23yr old people...nevermind athletes.

Get real man

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