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Perry and Getzlaf talks to start

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01-18-2013, 07:34 PM
  #151
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What are they looking for then?
If we were looking to trade him, we'd be looking for the package with the most overall value, I assume. Remember, if we lose Perry, we're also losing Selanne soon. So those are our best two wingers. Gotta replace them, too. We don't just need centers

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01-18-2013, 07:35 PM
  #152
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I'm not saying they wouldn't gladly take O'Reilly, but for Perry it's not a great fit. If Perry's going he probably needs to be replaced with a top 6 wing and some high-end depth.

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01-18-2013, 07:35 PM
  #153
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I don't think it's wrong. We don't really have a trade to point to in similar circumstances where someone got more. The ability to sap salary and cap hit in a sign and trade on the other hand might change that.

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01-18-2013, 07:49 PM
  #154
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I'd throw in mcginn and probably a depth defenceman if Anaheim needed it.. Conditional 1st and 2nd on Perry resigning

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01-18-2013, 08:31 PM
  #155
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Getzlaf is saying some encouraging things. I think locking him up sooner rather than later can only help negotiations with Perry. Gives us a contract to work around and gives Perry security that his friend/linemate will still be there which hopefully keeps the team competitive. And if it means anything to Perry we can then offer him a little more money if he wants to feel more valuable or whatnot.

But honestly its pretty impossible to know what Perry wants.

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01-18-2013, 08:41 PM
  #156
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For anyone that's looking for more quotes, there's video on the TSN website. Paraphrasing Getzlaf: coming off my ELC, we worked through a deal during the season and stuff. It didn't affect me then, it won't affect me now.

By the way, video title is: "Future Leafs? Set to become free agents, there's been buzz that Corey Perry and Ryan Getzlaf could land in Toronto."

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01-18-2013, 08:44 PM
  #157
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And Teemu wanted to sign in Montreal, and then later Winnipeg. Friggin media.

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01-18-2013, 09:26 PM
  #158
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It's so hard to gauge Perry... It scares me a bit. However, I do understand his position to some extent. He doesn't like to give any inclination as to which way he would lean but is completely satisfied letting the cards fall where they will. This doesn't necessarily mean he wants to test free agency or that he wants to stay. It just means as long as he is paid what he is worth he will be happy wherever he plays.

I obviously want him to stay and certainly hope he still does however unsettling this makes me until I fully come to terms with his stance on the matter.

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01-18-2013, 09:52 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by SupermanPahlsson View Post
For anyone that's looking for more quotes, there's video on the TSN website. Paraphrasing Getzlaf: coming off my ELC, we worked through a deal during the season and stuff. It didn't affect me then, it won't affect me now.

By the way, video title is: "Future Leafs? Set to become free agents, there's been buzz that Corey Perry and Ryan Getzlaf could land in Toronto."
Yeah it's the buzz of the self serving Toronto media and their fans

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01-19-2013, 01:36 AM
  #160
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Perry is socially awkward in the media, always has been.

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01-19-2013, 01:52 AM
  #161
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I was confident that Schultz would eventually sign here. I was pretty sure that the NHL and the NHLPA wouldn't let it get so far that there would be another lockout. And now, I'm comfortable saying that both Perry and Getzlaf will re-sign with us.

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01-19-2013, 08:45 AM
  #162
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Signing Getzlaf soon will probably help signing Perry eventually.

Think of it like Niedermayers or Koivu/Selanne. If they both get to FA, think Kariya/Selanne.

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01-19-2013, 09:09 AM
  #163
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I think that Perry would like to stay but he also wants to play for a contender. So if the team does well this season, he will probably stay. If the team does poorly, he might be had with a good contract but Ducks might not be able to afford him. I don't expect them getting the same kind of contract.

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01-19-2013, 10:04 AM
  #164
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If we are playing like **** 20 games into this season would you guys be ok with trading Perry or Getzlaf if they have not signed?

I want both on the team obviously, but more importantly I want some SOMETHING. If it looks like neither are going to stay then I hope we dont keep them just for 20 more games and a victory lap.

It could be a huge jump in the rebuild process. Lets be honest, if our young guys cant produce this year then we need a rebuild. We may lose 4 of our best 5 forward next offseason and while our drafting and prospect pool the last few years has shown a great future, that doesnt guarantee one.

competing>3 year rebuild> 6 year rebuild

If we lose Getzlaf and Perry for nothing it may kill the franchise.

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01-19-2013, 10:17 AM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Gliff View Post
If we are playing like **** 20 games into this season would you guys be ok with trading Perry or Getzlaf if they have not signed?

I want both on the team obviously, but more importantly I want some SOMETHING. If it looks like neither are going to stay then I hope we dont keep them just for 20 more games and a victory lap.

It could be a huge jump in the rebuild process. Lets be honest, if our young guys cant produce this year then we need a rebuild. We may lose 4 of our best 5 forward next offseason and while our drafting and prospect pool the last few years has shown a great future, that doesnt guarantee one.

competing>3 year rebuild> 6 year rebuild

If we lose Getzlaf and Perry for nothing it may kill the franchise.
I kinda wish Burke was still in Toronto because he definitely had a ***** for Perry and Getz and would get him at any cost. Of course the counter argument here is that Murray has displayed a consensual attitude while being trade ***** by Burke, and would probably only get JVR in return.

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01-19-2013, 12:40 PM
  #166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gliff View Post
If we are playing like **** 20 games into this season would you guys be ok with trading Perry or Getzlaf if they have not signed?

I want both on the team obviously, but more importantly I want some SOMETHING. If it looks like neither are going to stay then I hope we dont keep them just for 20 more games and a victory lap.

It could be a huge jump in the rebuild process. Lets be honest, if our young guys cant produce this year then we need a rebuild. We may lose 4 of our best 5 forward next offseason and while our drafting and prospect pool the last few years has shown a great future, that doesnt guarantee one.

competing>3 year rebuild> 6 year rebuild

If we lose Getzlaf and Perry for nothing it may kill the franchise.
If there not signed we're in full rebuild mode. I would WANT a sign and trade deal so we can pull off a Kovy or Nash deal out of it. Two top 10 picks in this years draft would be amazing IF we finish like last year. And 3 top 10 picks if both are signed and trade deals. Plus star players coming back we would be in great shape.

Still have Ryan so our rebuild wouldn't take years in my mind.

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01-19-2013, 01:06 PM
  #167
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Originally Posted by Ducksgo View Post
I would WANT a sign and trade deal so we can pull off a Kovy or Nash deal out of it.
Huh? Neither Kovy nor Nash were sign-and-trades (Nash still was signed, though). And if the whole "sign"-part of things was actually an option, why would we even bother with the "trade"-part? Or do you mean just allowing other GMs to talk to them about potential contracts beforehand to potentially increase their value?

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Two top 10 picks in this years draft would be amazing IF we finish like last year. And 3 top 10 picks if both are signed and trade deals. Plus star players coming back we would be in great shape.
Teams with own top-10 picks aren't going to trade for Getzlaf/Perry, because of their UFA status. Only teams in the playoff-hunt will look to add these guys for their run, and those usually don't have top-10 picks. With the new design of the draft lottery, I suppose there's a chance we could move into the top-10 if a team adding one of them ends up still missing the playoffs and wins in the lottery.

The teams in the playoff hunt won't trade star players for them, either. That certainly wasn't the case in the Kovy-trade and it wasn't even the case in the Nash trade. Top-10 picks as well as star players aren't a reasonable expectation at this point in time if we were to trade them.

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01-19-2013, 01:18 PM
  #168
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With the new design of the draft lottery, I suppose there's a chance we could move into the top-10 if a team adding one of them ends up still missing the playoffs and wins in the lottery.
Isn't it still the same system for this upcoming draft?

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01-19-2013, 01:20 PM
  #169
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Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
Huh? Neither Kovy nor Nash were sign-and-trades (Nash still was signed, though). And if the whole "sign"-part of things was actually an option, why would we even bother with the "trade"-part? Or do you mean just allowing other GMs to talk to them about potential contracts beforehand to potentially increase their value?


Teams with own top-10 picks aren't going to trade for Getzlaf/Perry, because of their UFA status. Only teams in the playoff-hunt will look to add these guys for their run, and those usually don't have top-10 picks. With the new design of the draft lottery, I suppose there's a chance we could move into the top-10 if a team adding one of them ends up still missing the playoffs and wins in the lottery.

The teams in the playoff hunt won't trade star players for them, either. That certainly wasn't the case in the Kovy-trade and it wasn't even the case in the Nash trade. Top-10 picks as well as star players aren't a reasonable expectation at this point in time if we were to trade them.
Well this may be the season to actually make a trade early and hope that the mid level team (like a Calgary or Dallas type team) after the trade doesn't have a great finish and the teams are so close in the standings that a team that finishes 5 points out of the playoffs ends up getting a 5-10 pick.
Of course, it is a huge gamble either way.
Personally I am not giving up Perry (Getz will stay I think) unless it is for a 1st rounder, a very high top prospect and a top 6 player.

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01-19-2013, 01:31 PM
  #170
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Isn't it still the same system for this upcoming draft?
Oh, I don't know, to be honest. Never read anything about that, so I just assumed we'd use the new one right away. Could just have missed that, obviously.

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Well this may be the season to actually make a trade early and hope that the mid level team (like a Calgary or Dallas type team) after the trade doesn't have a great finish and the teams are so close in the standings that a team that finishes 5 points out of the playoffs ends up getting a 5-10 pick.
Of course, it is a huge gamble either way.
Yeah, probably too much of a gamble. Especially since I don't think we'll be bad enough to prove we're not going anywhere this year that quickly.

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Personally I am not giving up Perry (Getz will stay I think) unless it is for a 1st rounder, a very high top prospect and a top 6 player.
Depending on the "very high top prospect" and the expected quality of the "top-6 player", that might be an expectation that won't be matched. If we're out of the race (or not looking good), I don't think there's no real question of what I'd be trading him for. At that point, it makes no sense to keep him. The rest is up to the market. There would be a decent return, anyway. But there's little of a point trying to force a return that's unknown for UFAs. I think he could net a bit more than Kovy at the time, but the definition of the terms "top-6er" or "very high top prospect" probably would to be softened, a bit. I would hope to be wrong, but before that, I hope we'll just be able to not find out by signing him.

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01-19-2013, 01:48 PM
  #171
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Huh? Neither Kovy nor Nash were sign-and-trades (Nash still was signed, though). And if the whole "sign"-part of things was actually an option, why would we even bother with the "trade"-part? Or do you mean just allowing other GMs to talk to them about potential contracts beforehand to potentially increase their value?


Teams with own top-10 picks aren't going to trade for Getzlaf/Perry, because of their UFA status. Only teams in the playoff-hunt will look to add these guys for their run, and those usually don't have top-10 picks. With the new design of the draft lottery, I suppose there's a chance we could move into the top-10 if a team adding one of them ends up still missing the playoffs and wins in the lottery.

The teams in the playoff hunt won't trade star players for them, either. That certainly wasn't the case in the Kovy-trade and it wasn't even the case in the Nash trade. Top-10 picks as well as star players aren't a reasonable expectation at this point in time if we were to trade them.
Your missing the point. If we get Perry and Getz to agree to sign, but in return they will be traded to there desirable team. I would want a Nash or Kovy trade. That's my point, and both Getz an Perry are worth top 10 picks with players coming back IF signed.

I also believe that both Getz and Perry IF want out and knows where they want to go. Would show enough respect for our organization and agree to a sign and trade unlike Shultz, so we wouldn't be rebuilding for years like Edmonton.


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01-19-2013, 02:20 PM
  #172
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Your missing the point. If we get Perry and Getz to agree to sign, but in return they will be traded to there desirable team. I would want a Nash or Kovy trade. That's my point, and both Getz an Perry are worth top 10 picks with players coming back IF signed.
I'm not missing the point, though. That's the last option I was talking about, basically. "We" can't get them to agree to sign with another team. The only way you could make that happen was if you let the teams interested in acquiring them talk to them / their agents beforehand. If that works, yes, that helps the value. But there's also a good chance that they'd not be interested in deciding upon their future at the deadline, when they are relatively short away from being UFAs where they could just take their time in making these decisions. They might tell others they don't want to sign in certain places long-term, straight away. In that scenario, you're only depleting the market for them. So, allowing them to talk to teams beforehand is a bit of a double-edged sword. There isn't much of a chance that we'd get Perry/Getzlaf to commit to a team at the deadline when they have all the time in the world in July.

And why do you keep referring to the Kovy-trade? That didn't bring back what you're mentioning, at all. It included a roster defenseman (Oduya), a decent young play (Bergfors), a decent prospect (Cormier) and what ended up an expectedly late 1st round pick (#24). No top-ten picks, no top prospects, and no star players.

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I also believe that both Getz and Perry IF want out and knows where they want to go.
I don't think that's a reasonable expectation. Yeah, they'd probably have a bunch of places in mind that would seem attractive to them, but at that point, they are unlikely to make such a decision. Some teams they like may not be in the situation to trade for them, especially at that added value. Some teams may have little idea if they can work out the cap. As much as that concept would be great for us, because of the higher value for them, it's very unlikely to go down that way. About every team would prefer it that way, but it almost never happens, for a reason.

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Would show enough respect for our organization and agree to a sign and trade unlike Shultz, so we wouldn't be rebuilding for years like Edmonton.
I don't think we're in for an Edmontonian rebuild, regardless. We've been restocking our prospect pool for a while. With the added pieces in such a situation, even if its the standard-type return, it should not take as long. But we'll have to wait and see, and see if we actually do have to see.

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01-19-2013, 03:02 PM
  #173
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I'm not missing the point, though. That's the last option I was talking about, basically. "We" can't get them to agree to sign with another team. The only way you could make that happen was if you let the teams interested in acquiring them talk to them / their agents beforehand. If that works, yes, that helps the value. But there's also a good chance that they'd not be interested in deciding upon their future at the deadline, when they are relatively short away from being UFAs where they could just take their time in making these decisions. They might tell others they don't want to sign in certain places long-term, straight away. In that scenario, you're only depleting the market for them. So, allowing them to talk to teams beforehand is a bit of a double-edged sword. There isn't much of a chance that we'd get Perry/Getzlaf to commit to a team at the deadline when they have all the time in the world in July.

And why do you keep referring to the Kovy-trade? That didn't bring back what you're mentioning, at all. It included a roster defenseman (Oduya), a decent young play (Bergfors), a decent prospect (Cormier) and what ended up an expectedly late 1st round pick (#24). No top-ten picks, no top prospects, and no star players.


I don't think that's a reasonable expectation. Yeah, they'd probably have a bunch of places in mind that would seem attractive to them, but at that point, they are unlikely to make such a decision. Some teams they like may not be in the situation to trade for them, especially at that added value. Some teams may have little idea if they can work out the cap. As much as that concept would be great for us, because of the higher value for them, it's very unlikely to go down that way. About every team would prefer it that way, but it almost never happens, for a reason.


I don't think we're in for an Edmontonian rebuild, regardless. We've been restocking our prospect pool for a while. With the added pieces in such a situation, even if its the standard-type return, it should not take as long. But we'll have to wait and see, and see if we actually do have to see.
I was simply using the Kovy trade as an example. I also am probably overvaluing Perry and Getz compared to Kovy, but still I think we could receive a bit more than that deal going down.

If we're gonna lose Getz and Perry at the same time you don't really think we will see a sign and trade Vipers? Knowing we drafted em they won a cup here and all?

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01-19-2013, 03:15 PM
  #174
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I was simply using the Kovy trade as an example. I also am probably overvaluing Perry and Getz compared to Kovy, but still I think we could receive a bit more than that deal going down.
Yeah, I could see a bit more. But we'll see, that's a long time from now. A lot of factors could come into play then.

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If we're gonna lose Getz and Perry at the same time you don't really think we will see a sign and trade Vipers? Knowing we drafted em they won a cup here and all?
No, I'd be surprised. It's a lot to ask of them, and it's not like either side owes the other. They were paid, and they gave a lot back with their play here over the years. I don't have any doubt that they'd prefer to give back even more in their departure if they'll decide to leave, but a LOT of things have to fall in place for such a scenario to work out for all sides. You just can't expect that kind of outcome in any single case. It's always a very long shot and a surprise.

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01-19-2013, 03:19 PM
  #175
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If they signed, I'd rather just cancel the trade, kidnap them and brainwash them into staying in Anaheim

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