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P.K. Subban Thread - Mk III - Unsigned Edition

View Poll Results: Who should break first
Bergevin 61 25.00%
Subban 183 75.00%
Voters: 244. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-19-2013, 01:25 PM
  #851
FinnHab
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
You won't hear that tonight.
Let`s wait and see, i will watch and listen live stream very very carefully on my secret Hab-headquarter in Finland


Last edited by FinnHab: 01-19-2013 at 01:56 PM. Reason: typos
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Old
01-19-2013, 01:31 PM
  #852
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I wouldn't trade Subban straight up for Eberle let alone add something else.
Final answer, not even going to Phone-A-Friend on that one?

There would be no chance of landing a special player like Eberle for Subban. You're attached to Subban a little too much to talk trade about him.

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01-19-2013, 01:32 PM
  #853
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
We want PK!
We want PK!
We want PK!

I almost guarantee we're going to hear this chant tonight.

This controversy will be Bergevin's doing.
I don't disagree that Bergevin has blame in this situation but if PK is asking for 7 million a season should MB really sign him to that?

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01-19-2013, 01:33 PM
  #854
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False premise on your part.

We have no idea what the numbers are. We know that Bergevin wants a short deal and PK wants a long term deal. That is ALL we know.

You call it false premise, I call it an educated guess!

(1) Bergevin mentioned on numerous occasions that he has a long terms plan for this team. He also mentioned that he intends to stick with it. Meehan on the other hand, gave examples of young RFA players who received long terms deals. Hence most people think that PK is looking for a long terns deal while Bergevin is looking for shorter terms.

(2) Most people agree that PK’s contribution at this age/stage of his career is higher than Pacioretty and Price at the same age. Price’s second contract had a cap hit of 2,75M$ and Pacioretty’s cap hit was 1,625M$. Hence me assuming Bergevin already offered Subban a short terms deal worth 4 to 4,5M$.

Again... in the context of a 48 games sprint to the playoffs if Subban decides to stay at home during x weeks, it would annoy the fans and his teammates.

Subban tweeted a while ago (not the exact quote): "Are they seeing me in this team’s future?", but, imo, the real question is:

"Is Subban willing to make a little sacrifice (à la Pacioretty, Brodeur, Hossa...) to help build and play for a contender?"


PS one year, 4,5M$... game on!


Last edited by Kjell Dahlin: 01-19-2013 at 01:52 PM.
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Old
01-19-2013, 01:34 PM
  #855
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Originally Posted by Tuggy View Post
I don't disagree that Bergevin has blame in this situation but if PK is asking for 7 million a season should MB really sign him to that?
because the fan boys want hiiiiimmmmmm!

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01-19-2013, 01:36 PM
  #856
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Would have kinda of whished someone offer sheet Subban so the habs would have matched. Can't believe they couldn't come to an agreement after this bs lockout. Another **** you to the fans.

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01-19-2013, 01:41 PM
  #857
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
We want PK!
We want PK!
We want PK!

I almost guarantee we're going to hear this chant tonight.

This controversy will be Bergevin's doing.
No one will care if the Habs score early and/or win.

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01-19-2013, 01:42 PM
  #858
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Originally Posted by elsubz View Post
Would have kinda of whished someone offer sheet Subban so the habs would have matched. Can't believe they couldn't come to an agreement after this bs lockout. Another **** you to the fans.
Maybe the offer sheets he received were nowhere as good as Subban expects?

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01-19-2013, 01:42 PM
  #859
E = CH²
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Originally Posted by Tuggy View Post
I don't disagree that Bergevin has blame in this situation but if PK is asking for 7 million a season should MB really sign him to that?
No, definitely not, I strongly doubt PK/Meehan are asking for that much though.

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01-19-2013, 01:43 PM
  #860
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because the fan boys want hiiiiimmmmmm!
Pretty much this. Some serious PK fanboys on here. Pay him what he's worth no what he and his fanboys think he's worth.

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Old
01-19-2013, 01:44 PM
  #861
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No, definitely not, I strongly doubt PK/Meehan are asking for that much though.
The rumour going around has been $6M.

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01-19-2013, 01:44 PM
  #862
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Final answer, not even going to Phone-A-Friend on that one?

There would be no chance of landing a special player like Eberle for Subban. You're attached to Subban a little too much to talk trade about him.
When did Eberle become a "special" player? He's a good young player but I think Subban has a chance to be a top 5(in the NHL) d-man. Eberle will be a good player but I doubt he is ever considered one of the 5 best forwards in the NHL.

Short of getting a Stamkos Toews Crosby Malkin Kopitar Tavares Giroux you don't trade Subban.

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01-19-2013, 01:45 PM
  #863
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Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
The rumour going around has been $6M.
That's not way off base if we are talking a 6-7-8 year deal when you look at Hall, Eberle, Zajac etc

6 year 33 mil or 7 year 37.5 would be a good deal IMHO.

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01-19-2013, 01:45 PM
  #864
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No one will care if the Habs score early and/or win.
The habs scored early and won last Thursday !

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Old
01-19-2013, 01:45 PM
  #865
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When did Eberle become a "special" player? He's a good young player but I think Subban has a chance to be a top 5(in the NHL) d-man. Eberle will be a good player but I doubt he is ever considered one of the 5 best forwards in the NHL.

Short of getting a Stamkos Toews Crosby Malkin Kopitar Tavares Giroux you don't trade Subban.
Eberle isn't even the best talent on his team. He's probably currently their best player but his performance has come in sheltered minutes. You don't trade a 1D for a soft winger.

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01-19-2013, 01:46 PM
  #866
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
No, definitely not, I strongly doubt PK/Meehan are asking for that much though.
We are arguing in circles here. We'll only know when he signs what the original demands could have been. Point is you are faulting Bergevin without knowing PKs demands.

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01-19-2013, 01:46 PM
  #867
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
When did Eberle become a "special" player? He's a good young player but I think Subban has a chance to be a top 5(in the NHL) d-man. Eberle will be a good player but I doubt he is ever considered one of the 5 best forwards in the NHL.

Short of getting a Stamkos Toews Crosby Malkin Kopitar Tavares Giroux you don't trade Subban.
You are way off on Subban's value. Subban will never be in that group of players.

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01-19-2013, 01:47 PM
  #868
Et le But
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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
You are way off on Subban's value. Subban will never be in that group of players.
And Eberle will?

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01-19-2013, 01:47 PM
  #869
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Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
1 - Nobody in this entire thread DOESN'T think that PK Subban is a true impact player with more to come. We ALL think that. That doesn't mean he deserves what (allegedly) he is asking for, which is close to Doughty type money and length.
At this point it would be nice to actually know what each side is asking for... The alleged amounts on both sides are unreasonable.

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Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
2 - Bergy is holding firm on a figure that is (again allegedly) VERY reasonable. It's not like he's offering peanuts, he just doesn't want to give a player, ANY player an inflated contract cuz they have leverage. There's a poster on HIO who claims to have some inside info (it's in the comments in the article about Price's mask) where (if you believe him, and I kind of do) that Bergevin respects the Habs, the history and the greatness too much to bow to a single player who is trying to ask for more than what he deserves. I totally respect that attitude. YES - it could hurt the team now, BUT, it will hurt the team much more in the grand scheme if he gives PK a 6.5 for 6 years deal.
Disagree...
"Habs greatness"?
We've been a mediocre franchise for 2 decades now... Subban is the best young dman we've had since chelios in the 80's (Markov wasn't even close at the same age), and every indication is that he has the work ethic, commiment & attitude needed to continue improving.

He's exactly the type of player a smart GM locks up long term early (at less than what it will take to lock him up in 2-3 years, once he's really peaking), bc that then helps set the upper limit of what any other player can expect.

Subban at 5, 5.5, even 6m works great, assuming he remains the minute eating impact player he's become (in just 2years!), bc MB can use the holland approach of using that contract/player as the benchmark.

Datsyuk, zetterberg & Franzen all cost the wings less in part bc holland had lidstrom's contract/status as the benchmark

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Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
13 - I assume you realize this scenario is absurd.
Stranger things have happened, wouldn't be the first time habs ownership meddled, and molson showed last year that he's very much "engaged" in the team...

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Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
1I do agree that if PK agreed to 5 or even 5.5 for 6 years, that's a deal you should make, although I don't know whether Meehan is willing to go for that. He seems to be trying to replicate the Doughty situation and in a market where the fan pressure is added leverage.
That, or MB is trying to lowball...
We don't really know either way
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Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
1Scenario 4:

PK doesn't play (you think he'll enjoy that?) until he agrees to a 2 year deal in which he is forced to work his butt off and show that he is what he thinks he's worth, and then gets the big bucks. Why this is such a problem for PK, I don't understand. He loves hockey, he supposedly loves the Habs and Montreal. What...is...the problem? Probably Meehan. This situation sucks hard and I don't like it more than you that things are the way they are, but IMO as much as Bergy can be criticized for limiting the offer to two years, PK can be criticized for not taking it. These threads have made him out to be the best D in the NHL, which he is not. He IS, however critical to our team so I hope this lockout-esque drama is over soon. Unfortunately, it looks like it's going to drag on into the season, thus ruining this one for us, but possibly saving future seasons. Hope I'm wrong and they meet half way.
Ppl seem to ignore the very simple fact that these athletes play a dangerous game...

If subban feels he's worth 5-6 even 7m, and he'd be stupid to settle for 1/2 that, even dumber to take a 2 year deal.

One bad hit in those two years and *pouf* there goes the 30-40 MILLION dollars he left on the table

It's easy to sit here and say we'd play "for free" or that he should be happy with his 2-3M $ /year even if he never earns another penny bc that "should" be more than enough for anyone...

But that isn't how our capitalist society works, nor how our brains work

He's got every right to wrestle every last penny out of the team, and to fault him for it under some utopic belief in the "history" of the franchise or the purity of the game is hogwash.

NHL is a business, plain and simple. He's a very talented employee of tremendous value to his company, and he's fighting for what he thinks he's worth... Good on him, too bad for us if it leads to him leaving town bc us fans are really the only ones who will "lose" (unless MB can land a kings ransom in return)

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Old
01-19-2013, 01:47 PM
  #870
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You are way off on Subban's value. Subban will never be in that group of players.
Why not? He has a similar development curve so far. What makes you think he will stop progressing and those guys will keep getting better?

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01-19-2013, 01:50 PM
  #871
Agnostic
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And Eberle will?
Let's try to follow the conversation ok? Subban does not get you Eberle in a trade, end of story.

Subban gets into a 2nd contract squawk with his GM and suddenly he's Orr.

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01-19-2013, 01:52 PM
  #872
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That's not way off base if we are talking a 6-7-8 year deal when you look at Hall, Eberle, Zajac etc

6 year 33 mil or 7 year 37.5 would be a good deal IMHO.
A little high for a 36 and 38 point seasons in my opinion. Do you have examples of young Ds making that much with similar stats?

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01-19-2013, 01:56 PM
  #873
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There's a lot more to being a DEFENSEman than scoring points..

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01-19-2013, 01:56 PM
  #874
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Let's try to follow the conversation ok? Subban does not get you Eberle in a trade, end of story.

Subban gets into a 2nd contract squawk with his GM and suddenly he's Orr.
That's this board. Our guys are greatly over valued.

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01-19-2013, 01:58 PM
  #875
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There's a lot more to being a DEFENSEman than scoring points..
That's stating the obvious....thanks for the contribution .

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