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The return of Colton Orr!

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Old
01-20-2013, 02:12 AM
  #151
RealisticLeaf55
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
Most coach's usually want to give your 4th line 8-10 mins a night . McClement played almost 14 min but Orr/Brown played 4 mins each and if that's all he trusts them to play then they won't be in the lineup long .

It's only the 1st game of the season so we'll see how it plays out .
I respect that and I have no doubt about seeing Frattin up and Orr being a scratch as well as Steckel jumping in too. Kind of exciting to see we are starting to piece together a more respectable team though. Kudos to that Randy guy

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01-20-2013, 08:02 AM
  #152
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I think Steckel would have been more effective then Orr tonight - reasons
1. Steckel would have been as effective as Orr in the face punching part of the game (as Orr let Brown do the fighting and sat back here)
2. Steckel would skated much better then Orr in the game
3. Steckel would have been a superior checker in the game
4. Steckel would have dominated the faceoff dot

Basically unless Orr punches someone face then Steckel wins hands down. But with Brown on the team throwing down the gloves and no other player willing to fight Orr I see no value for skating Orr and having Steckel sit.

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01-20-2013, 09:47 AM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Tak7 View Post
That look he had on his face when Brown and Prust dropped the gloves was priceless.


That's his job. If he's not doing that, then what the hell is he going to do? Absolutely nothing - which is why he will be in the lineup on Monday, and then likely pulled out of it after that.
Yup, Sabres have bulked up with Ott and Scott. Scott being a 6'8" behemoth who rarely loses a fight. A plug in terms of effecting a game, he only fights about 6-8 times a year but consider what the rest of the east has done since last season...

- The Islanders claimed 6-foot-8 defenseman Joe Finley off waivers from the Sabres.
- Carolina acquired Kevin Westgarth from Los Angeles.
- Florida traded for George Parros from Anaheim.
- New Jersey signed Krys Barch away from Florida.
- Montreal signed Brandon Prust away from the Rangers.

Add to that teams like Boston and Ottawa already have enforcers, Orr will be busy this season.

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01-20-2013, 09:54 AM
  #154
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Orr is a great teammate, he has a positive effect on the locker room, he is respected and well liked, he sets a great example to our younger players, leadership was a sore point with us last year, Orr fills this. This should not be dismissed.

Last year in the AHL playoffs, Kadri was going to have a fast food meal before a playoff game, Orr commented menacingly 'you better be good tonight' to Naz, Naz passed on the fast food. I am paraphrasing a little the story here, but that's the positive effect Orr has on teammates.

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01-20-2013, 09:58 AM
  #155
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How many teams have we 'scared' into losing in past seasons? I haven't seen that happen before in the Rosehill/Orr/Brown/Phaneuf era. Most of the time gooning has happened because we were losing, and yet we still lost in the game and in future games with the same teams. Now we're down to two 'goons' (one who has heart, but loses most fights) and Phaneuf. Gooning alone does not determine intimidation.

What's more demoralizing to a team, losing games or losing fist fights?

That said, both have there place in the game, but one is more important in the end.

Maybe I chose the wrong term,by gooning I meant hit them hard and hit them often.


The problem with any type of intimidation the last few years was with such a poor PK under RW the players had to hold back to avoid a penalty.And no doubt RW wanted to keep away from too physical of a game.Look at half the players he got Burke to aquire.

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01-20-2013, 10:01 AM
  #156
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Orr was pretty iseless last night tbh, hope steckle plays in his place next game

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01-20-2013, 10:04 AM
  #157
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
3 of the 4 guys you mentioned didn't even dress tonight and it remains to be seen if the 4th even sticks with his team .

Also my point wasn't you didn't need tougher guys in your lineup . My point is they have to be the Thornton types that can at least play a semi regular shift to be effective .


Yeah,and when the Leafs can get afew of them that is the time to get rid of a player like Orr.

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01-20-2013, 10:07 AM
  #158
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
He did nothing to help the team before and he'll do nothing to help them now .

I enjoy tough hard hitting games and if the odd fight happens during the heat of the moment then so be it . I don't enjoy staged fights between guys who don't serve any other purpose and if you enjoy that type of stuf there's always the UFC .


Did I miss a staged fight?

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01-20-2013, 10:13 AM
  #159
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
First you said goons now you make a list of people who can actually play ther game . Even the worst of the group play a semi regular shift .

Like i said before we need tougher players that can play , we don't need a 3-4 min a night enforcer and if RC wants to dress Orr then either Brown sits or he gives him more than the 4 mins he got tonight because you can't go through a whole season basically playing 3 lines especially with condensed sked like we have this year .

If Orr were to play 4 mins a game instead of the usual 4th line 8 mins there are 11 other forwards to split 4 mins of ice time.I think these players are in good enough shape to play an extra 25 secs each and all too happy to cover it for a bit of piece of mind.

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Old
01-20-2013, 10:18 AM
  #160
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Originally Posted by Donmega View Post
Orr was pretty iseless last night tbh, hope steckle plays in his place next game
Steckel is even more useless. He is easily the slowest skater on the team.

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01-20-2013, 10:28 AM
  #161
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Originally Posted by number72 View Post
I think Steckel would have been more effective then Orr tonight - reasons
1. Steckel would have been as effective as Orr in the face punching part of the game (as Orr let Brown do the fighting and sat back here)
2. Steckel would skated much better then Orr in the game
3. Steckel would have been a superior checker in the game
4. Steckel would have dominated the faceoff dot

Basically unless Orr punches someone face then Steckel wins hands down. But with Brown on the team throwing down the gloves and no other player willing to fight Orr I see no value for skating Orr and having Steckel sit.


I don't think you understand the role of an enforcer.His main purpose is toget into the other teams heads and make them think twice before taking advantage of the skill players.It's like a pre-emptive strike.


Sure Steckel would contribute more for the Leafs,but Orr makes the opponents contribute less for their team.

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01-20-2013, 10:44 AM
  #162
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Originally Posted by black charger View Post
I don't think you understand the role of an enforcer.His main purpose is toget into the other teams heads and make them think twice before taking advantage of the skill players.It's like a pre-emptive strike.
But how does a plug like Orr retaliate against opposing players who "take advantage" of our skilled guys unless they: 1) are on the ice at the same time Orr is on the ice (unlikely when he is only playing 5 minutes a game); 2) are willing to fight when Orr drops the gloves?

No one ever explains this.

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Old
01-20-2013, 10:51 AM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Hockeylaw View Post
But how does a plug like Orr retaliate against opposing players who "take advantage" of our skilled guys unless they: 1) are on the ice at the same time Orr is on the ice (unlikely when he is only playing 5 minutes a game); 2) are unwilling to fight when Orr drops the gloves?

No one ever explains this.
They can't explain this because it's unexplainable .

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01-20-2013, 10:58 AM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Hockeylaw View Post
But how does a plug like Orr retaliate against opposing players who "take advantage" of our skilled guys unless they: 1) are on the ice at the same time Orr is on the ice (unlikely when he is only playing 5 minutes a game); 2) are willing to fight when Orr drops the gloves?

No one ever explains this.
We have a coach who will pick him up and throw him out there as soon as said player hits the ice. Randy doesn't take **** from anyone. Welcome to the RC era, we don't have a soft coach anymore, and our team is going to reflect that.

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Old
01-20-2013, 10:59 AM
  #165
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The one thing about having Orr on the bench:

I rather have him on the bench and not need him than to need him and not have him on the bench. If a game calls for him to play 4 mins then lets be thankful because I don't think the team is ready for a game where we need him playing 10+ mins.

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01-20-2013, 11:08 AM
  #166
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Originally Posted by Hockeylaw View Post
But how does a plug like Orr retaliate against opposing players who "take advantage" of our skilled guys unless they: 1) are on the ice at the same time Orr is on the ice (unlikely when he is only playing 5 minutes a game); 2) are willing to fight when Orr drops the gloves?

No one ever explains this.


Does the school bully have to beat you up before he takes your lunch money? NO.You know from other peoples experiences it's best just to hand it over and keep your mouth shut.

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Old
01-20-2013, 11:13 AM
  #167
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I like the way Orr is skating and his improved quickness. At least he seems not to be a liability when he's on the ice. He is appreciated by his team-mates as an insurance policy. Like all insurance, best if the policy is not used, but valuable nevertheless.

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01-20-2013, 11:33 AM
  #168
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Orr is a great teammate, he has a positive effect on the locker room, he is respected and well liked, he sets a great example to our younger players, leadership was a sore point with us last year, Orr fills this. This should not be dismissed.

Last year in the AHL playoffs, Kadri was going to have a fast food meal before a playoff game, Orr commented menacingly 'you better be good tonight' to Naz, Naz passed on the fast food. I am paraphrasing a little the story here, but that's the positive effect Orr has on teammates.


Hopefully Orr keeps both teams in check

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Old
01-20-2013, 11:36 AM
  #169
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We have a coach who will pick him up and throw him out there as soon as said player hits the ice. Randy doesn't take **** from anyone. Welcome to the RC era, we don't have a soft coach anymore, and our team is going to reflect that.
Are you aware that there is a penalty for leaving the bench to fight, and that if Randy sent Orr over the boards to start an altercation, we'd immediately be shorthanded?

Quote:
Originally Posted by black charger View Post
Does the school bully have to beat you up before he takes your lunch money? NO.You know from other peoples experiences it's best just to hand it over and keep your mouth shut.
Except a hockey rink isn't a schoolyard, and hockey players aren't eight years old.

Of all the times Orr has fought in his career with the Leafs, I can probably count on one hand the number of times he has actually fought a player who took liberties with one of our skilled forwards. 95% of the time, he is throwing down with another goon like him in a completely senseless, irrelevant bout that has nothing to do with sending a message, or getting revenge, or changing the pace of the game in any measurable way.

If Orr was fast and skilled enough to crush the pests on an opposing team with punishing (but legal) hits, he would be more effective in the role you are attributing to him. As it stands, he is not.

I liked what I saw out of him last night, though, in that he threw a solid hit in the attacking zone, didn't do anything to make himself a liability, and demonstrated that he can actually skate.

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Old
01-20-2013, 11:45 AM
  #170
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Originally Posted by Hockeylaw View Post
Are you aware that there is a penalty for leaving the bench to fight, and that if Randy sent Orr over the boards to start an altercation, we'd immediately be shorthanded?



Except a hockey rink isn't a schoolyard, and hockey players aren't eight years old.

Of all the times Orr has fought in his career with the Leafs, I can probably count on one hand the number of times he has actually fought a player who took liberties with one of our skilled forwards. 95% of the time, he is throwing down with another goon like him in a completely senseless, irrelevant bout that has nothing to do with sending a message, or getting revenge, or changing the pace of the game in any measurable way.

If Orr was fast and skilled enough to crush the pests on an opposing team with punishing (but legal) hits, he would be more effective in the role you are attributing to him. As it stands, he is not.

I liked what I saw out of him last night, though, in that he threw a solid hit in the attacking zone, didn't do anything to make himself a liability, and demonstrated that he can actually skate.
Didn't know you were suggesting that the other player would never be on the ice again. must be afraid of Orr, job well done.

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01-20-2013, 12:06 PM
  #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by black charger View Post
I don't think you understand the role of an enforcer.His main purpose is toget into the other teams heads and make them think twice before taking advantage of the skill players.It's like a pre-emptive strike.


Sure Steckel would contribute more for the Leafs,but Orr makes the opponents contribute less for their team.
OK I guess our goaltenders don't count as skilled players as the Habs took liberties with them last night and nothing was done about it

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01-20-2013, 12:35 PM
  #172
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Whats with the ANTI Orr posts..

What a bunch of fruitcakes...where is your Pride or rather lack thereof..

This team is not physical yet and we need Orr in the lineup 50 games at least this year..

Makes me embarrassed to read some of the tripe, i guess most you disliked the Pat Burns leafs winning and playing very physical..

Go watch figure skating if your afraid of contact

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01-20-2013, 12:45 PM
  #173
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Do you guys think he suits up against Buffalo at home? Who would he even fight...

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01-20-2013, 01:05 PM
  #174
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Do you guys think he suits up against Buffalo at home? Who would he even fight...
John Scott.

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Old
01-20-2013, 01:09 PM
  #175
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I thought Orr looked good last night in a fourth line checking role .. Throwing the body around at everyone and staying in position

.. More importantly I think his skating looking a lot better, he wasn't lugging around like I remember him doing the last couple years .. Hopefully it's a sign that he's committed to improving his play like we've heard about

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