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This team will not succeed as long as David Desharnais is a top 6 center.

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01-21-2013, 01:20 AM
  #176
Mr. Hab
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
1 of Plekanec/Desharnais can not be here next year. Pretty clear to me. It's not a knock on either one, but you can not be a strong team by being so small down the middle on the top 2 lines. Plekanec has 3 more years @ 5 M per year. It's probably what he would get on the UFA market if he was a UFA.

Desharnais will be a RFA this summer and he's 1 year away from UFA. The time to make the decision is this summer.

Galchenyuk must play center next year. Period. The longer we put off him learning as a NHL center, the more time it will take for this team to someday be a contender.

Really ****ing tired of being a shrimp team down the middle. We've gone from Koivu-Perreault/Gilmour to Koivu-Ribeiro to Koivu-Plekanec to Plekanec-Gomez to what we have now. Enough is enough.
Agreed.
(I like DD's crafty style but he's only 5'6 and needs to be surrounded by our best tall/big Power Forwards, which takes away from spreading the wealth to our other lines...we need to get bigger/taller...Pleks,Eller,Galchenyuk...and maybe draft another big/tall center).


Next season (if up to me):
Pleks
Eller
Galchenyuk

L.Leblanc as top 9 winger (backup top 9 center).


IF our Habs lose a lot we could also pick up another big/skilled/gritty center during the Draft (top 3-5 overall pick).
(emphasis on word IF!), or I'd be very happy with a Seth Jones, as well!


Last edited by Mr. Hab: 01-21-2013 at 02:02 AM.
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01-21-2013, 02:02 AM
  #177
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Originally Posted by Mr. Hab View Post
Agreed.

Next season (if up to me):
Pleks
Eller
Galchenyuk

L.Leblanc as top 9 winger (backup top 9 center).


IF our Habs lose a lot we could also pick up another big/skilled/gritty center during the Draft (top 3-5 overall pick).
(emphasis on word IF!), or I'd be very happy with a Seth Jones, as well!
Why do people want to hurry Galchenyuk so badly? And why do people so badly want to get rid of DD? The dude in his first full year in the NHL went straight to becoming the #1 C. The problem is not DD. The problem is that every one else sucked so much to make DD 1st line C. I really don't think the team would go anywhere with Plek as our #1 C. He makes a great #2 C but he hasn't even done better than DD's first year in the NHL. And yes, if I was to choose who to keep, I would pick Plek over DD, but that's assuming there is someone who can replace DD as a true #1 C...which we don't have.

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01-21-2013, 02:42 AM
  #178
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Why do people want to hurry Galchenyuk so badly? And why do people so badly want to get rid of DD? The dude in his first full year in the NHL went straight to becoming the #1 C. The problem is not DD. The problem is that every one else sucked so much to make DD 1st line C. I really don't think the team would go anywhere with Plek as our #1 C. He makes a great #2C but he hasn't even done better than DD's first year in the NHL. And yes, if I was to choose who to keep, I would pick Plek over DD, but that's assuming there is someone who can replace DD as a true #1 C...which we don't have.
I don't (really I don't!). Ideally I'd love for Galchy to get some AHL time (if AHL rules let him play this season? or next season?).

Pleks isn't a #1 C but he's a solid two way#2C...we may have to wait 2 yrs for Galchy to be our #1C (hopefully!)...patience will pay off. Yes, I agree next season could be early for Galchy (as #3C), but another season in the OHL may not do anything for Galchy...time for AHL! (depoending on rules permit him to play next season in the AHL).

DD: crafty (I like his creative style, but...5'6...needs to be surrounded by our best Power Forwards (not fair to the other lines, imo... and we need more balance for our other lines). DD will get that 4-5mil/year contract for 5 yrs...I don't want to be stuck with that. No ****ing way (we'll be a joke in playoffs...tired of the Schmurf jokes).

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01-21-2013, 02:58 AM
  #179
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Oh look, the internet police is out. Sorry, sir. You can continue to go in circles if you like. It was just an accurate observation that I pointed out, and it will continue until Desharnais is no longer a member of this club.
In like 15 years.. when he retires with over 1,000 career points.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Hab View Post
DD: crafty (I like his creative style, but...5'6...needs to be surrounded by our best Power Forwards (not fair to the other lines, imo... and we need more balance for our other lines). DD will get that 4-5mil/year contract for 5 yrs...I don't want to be stuck with that. No ****ing way (we'll be a joke in playoffs...tired of the Schmurf jokes).
What a god damn myth. When has this ever been proven? Oh right, when he was producing with Pouliot, Pyatt, Darche, and White?

Cole was struggling before he was paired with DD and Patches/DD had chemistry from Hamilton.

Desharnais played like 3 games with Cammalleri and Leblanc last year. He helped get Cammy back on track (Cammy went on to publically praise him in the media) and Leblanc looked the most dangerous he ever has in the NHL during that stint. Cammy went right back to struggling after this stint (no idea why they were split up anyway).

There is no way to prove that he NEEDS Pacioretty and Cole to produce. They got put together because the team was struggling, started lighting the ice on fire, so they were left together. In fact, the proof seems to point that DD may be able to produce with just about anyone.

Give him Bourque and Galchenyuk. He'll still produce points. Although it will be because Bourque is so good and Galchenyuk developed that fast.

And PS. the only time Desharnais was in the playoffs, he looked pretty damn solid. And, as posted by someone earlier (I think Andy, could be wrong), Desharnais had 10 points (and like +5) in 11 games versus Philadelphia and Boston last year.

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01-21-2013, 03:39 AM
  #180
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Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
And, as posted by someone earlier (I think Andy, could be wrong), Desharnais had 10 points (and like +5) in 11 games versus Philadelphia and Boston last year.
no, we should draft for size like in the 90's and early 2000'ies. that worked wonders!


Last edited by MasterDecoy: 01-21-2013 at 04:21 AM.
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01-21-2013, 03:42 AM
  #181
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DD has been doubted his entire career. Doubting him after the first game of the season is nothing new for him.

That said, his spot isn't guaranteed. Desharnais became a top six center by out performing Gomez. It isn't out of the question for Eller to out perform Desharnais.

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01-21-2013, 03:52 AM
  #182
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Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
no, we should draft for size like in the 90 and early 2000'ies. that worked wonders!
Hell yeah. I'd gladly ditch Desharnais to see Terry Ryan wearing the CH again.

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01-21-2013, 04:04 AM
  #183
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Hell yeah. I'd gladly ditch Desharnais to see Terry Ryan wearing the CH again.
Size matters, just ask Ron Jeremy.

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01-21-2013, 04:21 AM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Talks to Goalposts View Post
I have no problem with Desharnais in a top six if he's there as an offensive specialist a la Briere.

Thing is you need two solid two-way centers and a good winger depth (Like Buffalo and Philadelphia did when they were going deep in the playoffs with Briere) if you want to build a good team that way.

I don't doubt he's a gifted playmaker but I have severe reservations about him as an all round center.
Do you think Desharnais is capable of improving his all around game though?

While he's older than other sophomores (and he isn't truly a sophomore either), I think it's easy to forget that Desharnais is still developing. He seems to me to be a student of the game and relatively malleable still.

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01-21-2013, 04:24 AM
  #185
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Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
In like 15 years.. when he retires with over 1,000 career points.


What a god damn myth. When has this ever been proven? Oh right, when he was producing with Pouliot, Pyatt, Darche, and White?

Cole was struggling before he was paired with DD and Patches/DD had chemistry from Hamilton.

Desharnais played like 3 games with Cammalleri and Leblanc last year. He helped get Cammy back on track (Cammy went on to publically praise him in the media) and Leblanc looked the most dangerous he ever has in the NHL during that stint. Cammy went right back to struggling after this stint (no idea why they were split up anyway).

There is no way to prove that he NEEDS Pacioretty and Cole to produce. They got put together because the team was struggling, started lighting the ice on fire, so they were left together. In fact, the proof seems to point that DD may be able to produce with just about anyone.

Give him Bourque and Galchenyuk. He'll still produce points. Although it will be because Bourque is so good and Galchenyuk developed that fast.

And PS. the only time Desharnais was in the playoffs, he looked pretty damn solid. And, as posted by someone earlier (I think Andy, could be wrong), Desharnais had 10 points (and like +5) in 11 games versus Philadelphia and Boston last year.
He was the best player on the ice in game 7 against Boston, playing with Gionta and GOMEZ. Our odds of winning the game would have increased tremendously had he not gotten injured.

DD didn't play well on Saturday but he did look much quicker, which bodes well for the rest of the year.

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01-21-2013, 06:12 AM
  #186
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Seems like a recurring theme with the "we can't win with X at position Y. Most times it's ********, if Boston proved anything(as well as the habs last 2 cups), if you have a dominant goalie and play as a team you can win the cup.

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01-21-2013, 06:14 AM
  #187
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Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
no, we should draft for size like in the 90's and early 2000'ies. that worked wonders!
Indeed. Pick studs like Fisher over gnomes like Giroux

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Old
01-21-2013, 06:16 AM
  #188
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Originally Posted by muzion;58001617[B
]He was the best player on the ice in game 7 against Boston, playing with Gionta and GOMEZ.[/B] Our odds of winning the game would have increased tremendously had he not gotten injured.

DD didn't play well on Saturday but he did look much quicker, which bodes well for the rest of the year.
Desharnais was injured in game 5 by trying to squeeze between Neidenmeyer (?) and.. someone else. They smashed him badly then.

But Desharnais was the most dangerous forward in that game. And he also proved to be quite effective in game 3 and 4. I remember his PK puck battle against Chara, WHICH HE WON.

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01-21-2013, 07:04 AM
  #189
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DD has been doubted his entire career. Doubting him after the first game of the season is nothing new for him.
What I think as well. DD gave me a crow indigestion already. I have stopped questionning him now.

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01-21-2013, 07:19 AM
  #190
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
Desharnais was injured in game 5 by trying to squeeze between Neidenmeyer (?) and.. someone else. They smashed him badly then.

But Desharnais was the most dangerous forward in that game. And he also proved to be quite effective in game 3 and 4. I remember his PK puck battle against Chara, WHICH HE WON.
neidermeyer? you must mean seidenberg.

although it's not his forte, david does win more board battles than the anti-midget rabble would have you believe.

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01-21-2013, 07:40 AM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
1 of Plekanec/Desharnais can not be here next year. Pretty clear to me. It's not a knock on either one, but you can not be a strong team by being so small down the middle on the top 2 lines. Plekanec has 3 more years @ 5 M per year. It's probably what he would get on the UFA market if he was a UFA.

Desharnais will be a RFA this summer and he's 1 year away from UFA. The time to make the decision is this summer.

Galchenyuk must play center next year. Period. The longer we put off him learning as a NHL center, the more time it will take for this team to someday be a contender.

Really ****ing tired of being a shrimp team down the middle. We've gone from Koivu-Perreault/Gilmour to Koivu-Ribeiro to Koivu-Plekanec to Plekanec-Gomez to what we have now. Enough is enough.
I happen to agree with you on all your points. You can't be small down the middle, your fine on the wings but a centerman has to do double as the best defensive forward for the line as well.

For everyone else you have to realize David Desharnais is going to get a significant raise next season. Our cap hit for the 2013-2014 sits at 54million with the buyout of Scott Gomez. You have to think we will add something like 5million to the cap as well with Subban, so that is 59million with 17 players signed. Which means we don't have alot of flexibility for signing more players. Desharnais is going to get 4-4.5million minumum. That 4million is a massive raise to what he is making now. Does he deserve it? Yes he put the production up so he deserves to get paid for it. But should Montreal invest 4million into a 5.6'' centerman? That really is the big question. If the answer is yes then Montreal is in a very bad situation for the cap since we would be near the 64million cap limit and still need to sign a backup goalkeeper and probably 4 other utility players. Even using our AHL team to fill our holes we couldn't afford to fit them under the cap.

That then would force us to buyout out another player, who would that be? Kaberle? Bourque? Even if we did buy them out, we are still very tight to the cap limit needing to sign a decent back up goal keeper would cost minumum 1or 2 million. And if we bought out another player, we still have to find another player to replace that player to fill out our roster.

The question that people have to ask themselves is, Is Desharnais worth spending 4+million for 2 or 3 years because that is probably what Montreal is going to give him if the answer is yes. Wouldn't you rather spend that money on Galchenyuk and have him take over as our number one center instead of locking up the franchise to a small center for several years? That is the question people are going to have to ask themselves because whatever you may think Desharnais value is truly is, he is NOT the future for Montreal. Galchenyuk is. And if you pay Desharnais 4+million this year, then your locking Montreal in with Desharnais. Plekanac is already with us for 3 more years and we want to keep Eller. If your going to pay a centerman 4+million he better be centering the top 2 lines. So if you want to keep Desharnais, is he going to be a top 2 centerman for us? Or do we not want Galchenyuk to take over that mantle? That question has to be answered after this season because Desharnais is going to get a big raise, it just depends if Montreal wants to keep him for the foreseeable future.

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01-21-2013, 07:42 AM
  #192
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Plekanec will be gone.
Not Desharnais.

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01-21-2013, 07:46 AM
  #193
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Plekanec will be gone.
Not Desharnais.
Only and only if Galchenyuk or Eller proves to be able to replace Plek as a shutdown centre on the PK.


But I do think we could get a juicy return for Plek...

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01-21-2013, 07:48 AM
  #194
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The question that people have to ask themselves is, Is Desharnais worth spending 4+million for 2 or 3 years because that is probably what Montreal is going to give him if the answer is yes.
From this distance, I'll be surprised if Desharnais gets "4+million" on his next deal. He's still RFA, and where he has come from, I think he appreciates playing and wouldn't hold out for large money. Obviously he won't draw any offer sheets or anything like that. Maybe he could file for arbitration and find a way to get more if he produces well this year, but the Habs will be able to walk away if he gets an award that high. I'll be surprised if he even tops $3M, end of the day. At something in the $2.5-$3M per range, for 3 or 4 years, I'm quite satisfied keeping him. He may not be the ideal fit for the long term, but in the meantime, he's the best we've got, so no point in clearing him away until we've got something better to go with.

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01-21-2013, 08:07 AM
  #195
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He reminds me of how bad of a team we are.

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01-21-2013, 08:33 AM
  #196
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He reminds me of how bad of a team we are.
Yeah that 60-points and +10 rating in his first full season was horrible. 55-point pace since sticking in the NHL.

Just terrible.

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01-21-2013, 08:36 AM
  #197
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I understand that any great team wouldn't have desharnais on the first line but why (some of you guys) want to trade him or just not sign him at the end of the season?

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01-21-2013, 08:45 AM
  #198
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I don't think this is true, he didn't look too good last game but neither did Cole & Patches for most of the game. I think what is needed is not necessarily a bigger stronger top 6 but someone that can go out there and play a high energy crash and bang game while being a legitimate top 6.

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01-21-2013, 08:46 AM
  #199
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Plekanec is not better than DD.

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01-21-2013, 08:53 AM
  #200
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oof I haven't been able to keep up with this thread but I did not intend for it to become a debate about whether or not Desharnais is a good player.

I think he is a pretty damn good player, but the team is hampered by having both he and Plekanec as our top 2 centers. It's the same story we've had in Montreal for a decade now, small centers...put Desharnais on the wing and he'll still get his 50 points while a bigger player (eller, gally, someone acquired via trade) can provide a presence on faceoff dots/defensively

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