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Sharks sign Gomez to 1 year $700k deal (Burns to IR to make roster spot)

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01-21-2013, 12:14 AM
  #226
The Nemesis
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
Anyone lamenting paying more than a million. On a regular open market july 1st free agency day he gets 3 mil minimum per year for 3 years. If we sign him for 2 mil for 2 years or even 3 years it would be a major steal. This guy is easily better than Ray Whitney who got 4.5 for 2 years as a 40 year old. Put him with Juicy and Havlat and he gets 50 pts.
Nobody's "hating" Gomez. Regardless of what you think he could/should do given the right situation, his value has absolutely tanked after the last couple years in Montreal. If you give him more than a million dollars, you're not doing your job right.

The only time you pay for potential is with RFAs or when the player is in the driver's seat. That's not where Gomez is right now. The contract he's getting is to try and earn his way back to regular NHL duty.

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01-21-2013, 12:49 AM
  #227
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Originally Posted by TheRealAllstar10 View Post
Woah there. You do know Ray Whitney put up 77 points LAST year. More than Gomez has had since 05-06.
Whitney trumps Gomez at this point in their careers. Given the choice between Gomez 2 years @ 2mil and Whitney at his price i would go with The Wizard everytime
He was given 1st line minutes and pp time. Whitney is a good player but Gomez is younger and more valuable to us. If hes healthy I think it'll be a no brainer that he's better at this point than whitney. You need to look up their stats. Gomez is way more reliable in point production. Whitney's really just had a late surge in his point total. I bet he's been very sheltered and gets soft minutes and PP time.


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01-21-2013, 12:54 AM
  #228
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Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post
Nobody's "hating" Gomez. Regardless of what you think he could/should do given the right situation, his value has absolutely tanked after the last couple years in Montreal. If you give him more than a million dollars, you're not doing your job right.

The only time you pay for potential is with RFAs or when the player is in the driver's seat. That's not where Gomez is right now. The contract he's getting is to try and earn his way back to regular NHL duty.
Sorry but you're wrong. He had one maybe 2 off seasons due to injury. Other than that his career is the model of consistency. Averaging somewhere around 50 pts a season if not better.

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01-21-2013, 01:03 AM
  #229
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
Sorry but you're wrong.
I guess the majority of the GMs are wrong too. But what do they know?

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01-21-2013, 01:04 AM
  #230
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Interesting read about Gomez...

http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/20...useless-player

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01-21-2013, 01:06 AM
  #231
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I think we should sign him for 2 years in case he's good.

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01-21-2013, 01:07 AM
  #232
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I guess the majority of the GMs are wrong too. But what do they know?
Why would you say that? I think Robinson gave the sharks the inside track and anyone else interested saw it as a waste of time as Gomez isn't looking for a payday at the moment since he's already got one. Only serious cup contenders were probably even in the running but he obviously has a close tie to Robinson.

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01-21-2013, 01:07 AM
  #233
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Originally Posted by Kitten Mittons View Post
I think we should sign him for 2 years in case he's good.
Bingo... This has the potential to be a gift for the next 2 years. He's a better setup man than anyone on the sharks not named JT. Him feeding Couture and Juicy could crack 40.

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01-21-2013, 01:08 AM
  #234
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
Bingo...
But still at 1.5M tops. He doesn't need the salary apart from an ego trip, and we're already in trouble next year in terms of cap space.

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01-21-2013, 01:12 AM
  #235
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
Whitney's really just had a late surge in his point total. I bet he's been very sheltered and gets soft minutes and PP time.
Not anymore than Gomez has been in his career. Whitney last season and Gomez in his full seasons with Montreal and NY faced similar competition. Gomez was sheltered in his last seasons with the team.

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Bingo... This has the potential to be a gift for the next 2 years. He's a better setup man than anyone on the sharks not named JT. Him feeding Couture and Juicy could crack 40.
I'd say Havlat is a better playmaker as well.

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01-21-2013, 01:15 AM
  #236
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But still at 1.5M tops. He doesn't need the salary apart from an ego trip, and we're already in trouble next year in terms of cap space.
True, but I think they'll make a couple trades to fix that. Clowe is done as a shark after this season IMO. If Gomez plays on the 2nd line that's a steal at 2 mil for the next 2 seasons. That's just the max of what I think they might pay. I don't think they'll have to pay that much though. We'l know tomorrow.

Simple reality though, a 50 point (minimum) player when healthy is worth more than 2 mil in the NHL.

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01-21-2013, 01:18 AM
  #237
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
Sorry but you're wrong. He had one maybe 2 off seasons due to injury. Other than that his career is the model of consistency. Averaging somewhere around 50 pts a season if not better.
yes, he one awful season and one pretty bad season. They also happen to be his two most recent ones. And fair as an evaluative tool or not, he did so while being judged as a guy who was being paid to be a front-line scoring forward. If you have to go back 3 years before you can point to a season as an example of what you think you'd be paying for, it's going to impact the player's value. Pro sports are the ultimate "what have you done for me lately" business.

If he goes out this year and puts up a pro-rated equivalent to a 50-60 point season, then yes you can write off some of the impact of the last couple years and hand out a value more in line with his career-long production. But until then you pay him based on what recent history says he's worth. And recent history says he's not worth a whole lot.

You only need to look as far as his compliance buyout compatriot, Wade Redden. He was reasonably productive right up until his last full NHL year in 09-10, and he was pretty productive in his two AHL years with the Whale. He's not worth the $6.5 he was getting before the buyout, but by the same logic you're applying to Gomez, he should be getting more than the $800k ($1m max if he hits his bonus triggers) that the Blues are paying him. But $800k is what he's getting because he's not been an NHL factor for 2 seasons and nobody knows quite what to expect at this point. Same as Gomez.

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01-21-2013, 01:26 AM
  #238
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Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post
yes, he one awful season and one pretty bad season. They also happen to be his two most recent ones. And fair as an evaluative tool or not, he did so while being judged as a guy who was being paid to be a front-line scoring forward. If you have to go back 3 years before you can point to a season as an example of what you think you'd be paying for, it's going to impact the player's value. Pro sports are the ultimate "what have you done for me lately" business.

If he goes out this year and puts up a pro-rated equivalent to a 50-60 point season, then yes you can write off some of the impact of the last couple years and hand out a value more in line with his career-long production. But until then you pay him based on what recent history says he's worth. And recent history says he's not worth a whole lot.

You only need to look as far as his compliance buyout compatriot, Wade Redden. He was reasonably productive right up until his last full NHL year in 09-10, and he was pretty productive in his two AHL years with the Whale. He's not worth the $6.5 he was getting before the buyout, but by the same logic you're applying to Gomez, he should be getting more than the $800k ($1m max if he hits his bonus triggers) that the Blues are paying him. But $800k is what he's getting because he's not been an NHL factor for 2 seasons and nobody knows quite what to expect at this point. Same as Gomez.

Redden is not a comparable in any reality. Redden sucked so bad he was demoted to the minors for a long time. DIdn't Redden benefit from playing with Chara when he was "good"? Gomez was injured one season and had a crappy year apparently with revolving linemates. Previous to that he carried the mail on his lines. He was the horse.

Yes we can agree that his previous contracts were too high but the stats don't lie. He's too young to suddenly be that awful without some outside influence.

I guess we'll see what happens if he signs.


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01-21-2013, 01:29 AM
  #239
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
He was given 1st line minutes and pp time. Whitney is a good player but Gomez is younger and more valuable to us. If hes healthy I think it'll be a no brainer that he's better at this point than whitney. You need to look up their stats. Gomez is way more reliable in point production. Whitney's really just had a late surge in his point total. I bet he's been very sheltered and gets soft minutes and PP time.
If you wanted to talk prime Gomez vs. prime Whitney you have a case. But Gomez is a has-been. Sure he can still play but he's a shell of his former self. While Whitney has always made his teamates better not to mention he is one of the greatest power play players in the game. I dont doubt Gomez could be usefull scoring support on the 3rd line similiar to Wellwood. Although i do believe he could be even better than Wellwood as a 3rd line option

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01-21-2013, 01:42 AM
  #240
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If you wanted to talk prime Gomez vs. prime Whitney you have a case. But Gomez is a has-been. Sure he can still play but he's a shell of his former self. While Whitney has always made his teamates better not to mention he is one of the greatest power play players in the game. I dont doubt Gomez could be usefull scoring support on the 3rd line similiar to Wellwood. Although i do believe he could be even better than Wellwood as a 3rd line option
I guess we'll see...

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01-21-2013, 03:46 AM
  #241
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For 700k please DW yes you mean

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01-21-2013, 03:49 AM
  #242
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Honestly, I feel Gomez will outperform Wellwood's point production. I see at a minimum a 25 point season from Gomez if he is centering our 3rd line.

If he comes cheap, I would not be upset with a two year deal. If he comes in at under 1m per year he will either be worth the contract or he may just exceed it. With the speed he adds to this team I don't see how he will not be worth a sub 1m deal regardless of production.

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01-21-2013, 04:57 AM
  #243
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That was pretty interesting. This part is what I'm taking away from it:

Quote:
All of these numbers could be a coincidence based upon a small 28 game sample size, but I do think it provides food for thought on what Scott Gomez does provide the Montreal Canadiens. He will never provide the offense of a $7M player, but he does provide under rated value.
If we sign him for cheap and he turns out to be a consistent producer it's a steal, if he isn't a big producer then we didn't lose a lot. Seems like a low risk, (potentially) high reward situation, as long as we don't give him the bank.

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01-21-2013, 10:20 AM
  #244
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That was pretty interesting. This part is what I'm taking away from it:



If we sign him for cheap and he turns out to be a consistent producer it's a steal, if he isn't a big producer then we didn't lose a lot. Seems like a low risk, (potentially) high reward situation, as long as we don't give him the bank.
He's definitely not worse than any on our bottom six. As for him out performing clowe, only time will tell.

I'm hoping clowe figures it out because he is my favorite player, but if not we need to trade high on him.

Gomez could definitely fill in on the top six, and I think havlat is becoming much more of a shoot first player rather than pass first. So it could potentially be a good fit.

I'm mostly curious about his speed, we were just god awful slow

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01-21-2013, 11:04 AM
  #245
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I'm predicting multi-year deal. They're working out the details. That is why its taking this long, otherwise he would be signed by now.

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01-21-2013, 11:12 AM
  #246
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I don't know why anyone worried that this is taking time. The Sharks are doing to right thing here. As Eliotte Friedman said:

Quote:
"Interesting dance between the San Jose Sharks and Gomez, but it makes a lot of sense. Because he was cut by Montreal and unable to skate at a high tempo as the NHL and NHLPA negotiated an opening, he gets a few extra days to tune up. Meanwhile, the Sharks, who are close to the cap, save pennies by holding off for a few days (rumbling is one year at a prorated $700,000). Smart by both sides."
The Sharks also have to make a roster move prior to signing Gomez. I would think putting Burns on IR would be that move.

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01-21-2013, 11:13 AM
  #247
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Originally Posted by bullslugg View Post
I'm predicting multi-year deal. They're working out the details. That is why its taking this long, otherwise he would be signed by now.
Actually I was thinking what happened here is that Gomez wanted to sign with SJ, did not get an offer from us, so came to us and asked instead. Doug said we would be looking at these kinds of numbers, but we want to see if you will fit with the team first, would you mind going through some practices. Gomez said sure, and that is the delay.

Just a guess.

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01-21-2013, 11:16 AM
  #248
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With Irwin about the only player exempt from waivers, I have to wonder if part of the reason for the delay in signing is to trade someone off the NHL roster (so there's a roster spot "available" when Demers returns).

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01-21-2013, 11:18 AM
  #249
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With Irwin about the only player exempt from waivers, I have to wonder if part of the reason for the delay in signing is to trade someone off the NHL roster (so there's a roster spot "available" when Demers returns).
Burns can go on IR. Don't think there's a very good chance he plays w/i the next 7 days.

If Gomez signs I'd imagine either McLaren (hopefully) or Sheppard get waived and sent back to Worcester.

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01-21-2013, 11:23 AM
  #250
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Burns can go on IR. Don't think there's a very good chance he plays w/i the next 7 days.

If Gomez signs I'd imagine either McLaren (hopefully) or Sheppard get waived and sent back to Worcester.
Can't waive Sheppard or Petrecki. They would almost certainly get picked up. Mclaren on the other hand wouldn't be picked up.

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