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Team Toughness 2013

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01-21-2013, 12:54 PM
  #26
TankLarkin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
In the Boston game...when Rupp fought Thornton and Bickel fought Campbell, it left Lucic to run around like a mad man...we have no answers for that.
Exactly. Horton, Chara, Marchand, McQuaid too. The path to the cup goes through Boston in a 7 game series. Scary.

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01-21-2013, 01:17 PM
  #27
Leetch66
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LOL...then we better hope the Pens or the Flyers get the Bruins !

Last season Konopka and Carkner/Neil took the best out of us . I think the Bruins would really hammer us .

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01-21-2013, 01:21 PM
  #28
-31-
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Does anyone remember why we got knocked out of the playoffs last season?

Oh yeah, New Jersey scored more goals than us.

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01-21-2013, 01:50 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Does anyone remember why we got knocked out of the playoffs last season?

Oh yeah, New Jersey scored more goals than us.
Yeah, but they punched them into the net.

This toughness thing is overblown. We have plenty of grit. Would a Milan Lucic type of player be a nice addition? Sure, but I'm not at all interested in worrying about one team. We were 3-1 against the Bruins last year. One game isn't going to suddenly make them the biggest threat we face.

The path to the cup also potentially runs through the Pens. They mopped the floor with us last night and they've had our number in general over the last couple of years. I'm far more worried about them than the Bruins.

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01-21-2013, 01:53 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Does anyone remember why we got knocked out of the playoffs last season?

Oh yeah, New Jersey scored more goals than us.
We are 1 for 9 so far on the PP this year (5 on 3).
Last year we were 23rd in the league at 15,7% conversion.
The year before we were 18th at 16,9%

This is our real problem
If this is addressed & solved many other pieces will fall into place
We simply need to get better here
Period
Torts neither seems to ackknoweldge or know how to fix this gaping, glaring disaster.
If we got up to a Top 5-10 in the league to around 21% - we would pot another 20 goals per year.
We certainly posses the talent to achieve this
But the system is IMO the real hampering effect here.
That would also be a great factor regarding toughness IMO
Easier to be tough while leading games as opposed to chasing a come from behind win - which we are terrible at.
Now we instead seem to start our games with penalties on the first shift by non tough players... not good

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01-21-2013, 01:58 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Yeah, but they punched them into the net.

This toughness thing is overblown. We have plenty of grit. Would a Milan Lucic type of player be a nice addition? Sure, but I'm not at all interested in worrying about one team. We were 3-1 against the Bruins last year. One game isn't going to suddenly make them the biggest threat we face.

The path to the cup also potentially runs through the Pens. They mopped the floor with us last night and they've had our number in general over the last couple of years. I'm far more worried about them than the Bruins.
Us getting the 8th seed would not have us facing Pittsburgh until ECF in theory - but when they already will have been eliminated by The Islanders No problem!!!

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01-21-2013, 02:00 PM
  #32
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Didn't the Rangers lead the league in fighting majors last season??

Toughness isn't just fighting, though and fighting doesn't amount to success so that's that.

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01-21-2013, 02:21 PM
  #33
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...you're all using the wrong word. It's not a question about toughness, as many of these guys are as tough or tougher than last season's team. It's WORK.

This team isn't WORKING to get the puck, not out-working the other team to create, and not working together as a squad.

We were 100% an identity team, work, hustle, grit. We got rid of that identity this offseason and brought in a scorer, a fighter, and a few question marks. It's not 2011/12 + NASH. Its 2011/12 + a scorer, minus the core of our identity.

We're gonna have to recreate an identity from the ground up around the players we have, no base it off of what we were or had. It's that simple, don't be blinded.

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01-21-2013, 02:28 PM
  #34
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There's plenty of grit. The problem with the Rangers in the first two games has been playing defense at an AHL level....and not just Stu Bickel.

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01-21-2013, 02:42 PM
  #35
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Team defense is a bigger problem. They seem to have read their own newspaper clippings and now think they're some freewheeling powerhouse, and forgot that the New York Rangers win with defensive and forechecking.

Yeah, Lucic got away with running around like a punk. He's rare that he can score like a top 6 and play rough like a bottom six. You just don't know what you're anticipating when he steps on the ice. But make no mistake, our guys aren't afraid of him. They just want to win, and will let him take penalties.

Of course, we don't want Cally or Danny G dropping the gloves with Lucic, even though they would. So if he runs Hags, and we've got Riche and Nasher out there, do we really want them responding? both are better players than Lucic, and maybe Nash has the size has and ability to hang with him, but we still don't want it.

If Rupp, StuBick Pyatt or Asham, can get him to go, GREAT. I don't really care if they lose, we're taking a solid scoring threat off the ice for nothing. I don't really want anyone else fighting with him unless the team NEEDS it.

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01-21-2013, 02:50 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by StaalWars View Post
Lack of toughness isn't the main problem with this team.
With all do respect.. IMHO i'm almost completely disagreeing.. I say almost, because i'm not sure it's the MAIN problem but real close.. This team has No One that other team's fear. Mike Rupp ends up on his back everytime he fights. That was the case last year as well. Why bring him back?.. God bless him, but he has to go! When your skill player's have to start growing eye's in the back of their head they can't concentrate and do their job..A.K.A- Hagelin Saturday night(still can't believe he wasn't hurt by Lucic)..Now Krieder..I realize you can't pay Dubi and Prusty what their asking but you have to replace them.. IMO this team is soft and will miss these player's more than you think.

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01-21-2013, 02:56 PM
  #37
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I would absolutely not bring McIlrath into this team with the way that they're playing right now. Why on earth would you bring your #1 D prospect up into the NHL when your team is playing awful defense and even guys like Staal are having trouble? That's a quick way to ruin McI's confidence. If he's ready to come up he should come up once the team settles down and gets team d in order.

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01-21-2013, 04:28 PM
  #38
Orr Nightmare
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
Team defense is a bigger problem. They seem to have read their own newspaper clippings and now think they're some freewheeling powerhouse, and forgot that the New York Rangers win with defensive and forechecking.

Yeah, Lucic got away with running around like a punk. He's rare that he can score like a top 6 and play rough like a bottom six. You just don't know what you're anticipating when he steps on the ice. But make no mistake, our guys aren't afraid of him. They just want to win, and will let him take penalties.

Of course, we don't want Cally or Danny G dropping the gloves with Lucic, even though they would. So if he runs Hags, and we've got Riche and Nasher out there, do we really want them responding? both are better players than Lucic, and maybe Nash has the size has and ability to hang with him, but we still don't want it.

If Rupp, StuBick Pyatt or Asham, can get him to go, GREAT. I don't really care if they lose, we're taking a solid scoring threat off the ice for nothing. I don't really want anyone else fighting with him unless the team NEEDS it.
There isn't one guy on our team who can fight Lucic and win....let alone Chara...I would think Rupp would have a hard time with McQuaid.

We have a lot of guys with big balls but even guys with balls aren't stupid enough to fight guys who would destroy them...if Cally or Giradi fought Lucic...they wouldn't play another game this year.

Carkner would have been the perfect signing...last year Prust had the balls to fight Lucic and maybe Asham does as well but it will never deter Lucic from imposing his will.

Nash is the last guy who should fight Lucic and Nash can't beat Malkin in a fight yet you think it makes sense to fight Lucic...

The 4th line of the Devils beat the Rangers last year in the playoffs...Carter, Beiner...both had size that the Rangers couldn't handle and it will be our achilles again this year.

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01-21-2013, 04:45 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
There isn't one guy on our team who can fight Lucic and win....let alone Chara...I would think Rupp would have a hard time with McQuaid.

We have a lot of guys with big balls but even guys with balls aren't stupid enough to fight guys who would destroy them...if Cally or Giradi fought Lucic...they wouldn't play another game this year.

Carkner would have been the perfect signing...last year Prust had the balls to fight Lucic and maybe Asham does as well but it will never deter Lucic from imposing his will.

Nash is the last guy who should fight Lucic and Nash can't beat Malkin in a fight yet you think it makes sense to fight Lucic...

The 4th line of the Devils beat the Rangers last year in the playoffs...Carter, Beiner...both had size that the Rangers couldn't handle and it will be our achilles again this year.
I'm not talking about fighting and winning. I'm not asking anyone to go toe to toe. If any of our guys decided to pick a fight with Lucic and play it safe (read: throw a few, clinch up and end the fight) i wouldn't be upset. Those punches hurt, but you really can't get the kind of power on ice as you can on solid ground, and these men are professional athletes. There aren't many players in the NHL who can't at the least defend themselves from anyone else.

Fighting in the NHL isn't always about winning. Sometimes a player's willingness to fight is all it takes, and sometimes it's about getting a player off the ice for 5 minutes.

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01-21-2013, 04:48 PM
  #40
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Bottom 6 could be improved on, and I miss Prust a ton, but this isn't a soft team.

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01-21-2013, 05:04 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by TankLarkin View Post
only thing McIlrath will do at this point in his development is make Bickel look good. and that's bad.
Yup, Bickel is better than McIlrath right now. The Undertaker fights better and his straight up speed is better, but Bickel is the better player for now.

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01-21-2013, 05:11 PM
  #42
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Would be nice if Callahan started finishing his checks again. He seems to still be in no-check playoff mode.

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01-21-2013, 05:18 PM
  #43
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Would be nice if Callahan started finishing his checks again. He seems to still be in no-check playoff mode.
Guess you didn't watch the first game where all he did was throw his body.

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01-21-2013, 05:19 PM
  #44
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Wow. If Bickel is better than McIlrath than all of the "McIlrath's been improving by leaps and bounds!" fanfare is garbage.

That's honestly disappointing to hear.

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01-21-2013, 05:25 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
Wow. If Bickel is better than McIlrath than all of the "McIlrath's been improving by leaps and bounds!" fanfare is garbage.

That's honestly disappointing to hear.
especially since Vladimir Tarasenko has already began his NHL career.

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01-21-2013, 05:49 PM
  #46
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The McIlrath pick was not a good one. I will always stand by that.

Even if McIlrath hits his ceiling he won't be on Tarasenko's level.

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02-02-2013, 10:32 AM
  #47
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I would have sooner had him , Mashinter , try Gallant...a much tougher Islander prospect than MacIver .

http://www.hockeyfights.com/fights/115504

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02-02-2013, 10:41 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Leetch66 View Post
I would have sooner had him , Mashinter , try Gallant...a much tougher Islander prospect than MacIver .

http://www.hockeyfights.com/fights/115504
I don't think Gallant was in the lineup. Mash is great for CT. I don't Haley has fought once since he was acquired. Was very impressive in his NHL scraps too.

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02-02-2013, 11:19 AM
  #49
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lost a lot of depth in the nash trade and then seeing prust walk

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02-02-2013, 11:42 AM
  #50
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I cant wait till McI comes up.

We could use this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9K4FHQUlmQ

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