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P.K Subban Thread 4.0 - Still Unsigned Edition

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01-21-2013, 02:41 PM
  #601
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Originally Posted by Strik_IX View Post
Bertrand Raymond is that you?
I hate that guy with a passion. Please don't compare me to him.

Also, like I said, I'm reaching big time. Just trying to find an explanation for something that makes no sense.

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01-21-2013, 02:42 PM
  #602
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I think that the offersheet scenario is more and more probable. PK wants to play, Bergevin doesn't want to break, so PK will go see a team that wants to pay him the $$$ and he's gonna go see Bergevin with the "Match it or i'm playing elsewhere" scenario.

I'm scared...
If thats his attitude then BYE BYE dont let the door hit you in the ass!

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01-21-2013, 02:42 PM
  #603
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Originally Posted by Dr Gonzo View Post
Are you forgetting he pushed Plekanec once or twice?!?!??!?!?!?!?!

Oh and uhm....He looks like the kind of guy that takes a penny from the "take a penny/leave a penny" jar at the convenience store. Greedy human 101.
He left some towels in the ground in the locker room once which Gill asked him to pick up.

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01-21-2013, 02:44 PM
  #604
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
I hate that guy with a passion. Please don't compare me to him.

Also, like I said, I'm reaching big time. Just trying to find an explanation for something that makes no sense.
Well, if the hat fits...

No offense, but that's his style

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01-21-2013, 02:47 PM
  #605
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If thats his attitude then BYE BYE dont let the door hit you in the ass!
Neither PK nor his agent can "force" a team to offer sheet him the money he wants.

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01-21-2013, 02:50 PM
  #606
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Originally Posted by Hannibal View Post
I think that the offersheet scenario is more and more probable. PK wants to play, Bergevin doesn't want to break, so PK will go see a team that wants to pay him the $$$ and he's gonna go see Bergevin with the "Match it or i'm playing elsewhere" scenario.

I'm scared...
If there were an offer sheet it would be under 6.5M and we would only get a 1st, 2nd and 3rd. That's nowhere near Subban's value and IMO we would have to match anything.

Now, an offer sheet would force Bergevin to do the right thing. I think other teams aren't likely to send an offer sheet to Subban because they know the habs would likely match and the only purpose it would serve is to force Bergevin to sign a player to a higher salary than he would like. I doubt that after a lockout like this, teams would want to start that kind of monetary warfare.

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01-21-2013, 02:55 PM
  #607
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
He left some towels in the ground in the locker room once which Gill asked him to pick up.
Disgusting.

Time to waive this egotistical maniac.

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01-21-2013, 02:58 PM
  #608
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
If there were an offer sheet it would be under 6.5M and we would only get a 1st, 2nd and 3rd. That's nowhere near Subban's value and IMO we would have to match anything.

Now, an offer sheet would force Bergevin to do the right thing. I think other teams aren't likely to send an offer sheet to Subban because they know the habs would likely match and the only purpose it would serve is to force Bergevin to sign a player to a higher salary than he would like. I doubt that after a lockout like this, teams would want to start that kind of monetary warfare.
Exactly.

Subban and his agent have not much good cards in hand.

For the good of PK, he must sign as soon as possible, even a one year deal and go to arbitration next Summer.

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01-21-2013, 03:01 PM
  #609
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Does PK gain leverage if we lose 3-4 games in a row but lose leverage if we win, say 3-4 of the first 15 games?

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01-21-2013, 03:04 PM
  #610
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Neither PK nor his agent can "force" a team to offer sheet him the money he wants.
I infer from the fact that no offer sheet has been extended that Subban and Meehan haven't found another GM who would meet their terms. I also assume that Bergevin would probably match it if one were offered by a rival in the East.

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01-21-2013, 03:05 PM
  #611
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Originally Posted by gusfring View Post
Does PK gain leverage if we lose 3-4 games in a row but lose leverage if we win, say 3-4 of the first 15 games?
IMO we gain more and more leverage everyday no matter what

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01-21-2013, 03:07 PM
  #612
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If the rumor 6yr for 24m is true. We should give him that amount...

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01-21-2013, 03:09 PM
  #613
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If the rumor 6yr for 24m is true. We should give him that amount...
In a heartbeat. And I'd see if Meehan was dumb enough to do it for 8 years.

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01-21-2013, 03:11 PM
  #614
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Originally Posted by ClasslessGuy View Post
IMO we gain more and more leverage everyday no matter what
I'm just saying, the outcry after 3 games will be immense, while after about 15 games, realization that this isn't a good team will settle in for those delusional fans.

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01-21-2013, 03:12 PM
  #615
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
I infer from the fact that no offer sheet has been extended that Subban and Meehan haven't found another GM who would meet their terms. I also assume that Bergevin would probably match it if one were offered by a rival in the East.
Or offer sheets were offered, and Subban rather stay with the Habs.

Maybe use them as leverage in negotiations. How can you know?

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01-21-2013, 03:13 PM
  #616
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
I infer from the fact that no offer sheet has been extended that Subban and Meehan haven't found another GM who would meet their terms. I also assume that Bergevin would probably match it if one were offered by a rival in the East.
We only know that no offer sheets have been signed by PK.

He could have received 29 offer sheets for all we know.

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01-21-2013, 03:14 PM
  #617
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Correct me if i'm wrong but if x team send an offer sheet to subban 4.5 a year for 3 years.

We match the offer so Subban is automaticaly signed for 3 years 4.5?

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01-21-2013, 03:14 PM
  #618
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Pay him 4.5 per for two years and watch him develop. I like that idea. But if it's going to be the end of the world then don't "stick to your guns" on it. Don't ruin the relationship over something like this.
But why watch him develop? You know he's a top 30 D in the NHL already, and from watching players over the years, I'm sure you can differentiate those that are good but still have big question marks and could turn up to be a flop, with those that are looking like they will just keep progressing.
Signing PK now to a long term actually makes more sense from a managerial point of view. You're likely going to get him to a cheaper deal and as a RFA he's probably not asking for the moon. I seriously doubt PK is asking to be part of the 10 best paid NHL Dman at this point, and I doubt Meehan would tell him to sit at home in order to get that amount and possibly lose a season over it. If that's the type of advice Meehan gave, he wouldn't have that many clients.

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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
If this drags out to a point where a trade is possible I wonder if the Bruins wouldn't make a good trading partner.

A bit unrealistic but what about PK for Horton and Hamilton? Maybe not exactly but those would be the principles involved.
That would be horrible, absolutely horrible, and Boston would do it in a heart beat.
Hamilton is nothing more than an unproven prospect with less upside than PK, and Horton is just a top 6 forward. Garbage deal.
Not only that, but do you even remember the style PK plays?? You would want to give that skilled pest to your nemesis?? Are you sure you're not a closet Bruins fan??
Horrible idea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maliki2 View Post
Personally I could care less about PK at this point. Trade him if we must. He's not a game breaker and at this point this team won't be much better with him in the lineup. If we can get a few decent picks for him, I'd say trade him away for our future at this point. The guy has a ego the size of Earth. He's not worth 5 or 6 million a year. That would handcuff us for years to come.
You mean like drawing a penalty at the end of game in the PK trailing by a goal, and then scoring on the PP??? Oh no actually, he did that.
You've made it clear that you're evaluation of PK is weak and reeks of bias.
PK is a top pairing Dman in the NHL. Not sure how many times this should be explained, but skilled players don't handcuff you, those are the guys you gladly pay and overpay if you have to. Aging veterans signed to contracts they won't fulfill handcuff you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
It's the 3rd or 4th article I read where all the stats point one way ie Subban is a stud young #1 dman that any team would jump at the chance of signing to a long term deal. This also confirms my own evaluation of the player after having watched nearly all his games.

On the other hand, I have yet to see a compelling argument against signing Subban to a long term deal.

But our GM Bergevin is unconvinced..

Even the Friedman article, the Stars want to sign Benn to a long term deal, but it's Benn who wants something shorter. That's normal. This situation in Montreal is abnormal.

I've been thinking and I can only think of one rational explanation. NHL is going to be cracking down on performance enhancing drugs next season. Maybe PK is a guy who they know is using them and they think he'll decline after not being able to use them anymore. I am reaching big time at this point because that's the only thing that would rationally explain Bergevin's reticence. It's that or Bergevin is dumb. Not sure which is worse.
I seriously doubt that, but as you said, you're reaching.

My thought is more of an ego/principle thing. Bergevin seems set on this bridge contract idea, and as a rookie GM, in Mtl, he wants to make sure he's the boss. No better way to do that than to hold his ground versus the team's best player.
Moving forward, guys that perform as well as PK will know, Bergevin is willing to make you sit out a full season to get his way, so if he says bridge contract, it means, bridge contract.
I think that's a very idiotic approach, and just a bad way to do business.

I doubt there's anything about enhancement drugs, and if that was the problem, they could put in a clause that would protect them against it.

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Old
01-21-2013, 03:15 PM
  #619
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
I infer from the fact that no offer sheet has been extended that Subban and Meehan haven't found another GM who would meet their terms. I also assume that Bergevin would probably match it if one were offered by a rival in the East.
When you make an offer sheet you have to think that the offer you make will put the other GM in a tough spot and prevent him from matching so you can actually acquire the player for that price and term. There is not much advantage in just driving a player's value up unless it's part of a bigger Machiavellian plot to throw their salary structure out of whack and get another player later, or force them to let a player go and weaken them. But this rarely ever happens... I can only think of the Niklas Hjalmarsson offer sheet, or maybe the Fedorov one. But the habs mediocrity over the past 15 years have made them too irrelevant for another team to want to do that IMO.

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01-21-2013, 03:16 PM
  #620
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Originally Posted by ClasslessGuy View Post
Correct me if i'm wrong but if x team send an offer sheet to subban 4.5 a year for 3 years.

We match the offer so Subban is automaticaly signed for 3 years 4.5?
As long as Subban signs the offer sheet, yes.

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01-21-2013, 03:16 PM
  #621
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Originally Posted by ClasslessGuy View Post
Correct me if i'm wrong but if x team send an offer sheet to subban 4.5 a year for 3 years.

We match the offer so Subban is automaticaly signed for 3 years 4.5?
Ya. But no team is going to sign PK to an offer sheet they think management will match. It's useless. They won't get the player and they will worsen their relationship with one GM. Pointless.

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Old
01-21-2013, 03:19 PM
  #622
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Originally Posted by ClasslessGuy View Post
If the rumor 6yr for 24m is true. We should give him that amount...
What rumor? I'm not really into breaking structure for just one guy and go long term (as opposed to a bridge contract) but 6yr 24m? My lord, Bergevin better not say no to that, that's just insane.

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01-21-2013, 03:19 PM
  #623
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Re-signed or traded by end of week. book-it.

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Old
01-21-2013, 03:21 PM
  #624
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
Exactly.

Subban and his agent have not much good cards in hand.

For the good of PK, he must sign as soon as possible, even a one year deal and go to arbitration next Summer.
That would be horrible for the team. Actually the worse case scenario.
PK would make a lot more off arbitration.

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Old
01-21-2013, 03:22 PM
  #625
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Originally Posted by pepperMonkey View Post
What rumor? I'm not really into breaking structure for just one guy and go long term (as opposed to a bridge contract) but 6yr 24m? My lord, Bergevin better not say no to that, that's just insane.
Everyday I twitter search for the word subban and I got at least 15 message in the last 30 min (english and french) about a 24m 6y contract

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