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Old
01-22-2013, 10:38 AM
  #851
Jame
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mergus View Post
What do you need help with Jame?

I think the kid has bust written all over him. I think the vast majority of sabres fans are wayyyyyyyy over hyping the kid. I hope they do the same thing they did with Kassian. Realize he isn't what they hoped he'd be and trade him before he loses too much value.
What led you to this opinion? His game has only gotten better over the last 2 years.

What informed this opinion of yours?

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01-22-2013, 11:11 AM
  #852
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I can't wait to see Armia in North America. His game has only gotten better since we drafted him.

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01-22-2013, 02:53 PM
  #853
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Like flyingpig said, it is a gut feeling. I watched all of the world junior games the past two years and have caught highlights from Assat games.

By the way, how has he improved? Statistically speaking he has regressed this season... (.7 PPG to .56).

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=130454

Want to see what a real top prospect does in that league?

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=118389
Just under a PPG EVERY season he played over there, including his rookie season.

I just don't think he has what it takes to replace Vanek like many people are expecting of him.

Feel free to bump this post in 3 years, only time will tell.

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Old
01-22-2013, 03:08 PM
  #854
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Originally Posted by Mergus View Post
Like flyingpig said, it is a gut feeling. I watched all of the world junior games the past two years and have caught highlights from Assat games.

By the way, how has he improved? Statistically speaking he has regressed this season... (.7 PPG to .56).

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=130454

Want to see what a real top prospect does in that league?

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=118389
Just under a PPG EVERY season he played over there, including his rookie season.

I just don't think he has what it takes to replace Vanek like many people are expecting of him.

Feel free to bump this post in 3 years, only time will tell.
So because he isn't one of the top prospects in the game like Granlund, or he won't be a perennial threat to score 35 goals like Vanek, he'll be a bust? There's no in between? He's not a "real" top prospect, as you put it? Also, you said you watched all the WJC games: did his consecutive performances against Sweden not impress you? Over the last two WJC's, he has 3 of Finland's five goals against the Swedes (in addition to their lone SO tally in the 2011-12 event).

Needless to say I disagree with you. And, yes, time will tell on this issue.

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01-22-2013, 03:15 PM
  #855
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mergus View Post
Like flyingpig said, it is a gut feeling. I watched all of the world junior games the past two years and have caught highlights from Assat games.

By the way, how has he improved? Statistically speaking he has regressed this season... (.7 PPG to .56).

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=130454

Want to see what a real top prospect does in that league?

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=118389
Just under a PPG EVERY season he played over there, including his rookie season.

I just don't think he has what it takes to replace Vanek like many people are expecting of him.

Feel free to bump this post in 3 years, only time will tell.
I'm with you too, not overly impressed with his development

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01-22-2013, 03:23 PM
  #856
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Outside of maybe 1-2 posters I am quite confident most here havent seen Armia play outside of the world juniors. Especially the posters who are not impressed with him. Right now he would be a top 5 scorer in the CHL are everyone would be going crazy over him.

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01-22-2013, 03:23 PM
  #857
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Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
I'm with you too, not overly impressed with his development
As I've often said, it's too bad he didn't decide to come over to NA and just destroy 16-18 yr olds this year in the CHL. Then most would be saying silly things like "he's the steal of the draft" like we are about Catenacci.

I can't wait for him to get to NA just so a lot of this crap will just stop.

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01-22-2013, 03:26 PM
  #858
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Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
I'm with you too, not overly impressed with his development
His skill alone makes him a potential 1st liner.

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01-22-2013, 03:30 PM
  #859
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I won't say I'm not concerned about Armia playing a consistent, involved all-around game, but he's still very young and these concerns are hardly unique among the type of player he is. Let's see him play for the organization before we start calling him a bust.

One thing I do know is that right now he has an elite NHL shot. Everything about it is elite: release, accuracy, velocity, ability to get it off from different body positions and angles. He has plus hands and has improved his skating. His job at any level will always be to score goals first and foremost and there shouldn't be much doubt that he can do that. At the same time, don't go expecting to see him play for the Sabres out of camp next year. He clearly needs work and the Sabres won't be hurting for top 6 wingers. I expect at least a full season as Rochester, with possible call-ups later in the year if he's worked on his game and the Sabres need a top 6 winger for a couple games.

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Old
01-22-2013, 03:31 PM
  #860
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
As I've often said, it's too bad he didn't decide to come over to NA and just destroy 16-18 yr olds this year in the CHL. Then most would be saying silly things like "he's the steal of the draft" like we are about Catenacci.

I can't wait for him to get to NA just so a lot of this crap will just stop.
Cat was a 3rd rounder so big difference and honestly if he's performing at a .5 ppg rate in finland he isnt making the NHL next year. The fin league is probably at a similar level as the AHL. I'm not saying he's a bust but for a 1st rounder I'm a bit dissapointed his production hasn't atleast improved

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Old
01-22-2013, 03:34 PM
  #861
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
Cat was a 3rd rounder so big difference and honestly if he's performing at a .5 ppg rate in finland he isnt making the NHL next year. The fin league is probably at a similar level as the AHL. I'm not saying he's a bust but for a 1st rounder I'm a bit dissapointed his production hasn't atleast improved
I think you are wrong, he is the type of player who will be better when he plays with better players.

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Old
01-22-2013, 03:42 PM
  #862
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
As I've often said, it's too bad he didn't decide to come over to NA and just destroy 16-18 yr olds this year in the CHL. Then most would be saying silly things like "he's the steal of the draft" like we are about Catenacci.

I can't wait for him to get to NA just so a lot of this crap will just stop.
this
this
this

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01-22-2013, 03:44 PM
  #863
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
I won't say I'm not concerned about Armia playing a consistent, involved all-around game, but he's still very young and these concerns are hardly unique among the type of player he is. Let's see him play for the organization before we start calling him a bust.

One thing I do know is that right now he has an elite NHL shot. Everything about it is elite: release, accuracy, velocity, ability to get it off from different body positions and angles. He has plus hands and has improved his skating. His job at any level will always be to score goals first and foremost and there shouldn't be much doubt that he can do that. At the same time, don't go expecting to see him play for the Sabres out of camp next year. He clearly needs work and the Sabres won't be hurting for top 6 wingers. I expect at least a full season as Rochester, with possible call-ups later in the year if he's worked on his game and the Sabres need a top 6 winger for a couple games.
I don't know how someone could come away from WJC and not be thinking, "damn!"

He has a better shot than any player that has ever been in the system in the era of Regier/Ruff

I wasn't a big fan of the pick at the time... but now I see why.
Armia is untouchable in my book (from a trade perspective)

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01-22-2013, 03:47 PM
  #864
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I don't know how someone could come away from WJC and not be thinking, "damn!"

He has a better shot than any player that has been in the system in the era of Regier/Ruff

I wasn't a big fan of the pick at the time... but now I see why.
Armia is untouchable in my book (from a trade perspective)
Because he is big and extremly skilled so he must be lazy and have a bad work ethic.

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Old
01-22-2013, 04:07 PM
  #865
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
So because he isn't one of the top prospects in the game like Granlund, or he won't be a perennial threat to score 35 goals like Vanek, he'll be a bust? There's no in between? He's not a "real" top prospect, as you put it? Also, you said you watched all the WJC games: did his consecutive performances against Sweden not impress you? Over the last two WJC's, he has 3 of Finland's five goals against the Swedes (in addition to their lone SO tally in the 2011-12 event).

Needless to say I disagree with you. And, yes, time will tell on this issue.
The 9th overall pick in a draft is not typically viewed as a "top prospect". I'd say they are typically viewed in the same regard as the 16th overall pick. So don't act as though Granlund was always on a different level than Armia. He has just made more strides in his overall game since being drafted.

And no, I was not overly impressed with his WJC performance. Points are nice, but it was the way he looked on the ice.... slow.

Listen, I hope I'm wrong, but I just am not a believer.

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Old
01-22-2013, 04:13 PM
  #866
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I think Armia's 'lousy' performance this year in Finland is due to his injuries. It seems he can't go more than a few games before getting dinged up, but even then he's still near the top of his team in scoring. Additionally, as an offensive player that has been one of his team's best the last few years he's drawing tougher assignments by the opposing team.

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Old
01-22-2013, 04:25 PM
  #867
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Armia's shot alone should net him 30 goals a season. It's a work of art, really. So sick. So, so sick.

Comparing him to MaCarthur is laughable. Armia may bust, but if he has a good work ethic and can learn the NHL speed...he'll be netting 30+ goals a year. You can't teach a shot like that.


Last edited by Dubi Doo: 01-22-2013 at 04:37 PM.
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Old
01-22-2013, 04:50 PM
  #868
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Lol, cant believe how people only see black and white. I mentioned that he has been playing badly but didnt say that he is going to be a bust and people here who have seen 3 games from him judge him by looking at his stats.

As I said before, I've seen ~100 games from him and lets point something out:
He has awesome skills. He is the best natural goal scorer from Finland since Selänne. He is big, its very hard to take the puck from him and he isn't very strong yet. He has scored 18 goals in pro league twice(at 17 and at 18), this season has been bad, but Ässät has been playing very ****** hockey. His linemates have changed all the time and none of them has performed well either. Team's playing system doesn't support his strenghts right now. You also have to consider that he was in military service from summer till christmas and that can be quite rough not physically but mentally.

What is the most interesting thing about his future career is one thing: if he can perform at his best at even at 80% of his games he will be a total beast in NHL. Now we have seen total domination in one game and very poor Armia in the next game. And by total domination I mean that in every shift he is the best player on the ice, he wants the puck and he wants to score. Sometimes he dissapears and you can sense his frustration.

Moving to NA will be big step for him and its big change since he's been living in Pori for all his life. I see very bright future for him but people in Buffalo need to be patient with him. It will be very different for him to see how people arent backstabbing you immediately after few bad games but telling you to try harder.

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Old
01-22-2013, 05:03 PM
  #869
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Lol, cant believe how people only see black and white. I mentioned that he has been playing badly but didnt say that he is going to be a bust and people here who have seen 3 games from him judge him by looking at his stats.

As I said before, I've seen ~100 games from him and lets point something out:
He has awesome skills. He is the best natural goal scorer from Finland since Selänne. He is big, its very hard to take the puck from him and he isn't very strong yet. He has scored 18 goals in pro league twice(at 17 and at 18), this season has been bad, but Ässät has been playing very ****** hockey. His linemates have changed all the time and none of them has performed well either. Team's playing system doesn't support his strenghts right now. You also have to consider that he was in military service from summer till christmas and that can be quite rough not physically but mentally.

What is the most interesting thing about his future career is one thing: if he can perform at his best at even at 80% of his games he will be a total beast in NHL. Now we have seen total domination in one game and very poor Armia in the next game. And by total domination I mean that in every shift he is the best player on the ice, he wants the puck and he wants to score. Sometimes he dissapears and you can sense his frustration.

Moving to NA will be big step for him and its big change since he's been living in Pori for all his life. I see very bright future for him but people in Buffalo need to be patient with him. It will be very different for him to see how people arent backstabbing you immediately after few bad games but telling you to try harder.
What do you mean backstabbing you immediately??

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01-22-2013, 05:05 PM
  #870
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Originally Posted by Zeitung View Post
Lol, cant believe how people only see black and white. I mentioned that he has been playing badly but didnt say that he is going to be a bust and people here who have seen 3 games from him judge him by looking at his stats.

As I said before, I've seen ~100 games from him and lets point something out:
He has awesome skills. He is the best natural goal scorer from Finland since Selänne. He is big, its very hard to take the puck from him and he isn't very strong yet. He has scored 18 goals in pro league twice(at 17 and at 18), this season has been bad, but Ässät has been playing very ****** hockey. His linemates have changed all the time and none of them has performed well either. Team's playing system doesn't support his strenghts right now. You also have to consider that he was in military service from summer till christmas and that can be quite rough not physically but mentally.

What is the most interesting thing about his future career is one thing: if he can perform at his best at even at 80% of his games he will be a total beast in NHL. Now we have seen total domination in one game and very poor Armia in the next game. And by total domination I mean that in every shift he is the best player on the ice, he wants the puck and he wants to score. Sometimes he dissapears and you can sense his frustration.

Moving to NA will be big step for him and its big change since he's been living in Pori for all his life. I see very bright future for him but people in Buffalo need to be patient with him. It will be very different for him to see how people arent backstabbing you immediately after few bad games but telling you to try harder.
I hope you're right! I'd be happy to eat some crow.

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Old
01-23-2013, 01:41 AM
  #871
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What do you mean backstabbing you immediately??
Custom in Finland and especially in Pori. Im not sure if that's even an English phrase. Meaning that when you play well and score winning goal(fans think that) you are the best player in the world but after a bad game you suck and should be benched or sold to KHL.

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01-23-2013, 02:58 AM
  #872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeitung View Post
Custom in Finland and especially in Pori. Im not sure if that's even an English phrase. Meaning that when you play well and score winning goal(fans think that) you are the best player in the world but after a bad game you suck and should be benched or sold to KHL.
It is an English phrase and it can be used for what you describe, but generally it has some connotations that don't necessarily fit. Anyhow, there are definitely a fair number of fans here in Buffalo who act like that, fueled by our crappy local sports media.

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Old
01-23-2013, 05:45 AM
  #873
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It is an English phrase and it can be used for what you describe, but generally it has some connotations that don't necessarily fit. Anyhow, there are definitely a fair number of fans here in Buffalo who act like that, fueled by our crappy local sports media.
Every team, every city, every sport.

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Old
01-24-2013, 12:12 PM
  #874
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I made through the snow to Owen Sound last night for the 3-0 Attack entertaining win over the Barrie Colts. Catenacci was all over the ice picking off two passes for breakaways. He was excellent at face-offs and I'm positive now that there isn't a better player on the PK in the league.
Lepkowski also looked great in the game for Barrie with his size and agressive play. He hurt one of the Attack players with a hit (although recieving a penalty). Alex will be a good prospect in the futurefor the Sabres.
I also wanted to note that Cat had an empty net and elected to pass to his teammate for the goal....very unselfish play for Cat which says a lot about his leadership and team first attitude.

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01-24-2013, 12:22 PM
  #875
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I made through the snow to Owen Sound last night for the 3-0 Attack entertaining win over the Barrie Colts. Catenacci was all over the ice picking off two passes for breakaways. He was excellent at face-offs and I'm positive now that there isn't a better player on the PK in the league.
Lepkowski also looked great in the game for Barrie with his size and agressive play. He hurt one of the Attack players with a hit (although recieving a penalty). Alex will be a good prospect in the futurefor the Sabres.
I also wanted to note that Cat had an empty net and elected to pass to his teammate for the goal....very unselfish play for Cat which says a lot about his leadership and team first attitude.
It's good to hear that Cat is performing so well. After an injury-ridden prospect camp the summer following his draft and a rather underwhelming (to me at least) showing at camp this past summer, I look forward to seeing him in Rochester later this year.

From what I collect, he's a unique center in this organization in that his defensive game and faceoff ability both seem to be at an elite level.

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