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Michael Ferland to Pittsburgh

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Old
01-22-2013, 09:40 PM
  #26
MichiganWolverines
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Originally Posted by Big McLargehuge View Post
Holy mother of pearl...Harrington for Ferland being suggested by a Penguins fan?


No...just...no. Emphatically no.
I usually overrate power-forwards.

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01-22-2013, 09:40 PM
  #27
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It usually takes power-forwards longer to develop.
If Eric Tangradi has taught us anything about power forwards it would have to be don't count your eggs before they've hatched.

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01-22-2013, 09:40 PM
  #28
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Ferland + Granlund for Harrington and a 6th?

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01-22-2013, 09:46 PM
  #29
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What makes you say that? From what I've heard, he has a good set of hands, plays very physical, he's good in front of the net and he also has a quick release in his shot. His skating needs to improve, but I think he what it takes to be a good 2nd/3rd line power forward in the future.

Perhaps we could trade Philip Samuelsson+ for him.
Ferland didn't get sent down from minor-pro to juniors as an overager for nothing. That does not happen to legitimate NHL prospects.

He's got a better chance of becoming a career ECHLer than an NHLer at this point. Do not be fooled by size and junior numbers put up two seasons after being drafted.

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01-22-2013, 09:51 PM
  #30
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Would like to have a guy like Ferland in the system, but the suggested return makes no sense at all.
A guy like Dominic Uher, our 5th round pick in '11 has done about as much as Ferland (a 5th rounder in 10) and he stuck in the AHL unlike Ferland.

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01-22-2013, 09:52 PM
  #31
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Harrington is better than both of those players right now.
Alright then switch in Maatta

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01-22-2013, 09:54 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
Ferland didn't get sent down from minor-pro to juniors as an overager for nothing. That does not happen to legitimate NHL prospects.

He's got a better chance of becoming a career ECHLer than an NHLer at this point. Do not be fooled by size and junior numbers put up two seasons after being drafted.
He got sent down by choice he wasn't seeing ice time with guys like Sven and Horak taking up spots. He wanted to be sent back to play not just sit on the bench.

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01-22-2013, 09:55 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by nogger View Post
Ferland + Granlund for Harrington and a 6th?
I'd rather hang on to Granlund and see what we have in him first.

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01-22-2013, 09:57 PM
  #34
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I'd rather hang on to Granlund and see what we have in him first.
As would I, but i'd be willing to give up one of our few forward prospects for a D prospect who were extremely limited in.

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01-22-2013, 10:00 PM
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As would I, but i'd be willing to give up one of our few forward prospects for a D prospect who were extremely limited in.
I am not as worried about D as you are we have Widemen, Gio,Jbo,Brodie for the foreseeable future I think we can find a couple of physical bottom pairing guys in free agency and give Wotherspoon(probably a #5), Sieloff (probably a #4), Breen and Ramage(#6) to develop and start drafting defensemen that will be ready in 4 years when we need them.

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01-22-2013, 10:07 PM
  #36
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He got sent down by choice he wasn't seeing ice time with guys like Sven and Horak taking up spots. He wanted to be sent back to play not just sit on the bench.
That's fine, but if he can't manage to find icetime on an AHL team where Ben Street - a guy we let go for nothing last summer - is the 2nd leading scorer, it isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of his quality.

I'm sure that even as an opposing fan, you can see the difference in value between a player like Ferland and a player like Harrington. It does not make sense.

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01-22-2013, 10:11 PM
  #37
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That's fine, but if he can't manage to find icetime on an AHL team where Ben Street - a guy we let go for nothing last summer - is the 2nd leading scorer, it isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of his quality.

I'm sure that even as an opposing fan, you can see the difference in value between a player like Ferland and a player like Harrington. It does not make sense.
Completely different players Ferland was competing with Sven,Horak(nhl players),Kolanos(top ahl player for several years) etc for winger spots. Also Ward loves his kind of players and is loyal to guys that have played for him before and he pushed Ferland down the depth chart personally I think he was the 4th best winger but thats just me.

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01-22-2013, 10:17 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
Completely different players Ferland was competing with Sven,Horak(nhl players),Kolanos(top ahl player for several years) etc for winger spots. Also Ward loves his kind of players and is loyal to guys that have played for him before and he pushed Ferland down the depth chart personally I think he was the 4th best winger but thats just me.
Yes, they are. So are Sven Baertschi and Brian Dumoulin.

That doesn't mean one can't determine which is more valuable, if you're honest with yourself.

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01-22-2013, 10:42 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
Yes, they are. So are Sven Baertschi and Brian Dumoulin.

That doesn't mean one can't determine which is more valuable, if you're honest with yourself.
Yes I am in denial that Ferland is most likely a 3rd liner. But hey Pitts has 15 #1 defensemen coming up so why bother discussing trading any of them.

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01-22-2013, 10:50 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
Yes I am in denial that Ferland is most likely a 3rd liner. But hey Pitts has 15 #1 defensemen coming up so why bother discussing trading any of them.
Oh, we'll discuss trading them, but it certainly won't be for a guy like Ferland. You'll just need to loosen your grip on #12.

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01-22-2013, 11:01 PM
  #41
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Oh, we'll discuss trading them, but it certainly won't be for a guy like Ferland. You'll just need to loosen your grip on #12.
I'm fine with moving Iggy I just think saying the fact that Ferland can't beat out a center is a ****** reason to say he is closer to a bust then an nhler.

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01-22-2013, 11:09 PM
  #42
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I'm fine with moving Iggy I just think saying the fact that Ferland can't beat out a center is a ****** reason to say he is closer to a bust then an nhler.
You're probably right - I just made the WBS connection, and Street wasn't anything extraordinary while here.

But if Ferland couldn't land a top 9 spot in the AHL because of 3 better wingers and a coach who defers to vets, he'd have no chance in the Pittsburgh organization. Bylsma et al defer to vets like it's going out of style.

That's beyond the obvious value discrepancy between Ferland and Harrington. I'm not even sure why I'm taking the time to discuss Michael Ferland here, no offense.

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01-22-2013, 11:16 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
You're probably right - I just made the WBS connection, and Street wasn't anything extraordinary while here.

But if Ferland couldn't land a top 9 spot in the AHL because of 3 better wingers and a coach who defers to vets, he'd have no chance in the Pittsburgh organization. Bylsma et al defer to vets like it's going out of style.

That's beyond the obvious value discrepancy between Ferland and Harrington. I'm not even sure why I'm taking the time to discuss Michael Ferland here, no offense.
Its like I said Ward is a very loyal coach he gave the spots Nemisz/Sylvester/Bancks etc. I am not the only Flame fan that is tired of Ward he plays a very defensive system (much like Sutter did) and doesn't often allow players to rise through the ranks.

The OP asked what we would want in exchange for a player that we need on our team and we would want one of the defensemen from Pitt's and Harrington made the most sense he is the least shinny toy.

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01-22-2013, 11:29 PM
  #44
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In no way is Ferland worth Harrington right now. I am a Flames fan in saying that.

With that being said, Flames aren't interested in trading him away at this point, since he is a very unique prospect in the system. Good hands, awesome in the corners, difficult to remove him from the puck, and has been considered the toughest guy in the WHL. He has been playing 1st line minutes while doing so.

Weaknesses? I would think his mindset. He needs to become a better 'pro'. He had an off-ice incident during the off-season, but hopefully that will be it. I haven't heard anything else negative about his behavior in any way. He needs to be more determined in his conditioning, and has to become a better skater. Will he be? That is a good question, but if he does, he becomes a very valuable 3rd liner for the Flames (or most any team in the NHL with that amount of grit, toughness and secondary scoring ability).

Overpayment for him is the only way the Flames will trade him. Flames definitely say yes to Harrington. However, very unlikely anyone is going to overpay for him at all. I would think that he is probably worth a low 2nd right now. Harrington is definitely (in my opinion) worth much more than a 2nd. I would much rather the Flames hang onto him and see how he develops than packaging him out for something 'fair'. He might end up becoming a very important player in the future if he gets it together.

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01-22-2013, 11:31 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
That's fine, but if he can't manage to find icetime on an AHL team where Ben Street - a guy we let go for nothing last summer - is the 2nd leading scorer, it isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of his quality.

I'm sure that even as an opposing fan, you can see the difference in value between a player like Ferland and a player like Harrington. It does not make sense.
Ben Street is one of the better AHL vets kicking around. AHL vets just happen to be expendable, for the most part.

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01-22-2013, 11:43 PM
  #46
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Ben Street is one of the better AHL vets kicking around. AHL vets just happen to be expendable, for the most part.
The point is that there are a number of unspectacular players at the AHL level who still pushed him down the depth chart to the point where he wasn't seeing sufficient icetime. And this is a player being discussed as a return for a prospect who was just named the best defenseman on the Team Canada WJC squad by the IIHF directorate, over a bunch of very highly-touted blueliners.

That's where the disconnect happens. That's why it's a non-starter.

One has trouble establishing himself on an AHL team. The other has distinguished himself against the very best of his age group.

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01-22-2013, 11:47 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
The point is that there are a number of unspectacular players at the AHL level who still pushed him down the depth chart to the point where he wasn't seeing sufficient icetime. And this is a player being discussed as a return for a prospect who was just named the best defenseman on the Team Canada WJC squad by the IIHF directorate, over a bunch of very highly-touted blueliners.

That's where the disconnect happens. That's why it's a non-starter.

One has trouble establishing himself on an AHL team. The other has distinguished himself against the very best of his age group.
Agree he is a great kid the point is we need Ferland and we aren't looking to move him I don't think we need another defensemen as much as Ferland not say that Harrington isn't worth more but to us Harrington isn't worth Ferland ++ I think I offered Ferland + mid pick for Harrington and that is as much as we could give up. We already have Wotherspoon who I consider to be about as valuable as Harrington.

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