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Florida Panthers Vs. Montreal Canadiens 1/22/13

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01-22-2013, 11:20 PM
  #451
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
If he's easily replaceable why can we never find anyone for that line? Smithson does what he does well, I think you're expecting way too much for a grinder, not real sure why he's at all complaint when the top two likes have been awful. Top lines do their jobs, the grind lines can do just that, grind teams down.
what? who says we cant find a fourth line center? john madden did a much better job in that role IMO. and he was out of a job for half the season last year. guys like that are so replaceable there's probably several of them just sitting at home waiting for a phone call like madden was at this time last yr.

i'm not really complaining about him, theres been much bigger problems. someone said they were impressed by him; my answer was basically that there's nothing to be impressed with. nit-picking, i guess.


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01-22-2013, 11:22 PM
  #452
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Originally Posted by JonathanHuberdoh View Post

I think Dineen is a damn idiot for making a guy who won't even dress in all of our games the captain. Campbell should be captain as he's in the lineup every night.
disagree. i think Jovo is terrible, but i think tonight is a perfect example as to why he IS the captain. the team completely fell apart and lost composure as the game went on. that didn't happen in ottawa, we actually played a much better game in the second half.

if campbell and/or weiss were the true leaders of this team, that wouldn't have happened.

Dineen has a much better grasp of the lockroom than anyone of us do...because....um, he's actually in it. i always laugh when fans try to debate who should and shouldn't be captain. how the hell should we know? we're not in the room. we don't know who the leaders are.

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01-22-2013, 11:28 PM
  #453
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What's the difference? You might feel he can score, but the bottom line is he can't. And that's all Skille does. So, at the end of the day, it boils down to both players are limited, which is the reason that they're 4th liners.
except he can score. he scored 4 goals and assists goals in 46 games. over a full 82, thats 7 goals and 11 assists. great fourth liner. throw in his speed, tenacity and physical play...he's a great fourth liner. and thats not even mentioning the countless chances he creates that he doesnt finish...that gives the team energy and momentum)

smithson is a zero offensively. nada. he's just too bleh

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01-22-2013, 11:53 PM
  #454
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Originally Posted by flapanthersfan View Post
what? who says we cant find a fourth line center? john madden did a much better job in that role IMO. and he was out of a job for half the season last year. guys like that are so replaceable there's probably several of them just sitting at home waiting for a phone call like madden was at this time last yr.

i'm not really complaining about him, theres been much bigger problems. someone said they were impressed by him; my answer was basically that there's nothing to be impressed with. nit-picking, i guess.
Madden isn't some guy just sitting at home waiting for a phone call, c'mon now. That guy brought so much to the table in so many ways. Before him it Campbell playing that role best, IMO. Nothing wrong. Being nitpicky, I just think their shortcomings wouldn't be AS evident if the top lines were getting it done.

Been a bit disappointed with Parros this far, two crap games and no fights. That said, I don't honestly expect Prust and Neal to go with him. Though, Neal would've had the tides gone the other way last night, but Neal rarely returns a favor.

Guys have to keep working, top two lines are too soft and IMO literally miss the guys who're out, energy guys.

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01-23-2013, 12:26 AM
  #455
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Originally Posted by flapanthersfan View Post
except he can score. he scored 4 goals and assists goals in 46 games. over a full 82, thats 7 goals and 11 assists. great fourth liner. throw in his speed, tenacity and physical play...he's a great fourth liner. and thats not even mentioning the countless chances he creates that he doesnt finish...that gives the team energy and momentum)

smithson is a zero offensively. nada. he's just too bleh
Before last year, Smithson had six consecutive seasons with double-digit point totals.

Skille might have more scoring chances but if he's not converting, it's just an intangible, at the end of the day. Much like Smithson's ability to win faceoffs is an intangible. You could actually make a case that Smithson's intangible is more important, if anything.

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01-23-2013, 12:29 AM
  #456
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Smithson is a right handed center, who wins a good amount of faceoffs, is defensively responsible, skates fairly well, plays the pk, and can contribute some offense here and there. He's a good fourth line center. He fits his position a lot more than Weiss or Mueller do as the first and second line as centers.

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01-23-2013, 12:37 AM
  #457
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
Smithson is a right handed center, who wins a good amount of faceoffs, is defensively responsible, skates fairly well, plays the pk, and can contribute some offense here and there. He's a good fourth line center. He fits his position a lot more than Weiss or Mueller do as the first and second line as centers.
Agree completely. What fourth line center does MORE than what Smithson has been able to do for us, especially the last 2-3 games. He has been the only one on the ice that looks like he really wants to win.

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01-23-2013, 12:41 AM
  #458
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Starting to get the feeling this isn't going to be a good season

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01-23-2013, 12:42 AM
  #459
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You can tell all these injuries are taking a toll early on this short, compacted season.

Could really use Gubs size and nastiness. Too many minutes going to guys who can't handle them anymore/ guys who aren't used to it.

Our first line is struggling as well. Weiss & Flash our both -3. We are really missing Versteeg, as no one has been able to show they belong on the 1st line.


I was starting to forget how much Clemmer disappointed me last season. He would have a really strong, focused game, and then follow it up we a weak one were he isn't on top of his angles and/or allows weak five-hole goals.


I wouldn't bet against Dineen shaking the lines up for Ottawa.

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01-23-2013, 12:45 AM
  #460
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Starting to get the feeling this isn't going to be a good season
The best news about this season so far is we beat up on Carolina our first game and won. We our at least right there, just really need to change this play.

Hopefully Dineen injects a little more life into this team.

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01-23-2013, 02:10 AM
  #461
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Originally Posted by flapanthersfan View Post
disagree. i think Jovo is terrible, but i think tonight is a perfect example as to why he IS the captain. the team completely fell apart and lost composure as the game went on. that didn't happen in ottawa, we actually played a much better game in the second half.

if campbell and/or weiss were the true leaders of this team, that wouldn't have happened.

Dineen has a much better grasp of the lockroom than anyone of us do...because....um, he's actually in it. i always laugh when fans try to debate who should and shouldn't be captain. how the hell should we know? we're not in the room. we don't know who the leaders are.
so... the ONLY guy who can lead the team is an awful, willfully out of shape guy who can only play every other game? that's what you're saying?

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01-23-2013, 03:06 AM
  #462
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so... the ONLY guy who can lead the team is an awful, willfully out of shape guy who can only play every other game? that's what you're saying?
apparently. proof is in the pudding.

dineen (or any NHL coach) has a much better grasp of their locker rooms than any fan ever would. criticizing their choice of captaincy is silly.

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01-23-2013, 03:12 AM
  #463
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Madden isn't some guy just sitting at home waiting for a phone call, c'mon now.
but thats EXACTLY what he was last season, and that's exactly my point. he was at home, unemployed and waiting for a phone call. we had a bunch of injuries and he was a great addition in a bottom-6 role.

there's better players who are unemployed right now than jarred smithson, and that's exactly my point. hell, marco sturm is a better player, a better PKer. the only thing smithson has on him (or anyone practically) is faceoffs)


Quote:
That guy brought so much to the table in so many ways. Before him it Campbell playing that role best, IMO. Nothing wrong. Being nitpicky, I just think their shortcomings wouldn't be AS evident if the top lines were getting it done.
campbell is another example of a great fourth liner, too. that's the type of grit we need down there, not smithson.
Quote:
Been a bit disappointed with Parros this far, two crap games and no fights. That said, I don't honestly expect Prust and Neal to go with him. Though, Neal would've had the tides gone the other way last night, but Neal rarely returns a favor.

Guys have to keep working, top two lines are too soft and IMO literally miss the guys who're out, energy guys.

you know that we differ on enforcers. i hate parros, he sucks, doesn't fight often and has made a career off his stupid porn mustache.

brandon prust and chris neil (although i absolutely HATE Neil, i'd probably adore him if he were a Cat) are exactly the type of fighters i'd like on my team. they may not be true heavy's but still get the job done (offer protection) and can play the game and contribute. i love prust, not so sure i would have given him the contract montreal did though. pretty pricey.

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01-23-2013, 03:23 AM
  #464
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Originally Posted by Erick View Post
Before last year, Smithson had six consecutive seasons with double-digit point totals.

Skille might have more scoring chances but if he's not converting, it's just an intangible, at the end of the day. Much like Smithson's ability to win faceoffs is an intangible. You could actually make a case that Smithson's intangible is more important, if anything.
i agree with your premise that, in a vacuum, faceoffs are more important than the energy/momentum of scoring chances if they are not finished.

that being said, the overall point you're trying to make is completely flawed because these two players are not in a vacuum. skille can contribute offensively, smithson cannot.

skille's statistics last year (on pace) were more than smithson had in any season, and he's clearly improving as a player while smithson is clearly on the decline. he had six points last year (that's abysmal).

if smithson could contribute the points he did in 07-08 or the goals he did in 09-10, then you might have some type of argument here. but if you think this guy has the ability to score 10 goals or 20 points after watching him during his tenure as a panther, we're clearly watching a different player.

this guy has absolutely nothing to offer in the offensive zone. and looking at his stats, he's also never been a + player in his career after 05-06.....playing on pretty good predators teams too. i don't put much stock into the +/- stat, but in this case, i do, as his numbers in this category are extremely consistent. the fact that he's a -4 through -9 in his last 6 seasons straight is pretty telling. lets say you're the best defensive player in the history of the NHL and only allow 10 goals scored while you're on the ice. but you're so terrible offensively that you score 0. you're still a -10, despite being a wizard on D, you're causing more harm than overall good to your team.

i know your're a big baseball fan too (i lurk on marlinsbaseball.com) - but hockey isn't a sport like baseball where you have "specialists" like LOOGY's that can contribute in only one area. having a good faceoff guy is great, as are enforcers, if they can play and contribute in all three zones. Smithson doesn't. Neither does Parros. and because of it, our fourth line is a complete black whole, regardless of the unfortunate soul that is paired with those two. that's a PROBLEM.

now, on the list of problems this team has right now, jarred smithson being terrible is probably in the 20's or 30's of things that need to be fixed, but my point is he's still a problem. he's waiver wire fodder just like santorelli.

thanks, santos


Last edited by flapanthersfan: 01-23-2013 at 03:33 AM.
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01-23-2013, 05:46 AM
  #465
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I just have one thing to say:

3 games in 4 nights, right? 2nd game in 2? 0 Exhibition games?


You team basically was screwed by the schedule, while the Habs were fresh and willing to prove themselves after a terrible display last saturday. And the Habs were deliberately twisting that knife, playing a very physical game against you to tire you even more out.

No wonder the 5-minute powerplay was underwhelming; your players were simply at the end of their battery.

When the Panthers started the 2nd, they definetly had some gas in the tank and it showed. You definetly aren't a team as bad as it showed last night.

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01-23-2013, 06:46 AM
  #466
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Originally Posted by flapanthersfan View Post
except he can score. he scored 4 goals and assists goals in 46 games. over a full 82, thats 7 goals and 11 assists. great fourth liner. throw in his speed, tenacity and physical play...he's a great fourth liner. and thats not even mentioning the countless chances he creates that he doesnt finish...that gives the team energy and momentum)
Honestly thats why i like Skille. His hard work and determination is what this team really needs right about now.

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01-23-2013, 08:00 AM
  #467
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
I just have one thing to say:

3 games in 4 nights, right? 2nd game in 2? 0 Exhibition games?


You team basically was screwed by the schedule, while the Habs were fresh and willing to prove themselves after a terrible display last saturday. And the Habs were deliberately twisting that knife, playing a very physical game against you to tire you even more out.

No wonder the 5-minute powerplay was underwhelming; your players were simply at the end of their battery.

When the Panthers started the 2nd, they definetly had some gas in the tank and it showed. You definetly aren't a team as bad as it showed last night.
Pretty much... When we had the 5 min PP, the team looked so gassed - if it was 5 on 2 for the rest of the game, I doubt we could have tied it.

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01-23-2013, 08:01 AM
  #468
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We had a great start to the season last year because we were healthy. We're just not as lucky this time. Hopefully, Dineen can make some adjustments and get this team in the video room. They need to see how ineffective their powerplays were last night. The 4 minute penalty and the 5-on-3 were BRUTAL. It's just unacceptable to blow chances like that just because you're tired or whatever the excuse is this time. You simply cannot dump the puck in and have one guy chase it and miss. They made the same mistake over and over again. Is Dineen implementing the system from last year or what? I cannot tell from watching three games where we were three different hockey teams. Hubs is only guy who looked like he possessed some killer instinct on the powerplay. He gets pushed around pretty easily but that's expected from a 19-year-old coming from junior hockey.

Now we play Ottawa at home and Philly on the road.

Ottawa - always has our number. Expect a loss.

Philadelphia - hasn't won a game. They're going to be motivated and ready to get a win.


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01-23-2013, 08:17 AM
  #469
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Originally Posted by Rick Rypien Farts View Post
we play Ottawa at home and Philly on the road.

Ottawa - always has our number. Expect a loss.

Philadelphia - hasn't won a game. They're going to be motivated and ready to get a win. We're 0-2 on the road. Do the math.

The Philly game is at home on Saturday night.

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01-23-2013, 08:22 AM
  #470
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talking about the 4th line. i'm very disappointed in parros!!! i don't see much physicality, or hard checking. he's been pretty much floating around and seems pretty slow. we've been manhandled the last 2 games!! where was parros? he should've been stemming the tide and sticking up for our players. liked barch a lot better!!!!!

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01-23-2013, 08:30 AM
  #471
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The Philly game is at home on Saturday night.
Yep. My mistake.

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01-23-2013, 08:36 AM
  #472
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Our problems have everything to do with conditioning and nothing to do with will to win.
You can tell who put in the time during the lockout and who didn't. Skille and Matthias obviously put in the time and good for them. They have both shown that they are true professionals by showing up to camp in great shape to start the season and it shows not only in the games so far but also in the comments on this board about who looked good in camp.
Our core group however looked like they took four months off and decided to start skating the day before camp openned. Espesially the players that were working out in Florida.
I think the level of readiness to play at start of camp is the reason for what we are seeing on the ice. This is not only the Panthers but all the teams that are off to slow starts.

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01-23-2013, 09:03 AM
  #473
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How did Shore look?

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01-23-2013, 09:05 AM
  #474
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It seems like we get bit by the injury bug the hardest and most often out of 30 teams.

I mean.. Gudbranson (I know his was non-hockey related), Goc, Versteeg and Bergenheim.

It's so disappointing.

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01-23-2013, 09:10 AM
  #475
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Originally Posted by harv3317 View Post
talking about the 4th line. i'm very disappointed in parros!!! i don't see much physicality, or hard checking. he's been pretty much floating around and seems pretty slow. we've been manhandled the last 2 games!! where was parros? he should've been stemming the tide and sticking up for our players. liked barch a lot better!!!!!
Yeah, funny the last two games our guys get jumped. Thing with Parros is that he's a 'super' heavyweight and kinda needs guys like Orr & Bollig to fight. I don't expect him to fight guys like White or Smith. Guds is more the match for guys like them.

-ghoste

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