I don't know if you read what I linked, but it's pretty clear what he was saying. His point was that trading Subban to move up 2 spots and ''something else'' would be something he'd consider from a MTL perspective and would not dismiss entirely.
Usually ''something else'' is not a particularly valuable asset.
You wanna "do the math" then go ahead, knowledgeable fans know where this team can go without PK Subban: 13th or 14th place in the conference as the maximum likelihood outcome, and if *everything* goes well, a ceiling that is a Cinderella run all the way to a 4 or 5 game first round playoff exit.
The only reason why I think you might be wrong is that this season, it seems, will depend on special teams even more so than in the past. Refs are going to be even more harsh apparently.
We have guys that are solid on the PK and we have a strong goalie. If our PP can click like it did yesterday, I think we have a very good chance to make the POs.
Will they click is the only question but the possibility is definitely there.
However, with PK in the line up, I would bet that we'd make them.
To me last night clearly showed how much PK still has to learn to be able to carry a game like that the way Markov did last night. Not only in terms of scoring goals, but in terms of dictating the play, making those first passes each and every shift, quarterbacking a powerplay and controlling the play allowing the Habs to pretty much have constant puck possession. I love PK's enthusiasm and I think he has just as much raw skill if not more than Markov, but he still has a lot of refining to do in his game to get to Markov's level. Pay your dues kid, sign-up and work up to that lucrative contract that you will then deserve. You're not quite there yet.
You wanna "do the math" then go ahead, knowledgeable fans know where this team can go without PK Subban: 13th or 14th place in the conference as the maximum likelihood outcome, and if *everything* goes well, a ceiling that is a Cinderella run all the way to a 4 or 5 game first round playoff exit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Hab
Markov usually can't pass the torch or anything else since both his hands are usually quite busy (holding crutches). The torch was automatically passed to Subban a long long time ago (been 3 years since we've seen a healthy Markov).
Everyone will despise Bergevin IF/WHEN Markov gets injured and Subban is still not signed (just a matter of time with Markov). It's frustrating...'cause Markov still has not learned how to protect himself (ex: Kadri hit last Saturday vs Leafs...Markov was so vulnerable you'd think he wanted to get injured...obviously I'm not saying he does but you know what I mean...he still turns his back to the player...fully trusting the player will not hit him from behind...****ing stupid if you ask me...dumb for such a cerebral player...Gorges and Subban should speak to Markov to let him know how to protect himself).
I see. So Markov is better but only by virtue of PK sitting out...
Compelling argument.
I think you all have VERY short term memory or have never seen Markov play.
pre injury Markov IS better than current PK. If he holds up and it seems after last night that he will, he is STILL better than current PK. Add to that Markov is playing and PK is playing Playstation, it's kind of a no brainer who's more important to the Habs right now.
To me last night clearly showed how much PK still has to learn to be able to carry a game like that the way Markov did last night. Not only in terms of scoring goals, but in terms of dictating the play, making those first passes each and every shift, quarterbacking a powerplay and controlling the play allowing the Habs to pretty much have constant puck possession. I love PK's enthusiasm and I think he has just as much raw skill if not more than Markov, but he still has a lot of refining to do in his game to get to Markov's level. Pay your dues kid, sign-up and work up to that lucrative contract that you will then deserve. You're not quite there yet.
He's 23yrs old...he's not supposed to be there already
Man, reading some posts (not yours specifically), listening to the radio/TV...it's ridiculous how much hate Subban gets
The character assasination of PK Subban rolls on...
This early in his career, PK seems to be getting some bad advice from his agent...
Or he's getting a lowball offer from the Habs.
MDZ money isn't realistic given when Subban did last year. His value is closer to what Hall/Eberle/Zajac etc signed...5-6 years 5+ mil. If MB absolutely only wants 2 years then 2 years and 9-9.5 mil total.
He's 23yrs old...he's not supposed to be there already
Man, reading some posts (not yours specifically), listening to the radio/TV...it's ridiculous how much hate Subban gets
The character assasination of PK Subban rolls on...
I did say I think he has as much if not more skill than Markov. I think there is a huge difference between character assassination and pointing out what needs refinement in his game. I love the kid. I just think Markov gave him a 101 on how to be a #1 defenseman last night. And I agree he's 23 years old and he's not there yet. Pretty much exactly my point. I know you didn't mean to target my post specifically though and I wholeheartedly agree with you. There is positive criticism then there is outright bashing.
Just too bad that on these boards sometimes the second you bring up a point about a player you're labeled a hater. The polarization on here is crazy sometimes.
I think you all have VERY short term memory or have never seen Markov play.
pre injury Markov IS better than current PK. If he holds up and it seems after last night that he will, he is STILL better than current PK. Add to that Markov is playing and PK is playing Playstation, it's kind of a no brainer who's more important to the Habs right now.
Nevermind just better than PK, he showed last night why he was arguably top 5 in the league before injuries. His anticipation defensively is also really incredible.
This doesn't Subban is any less valuable. He brings a whole different dimension to this team. Really hoping we're not lowballing him. Let's get him signed and let's get on with the season!
He's 23yrs old...he's not supposed to be there already
Man, reading some posts (not yours specifically), listening to the radio/TV...it's ridiculous how much hate Subban gets
The character assasination of PK Subban rolls on...
Well, Doughty is also 23 yrs old. I got to watch him up close at the Pepsi Center last night ($35 lower level tickets )
Doughty plays a vary mature game. Reminds me of how Markov seems to know when to conserve energy and when to jump in. I was very impressed with his poise (despite the Kings not really showing up). That's what people mean by "not being there yet".
However, I totally agree that it's annoying to hear all the criticism of PK that is based on non-hockey related stuff that's been blown out of proportion. Reminds me of when Ribs, Theo and, to a certain extent, Chelios, Corson, Carbo got traded. Huge mistakes. Hope we're not heading that way.
I did say I think he has as much if not more skill than Markov. I think there is a huge difference between character assassination and pointing out what needs refinement in his game. I love the kid. I just think Markov gave him a 101 on how to be a #1 defenseman last night. And I agree he's 23 years old and he's not there yet. Pretty much exactly my point. I know you didn't mean to target my post specifically though and I wholeheartedly agree with you. There is positive criticism then there is outright bashing.
Just too bad that on these boards sometimes the second you bring up a point about a player you're labeled a hater. The polarization on here is crazy sometimes.
Yeah agreed and like I said, I wasn't referring to your post specifically...I don't think what you said isn't true.
Subban was 14th in the league in icetime played and 19th in icetime/game last season. This is why a Del Zotto offer would be deemed lowball. Subban was played like a #1 D and he was very effective defensively despite a couple bumps on the road last season.
Well, Doughty is also 23 yrs old. I got to watch him up close at the Pepsi Center last night ($35 lower level tickets )
Doughty plays a vary mature game. Reminds me of how Markov seems to know when to conserve energy and when to jump in. I was very impressed with his poise (despite the Kings not really showing up). That's what people mean by "not being there yet".
However, I totally agree that it's annoying to hear all the criticism of PK that is based on non-hockey related stuff that's been blown out of proportion. Reminds me of when Ribs, Theo and, to a certain extent, Chelios, Corson, Carbo got traded. Huge mistakes. Hope we're not heading that way.
Well Doughty was a #2 draft pick and he also plays on a much better team...PK Subban is still a little raw but think back to when he was drafted to the player he is today, that's a tremendous amount of growth in 5 years.
This early in his career, PK seems to be getting some bad advice from his agent...
Best advice he got so far was to stop Tweeting crap. Next bit of advice is to stop behaving like a prima dona and get back on the ice with his team. If he does not accept the contract currently on the table, whatever it is within a week I say trade him. He'll net us something good.
(just a matter of time with Markov). It's frustrating...'cause Markov still has not learned how to protect himself (ex: Kadri hit last Saturday vs Leafs...Markov was so vulnerable you'd think he wanted to get injured...obviously I'm not saying he does but you know what I mean...he still turns his back to the player...fully trusting the player will not hit him from behind...****ing stupid if you ask me...dumb for such a cerebral player...Gorges and Subban should speak to Markov to let him know how to protect himself).
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