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01-24-2013, 01:26 PM
  #151
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So are you. Are you honestly trying to say that a majority of citizens use the library? And just because someone is in a minority doesn't mean that only very basic entertainment options should be available to them. Hell, how many multi-cultural centers etc. are in Edmonton that are actually frequented mostly by people who a majority of their money doesn't even stay in the country let alone the city.

And I haven't even gotten into how much would be lost in the charity front if the Oilers were to go away.
EPL afairc has well over 500K members/users. Its a hugely successful program that benefits most citizens. You could hardly come up with more common use facilities than a public library. Keeping in mind virtually every student in Edmonton would have and use a library card.

You know its funny how this goes, I state my case, using detail, substantiation, and half a dozen people in the thread flat out tell me if I don't like it move out of town. Which is rude to begin with and especially seeing I've invested over 50yrs here and don't wish to leave. (not saying you and thank you for keeping it civil)

What would people state if I was rude enough to say if you want a world class arena move to a world class city. Nobody would appreciate that comment at all. I wouldn't state it.

Its OK for people to agree, or disagree, that this is what Edmonton needs. Hell most Edmontonians agree that they DON'T want a publicly funded arena. The city acted on its own recognizance in that regard and full well knowing the polls didn't support this public investment. just saying.

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01-24-2013, 01:26 PM
  #152
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MSI is calculated based on a municipality's population, kilometres of roads and, as I recall, school tax assessment. I work in this area.

Edit: I see this has been covered already.

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01-24-2013, 01:27 PM
  #153
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Are you forgetting about the new ticket tax(you know, to help pay for this thing) or that there will be no "nosebleed" configuration equivalent in the new facility and few cheap seats of any kind to begin with?

Remember I'm including ALL charges. Some will likely be invented in the interim..

If you think top priced tickets are going up 10bucks in the new facility you got the wrong idea. The seating layout is the ritz pure and simple.
There's the rub. The ticket tax has been around since Pocklington. It's not new.

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01-24-2013, 01:29 PM
  #154
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Exactly the point i made earlier! Nice one!

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01-24-2013, 01:30 PM
  #155
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Hey, those communities spend money on entertainment venues, too.
What does South Cooking Lake have?

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01-24-2013, 01:31 PM
  #156
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01-24-2013, 01:31 PM
  #157
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What does South Cooking Lake have?
Don't they have a lake?

Seriously, I wasn't saying all of the outlying communities, but communities like St. Albert, Stony Plain, Spruce Grove, Leduc, etc. have a lot of rec facilities. The very small communities and the leeching counties don't, agreed.

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01-24-2013, 01:32 PM
  #158
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What does South Cooking Lake have?
http://www.huntcal.com/cal/view/SCLC..._calendar?vm=r

I believe that the Library Bookmobile is a New Years Day tradition.

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01-24-2013, 01:32 PM
  #159
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WEll dammit, now I have no clothes. Good job, good dig.


I can laugh at myself. I post too much.


Tbh I used to take some issues with the blogger in question but enough people kept forwarding his stuff and its hard not to start appreciating his detail. Its like anything though. Sometimes you don't like a journalist but doesn't mean he doesn't come up with good stuff. Or vice versa. I don't think a pov other than mine exists which I agree with all the time..thats human nature.

Anyway he's a worthy read if I'm not.

cheers

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01-24-2013, 01:32 PM
  #160
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Its OK for people to agree, or disagree, that this is what Edmonton needs. Hell most Edmontonians agree that they DON'T want a publicly funded arena. The city acted on its own recognizance in that regard and full well knowing the polls didn't support this public investment. just saying.
You cannot one way or another say this is true or not.

Also, highly doubt that half of the COE has Library cards

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01-24-2013, 01:32 PM
  #161
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Just pointing out the obvious so that you're not "misleading" anyone. I could see the top level tickets going up to around 10 bucks more..no biggie. The prices will go up a bit, but no where as extravagent as you are bemoaning.

I split a pair of season seats up in the gallery with a guy who's had the tickets since 79. We get the price discounted down to $31/seat, I'm pretty sure that's the cheapest seat you can get outside of the game day half price off standing seats.

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01-24-2013, 01:33 PM
  #162
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I'm dying here. That was a gotcha.

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01-24-2013, 01:34 PM
  #163
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I'm dying here. That was a gotcha.
At least you can take your lumps, most people around here would just stop posting and hope the thread dies.

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01-24-2013, 01:34 PM
  #164
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WEll dammit, now I have no clothes. Good job, good dig.


I can laugh at myself. I post too much.


Tbh I used to take some issues with the blogger in question but enough people kept forwarding his stuff and its hard not to start appreciating his detail. Its like anything though. Sometimes you don't like a journalist but doesn't mean he doesn't come up with good stuff. Or vice versa. I don't think a pov other than mine exists which I agree with all the time..thats human nature.

Anyway he's a worthy read if I'm not.

cheers
The internet is a wonderful thing, but damn can it come back to bite ya in the ass, too!

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01-24-2013, 01:35 PM
  #165
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EPL afairc has well over 500K members/users. Its a hugely successful program that benefits most citizens. You could hardly come up with more common use facilities than a public library. Keeping in mind virtually every student in Edmonton would have and use a library card.

You know its funny how this goes, I state my case, using detail, substantiation, and half a dozen people in the thread flat out tell me if I don't like it move out of town. Which is rude to begin with and especially seeing I've invested over 50yrs here and don't wish to leave. (not saying you and thank you for keeping it civil)

What would people state if I was rude enough to say if you want a world class arena move to a world class city. Nobody would appreciate that comment at all. I wouldn't state it.

Its OK for people to agree, or disagree, that this is what Edmonton needs. Hell most Edmontonians agree that they DON'T want a publicly funded arena. The city acted on its own recognizance in that regard and full well knowing the polls didn't support this public investment. just saying.
You can poll people in a city and they are going to disagree with most things that spend a lot of money. And I can understand some peoples hesitancy to spend that kind of money. But I also do believe that over time, this project will end up returning money into the city coffers, and also bring a sense of pride back to downtown Edmonton.

I do agree, the people who are saying things like "get out of town" etc, are just being childish and rude, and honestly it doesn't really help people like me who are trying to argue for the arena. I get a little worked up sometimes about it myself, but I mostly get worked up on the whole "families" thing. Because I pay my taxes, just as much as my neighbor who has a kid, I know I won't get any use out of the new school that is getting built down the road, or the skatepark they built last year, or anything like that, and I'm totally cool with that. Just as long as those families are cool with the idea that at some point, something is going to come along that I want my tax dollars spent on, and if they are disapproving on the pure idea that it is not "family friendly" infuriates me.

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01-24-2013, 01:36 PM
  #166
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Every library in the city is crowded. Where you been?

Minimum ticket price in the new arena for hockey will easily be 100bucks/ticket with all charges. Easy. If anybody wants to bet on that.

you think a normal family of 4 is going to plunk down 400buck minimum just to get in? Another 100bucks on concessions?


Remember as well people are engaged in "boomspeak' at the moment. Theres nobody here in the 90's that would be suggesting that people would be spending this kind of money on entertainment back then. Premium Oiler tickets were going for 20bucks pretty much any night right outside of Northlands. Scalpers could barely give them away.

Guess what discretionary spending gets cut first during a downturn?

High priced entertainment.

Guess where were headed?
Then don't bring the whole family. You can't expect games to be cheap when there's so much demand for them. You can have a night out at the game with 2 seats for under $200. Don't go blow money at the concessions. It's not a mandatory thing to go buy $6 drinks and a whackload of snacks to go with it.

I've been to Bonnie Doon's library a couple times recently and it was a ghost town. Admittedly, I haven't been anywhere else in years, but it's still irrelevant. There are so many free and good sources for education online these days that libraries aren't as important as they used to be.

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01-24-2013, 01:37 PM
  #167
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There's the rub. The ticket tax has been around since Pocklington. It's not new.
We're not talking ticketmaster here we're talking ticket tax. The one allegedly funding 125M of the building price. Not sure if we're on the same page here.

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01-24-2013, 01:39 PM
  #168
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The internet is a wonderful thing, but damn can it come back to bite ya in the ass, too!
Apparently you have a better photo memory of our collective exchanges than I do.

But you got my undivided attention now. **** that was classic.

I'm googling now to see if I ever said the world was flat. I'm old you know.

respect

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01-24-2013, 01:39 PM
  #169
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I'm dying here. That was a gotcha.
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At least you can take your lumps, most people around here would just stop posting and hope the thread dies.
Cantankerous, maybe. But you are a stand up guy, Replacement. Big kudos for not going petulant, as some would do...

It's not "Horcoff has more value than Crosby" foot-in-mouth worthy, but it's not without it's charm. Good show!

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01-24-2013, 01:41 PM
  #170
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Cantankerous, maybe. But you are a stand up guy, Replacement. Big kudos for not going petulant, as some would do...

It's not "Horcoff has more value than Crosby" foot-in-mouth worthy, but it's not without it's charm. Good show!
Well that damn Yakupov kid is always on his lawn!

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01-24-2013, 01:41 PM
  #171
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Who cares what the ticket prices are?
If people fill the building.. they go up. when they stop going.. they go down.

The city isn't building this so the less fortunate can see NHL hockey. They're doing it in hopes of making a return via tax investment for the arena itself and the surrounding development.

You can argue that there won't be any return on that investment. I've heard heard so many different things about it that I don't know what to think.

I do know they'll never make a return on the millwoods LRT. The meadows rec centre... any bloody library ever built. etc.

Funny part is Replacement. The arena could just as possibly be funding your LRT as it could be responsible for its demise.

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01-24-2013, 01:41 PM
  #172
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We're not talking ticketmaster here we're talking ticket tax. The one allegedly funding 125M of the building price. Not sure if we're on the same page here.
I'm not talking ticketmaster either lol..

http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/201...monton-public/

Quote:
In 1998 Pocklington hatched a plan to move the struggling Oilers to Houston.
The NHL franchise was only saved when a group of local investors, Cal Nichols and the EIG, stepped up to buy the team, then worked out a new lease deal with the city on extremely favourable terms.
The new deal saw the EIG pay $1 per year for rent (plus about a million per year to Northlands for game expenses). At the same time, the EIG got to keep the ticket tax collected at Oilers games, which now amounts to about $4 million dollars a year. This money goes straight into the Katz Groupís coffers.
It's suprising how many people forget this....


Anyhew...here's the projected seating plan for the new arena. I see lots of top tier seats here:


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01-24-2013, 01:45 PM
  #173
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Then don't bring the whole family. You can't expect games to be cheap when there's so much demand for them. You can have a night out at the game with 2 seats for under $200. Don't go blow money at the concessions. It's not a mandatory thing to go buy $6 drinks and a whackload of snacks to go with it.

I've been to Bonnie Doon's library a couple times recently and it was a ghost town. Admittedly, I haven't been anywhere else in years, but it's still irrelevant. There are so many free and good sources for education online these days that libraries aren't as important as they used to be.
Its a pretty mature area, I see a lot of seniors around there and a lot of them that do make it out to the library. If you checked that library 20-30 years ago it was full to the rafters. Just like any current area where most of the family populations are. Bonnie Doon is a seniors and adult area now. Not as many kids anymore.

I don't go to NHL games out of principal. We all make our personal decisions. I do support other teams, U of A especially. Eskimos as well. FC Edmonton. I just prefer going to events and hobnobbing with regular folk. Pro hockey is just feeling too much of the ritz for me. I can't relate to the players.

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01-24-2013, 01:48 PM
  #174
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Well that damn Yakupov kid is always on his lawn!
Hey I love Yakupov. Now talk up Ben Eager and you got something.

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01-24-2013, 01:48 PM
  #175
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Here's a cross section:



Stage set up on the end:



And stage set up in the middle:


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