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Flyers Terminate Hovinen's Contract (claimed by Edmonton Oilers, per D. Dreger)

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Old
01-24-2013, 02:36 PM
  #26
Krishna
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Originally Posted by OccupySouthBroadSt View Post
So when is Hovinen's name going to be removed from that enviable Flyers prospect ticker?
Probably after the draft

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01-24-2013, 02:40 PM
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Joacim Eriksson. many think he has a likeness to Sunshine from Remember The Titans.
seems to be having a great season this year so far

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01-24-2013, 02:42 PM
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Probably after the draft
My point is why bother...

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01-24-2013, 02:49 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by PhilaFlyers View Post
Bill Meltzer ‏@billmeltzer
Organization had been very unhappy w/ Hovinen. They perceived work ethic issues ("doesn't compete") and half-hearted effort to adapt game.

There were loud whispers that Hovinen quit trying to work his way up after bad preseason + being sent to Trenton.Wasn't a question of talent
I was lucky enough to have a conversation with Bill wherein he told me exactly this, which explains a few comments I made awhile ago. Aside: Bill is super nice and has forgotten more hockey than I know. I was wondering when this news would hit the fan.

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01-24-2013, 03:01 PM
  #30
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That's a shame. I wanted to see him make it. Oh well.
Yeah, same here.

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Originally Posted by janecky View Post
It took a while for him to break through as a starter in Finland, so he's had his fill of being pushed to the back of the queue. He came to North America to play in the AHL and then challenge for a spot in the NHL. The ECHL is a low-level league, so anything but a conditioning assignment there is a slap in the face to most Euro goalies. Teams in the ECHL roll only three lines and the systems are below par. Hovinen expected to move up in his career, but he actually moved down as the ECHL is skill wise on level with Mestis (second tier of Finnish hockey) and tactically less sophisticated. What's worse, he wasn't even playing that much.

You have to wonder what the Flyers management thought it was doing. When you sign a Euro goalie, the options are NHL, AHL, or send the goalie back to Europe. Sending a guy to be a backup in the ECHL is just stupid. They treated him like he was a kid fresh out of the juniors. I can't say I'm surprised though. I never understood why Hovinen signed for the Flyers to begin with. It must've been his only NHL offer or his agent doesn't have his finger on the pulse. The Flyers is one of the very last organizations I'd advise my European AHL-level goalie to sign for. Don't get me wrong, the Flyers in itself is a great NHL club, but the way the hockey ops are run, it's ruthless and volatile. When it comes to goalies, there just doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason in how goalies are used and developed in the organization.
I fully agree here and while I think he should've put more into it at least at the beginning of his stint in the ECHL, I can't really blame him for the attitude too much. What we found out, though, is that he doesn't thrive in situations where he's being pushed to the bottom, but unfortunately we'll never know how he'd do if given a more fitting position at least in the AHL. He didn't play well in the preseason, so that might signal him not being good enough, but that was a couple of games and him coming off an injury. It's also true that ideally you'd want all players on the team to be superheroes that battle through adversity, both mental and physical, but on the other hand it's only human to say **** it in situations like this. I know people might jump onto this post, but I wonder how many of them would give it their all if they switched their workplace from one where they've established themselves only to compete with interns or whatever as supposedly the way to ultimately make it to the top of the ladder. It's a silly thing to do, and I think Hovinen should've been kept at least in the AHL and given playing time there. If he doesn't perform, fine, release him, no problem there. But this is just bad handling of prospects, at least in my opinion.

I do wonder, though, whether he had this attitude right from the get-go or was it the fact that he played badly at the beginning to get that resentment and resignation to kick in, and that that then only further deepened his woes.

Another thing I wonder is how other teams deal with prospects on the fringe? Are they also as happy-go-lucky with contracts as Holmgren is?

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01-24-2013, 03:09 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by janecky View Post
It took a while for him to break through as a starter in Finland, so he's had his fill of being pushed to the back of the queue. He came to North America to play in the AHL and then challenge for a spot in the NHL. The ECHL is a low-level league, so anything but a conditioning assignment there is a slap in the face to most Euro goalies. Teams in the ECHL roll only three lines and the systems are below par. Hovinen expected to move up in his career, but he actually moved down as the ECHL is skill wise on level with Mestis (second tier of Finnish hockey) and tactically less sophisticated. What's worse, he wasn't even playing that much.

You have to wonder what the Flyers management thought it was doing. When you sign a Euro goalie, the options are NHL, AHL, or send the goalie back to Europe. Sending a guy to be a backup in the ECHL is just stupid. They treated him like he was a kid fresh out of the juniors. I can't say I'm surprised though. I never understood why Hovinen signed for the Flyers to begin with. It must've been his only NHL offer or his agent doesn't have his finger on the pulse. The Flyers is one of the very last organizations I'd advise my European AHL-level goalie to sign for. Don't get me wrong, the Flyers in itself is a great NHL club, but the way the hockey ops are run, it's ruthless and volatile. When it comes to goalies, there just doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason in how goalies are used and developed in the organization.
Great post. I love the Nordics and their superior English grammar that puts most of us to shame.

But I have to say, I think you're missing the wildcard factor. No position is more volatile than goaltender. And no athlete or scout or agent can ever say for sure where they'll top out. At this level - the highest one - it's all gambles.

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01-24-2013, 03:31 PM
  #32
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I was hoping he would turn out to be something good with that 6'7' frame...

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01-24-2013, 03:52 PM
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Yeah, didn't mean to jump down your throat. Seravalli is pretty stupid about everything when it comes to player movement and such
I haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate him. THE worst writer in Philly

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01-24-2013, 04:00 PM
  #34
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I haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate him. THE worst writer in Philly
Panotch

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01-24-2013, 04:04 PM
  #35
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Many more say CarchidiOT

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01-24-2013, 04:05 PM
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One thing I like about Carchidi is that he actually responds to other people on twitter

Panotch just sends you an angry message if you bash him

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01-24-2013, 04:07 PM
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Panotch just sends you an angry message if you bash him
Does he? I did not know that....then again never felt the need to communicate with him.

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01-24-2013, 04:12 PM
  #38
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Yeah, same here.

I fully agree here and while I think he should've put more into it at least at the beginning of his stint in the ECHL, I can't really blame him for the attitude too much. What we found out, though, is that he doesn't thrive in situations where he's being pushed to the bottom, but unfortunately we'll never know how he'd do if given a more fitting position at least in the AHL. He didn't play well in the preseason, so that might signal him not being good enough, but that was a couple of games and him coming off an injury. It's also true that ideally you'd want all players on the team to be superheroes that battle through adversity, both mental and physical, but on the other hand it's only human to say **** it in situations like this. I know people might jump onto this post, but I wonder how many of them would give it their all if they switched their workplace from one where they've established themselves only to compete with interns or whatever as supposedly the way to ultimately make it to the top of the ladder. It's a silly thing to do, and I think Hovinen should've been kept at least in the AHL and given playing time there. If he doesn't perform, fine, release him, no problem there. But this is just bad handling of prospects, at least in my opinion.

I do wonder, though, whether he had this attitude right from the get-go or was it the fact that he played badly at the beginning to get that resentment and resignation to kick in, and that that then only further deepened his woes.

Another thing I wonder is how other teams deal with prospects on the fringe? Are they also as happy-go-lucky with contracts as Holmgren is?
What more could the Flyers have done with Hovinen though? He came to training camp and was clearly outplayed by Heeter and Munroe. What kind of message would the organization have sent to everyone if Hovinen was kept in the AHL while Heeter went to the ECHL? Seems to me that Hovinen came in with an entitled attitude and when things didn't go his way, he sulked.

You'd figure that the competitor in him would want to prove everyone wrong and that they made a mistake sending him to the ECHL, but he didn't. Hopefully now the Flyers right their wrong and they get Ericsson signed to a contract.

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01-24-2013, 04:12 PM
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I tweeted at him about his article on CSN being wrong when he posted about the weber offersheet

He sent me back an angry message telling me to not tell him how to do his job

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01-24-2013, 04:12 PM
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Panotch just sends you an angry message if you bash him
I can't wait to try it.

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01-24-2013, 04:15 PM
  #41
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What more could the Flyers have done with Hovinen though? He came to training camp and was clearly outplayed by Heeter and Munroe. What kind of message would the organization have sent to everyone if Hovinen was kept in the AHL while Heeter went to the ECHL? Seems to me that Hovinen came in with an entitled attitude and when things didn't go his way, he sulked.

You'd figure that the competitor in him would want to prove everyone wrong and that they made a mistake sending him to the ECHL, but he didn't. Hopefully now the Flyers right their wrong and they get Ericsson signed to a contract.
This is true....I mean what's the point of camp then? Sounds like he got beat out fair and square but at the same time I can see how he would sulk but don't condone it and certainly not professional of him.

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01-24-2013, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by janecky View Post
It took a while for him to break through as a starter in Finland, so he's had his fill of being pushed to the back of the queue. He came to North America to play in the AHL and then challenge for a spot in the NHL. The ECHL is a low-level league, so anything but a conditioning assignment there is a slap in the face to most Euro goalies. Teams in the ECHL roll only three lines and the systems are below par. Hovinen expected to move up in his career, but he actually moved down as the ECHL is skill wise on level with Mestis (second tier of Finnish hockey) and tactically less sophisticated. What's worse, he wasn't even playing that much.

You have to wonder what the Flyers management thought it was doing. When you sign a Euro goalie, the options are NHL, AHL, or send the goalie back to Europe. Sending a guy to be a backup in the ECHL is just stupid. They treated him like he was a kid fresh out of the juniors. I can't say I'm surprised though. I never understood why Hovinen signed for the Flyers to begin with. It must've been his only NHL offer or his agent doesn't have his finger on the pulse. The Flyers is one of the very last organizations I'd advise my European AHL-level goalie to sign for. Don't get me wrong, the Flyers in itself is a great NHL club, but the way the hockey ops are run, it's ruthless and volatile. When it comes to goalies, there just doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason in how goalies are used and developed in the organization.
or maybe the kid just dont have the stuff

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01-24-2013, 04:33 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by janecky View Post
It took a while for him to break through as a starter in Finland, so he's had his fill of being pushed to the back of the queue. He came to North America to play in the AHL and then challenge for a spot in the NHL. The ECHL is a low-level league, so anything but a conditioning assignment there is a slap in the face to most Euro goalies. Teams in the ECHL roll only three lines and the systems are below par. Hovinen expected to move up in his career, but he actually moved down as the ECHL is skill wise on level with Mestis (second tier of Finnish hockey) and tactically less sophisticated. What's worse, he wasn't even playing that much.

You have to wonder what the Flyers management thought it was doing. When you sign a Euro goalie, the options are NHL, AHL, or send the goalie back to Europe. Sending a guy to be a backup in the ECHL is just stupid. They treated him like he was a kid fresh out of the juniors. I can't say I'm surprised though. I never understood why Hovinen signed for the Flyers to begin with. It must've been his only NHL offer or his agent doesn't have his finger on the pulse. The Flyers is one of the very last organizations I'd advise my European AHL-level goalie to sign for. Don't get me wrong, the Flyers in itself is a great NHL club, but the way the hockey ops are run, it's ruthless and volatile. When it comes to goalies, there just doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason in how goalies are used and developed in the organization.
it's simple, play well get rewarded. Hovinen was the worst of the bunch so he was sent to the ECHL. once down there it was between him and wedgewood. hovinen was worse yet again so he took the back-up spot. it's no ones fault but his own. player don't just get handed a back-up NHL spot or even a spot on a AHL team, they have to prove they are worthy. Hovinen didn't do that.

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01-24-2013, 04:49 PM
  #44
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I understand that Europeans are more socialist in the paradigms they were raised on. Everyone has their place to more of an extent than is believed in in North America.

Plus when the leagues you follow are not at the top of the heap, that changes your outlook as well. There's more like to be a "settling" factor, or a ceiling, for the players you're interested in.

Here it's all about getting the most out of potential. What someone might once have told you is your probable professional eventuality gets thrown out the window.

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01-24-2013, 04:50 PM
  #45
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Both are still FA's but Moore just lost his wife after battle with cancer so I am not sure he is looking to get back on ice anytime soon

Why would you want to sign a C? Flyers problem is the D not C

I think your 1st round pick looks pretty comfortable at NHL level
defense is not the issue for the flyers right now. PK troubles and an inability to score are our biggest problems. our forward corps is too young. bringing in a vet whose name isn't ruslan fedotenko might be a good move.

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01-24-2013, 04:52 PM
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What more could the Flyers have done with Hovinen though? He came to training camp and was clearly outplayed by Heeter and Munroe. What kind of message would the organization have sent to everyone if Hovinen was kept in the AHL while Heeter went to the ECHL? Seems to me that Hovinen came in with an entitled attitude and when things didn't go his way, he sulked.
The same message that the organization sends yearly by keeping Shelley on the NHL roster over much more talented players. The same message that was sent to the other AHL players when we sent Couturier and Schenn down to the Phantoms, which drastically cut everyone else's ice time. The same message that was sent when Akeson was moved to the ECHL to make room for said NHL players.
That message is: THE NHL CLUB COMES FIRST!

The Phantoms are a farm team, as is our ECHL affiliate. Their primary goal is the development of our pro prospects and the advancement of our NHL team. So if Heeter or Munroe have no chance of ever being legitimate NHL players, but they happen to be on better form then Hovinen right now, then that sucks for Munroe and/or Heeter, but one of them is getting sent down. That's just the way it is. Top prospects take precedence over career AHL players.

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01-24-2013, 05:10 PM
  #47
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It took a while for him to break through as a starter in Finland, so he's had his fill of being pushed to the back of the queue. He came to North America to play in the AHL and then challenge for a spot in the NHL. The ECHL is a low-level league, so anything but a conditioning assignment there is a slap in the face to most Euro goalies. Teams in the ECHL roll only three lines and the systems are below par. Hovinen expected to move up in his career, but he actually moved down as the ECHL is skill wise on level with Mestis (second tier of Finnish hockey) and tactically less sophisticated. What's worse, he wasn't even playing that much.

You have to wonder what the Flyers management thought it was doing. When you sign a Euro goalie, the options are NHL, AHL, or send the goalie back to Europe. Sending a guy to be a backup in the ECHL is just stupid. They treated him like he was a kid fresh out of the juniors. I can't say I'm surprised though. I never understood why Hovinen signed for the Flyers to begin with. It must've been his only NHL offer or his agent doesn't have his finger on the pulse. The Flyers is one of the very last organizations I'd advise my European AHL-level goalie to sign for. Don't get me wrong, the Flyers in itself is a great NHL club, but the way the hockey ops are run, it's ruthless and volatile. When it comes to goalies, there just doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason in how goalies are used and developed in the organization.
Couldnt have said it better myself. Only reason Hovinen didn't work out is the stupuid management decisions. Bringing him over to play in ECHL is the dumbess **** Ive ever seen the Flyers do.

I dont care that he had a bad camp this year in AHL,he should have been given a chance anyway.

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01-24-2013, 05:21 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by janecky View Post
It took a while for him to break through as a starter in Finland, so he's had his fill of being pushed to the back of the queue. He came to North America to play in the AHL and then challenge for a spot in the NHL. The ECHL is a low-level league, so anything but a conditioning assignment there is a slap in the face to most Euro goalies. Teams in the ECHL roll only three lines and the systems are below par. Hovinen expected to move up in his career, but he actually moved down as the ECHL is skill wise on level with Mestis (second tier of Finnish hockey) and tactically less sophisticated. What's worse, he wasn't even playing that much.

You have to wonder what the Flyers management thought it was doing. When you sign a Euro goalie, the options are NHL, AHL, or send the goalie back to Europe. Sending a guy to be a backup in the ECHL is just stupid. They treated him like he was a kid fresh out of the juniors. I can't say I'm surprised though. I never understood why Hovinen signed for the Flyers to begin with. It must've been his only NHL offer or his agent doesn't have his finger on the pulse. The Flyers is one of the very last organizations I'd advise my European AHL-level goalie to sign for. Don't get me wrong, the Flyers in itself is a great NHL club, but the way the hockey ops are run, it's ruthless and volatile. When it comes to goalies, there just doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason in how goalies are used and developed in the organization.
Agree 100%.

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01-24-2013, 05:33 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by TheIceman26 View Post
Should of signed sunshine. I saw hovinen in Trenton and he was freakin awful. Knew right away he had no shot at the NHL.
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Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
work ethic issues. LOL

kudos to the scout that recomended him over Sunshine
This again?

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01-24-2013, 05:38 PM
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All right, as an outsider here, I've seen 'Sunshine' and 'should have signed Sunshine' come up a few times. Who is Sunshine?
A guy we drafted in the 7th round in 2008 named Joacim Eriksson. He came to prospect camp that year and dominated the running portion of the trial on the isle proving his dedication to fitness which is a huge factor with goalies. By about mid to late 08 many around here were very excited about him (myself included) and when 2010 came and went and he wasn't signed a lot posters around here were ready to quarter and drag Homer even though no-one had any clue as what his demands were regarding a contract (once again, myself included).

He has been a very steady goaltender ever since the draft back in 08 (and has posted some monster numbers along the way) which has made many here wish he had been signed instead of some or all of the other guys who have been brought in instead. Although he is now draft eligible, no-one else has bothered to draft him either which leads me to think there is a reason no-one wants him (like he said he doesn't want to come over for example). But if he has not made any strange demands I join the list of those who wonder why we keep signing garbage or old fogies instead of guys like him.

I'm really hoping that Stolie the goalie becomes the tender of the future so we can put the Sunshine thing to rest because it is going to bother many of us until someone we draft actually stops some pucks. Until then he is destined to be the most overtalked about player who was never signed.

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