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Phoenix LXVIII - "Watch out for that Tree"

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Old
01-24-2013, 05:45 PM
  #901
Whileee
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Originally Posted by TheLegend View Post
Based on what?? Because he's the only other name mentioned so far that's involved with Jamison?? Or do you have a real source for this assertion???
The IEH guys always had the biggest mouths - not the biggest wallet.

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01-24-2013, 05:49 PM
  #902
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As this saga comes down to the wire, and we eagerly await the arrival of "the Tortoise", I think it is time to remind ourselves that if the NHL had set the sale price at a fair market value, this deal would likely have been done long ago. It's easy to point the finger at the COG and Jamison, but they did what they could. I think that the NHL has been rather brutish with Glendale and the Coyotes fans.

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01-24-2013, 05:50 PM
  #903
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I think that you are on to something. The all Coyotes attendance thread. People from all over Quebec can congregate and speak of how many more people would be at a Nordiques game. This would be a designated smoking room as well
I almost started one last night. However, the title I had in mind would have surely earned me the *

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01-24-2013, 05:54 PM
  #904
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Coming off a WCF appearance are you seriously going to blame the attendance on not having an owner. How many times are Coyote fans going to use that as a crutch.. pathetic. How about getting off the message boards and going to some games once and a while. Honestly how many more years do we have to watch on television chunks and chunks of empty seats. Tickets are like 4 bucks lol if you're a hockey fan how do you beat that deal.
This is something I often wonder about with the fanbase. Ok fine, ownership drama discourages season ticket sales. I get that, but why wouldn't be people showing up to games on single game tickets? That makes no sense. They can get the tickets on shorter notice than season tickets and the team will be there, no theoretical loss of investment. And ticket prices aren't exactly astronomical (in fact, quite the opposite. They're rock bottom, deep down on this little dirtwad we call Earth). Bad location? Ok, that covers weekday games, but what about weekend games? And are there so few local (i.e. Glendale & adjacent suburbs) Coyotes fans, or heck, hockey fans, that clearance sale ticket prices won't lure them out. Heck, it looks like for $20-30, 2 people could get pretty good seats and eat-in at the arena. What's baffling is this isn't some flattened Wily E. Coyote roadkill team on the ice, they're actually quite good (NHL Coyotes & MLB Rangers proved ownership dramas, bankruptcy and the like have no effect on on-ice/on-field competitive ability). These Coyotes may be the best bargain in NHL history (lowest ticket price relative to on-ice skill). Even with 2012's playoff run, there were pictures of "buy a case of beer, get tix to the playoff games" and not the enter into the drawing kind either. With all this, it looks like the ownership drama is just an excuse to not support the team. That or NHL hockey for over $1 is just too outrageous a price.

With the way the Coyotes saga has gone, are we sure the Jobing Arena wasn't named after the Biblical Job?

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01-24-2013, 05:55 PM
  #905
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As this saga comes down to the wire, and we eagerly await the arrival of "the Tortoise", I think it is time to remind ourselves that if the NHL had set the sale price at a fair market value, this deal would likely have been done long ago. It's easy to point the finger at the COG and Jamison, but they did what they could. I think that the NHL has been rather brutish with Glendale and the Coyotes fans.
This comes to mind.

FREE Franchise here.....Get your free franchise here!!! Franchise Here...Get your FREE franchise here.

Peanuts here! Popcorn here $7.00

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01-24-2013, 05:59 PM
  #906
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Originally Posted by blues10 View Post
This comes to mind.

FREE Franchise here.....Get your free franchise here!!! Franchise Here...Get your FREE franchise here.

Peanuts here! Popcorn here $7.00
Hard to know for sure, but I wonder whether $90-100 million sale price might get it done.

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01-24-2013, 06:04 PM
  #907
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Hard to know for sure, but I wonder whether $90-100 million sale price might get it done.
I have never been in the market for an NHL franchise but I would assume that may have gotten the ball rolling.

I do own a single share in Stamford Bridge as a member of the Chesea pitch owners. but that is the extent of my foray into professional sports ownership.

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01-24-2013, 06:13 PM
  #908
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Originally Posted by Whileee View Post
Hard to know for sure, but I wonder whether $90-100 million sale price might get it done.
BK sale was cash $128,382,121. No bidders at that price (2009 $)

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01-24-2013, 06:14 PM
  #909
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Originally Posted by Whileee View Post
Hard to know for sure, but I wonder whether $90-100 million sale price might get it done.
I can remember rumors from when the NHL originally took control of the Coyotes that Bettman made assurances to the other owners that he would eventually get the money back. Now the losses look to have been mostly covered by the COG, but the original investment hasn't been met yet. This is where the $160 million figure comes from.

I would also guess that the $90-100 million figure is the value of the franchise in Phoenix. Bettman knows he could get his asking price, and probably more, in another city.

My ownership experience: I once owned stock in the Boston Celtics and Manchester United.

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01-24-2013, 06:20 PM
  #910
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Originally Posted by CasualFan View Post
BK sale was cash $128,382,121. No bidders at that price (2009 $)
Yup... but add $300+ million in subsidies from the COG, free use of the arena, plus all parking revenues over the next 20 years, drop the price by $30 million, and you might have some interested potential owners.

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01-24-2013, 06:25 PM
  #911
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Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
I can remember rumors from when the NHL originally took control of the Coyotes that Bettman made assurances to the other owners that he would eventually get the money back. Now the losses look to have been mostly covered by the COG, but the original investment hasn't been met yet. This is where the $160 million figure comes from.

I would also guess that the $90-100 million figure is the value of the franchise in Phoenix. Bettman knows he could get his asking price, and probably more, in another city.

My ownership experience: I once owned stock in the Boston Celtics and Manchester United.
I have no doubt that Bettman could get more if he sold to an owner and let him relocate to another city.

But I think that the NHL owes Glendale. During the NHL's battle with Balsillie during the bankruptcy fiasco, the COG supported the NHL's auction bid, even though they would have made a lot more from Balsillie. Had they backed Balsillie's auction bid, the NHL might have been in some deep mire. Since then the COG has put out $50 million while the NHL has been looking for a buyer to pay an inflated price that they stubbornly refuse to reduce.

So, the thanks that Glendale gets for helping out the NHL in the bankruptcy saga is a big kick in the teeth. Not nice.

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01-24-2013, 06:34 PM
  #912
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Originally Posted by Whileee View Post
I have no doubt that Bettman could get more if he sold to an owner and let him relocate to another city.

But I think that the NHL owes Glendale. During the NHL's battle with Balsillie during the bankruptcy fiasco, the COG supported the NHL's auction bid, even though they would have made a lot more from Balsillie. Had they backed Balsillie's auction bid, the NHL might have been in some deep mire. Since then the COG has put out $50 million while the NHL has been looking for a buyer to pay an inflated price that they stubbornly refuse to reduce.

So, the thanks that Glendale gets for helping out the NHL in the bankruptcy saga is a big kick in the teeth. Not nice.
There's no doubt that the NHL would be the bad guy in this and they will get most of the blame if it doesn't work out. But I don't think we'll ever know the true story behind all of this. If GJ doesn't close the deal, I think he'll eventually come out and say that one of his investors got cold feet and wouldn't put his money in. I don't think he'll blame GB, saying that the NHL wouldn't lower its asking price. GB will just say that a deal couldn't be reached, but he thanks the city of Glendale for all they've done.

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01-24-2013, 06:56 PM
  #913
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Originally Posted by Whileee View Post
I have no doubt that Bettman could get more if he sold to an owner and let him relocate to another city.

But I think that the NHL owes Glendale. During the NHL's battle with Balsillie during the bankruptcy fiasco, the COG supported the NHL's auction bid, even though they would have made a lot more from Balsillie. Had they backed Balsillie's auction bid, the NHL might have been in some deep mire. Since then the COG has put out $50 million while the NHL has been looking for a buyer to pay an inflated price that they stubbornly refuse to reduce.

So, the thanks that Glendale gets for helping out the NHL in the bankruptcy saga is a big kick in the teeth. Not nice.
Glendale support for or against the NHL did not change jack squat. The moment the NHL told the judge they would not approuve the sale and the relocation Balsillie's bid was dead. If anything siding with the NHL likely just told Garry that he had some serious suckers to fleece. And fleece them he sure did.

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01-24-2013, 06:56 PM
  #914
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Indications are Tony Leblanc will be his senior money man!
Anthony Leblanc is another great character in this story. His family name means "The White ( knight?)" in French, it seemed he was representing the obscure investors at the home opener and he is a nostalgic Nordiques fan .
http://www.lakeheadualumni.ca/articl...eblanc-392.asp

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01-24-2013, 07:07 PM
  #915
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There is so much wrong with what has been posted in the past 24 hours I can't quote it all but let me summarize and say why its wrong:

1) Its an 8PM start and all the money guys live on the other side of town - thats wrong because the Arizonans here have said the location is not a problem

2) Come on its the Blue Jackets on a Wednesday! We drew well when it was the Hawks on a weekend and we'll do it again when the Kings come to town - Yeah so your solution is that your home games should only be on weekends against Original 6 teams, the reigning champs, and teams who come from cities that have a lot of ex-residents in Glendale. Sorry every team has to have week night games and not every matchup is going to be a glamor one. There are 30 teams, they can't all be cool. How do you think other teams feel when your boys come to town. If your main draw is the opponent and not you you are in trouble.

3) The stubhub prices don't matter, those are tickets sold. Yeah but how long do season ticket holders stay if they see those prices. I used to have a 20 game pack to the Cleveland Indians (I'm a Jays fan but live in Cleveland so I went because I like baseball - basically the type of people the Yotes need until they get their own full time fans) I didn't reup because I was paying $23 for seats that you could get on the street for $10

4) Fans aren't buying because the team might move. Yeah there are many teams that had a gun to their heads "sell 13K seats or we are leaving" and they did. You've had more time to get your act together than anyone else

5) Why do we keep repeating the same stuff over and over - because it hasn't changed

6) The next thread title should be xyz. No it should be "How I Bought Your Hockey Team" like How I Met Your Mother

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01-24-2013, 07:14 PM
  #916
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Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
There's no doubt that the NHL would be the bad guy in this and they will get most of the blame if it doesn't work out. But I don't think we'll ever know the true story behind all of this. If GJ doesn't close the deal, I think he'll eventually come out and say that one of his investors got cold feet and wouldn't put his money in. I don't think he'll blame GB, saying that the NHL wouldn't lower its asking price. GB will just say that a deal couldn't be reached, but he thanks the city of Glendale for all they've done.
I can picture Jamison trying to not offend anyone (Glendale, NHL, Bettman) as he reveals he doesn't have the investment group assembled (at least, if he doesn't slink away that is). He's not exactly a firebrand like Clark, who tosses nasty insults and tries to put the blame on everyone else. He's not the type to sling napalm. He's about as offensive as vanilla. He is a tortoise, but are we sure he's even in a race?

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01-24-2013, 07:23 PM
  #917
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I have never been in the market for an NHL franchise but I would assume that may have gotten the ball rolling.

I do own a single share in Stamford Bridge as a member of the Chesea pitch owners. but that is the extent of my foray into professional sports ownership.
Well, you know how to kick a man when he's down. No wonder you like this thread so much.

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01-24-2013, 07:42 PM
  #918
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Anthony Leblanc is another great character in this story....
Its difficult to ascertain just what involvement if any Le Blanc & McCullough of Ice Edge Holdings have with Jamison. Le Blanc purportedly splits his time between Thunder Bay, Ottawa & Phoenix. He ran as a Progressive Conservative in the Ontario Provincial Election in the Thunder Bay / Superior North Riding a couple of years back & was soundly defeated. For some time, been engaging the City of Thunder Bay in wanting to build a new arena (on the City & Provinces dime of course) and bringing in an AHL or ECHL team, likely more the latter than the former if at all.

His only real claim to fame was simply being lucky, being in the right place at the right time working for Jim Balsillie at RIM when it was flying high. Director of International Sales, mostly to Governments, leaving before Rim Jim & Rodier went after Phoenix through Bankruptcy. Picking up the pieces and thread thereafter with their ridiculous play for the franchise themselves. Apparently enlisting & or motivating one of the groups buddies, Matthew Hulsizer to step in & up after their efforts had cratered. Again, reported they were still involved but with Hulsizer at the minority level. Ditto with Jamison, along with apparently approaching the City of Glendale at one time to "manage the arena" (with absolutely no experience nor track record in the industry, let alone much in the way of capitol themselves).

Strange crew. Basically, like Hulsizer, Rounders. Opportunists playing the short-con. Persistent. No question their hockey fans, love the game, but so what? That doesnt automatically make them good people, and with exactly zero experience in the fields of sports & entertainment management, marketing, at any executive level, let alone ownership, with champagne tastes, I mean, what can you say? These unfortunately are often the types of individuals the NHL attracts, likes moths to a flame since 1924. The longest running off off OFF Broadway non-stage production of the Pirates of Penzance in the history of off off OFF Broadway Flim Flammery.... ever.

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01-24-2013, 08:15 PM
  #919
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Not to brag or anything but I own part of the Greenbay Packers

Seriously...

http://www.packers.com/community/shareholders.html

http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/...rn=nfl,wp13316

Me and a colleague split $5000 worth of shares IE 20 shares @ $250/pop.

Now THIS is what the Coyotes should do, become a publicly traded company to try and recoup their money. It's reported that Green Bay raised $70M with the share sales alone, at that rate the team could be owned by the City or State.....

Maybe I shouldn't give them any ideas.

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01-24-2013, 08:38 PM
  #920
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Not to brag or anything but I own part of the Greenbay Packers

Seriously...

http://www.packers.com/community/shareholders.html

http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/...rn=nfl,wp13316

Me and a colleague split $5000 worth of shares IE 20 shares @ $250/pop.

Now THIS is what the Coyotes should do, become a publicly traded company to try and recoup their money. It's reported that Green Bay raised $70M with the share sales alone, at that rate the team could be owned by the City or State.....

Maybe I shouldn't give them any ideas.
I have a share of Celtics stock in a frame. The problem is who would buy a share of Coyotes stock. Also the league rule is only a minority interest can be public

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01-24-2013, 08:50 PM
  #921
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I have a share of Celtics stock in a frame. The problem is who would buy a share of Coyotes stock. Also the league rule is only a minority interest can be public
To be honest, as much as I rip on the Coyotes and this joke of a fiasco. I would pay $250 to own a share of the team.............




........since they aren't likely to be around much longer.

Had you worried that I was going soft for a minute there didn't I.....

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01-24-2013, 08:50 PM
  #922
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The latest, if you want to call it that

Quote:
No news from Jamison as deadline nears

Eighteen days after he put forth a two-to-three-week timeline for closing the deal, prospective Coyotes owner Greg Jamison had nothing new to report when we caught up with him on Thursday.

"We’re working to finish this,” he said. “We’re aware of the deadline, and we know what we have to do to get it to the finish."

After approving a $308 million arena management deal in late November, the Glendale City Council gave Jamison until Jan. 31 to buy the team -- a deadline Jamison still believes is firm. That gives him one week to close the deal.
http://www.foxsportsarizona.com/pages/inthezona_blog

Tree ahead...

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01-24-2013, 08:55 PM
  #923
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Glendale has ponied up their cash...
How much longer until Jamison gets his act together ?

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01-24-2013, 08:56 PM
  #924
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The latest, if you want to call it that



http://www.foxsportsarizona.com/pages/inthezona_blog

Tree ahead...
May not be the latest but now the reality of the deadline approaching is starting to appear in more mainstream media

'In all our conversations with him, he has consistently outlined the possibility that this deal may not happen. But again, that is his experience as a businessman talking, not his concern that the deal will fall through.'


At least he's sounding like a realist

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01-24-2013, 09:19 PM
  #925
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My gosh, so few people at the Florida game. Another joke of a market. He hope we can start the Panthers relocation watch soon...
Everyone says that but they miss the context. The Panthers are a loss leader for the ownership group. They lose money on the Panthers but their whole entertainment enterprise is profitable. And the Panthers are the key to that enterprise (he who owns the team gets the arena contract, those events held in the arena are net profitable). They get rid of the Panthers, their business no longer exists.

Now, lets look at the Coyotes. They are a loss leader certainly, leading all pro sports in their losses (16 seasons of losses? Some upwards of tens of millions?). Owning them and getting the arena AMF is not the key to a thriving enterprise. The arena is just the second fiddle in the Phoenix area and while it can do well when well-stocked with events (as the numbers have shown), the Coyotes are being sold as a hockey team, not a piece of an entertainment venture with the location being the key (even some fans have argued for the West Valley being a bad location to put a non-NFL arena/ballpark/etc). That heavy subsidy *may* cover the losses if the stars align in the perfect position. Otherwise it's a bandage on a deep wound. Who is really after the arena, as was the case in South Florida? The NHL hasn't bothered to fill the non-Coyotes schedule and Jamison hasn't displayed competence in that (yeah, school graduations are the ticket. Maybe they can even sell tickets to it for more than the cost of NHL tickets there).

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