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P.K. Subban Thread - Edition 6.0 - #BlameSubban

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Old
01-24-2013, 06:02 PM
  #776
Teufelsdreck
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
If he plays as well and work on his few flaws and help this team to win, I don't see any problem.

If Gorges can get 3,9 for 5 years, PK can certainly get 5,5-6 for 6 or 7 years, and maybe more. But he has to mature as an individual as well as a hockey player.
Your outlook seems reasonable.

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01-24-2013, 06:04 PM
  #777
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Not sure how that changes what I said...is it his fault management built a defense squad that was so inept, it had it's 22yr old dman playing the toughest minutes and getting the toughest assignments?
McDonagh is NY did the same.

Hamonic for the isles did the same.

And many more last year and over the years.

Doesn't mean they have to get the big $$$ after a couple of seasons only.

It happens sometimes that injuries open doors for the youngest.

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01-24-2013, 06:05 PM
  #778
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Imagine ladies and gentleman, the rest of the season with PK, Marky, Diaz, etc...

It's going to be a good season.
Haven't you heard? PK is a detriment to the team and brings everyone around him down and simply must be sent away

Seriously though, it's gonna be great to see them all together

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01-24-2013, 06:06 PM
  #779
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
Your outlook seems reasonable.
Right now he is a thoroughbred, but he still doesn't know how to race. It takes more than a couple of seasons in the NHL. He's no Bobby Orr.

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01-24-2013, 06:06 PM
  #780
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Unless you are a good Canadian white kid or Scandinavian... you are a non-team player with attitude problems.
There certainly does seem to be an excess amount of "dislike" for the best young defenseman and clearly the best defenseman that Montreal last year. I guess PK is the ONLY "selfish" player in the league and the ONLY "player disliked in the locker room."

All this from people who don't have a clue as to what goes on in the locker room.

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01-24-2013, 06:06 PM
  #781
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Wrong about the penalties.

He may take a lot of penalties, but he also draws a lot of penalties. He takes 1.2 penalties per 60 minutes but he draws 0.9 penalties per 60 minutes, for a deficit of 0.3 penalties per 60 minutes; Emelin is the only dman who did better last year, Gorges and Kaberle did the same.

On average, Habs dmen took more penalties than they drew, probably the nature of the position and the system.

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stati...42+43+44+45+46
Who cares, if I see him take another one handed slashing penalty because he is flailing his stick over his head I will lose my mind. You also have to believe that number is going to increase with a crack down on diving.

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01-24-2013, 06:06 PM
  #782
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
I feel PK won't mature with a long term deal. That's my issue.
I completely disagree that PK is immature...how many 22-23yr olds get invited to do TV on a major sports channel and come off so eloquently as he did? How many young men of that age give as much time to charity as PK does? Not a team function charity, a charity that he drives on his own time.

Does PK need to change certain things about his behaviour? Probably, but that's not unlike most human beings.

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01-24-2013, 06:07 PM
  #783
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
Right now he is a thoroughbred, but he still doesn't know how to race. It takes more than a couple of seasons in the NHL. He's no Bobby Orr.
He doesn't know how to race best.

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01-24-2013, 06:07 PM
  #784
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Lecavalier is no longer elite anyway.

As for Crosby and Toews. Both were injured at some point. They were at reasonable PPGs to hit 70 points but didn't. I happen to count injury status as a downside too but can respect they could will be back to form as soon as this year.

If you wanna bring up defensive play and all that, sure. Just at a certain point whats the criteria? You said 70 points, you never said if gally would have strong or weak defensive play. I just assumed it would be respectable or average.

FWIW, I don't consider any player in last years 70+ points club to be weak defensively. Good players.
Fair enough. I have not been convinced that staying health is more skill than luck.

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01-24-2013, 06:07 PM
  #785
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Not sure how that changes what I said...is it his fault management built a defense squad that was so inept, it had it's 22yr old dman playing the toughest minutes and getting the toughest assignments?
Of course not. I'm just saying he's not a super stud yet. That's all. I think it's a fair comment.

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01-24-2013, 06:07 PM
  #786
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Forget about the obvious talent of PK. That arrogance and cockiness is also why he was able to handle the pressure and scrutiny of being a 22 year old playing as a #1 in Montreal. It takes a special player to be a star here. You take the good with the bad. And IMO the bad isn't even that bad. He is a hard worker who always shows up and when he makes a mistake or plays poorly he is always there facing the media saying exactly that.

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01-24-2013, 06:08 PM
  #787
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Does anyone else find it strange that people point to Price and MaxPac's bridge contracts when talking about the organization's philosophy when we have an entirely new management team in place?

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01-24-2013, 06:09 PM
  #788
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Fair enough. I have not been convinced that staying health is more skill than luck.
Of course not. Didn't mean to suggest that. Even so, the list grows to 11 or so(malkin as well). Still elite nonetheless correct?

I'm just pointing out that value includes injury status. In their case, minimal risk, maybe crosby though, who knows.

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01-24-2013, 06:09 PM
  #789
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
And he finished last in east.
We didn't finish last because of the 24 minutes a game PK was on the ice, but rather because of the 36 minutes a game PK was not on the ice.

Subban was a +9 last year playing against elite opposition, and the team as a whole was a -14.

That means the Habs were -23 when PK wasn't on the ice... -23 against the leftover opposition... that's really bad.

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01-24-2013, 06:09 PM
  #790
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Originally Posted by HankyZetts View Post
Crazy.
He'd be a number one defenseman

UNDISPUTABLE

Anaheim
Buffalo
Calgary
Carolina
Dallas
Columbus
Colorado
Edmonton
Florida
New Jersey
New York Islanders
Philadelphia
Tampa Bay
Washington

Arguable but can make a case that he would be:

Detroit
San Jose
Toronto
Vancouver
Winnipeg

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01-24-2013, 06:09 PM
  #791
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Of course not. I'm just saying he's not a super stud yet. That's all. I think it's a fair comment.
That's your opinion...and that's fine. But the raw data shows otherwise.

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01-24-2013, 06:09 PM
  #792
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Originally Posted by Sorinth View Post
Does anyone else find it strange that people point to Price and MaxPac's bridge contracts when talking about the organization's philosophy when we have an entirely new management team in place?
Well habs have never flexed their big money by giving long term front loaded deals. Maybe new management isn't like that, but so far they appear to be. I like that.

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01-24-2013, 06:10 PM
  #793
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Originally Posted by holyhabs87 View Post
Forget about the obvious talent of PK. That arrogance and cockiness is also why he was able to handle the pressure and scrutiny of being a 22 year old playing as a #1 in Montreal. It takes a special player to be a star here. You take the good with the bad. And IMO the bad isn't even that bad. He is a hard worker who always shows up and when he makes a mistake or plays poorly he is always there facing the media saying exactly that.
Arrogance and cockiness are fine, as long as you not brushing your teamates in the wrong side.

The guy need to start listening to the coaching staff and the veterans surrounding him on his team.

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01-24-2013, 06:11 PM
  #794
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LeBrun on TSN 690 a few moments ago:

''I talked to a couple of sources in the Habs front office last week and they have no intention of trading Subban.''

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01-24-2013, 06:11 PM
  #795
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Well habs have never flexed their big money by giving long term front loaded deals. Maybe new management isn't like that, but so far they appear to be. I like that.
They gave a very generous contract to Price. I don't see why they would not give one to PK IF he performs well and is a key component of this team in a couple of years. (Which mean basically a season and a half)

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01-24-2013, 06:11 PM
  #796
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
We didn't finish last because of the 24 minutes a game PK was on the ice, but rather because of the 36 minutes a game PK was not on the ice.

Subban was a +9 last year playing against elite opposition, and the team as a whole was a -14.

That means the Habs were -23 when PK wasn't on the ice... -23 against the leftover opposition... that's really bad.
He was probably also on the ice for most of if not all Gorges +14 as well

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01-24-2013, 06:12 PM
  #797
LyricalLyricist
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
We didn't finish last because of the 24 minutes a game PK was on the ice, but rather because of the 36 minutes a game PK was not on the ice.

Subban was a +9 last year playing against elite opposition, and the team as a whole was a -14.

That means the Habs were -23 when PK wasn't on the ice... -23 against the leftover opposition... that's really bad.
Well, he was our best D. I would imagine when crosby is on the ice the +- is greater than when the 4th line is.

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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
That's your opinion...and that's fine. But the raw data shows otherwise.
I've seen it and can see the argument. So don't blame you either.

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01-24-2013, 06:12 PM
  #798
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Can you name me an athlete, let a alone a human being...who doesn't want it all?

Who here wants to be paid LESS than what they think they're worth, IF they had a choice in the matter?

Ridiculous...
Apparently all the arm chair GM's who think Subban should sign for whatever or "shad up and play." A lot of phonies out there masquerading as hockey fans.

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01-24-2013, 06:13 PM
  #799
LyricalLyricist
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
LeBrun on TSN 690 a few moments ago:

''I talked to a couple of sources in the Habs front office last week and they have no intention of trading Subban.''
Excellent! What we already knew but confirmed.

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01-24-2013, 06:13 PM
  #800
417
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
Arrogance and cockiness are fine, as long as you not brushing your teamates in the wrong side.

The guy need to start listening to the coaching staff and the veterans surrounding him on his team.
He doesn't listen to the coaching staff...yet the coaching staff used him more than anyother player last year and even if there's a new coach in place, i'm 100% sure he's going to do the same

Something doesn't compute

Usually, when a player doesn't 'listen' to a coaching staff...they're playing time is reduce or even cut completely.

They don't usually have their icetime rise

But then again...I could be totally wrong

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