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Rangers @ Flyers | 1/24/13 : Kill Me Now!

View Poll Results: 3 Stars of the Game
Biron/Kreider/Asham 42 31.11%
Lundqvist 65 48.15%
Girardi 1 0.74%
Staal 11 8.15%
McDonagh 4 2.96%
Del Zotto 3 2.22%
Eminger 0 0%
Stralman 2 1.48%
Rupp 1 0.74%
Bickel 5 3.70%
Newbury 3 2.22%
Boyle 0 0%
Pyatt 58 42.96%
Hagelin 4 2.96%
Stepan 0 0%
Richards 1 0.74%
Callahan 1 0.74%
Nash 5 3.70%
Gaborik 7 5.19%
The Guys Who didn't Play 70 51.85%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 135. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-25-2013, 04:35 AM
  #251
fredrikstad
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRSchrute217 View Post
We look like ****. Lundqvist was great. PP still sucks. Same story.
It's great that Henke found his game again. Last game Gaborik-Richards- Nash was outstanding. They will find each other again. Trust it.

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01-25-2013, 05:32 AM
  #252
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I'm not going to panic just yet. But that being said, not being able to score on a 2 man advantage is killer! If Torts wants to win games by being a defense first team, we need to capitalize on "special team" assignments as much as possible. And to those down playing our start saying we've played top rated teams so far, we eventually have to go through these teams to win the cup, and right now it doesn't look too good!

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01-25-2013, 05:53 AM
  #253
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Originally Posted by LittleKev6D9 View Post
Would rather go to Federal "***** me in Ass" Prison for a year than have to watch the Rangers attempt another 5 on 3. Any chance they make a rule to start declining penalties?
Overreaction or hidden desires?

Sorry, but it's difficult not to slam lobs.

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01-25-2013, 05:54 AM
  #254
SixGoalieSystem
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They were 1 and 3 after four games last year too. I'm not worried at all.

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01-25-2013, 05:56 AM
  #255
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Last night disgusted me. I'm so tired of our team being pushed around. Flyers player plants Gaborik into the glass and no response. I'm not talking about fighting the guy who did it. I'm talking about someone putting Giroux on his ass. Why don't our guys make hits like that? They hit our top guy, we hit their top guy. Torts preaches jam yet I still don't see any. They skate around like a bunch of *******.

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01-25-2013, 06:02 AM
  #256
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Originally Posted by SixGoalieSystem View Post
They were 1 and 3 after four games last year too. I'm not worried at all.
Well the thing is that this time there is not that much time to fix things.

In general they're not playing BAD, but PP has to get fixed ASAP and Tortorella should start thinking a bit more offensively now that he has some weapons. Of course, that would also require Hagelin and Stepan to play much better than they have thus far, but still. Wouldn't kill me to see some creative puck movement.

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01-25-2013, 06:12 AM
  #257
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As i said in the GDT.

This team reminds me of the lifeless, lazy, and star powered teams the Rangers iced before the 2004-2005 lock out.

Boring to watch, no heart and most of all they are terrible.

I mean come on, the FLYERS??? The same Flyers who are icing half of their hockey team and have one of the worst goalies in the NHL??

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01-25-2013, 06:19 AM
  #258
SixGoalieSystem
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Originally Posted by tomcatNYR View Post
Well the thing is that this time there is not that much time to fix things.

In general they're not playing BAD, but PP has to get fixed ASAP and Tortorella should start thinking a bit more offensively now that he has some weapons. Of course, that would also require Hagelin and Stepan to play much better than they have thus far, but still. Wouldn't kill me to see some creative puck movement.
That is a valid point, but fact is the style of hockey we (wish to) play is hard on the players. Getting things working will take a few games and without the regular Torts camp it could be even more. We could change our style of play, but even if we do have some high end talent now, most of our roster still consists of gritty, defense first type of players who aren't equiped to be playing a higher risk kind of hockey.

The changes they need to make would be to have a more aggressive forecheck, take their shots and to get more movement on the pp. I still think Hags and Kreids will find their game and that would probably be enough to get this team going.

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01-25-2013, 06:30 AM
  #259
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Richards lacks the drive and dedication he had last season...

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01-25-2013, 06:37 AM
  #260
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I'm not in Panic, but I am concerned with what I see. I'm seeing way to many stick checks and leaning...no body leaning, two strides back. I'm utterly disgusted with last night.

Hank had a wonderful game.

1st Line did not other than a few chances...


Low scoring chances...no shots...another 5-3 and PP...Something has to give.


They better not waltz into Toronto. Come ready to play, they look lifeless. I don't like that one bit.

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01-25-2013, 06:41 AM
  #261
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What a ****ing joke.

Put Stralman on the 5 on 3. No joke. At least the dude doesn't hesitate to rocket fire from the point. 5 forwards clearly isn't working.

At least it's game 4, and not 40
WTF shoot the puck, they're killing the penalty themselves with all these perimeter passes...

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01-25-2013, 06:47 AM
  #262
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It's frustrating watching them, because we all know how much better they should be playing.

It's not time to panic though. I'm still confident this team will go on a tear some time in the next two weeks.

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01-25-2013, 06:50 AM
  #263
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Originally Posted by MacTruck View Post
Still optimistic but what I truly think this team needs is a big, puck possession forward to play third line minutes (ala Dustin Penner) with Boyle and Pyatt. We need to have a bottom six that can be effective, score goals when needed, and be strong defensively. Kreider isn't ready for that role yet and Hagelin doesn't fit into that spot. Ideally, if we were able to acquire someone like Penner at the deadline (not actually Penner, doubt LA moves him) we could roll out something like this

Nash Richards Gaborik
Hagelin Stepan Callahan
(Acquisition) Boyle Pyatt
Asham Halpern Ferreiro (yes, I think we use him)

Rupp as extra F and Kreider to Connecticut for some
seasoning.
One of the biggest hang-ups I have on Torts is the fact that any line of him that isn't "perfect" seem to struggle.

We need a big skilled player for the 3rd line? Preferbly NA'n? What's the cost for a player like that? A Penner? Or a Zajac? A bunch of assets and 5-6m per just to get a lw for your "3rd line"... Without the said player, its like we can't even get a decent shift from our 3rd...

One thing that has been evident since the cap was put in place that the best teams are the teams who manage to get production from a flawed player as if that said player was complete. Detroit is natrually the master of masters on this. They won a cup with a ton of guys who only could do one or two things, but always somehow found a way to put complete lines on the ice (If you play like a Holmström who can't skate to save his life with a Datsyuk you both get the puck up ice and a net presence. I wonder how good of a career Franzen would have had for another organization and so forth. Soft 1-way D's.). But players like Horton and Lucic in Boston are also as good examples as any. Anaheim with its big wingers are also examples of that. Bergeron, Krejci and Marchand (with help from a few others of the like) skates really well and gets the puck up ice. None of them really has any kind of elite top end ability. In the attacking zone, guys like Horton and Lucic thrive. You don't notice it while that much when they are still playing in Boston -- but they would struggle alot more to get involved for weaker teams. I Anaheim they had Andy McDonald, Sami Påhlsson, Todd Marchant and Rob Niedermayer who all skated well and had their strongest ability in just taking the puck up ice, which enabled their heavy wingers of Kunitz, Penner, Perry and co to get up ice. When Penner was moved of McDonald's line, he was never the same player again. If you have the puck in your own end and wants to get it into the attacking zone, Penner sucks. If you want to hunt down D's, Penner sucks. He is only good with the puck under controll in the attacking zone, there he actually is extremely good. We certainly did it with Straka-Nyls-JJ. We did it with Avery-Dubi-JJ.

I think that its nutz to ask for a big, strong, fast, and skilled player for the 3rd line. You can get a small player who is skilled cheap, or a big player who can't skate well cheap. Or a agressive player cheap, if he is not that gifted in other areas.

Torts has been spoiled by having a slew of relativetely cheap all-around guys like Dubinsky and Anisimov and Callahan and co to use on 3rd and 4th lines. So far I've seen Torts ice a good 4th line and I've seen him for one season ice a 1st that overperformed (Dubi-AA-Cally), but besides that, I've not seen him get a good game from a line that wasn't complete basically. Torts is behind this roster. Boyle as the 3rd line center and Halpern as the 4th line center. He is behind the acquisitions of Pyatt and Hamas. All in all, he could look at the line up in June and see what we had and have a say in what we were going to get. Slats definitely not running the roster with an iron hand. I definitely think he is responsible for the lack of 4th line and lack of performance from the 3rd line so far. I think its obvious for everyone after a game or two that a line of Kreider-Boyle-Pyatt are just way to imobile to have success against all teams at least. They are very easy to execute a transition play on, it takes way to long for them to shift direction to be frank.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderhead View Post
I like Torts and even defended him in the past , but imo, this is a coaching problem.
I get kind of pissed when looking at NJD's roster for example. They should be struggling now. Not making it to the SCF's. But they flank Elias with an ultra small skilled Swede in Tedenby and a AHL stiff in Clarkson and get a complete line of it. They have Gionta as their 3rd line center and a soft 1-way Swede in Josefsson as their 4th line center. Torts would never even look at Tedenby (5'8.5), Gionta (5'7) and Josefsson. They wouldn't be good enough along the boards. Torts couldn't even work with MZA. We need someone who is 6'4 and we get players who are "6'4", and then when we are slow and awful -- its not Torts fault because the players aren't talented enough.

They lack a RH PPQB? Sure, give up a 2nd rounder and get Marek Zidlick. He can score almost 0.5 PPG and be a top 2 defensemen for you all the way SCF's. Another player we wouldn't even consider because he doesn't fit the bill. We have missed a RH PPQB forever, but had we put together a top 1000 list of available candidates I am sure Zidlicky wouldn't even have been on it. He is cut first because he doesn't fit the bill.

NJ has a bunch of half slow flawed bigger players and need someone to get the puck up ice, sure doesn't Brian Gionta has a brother? Ok, he is 5'07 and scored 16 pts in 54 AHL games, but can he get the puck up ice? Well then what's the problem. And they get a 3rd line that can put in a good shift in the AHL.


Last edited by Ola: 01-25-2013 at 07:17 AM.
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01-25-2013, 07:08 AM
  #264
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Rangers are succeeding in making their division rivals overconfident. Bring on the Devils and Islanders!!!!

I'd be very surprised if they don't turn it around soon and start playing with some urgency. Maybe not Stanley Cup contender urgency but playoff urgency,

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01-25-2013, 07:28 AM
  #265
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Originally Posted by NvincentYvalentineR View Post
As i said in the GDT.

This team reminds me of the lifeless, lazy, and star powered teams the Rangers iced before the 2004-2005 lock out.

Boring to watch, no heart and most of all they are terrible.

I mean come on, the FLYERS??? The same Flyers who are icing half of their hockey team and have one of the worst goalies in the NHL??
Yup.

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01-25-2013, 07:35 AM
  #266
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Infuriating to watch last night. I'm trying to temper my emotions because it's only been 4 games and a lot of players haven't played any hockey since, what, May? But...damn! No life at all. Effort comes in spurts. Very difficult to watch after getting used to their blue collar work the past couple of seasons.

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01-25-2013, 07:38 AM
  #267
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If by game 10 they aren't at .500, I will start to panic slightly. Until then, it's a loss on a back-to-back.

Looking back, if the Rangers had won the first (2) games and were going into a back-to-back with Boston and Philly, would people really be all that upset with going 1-1? I don't think so.

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01-25-2013, 07:42 AM
  #268
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The problem, as noted by Ola, is the team's depth or lack thereof. In acquiring Nash, management assumed that Kreider and Hagelin could or should replace Dubi and Ansi as top six forwards. Further the loss of Prust, though he now makes too much, hurts the bottom six. The Rangers now must be patient and hope Hags and Kreider fulfill their roles or this will be a long season. Long term, Pyatt will not be the answer to the top six forward woes
By the way, could someone shoot the puck from the point and can our forward crash the net on a powerplay?

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01-25-2013, 07:46 AM
  #269
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Originally Posted by Shadowtron View Post
Infuriating to watch last night. I'm trying to temper my emotions because it's only been 4 games and a lot of players haven't played any hockey since, what, May? But...damn! No life at all. Effort comes in spurts. Very difficult to watch after getting used to their blue collar work the past couple of seasons.
Collapsing defense that let's the opposition control the puck 60% of the time, zero sustained pressure in the offensive zone...no forecheck...disappointing

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01-25-2013, 07:50 AM
  #270
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Its pretty obvious the Rangers had absolutely no legs last night.

Thank god this was the last back to back set until March, that should help. But they are back at it again against on Saturday against a Leafs team that just got embarrassed at home by the Isels. Then the Flyers and Pens again. It doesnt get easier.

But its a chance with a home stand to right themselves with a day in between each game. I think they have to have Biron go on Sat, just my opinion. Whatever the case, the past is the past and now they need to start playing more consistent. The no camp, tough schedule excuse is gone now as far as im concerned.

Some players really need to up their game. Boyle (what is he doing out there?), Cally, Hags, most of the D, Richards, etc etc. Last night everyone was gliding around waiting for the puck to come to them. They looked shot.

Its a ridiculous statement, but I wish they were all skating around the ice, full throttle every shift like I was on Weds night in my mens league. Theres was just WAY too much standing around, from everyone. When I start comparing the Rangers to my game, there's definitely something wrong - meaning they physically didnt have any jump. 4 games in the first 6 days isnt easy off a shorten camp and cold start. Lets just be thankful they are healthy after it (knock on wood). Sure i was going full throttle, but i havent had 4 games and a mini-camp jammed into a week and half. Youd probably find me face down in the lockeroom floor after this game if I even got 12 minutes. Legit Excuse? Possibly.

It'll be fixed. They are too good. Sucks because the Flyers were ripe for picking last night. They sucked and had major holes in the team last night. The Rangers shouldve taken advantage and have a 2-2 record right now.


Last edited by HockeyBasedNYC: 01-25-2013 at 08:09 AM.
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01-25-2013, 07:52 AM
  #271
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I think the thing that is bothering me most after last night's game is the conditioning level of the players. I may get flamed for this, but here goes. The players (except for the new additions) have been through training camp before. They know what Torts expects from them, and they have all had to pass his fitness test of doom. So why didn't they keep in that kind of pre training camp shape during the lockout?

I'm lucky enough to get to play piano for a living and I have long stretches of time off where I play at least four hours a day to keep sharp. A lawyer has to keep abreast of new statutes, an IT guy has to constantly read up on new technology. We do that stuff because it's our JOB to do it. Not on our bosses time, but on our own time. So doesn't it stand to reason that professional hockey players who make way more money than most piano players, lawyers and IT guys should keep in top shape on their own time as well?

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01-25-2013, 07:54 AM
  #272
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I think the thing that is bothering me most after last night's game is the conditioning level of the players. I may get flamed for this, but here goes. The players (except for the new additions) have been through training camp before. They know what Torts expects from them, and they have all had to pass his fitness test of doom. So why didn't they keep in that kind of pre training camp shape during the lockout?

I'm lucky enough to get to play piano for a living and I have long stretches of time off where I play at least four hours a day to keep sharp. A lawyer has to keep abreast of new statutes, an IT guy has to constantly read up on new technology. We do that stuff because it's our JOB to do it. Not on our bosses time, but on our own time. So doesn't it stand to reason that professional hockey players who make way more money than most piano players, lawyers and IT guys should keep in top shape on their own time as well?
Yup.

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01-25-2013, 07:57 AM
  #273
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And I'm sick of Girardi throwing a weak wrist shot from the point that automatically leads to a turnover. Every ****ing time it's a turnover! And they never get through!

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01-25-2013, 08:03 AM
  #274
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Everyone needs to take a deep breath.

The issues the Rangers had were clear as day: lack of conditioning and lack of forward depth. And these were two hurdles we knew would be issues heading into the season. They need to be addressed but they should not be a surprise. I would love Prust, Dubi, an Artie back as much as anyone but at what cost?

What I was not expecting to see were the defensive breakdowns and sub-par goaltending of the first few games. Those issues were corrected last night and hopefully will be moving forward.

We all knew this was going to be a sprint, with an especially tough opening month, and that this team would likely need some time to come together. In the instances it has (3rd vs Pitt, Boston game at MSG) the offense has looked the best it has since the prime Jagr years. This team needs to get to the dance, ideally with home ice, but then all bets are off.

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01-25-2013, 08:04 AM
  #275
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Originally Posted by Antithesis View Post
I would rather we finish strong than start that way and tail off.

However, as of yet the team has not shown that it is built to be successful, nor have they given the fanbase much to be optimistic about.

They aren't sharp, and they are fatigued. Still, considering this, team depth is still a concern.

We're not cycling properly, guys are fleeing the boards too early and leaving our defensemen on an island without a play to make but throw it in and have it blocked down.

Our collapsing defense is leaving the team susceptible to deflections and rebound chances.
If so, I really don'tget why this is a much better environment fro kreider to develop, than the "no skill" Whale?

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