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Best Seasons 18year old until 40 years old by Country

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Old
01-25-2013, 04:02 PM
  #1
IggyFan12
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Best Seasons 18year old until 40 years old by Country

I have compiled a list of the best seasons by players by age by country. For Canada I decided to level the playing field and remove the 4 Gods of Gretzky, Mario, Orr and Howe. Here are the lists:

Canada

Dale Hawerchuk 1981-82 18 WIN 80 45 58 103
Sidney Crosby 2006-07 19 PIT 79 36 84 120
Denis Savard 1981-82 20 CBH 80 32 87 119
Dale Hawerchuk 1984-85 21 WIN 80 53 77 130
Bryan Trottier 1978-79 22 NYI 76 47 87 134
Steve Yzerman 1988-89 23 DET 80 65 90 155
Paul Coffey 1985-86 24 EDM 79 48 90 138
Mike Bossy 1981-82 25 NYI 80 64 83 147
Dennis Maruk 1981-82 26 WSH 80 60 76 136
Bernie Nicholls 1988-89 27 LAK 79 70 80 150
Phil Esposito 1970-71 28 BOS 78 76 76 152
Marcel Dionne 1980-81 29 LAK 80 58 77 135
Adam Oates 1992-93 30 BOS 84 45 97 142
Phil Esposito 1973-74 31 BOS 78 68 77 145
Phil Esposito 1974-75 32 BOS 79 61 66 127
Marcel Dionne 1984-85 33 LAK 80 46 80 126
Frank Mahovlich 1971-72 34 MTL 76 43 53 96
John Bucyk 1970-71 35 BOS 78 51 65 116
Jean Ratelle 1976-77 36 BOS 78 33 61 94
Joe Sakic 2006-07 37 COL 82 36 64 100
Adam Oates 2000-01 38 WSH 81 13 69 82
John Bucyk 1974-75 39 BOS 78 29 52 81
John Bucyk 1975-76 40 BOS 77 36 47 83

Canada Average= 122 points


USA

Jimmy Carson 1986-87 18 LAK 80 37 42 79
Jimmy Carson 1987-88 19 LAK 80 55 52 107
Jimmy Carson 1988-89 20 EDM 80 49 51 100
Bob Carpenter 1984-85 21 WSH 80 53 42 95
Jeremy Roenick 1991-92 22 CHI 80 53 50 103
Jeremy Roenick 1992-93 23 CHI 84 50 57 107
Jeremy Roenick 1993-94 24 CHI 84 46 61 107
Brett Hull 1989-90 25 STL 80 72 41 113
Brett Hull 1990-91 26 STL 78 86 45 131
Pat LaFontaine 1992-93 27 BUF 84 53 95 148
Brett Hull 1992-93 28 STL 80 54 47 101
Brett Hull 1993-94 29 STL 81 57 40 97
Pat LaFontaine 1995-96 30 BUF 76 40 51 91
Joe Mullen 1988-89 31 CGY 79 51 59 110
Mike Modano 2002-03 32 DAL 79 28 57 85
Scott Young 2000-01 33 STL 81 40 33 73
Joe Mullen 1991-92 34 PIT 77 42 45 87
Mike Modano 2005-06 35 DAL 78 27 50 77
Brett Hull 2000-01 36 DAL 79 39 40 79
Brett Hull 2001-02 37 DET 82 30 33 63
Brett Hull 2002-03 38 DET 82 37 39 76
Brett Hull 2003-04 39 DET 81 25 43 68
Chris Chelios 2001-02 40 DET 79 6 33 39

Average= 93

Czech Republic and Slovakia combined:

Jaromir Jagr 1990-91 18 PIT 80 27 30 57
Jaromir Jagr 1991-92 19 PIT 70 32 37 69
Jaromir Jagr 1992-93 20 PIT 81 34 60 94
Jaromir Jagr 1993-94 21 PIT 80 32 67 99
Robert Reichel 1993-94 22 CGY 84 40 53 93
Jaromir Jagr 1995-96 23 PIT 82 62 87 149
Peter Stastny 1980-81 24 QUE 77 39 70 109
Peter Stastny 1981-82 25 QUE 80 46 93 139
Jaromir Jagr 1998-99 26 PIT 81 44 83 127
Peter Stastny 1983-84 27 QUE 80 46 73 119
Jaromir Jagr 2000-01 28 PIT 81 52 69 121
Peter Stastny 1985-86 29 QUE 76 41 81 122
Ziggy Palffy 2002-03 30 LAK 76 37 48 85
Peter Stastny 1987-88 31 QUE 76 46 65 111
Peter Stastny 1988-89 32 QUE 72 35 50 85
Jaromir Jagr 2005-06 33 NYR 82 54 69 123
Jaromir Jagr 2006-07 34 NYR 82 30 66 96
Patrik Elias 2011-12 35 NJD 81 26 52 78
Vinny Prospal 2011-12 36 CBJ 82 16 39 55
Stan Mikita 1977-78 37 CBH 76 18 41 59
Stan Mikita 1978-79 38 CBH 65 19 36 55
Jaromir Jagr 2011-12 39 PHI 73 19 35 54
Jaromir Jagr 2012-13 40 DAL 4 2 2 4

Average= 92

Sweeden

Mika Zibanejad 2011-12 18 OTT 9 0 1 1
Mats Sundin 1990-91 19 QUE 80 23 36 59
Mats Sundin 1991-92 20 QUE 80 33 43 76
Mats Sundin 1992-93 21 QUE 80 47 67 114
Peter Forsberg 1995-96 22 COL 82 30 86 116
Peter Forsberg 1996-97 23 COL 65 28 58 86
Kent Nilsson 1980-81 24 CGY 80 49 82 131
Peter Forsberg 1998-99 25 COL 78 30 67 97
Mats Naslund 1985-86 26 MTL 80 43 67 110
Hakan Loob 1987-88 27 CGY 80 50 56 106
Kent Nilsson 1984-85 28 CGY 77 37 62 99
Henrik Sedin 2009-10 29 VAN 82 29 83 112
Daniel Sedin 2010-11 30 VAN 82 41 63 104
Henrik Sedin 2011-12 31 VAN 82 14 67 81
Markus Naslund 2005-06 32 VAN 81 32 47 79
Daniel Alfredsson 2005-06 33 OTT 77 43 60 103
Daniel Alfredsson 2006-07 34 OTT 77 29 58 87
Daniel Alfredsson 2007-08 35 OTT 70 40 49 89
Mats Sundin 2007-08 36 TOR 74 32 46 78
Daniel Alfredsson 2009-10 37 OTT 70 20 51 71
Nicklas Lidstrom 2008-09 38 DET 78 16 43 59
Daniel Alfredsson 2011-12 39 OTT 75 27 32 59
Nicklas Lidstrom 2010-11 40 DET 82 16 46 62

Average=86

Russia

Ilya Kovalchuk 2001-02 18 ATL 65 29 22 51
Ilya Kovalchuk 2002-03 19 ATL 81 38 29 67
Alex Ovechkin 2005-06 20 WSH 81 52 54 106
Pavel Bure 1992-93 21 VAN 83 60 50 110
Evgeni Malkin 2008-09 22 PIT 82 35 78 113
Alexander Mogilny 1992-93 23 BUF 77 76 51 127
Sergei Fedorov 1993-94 24 DET 82 56 64 120
Evgeni Malkin 2011-12 25 PIT 75 50 59 109
Sergei Fedorov 1995-96 26 DET 78 39 68 107
Alex Kovalev 2000-01 27 PIT 79 44 51 95
Pavel Bure 1999-00 28 FLA 74 58 36 94
Pavel Datsyuk 2007-08 29 DET 82 31 66 97
Pavel Datsyuk 2008-09 30 DET 81 32 65 97
Sergei Makarov 1989-90 31 CGY 80 24 62 86
Sergei Makarov 1990-91 32 CGY 78 30 49 79
Sergei Fedorov 2002-03 33 DET 80 36 47 83
Alex Kovalev 2007-08 34 MTL 82 35 49 84
Igor Larionov 1995-96 35 TOT 73 22 51 73
Vyacheslav Kozlov 2008-09 36 ATL 82 26 50 76
Igor Larionov 1997-98 37 DET 69 8 39 47
Igor Larionov 1998-99 38 DET 75 14 49 63
Igor Larionov 1999-00 39 DET 79 9 38 47
Igor Larionov 2000-01 40 TOT 65 9 31 40

Average=85

Finland

Aki Berg 1995-96 18 LAK 51 0 7 7
Hannu Virta 1982-83 19 BUF 74 13 24 37
Jari Kurri 1980-81 20 EDM 75 32 43 75
Jari Kurri 1981-82 21 EDM 71 32 54 86
Teemu Selanne 1992-93 22 WIN 84 76 56 132
Jari Kurri 1983-84 23 EDM 64 52 61 113
Jari Kurri 1984-85 24 EDM 73 71 64 135
Jari Kurri 1985-86 25 EDM 78 68 63 131
Teemu Selanne 1996-97 26 MDA 78 51 58 109
Jari Kurri 1987-88 27 EDM 80 43 53 96
Teemu Selanne 1998-99 28 MDA 75 47 60 107
Jari Kurri 1989-90 29 EDM 78 33 60 93
Teemu Selanne 2000-01 30 TOT 73 33 39 72
Saku Koivu 2005-06 31 MTL 72 17 45 62
Jari Kurri 1992-93 32 LAK 82 27 60 87
Jari Kurri 1993-94 33 LAK 81 31 46 77
Saku Koivu 2008-09 34 MTL 65 16 34 50
Teemu Selanne 2005-06 35 MDA 80 40 50 90
Teemu Selanne 2006-07 36 ANA 82 48 46 94
Teppo Numminen 2005-06 37 BUF 75 2 38 40
Teemu Selanne 2008-09 38 ANA 65 27 27 54
Teemu Selanne 2009-10 39 ANA 54 27 21 48
Teemu Selanne 2010-11 40 ANA 73 31 49 80

Average=82

Now some of these numbers are skewed by facts like very few players from Europe play in the NHL at age 18 but it I found it intersting. Most countries list only have a few players on it who dominate their country. One thing that I thought that stood out was that no Russian NHLer got over 100 points after the age of 27 or that Forsberg is on the list for Sweeden 3 times, Sundin 4 times and Alfredson 5 times.

Like to get other peoples opinions on what they think of these lists.


Last edited by IggyFan12: 01-25-2013 at 04:54 PM.
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Old
01-25-2013, 04:29 PM
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Kane One
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Pretty unleveled playing field by taking off Gretzky, Orr, Lemieux, and Howe, but also putting on Hull for USA. He was born in Canada, and he only lived in the US until he was 8. I know it's a popular debate and probably shouldn't be in this thread, but he's Canadian, IMO.

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01-25-2013, 04:37 PM
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13th Floor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
Pretty unleveled playing field by taking off Gretzky, Orr, Lemieux, and Howe, but also putting on Hull for USA. He was born in Canada, and he only lived in the US until he was 8. I know it's a popular debate and probably shouldn't be in this thread, but he's Canadian, IMO.
But he played for US internationally though, right? So by hockey standards, he's American.

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01-25-2013, 04:42 PM
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Sanf
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Intresting idea and couple of very surprising names.

Few correction Sandström is born in Finland but he is Swedish.Bondra is born in Ukraine? but he is Slovakian. Also few other debatable.

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01-25-2013, 04:50 PM
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Leafsdude7
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Stan Mikita also played for Canada internationally. If Hull counts as American, then Mikita should count as a Canadian.

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01-25-2013, 04:54 PM
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IggyFan12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanf View Post
Intresting idea and couple of very surprising names.

Few correction Sandström is born in Finland but he is Swedish.Bondra is born in Ukraine? but he is Slovakian. Also few other debatable.
Thank you for pointing that out my mistake they have been corrected.

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Old
01-25-2013, 05:03 PM
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jigglysquishy
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Very interesting numbers. I never realized how high Russians peaked and how weak their later years were.

Edit: I'm reading wrong. Ignore the Crosby quip

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01-25-2013, 05:09 PM
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Very interesting idea. I'm not sure if Jagr really is the only 40yr old Czech and therefore his 4 pts are the best 40yr old's performace though, I'll try to dig out some figures.

Edit: I'm quite surprised that Jagr really is probably the only Czech (except Dominator) who played in the NHL in his 40s. I didn't expect that. Sorry for questioning the OP What confused me was probably the "early" retirement of Holik and memories of old still Modry playing - but I didn't realize that Modry spent a few of his last seasons in Czech extraliga.


Last edited by kudymen: 01-25-2013 at 05:58 PM.
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Old
01-25-2013, 07:21 PM
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JFA87-66-99
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I think Crosby had the best 18 year old season as well. 102 points and I beileve by 2005-2006 seasons end he had climbed into a top 5 player in the league. Obviously that carried over into his 19 year old season when he became the youngest art ross winner ever.

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01-25-2013, 07:23 PM
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vadim sharifijanov
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i know it's just raw points totals, but jagr won the art ross trophy at 22 (lockout shortened season). should be him, not reichel.

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Old
01-26-2013, 04:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IggyFan12 View Post
...
Czech Republic and Slovakia combined:
Stan Mikita 1977-78 37 CBH 76 18 41 59
Stan Mikita 1978-79 38 CBH 65 19 36 55
...
There was some discussion if Stan Mikita should be considered as Slovak player and if im correct, the conclusion was NO.

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01-26-2013, 05:35 AM
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You should do it by adjusted stats, so we see a little more of reality than fiction which the eighties were.

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01-26-2013, 06:15 AM
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TAnnala
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Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
You should do it by adjusted stats, so we see a little more of reality than fiction which the eighties were.
I agree. Using raw stats cab twist the outcome by a large margin.

Hockey-reference to use....

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01-26-2013, 03:06 PM
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Hardyvan123
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Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
You should do it by adjusted stats, so we see a little more of reality than fiction which the eighties were.
This was my 1st thought as well, the high scoring 80's really can slant the true impact of "best seasons."

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01-27-2013, 05:27 AM
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alko
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You should do it by adjusted stats, so we see a little more of reality than fiction which the eighties were.
How it works?

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01-27-2013, 03:22 PM
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Crosby the best 18 year old. 102 points sixth in NHL scoring. (5th if we don't count tiebreakers)

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01-27-2013, 03:52 PM
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Brewsky
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Seems like 23 is the prime year.

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01-27-2013, 05:25 PM
  #18
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These are some of the adjusted leaders (bold is different than raw point leader)

Finland

18 Aki Berg 1995-96 LAK 51 0 7 7 (7)
19 Hannu Virta 1982-83 BUF 74 13 24 37 (30)
20 Jari Kurri 1980-81 EDM 75 32 43 75 (61)
21 Jari Kurri 1981-82 EDM 71 32 54 86 (66)
22 Teemu Selanne 1992-93 WIN 84 76 56 132 (106); Kurri (84)
23 Jari Kurri 1983-84 EDM 64 52 61 113 (89)
24 Jari Kurri 1984-85 EDM 73 71 64 135 (107); Selanne (83)
25 Teemu Selanne 1995-96 MDA 79 40 68 108 (103); Kurri (102)
26 Teemu Selanne 1996-97 MDA 78 51 58 109 (113); Kurri (91)
27 Teemu Selanne 1997-98 MDA 73 52 34 86 (98); Kurri (80)
28 Teemu Selanne 1998-99 28 MDA 75 47 60 107 (122); Kurri (84)
29 Teemu Selanne 1999-00 29 MDA 79 33 52 85 (92); Kurri (78)
30 Teemu Selanne 2000-01 TOT 73 33 39 72 (78)
31 Tomas Sandstrom 1995-96 PIT 58 35 35 70 (67); Selanne (62)
32 Saku Koivu 2006-07 MTL 81 22 53 75 (76); Selanne (71), Kurri (70)
33 Jari Kurri 1993-94 LAK 81 31 46 77 (70); Jokinen (67)
34 Olli Jokinen 2011-12 82 23 38 61 (67)
35 Teemu Selanne 2005-06 MDA 80 40 50 90 (88)
36 Teemu Selanne 2006-07 ANA 82 48 46 94 (96)
37 Saku Koivu 2011-12 ANA 74 11 27 38 (42); Numminen (38), Kurri (36)
38 Teemu Selanne 2008-09 ANA 65 27 27 54 (56)
39 Teemu Selanne 2009-10 ANA 54 27 21 48 (51)
40 Teemu Selanne 2010-11 ANA 73 31 49 80 (86)
41 Teemu Selanne 2011-12 ANA 82 26 40 66 (73)

Sweden

18 Mika Zibanejad 2011-12 OTT 9 0 1 1
19 Mats Sundin 1990-91 QUE 80 23 36 59 (52)
20 Mats Sundin 1991-92 QUE 80 33 43 76 (67)
21 Mats Sundin 1992-93 QUE 80 47 67 114 (92)
22 Peter Forsberg 1995-96 COL 82 30 86 116 (111); Sundin (77)
23 Peter Forsberg 1996-97 COL 65 28 58 86 (89); Nilsson (83), Sundin (81)
24 Kent Nilsson 1980-81 CGY 80 49 82 131 (107); Forsberg (104)
25 Peter Forsberg 1998-99 COL 78 30 67 97 (110); Sundin (97)
26 Mats Naslund 1985-86 MTL 80 43 67 110 (86); D.Sedin (85), Sundin (85), Nilsson (84), H.Sedin (81)
27 Peter Forsberg 2000-01 COL 73 27 62 89 (96); Sundin (94), Loob (88), H.Sedin (82), D.Sedin (80)
28 Markus Naslund 2001-02 VAN 81 40 50 90 (103); D.Sedin (85), H.Sedin (84), Sundin (79), Nilsson (79), Alfredsson (75)
29 Henrik Sedin 2009-10 VAN 82 29 83 112 (118); Forsberg (118), MkNaslund (116), D.Sedin (85), H.Sedin (84)
30 Daniel Sedin 2010-11 VAN 82 41 63 104 (112); H.Sedin (101), MkNaslund (97), Sundin (91), Alfredsson (87)
31 Daniel Alfredsson 2003-04 77 32 48 80 (93); H.Sedin (89); Sundin (81), D.Sedin (74)
32 Mats Sundin 2003-04 TOR 81 31 44 75 (87); MkNaslund (77), Forsberg (73), Lidstrom (69)
33 Daniel Alfredsson 2005-06 OTT 77 43 60 103 (100)
34 Daniel Alfredsson 2006-07 OTT 77 29 58 87 (88); Sundin (76)
35 Daniel Alfredsson 2007-08 OTT 70 40 49 89 (97); Lidstrom (77), Sundin (77)
36 Mats Sundin 2007-08 TOR 74 32 46 78 (85); Alfredsson (76)
37 Daniel Alfredsson 2009-10 OTT 70 20 51 71 (75); Lidstrom DET 2007-08 76 10 60 70 (75)
38 Nicklas Lidstrom 2008-09 DET 78 16 43 59 (61)
39 Daniel Alfredsson 2011-12 OTT 75 27 32 59 (65); Lidstrom (52)
40 Nicklas Lidstrom 2010-11 DET 82 16 46 62 (67)
41 Nicklas Lidstrom 2011-12 DET 70 11 23 34 (38)

Czech Republic and Slovakia combined:

18 Jaromir Jagr 1990-91 PIT 80 27 30 57 (51); Gaborik (39)
19 Marian Gaborik 2001-02 MIN 78 30 37 67 (76); Jagr (61)
20 Jaromir Jagr 1992-93 PIT 81 34 60 94 (76); Gaborik (73)
21 Jaromir Jagr 1993-94 PIT 80 32 67 99 (90); Reichel (71), Havlat (66)
22 Jaromir Jagr 1994-95 PIT 48 32 38 70 (121); Reichel (84), Sykora (82), Hossa (81), Havlat (79)
23 Jaromir Jagr 1995-96 PIT 82 62 87 149 (143); Palffy (83), Hejduk (78), Hossa (75)
24 Patrik Elias 2000-01 NJD 82 40 56 96 (103); Demitra (101), Jagr (98), Nedved (95), Palffy (93), Hossa (90) P.Stastny (89)
25 Jaromir Jagr 1997-98 77 35 67 102 (117); P.Stastny (107), Palffy (99), Hossa (95), Gaborik (90)
26 Jaromir Jagr 1998-99 PIT 81 44 83 127 (144); Hejduk (110), P.Stastny (100), Straka (94)
27 Jaromir Jagr 1999-00 PIT 63 42 54 96 (104); Elias (94), P. Stastny (94), Gaborik (92), Hossa (90), Demitra (89) Prospal (88), Hejduk (87)
28 Jaromir Jagr 2000-01 PIT 81 52 69 121 (130); Demitra (104), Straka (102), Hossa (102), Palffy (96)
29 Peter Stastny 1985-86 QUE 76 41 81 122 (95); Jagr (90), Bondra (89), Gaborik (84), Nedved (84)
30 Ziggy Palffy 2002-03 LAK 76 37 48 85 (95); Jagr (86), Lang (86)
31 Peter Stastny 1987-88 QUE 76 46 65 111 (92); Jagr (86)
32 Peter Bondra 2000-01 WSH 82 45 36 81 (87); Elias (81), Lang (77), Prospal (77), Straka (74), P.Stastny (70)
33 Jaromir Jagr 2005-06 NYR 82 54 69 123 (120); Lang (91), Hossa (85), Bondra (80)
34 Jaromir Jagr 2006-07 NYR 82 30 66 96 (97); Elias (67), Bondra (63)
35 Patrik Elias 2011-12 NJD 81 26 52 78 (86); Jagr (77)
36 Vinny Prospal 2011-12 CBJ 82 16 39 55 (61); Lang (53)
37 Robert Lang 2007-08 CHI 76 21 33 54 (58)
38 Robert Lang 2008-09 MTL 50 18 21 39 (40)
39 Jaromir Jagr 2011-12 PHI 73 19 35 54 (60)
40 Jaromir Jagr 2012-13 DAL 4 2 2 4

Russia

18 Ilya Kovalchuk 2001-02 ATL 65 29 22 51 (58)
19 Ilya Kovalchuk 2002-03 ATL 81 38 29 67 (75)
20 Alex Ovechkin 2005-06 WSH 81 52 54 106 (103); Kovalchuk (101), Malkin (86)
21 Evgeni Malkin 2007-08 PIT 82 47 59 106 (115); Ovechkin (94), Bure (89)
22 Alex Ovechkin 2007-08 WSH 82 65 47 112 (122); Malkin (116), Bure (97), Kovalchuk (96)
23 Alex Ovechkin 2008-09 WSH 79 56 54 110 (114); Mogilny (102), Malkin (82)
24 Alex Ovechkin 2009-10 WSH 72 50 59 109 (116); Zhamnov (112), Fedorov (109), Kovalchuk (95)
25 Evgeni Malkin 2011-12 PIT 75 50 59 109 (121); Yashin (107), Kovalchuk (94), Ovechkin (92), Fedorov (86), V.Bure (82), Mogilny (81), Datsyuk (79)
26 Pavel Bure 1997-98 VAN 82 51 39 90 (103); Fedorov (102), Mogilny (102), Kovalchuk (90)
27 Alex Kovalev 2000-01 PIT 79 44 51 95 (102); Yashin (95), Datsyuk (84), Mogilny (76)
28 Pavel Bure 1999-00 FLA 74 58 36 94 (102); Kovalchuk (92), Dastyuk (88), Kovalev (87), Yashin (86)
29 Pavel Datsyuk 2007-08 DET 82 31 66 97 (105); Bure (99), Kovalev (86)
30 Pavel Datsyuk 2008-09 DET 81 32 65 97 (100); VyKozlov (78), Fedorov (67)
31 Alexander Mogilny 2000-01 NJD 75 43 40 83 (90); Makarov (72)
32 Sergei Fedorov 2001-02 DET 81 31 37 68 (78); Zhamnov (76), Makarov (70), Gonchar (67), Mogilny (65), Yashin (64), Datsyuk (64)
33 Sergei Fedorov 2002-03 DET 80 36 47 83 (93); Mogilny (88)
34 Alex Kovalev 2007-08 MTL 82 35 49 84 (91); VyKozlov (81), Fedorov (75)
35 Igor Larionov 1995-96 TOT 73 22 51 73 (70); Zubov (69), Kovalev (67), Makarov (62)
36 Vyacheslav Kozlov 2008-09 ATL 82 26 50 76 (78); Larionov (56), Zubov (54), Kovalev (52)
37 Igor Larionov 1997-98 DET 69 8 39 47 (54); Fedorov (44)
38 Igor Larionov 1998-99 DET 75 14 49 63 (71)
39 Igor Larionov 1999-00 DET 79 9 38 47 (51)
40 Igor Larionov 2000-01 TOT 65 9 31 40 (43)
41 Igor Larionov 2001-02 DET 70 11 32 43 (49)
42 Igor Larionov 2002-03 DET 74 10 33 43 (48)

Adjusted, All Non-North American

18: Kovalchuk 58, Jagr 51, Gaborik 39
19: Gaborik 76, Kovalchuk 75, Kopitar 62, Jagr 61, Sundin 52
20: Ovechkin 103, Kovalchuk 101, Malkin 86, Kopitar 83, Jagr 76, Gaborik 73
21: Malkin 106, [Kovalchuk 98], Ovechkin 94, Sundin 92, Jagr 90, Bure 89
22: Ovechkin 122, Jagr 121, Malkin 116, Forsberg 111, Selanne 106, Bure 97, Kovalchuk 96
23: Jagr 143, Ovechkin 114, Mogilny 102, Forsberg 89, Kurri 89, Palffy 83, Nilsson 83, Malkin 82, Sundin 81
24: Ovechkin 116, Zhamnov 112, Fedorov 109, Kurri 107, Nilsson 107, Forsberg 104, Elias 103, Demitra 101, Jagr 98, Kovalchuk 95, Nedved 95, Palffy 93
25: Malkin 121, Jagr 117, Forsberg 110, Stastny 107, Yashin 107, Selanne 103, Kurri 102, Palffy 99, Sundin 97, Hossa 95, Kovalchuk 94, Ovechkin 92
26: Jagr 144, Selanne 113, Hejduk 110, Bure 103, Fedorov 102, Mogilny 102, Stastny 100, Straka 94, Kurri 91, Kovalchuk 90
27: Jagr 104, Kovalev 102, Selanne 98, Forsberg 96, Yashin 95, Stastny 94, Sundin 94, Elias 94, Gaborik 92, Hossa 90, Demitra 89
28: Jagr 130, Selanne 122, Demitra 104, MkNaslund 103, Bure 102, Hossa 102, Straka 102, Palffy 96, Kovalchuk 92, Datsyuk 88
29: H.Sedin 118, Forsberg 118, MkNaslund 116, Datsyuk 105, Bure 99, Stastny 95, Selanne 92, Jagr 90, D.Sedin 90, Bondra 89, Kovalev 86
30: D.Sedin 112, H.Sedin 101, Datsyuk 100, MkNaslund 97, Palffy 95, Sundin 91, Alfredsson 87, Jagr 86, Lang 86
31: Alfredsson 93, Stastny 92, Mogilny 90, H.Sedin 89, Jagr 86, Sundin 81
32: [Jagr 103], [Alfredsson 96], Sundin 87, Bondra 87, Elias 81, Fedorov 78, MkNaslund 77, Lang 77, Prospal 77
33: Jagr 120, Alfredsson 100, Fedorov 93, Lang 91, Mogilny 88, Hossa 85, [Sundin 81], Bondra 80
34: Jagr 97, Kovalev 91, Alfredsson 88, VyKozlov 81, Sundin 76, Fedorov 75
35: Alfredsson 97, Selanne 88, Elias 86, Jagr 77, Lidstrom 77, Sundin 77
36: Selanne 96, Sundin 85, VyKozlov 78, Alfredsson 76
37: Alfredsson 75, Lidstrom 75, Lang 58, Larionov 54
38: Larionov 71, Lidstrom 61, Selanne 56
39: Alfredsson 65, Jagr 60, Lidstrom 52, Selanne 51, Larionov 51
40: Selanne 86, Lidstrom 67, Larionov 43
41: Selanne 73, Larionov 49, Lidstrom 38
42: Larionov 48

Note: [ Player ] is estimate for '05 lockout season (avg. of '04 & '06 seasons)

Jagr's age 22-28 seasons were rather dominant, as he had the best adjusted point season 4/7 times, barely edged by Ovechkin at age 22 and Malkin at age 25, and injury preventing him from leading at age 24. Ovechkin & Kovalchuk were very strong at earlier ages, but perhaps their lack of adjustment and reliance on skill hurt them as they aged. By contrast, Jagr, Alfredsson, Selanne & Lidstrom dominate much of the mid-30s to 40s.


Last edited by Czech Your Math: 01-27-2013 at 08:39 PM.
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01-27-2013, 09:25 PM
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These are adjusted based on PPG (at least 3/4 of season):

18: Kovalchuk (74), Jagr (51), Gaborik (45)
19: Gaborik (80), Kovalchuk (76), Jagr (70), Kopitar (70)
20: Ovechkin (105), Kovalchuk (102), Malkin (91), Kopitar (83), Jagr (79), Gaborik (74)
21: Malkin (115), [Kovalchuk (101)], Sundin (96), Ovechkin (94), Jagr (94), Bure (90), Forsberg (88)
22: Ovechkin (122), Jagr (121), Malkin (116), Forsberg (111), Selanne (106), Bure (107), Kovalchuk (101)
23: Jagr (143), Ovechkin (118), Forsberg (112), Mogilny (112), Kurri (111), Malkin (100)
24: Ovechkin (132), Jagr (128), Forsberg (119), Kurri (117), Zhamnov (112), Fedorov (111), Nilsson (107), Elias (103), Demitra (101), Kovalchuk (98)
25: Malkin (132), Jagr (124), Forsberg (116), Stastny (107), Yashin 107, Selanne (107), Kurri (105), Palffy (99), Kovalchuk (98), Sundin (97), Gaborik (96), Hossa (96)
26: Jagr (146), Forsberg (119), Selanne (119), Hejduk (110), Fedorov (108), Stastny (106), Mogilny (106), Bure (103), Kovalchuk (98), Straka (97), [Hossa (94)]
27: Jagr (136), Selanne (110), Forsberg (108) Kovalev (106), Gaborik (99), Yashin 95, Elias (94), Stastny (94), Sundin (94), Bondra (94)
28: Selanne (133), Jagr (132), Bure (113), Demitra (109), Palffy (108), Kovalev (106), MkNaslund (104), Hossa (102), Straka (102), Kovalchuk (98)
29: Forsberg (129), H.Sedin (118), D.Sedin (117), MkNaslund (116), Jagr (107) Datsyuk (105), Stastny (100), Bure (99), Selanne (96), Bondra (96)
30: D.Sedin (112), Lang (109), Palffy (102), MkNaslund (102), H.Sedin (101), Datsyuk (101), Jagr (94), Sundin (91), Alfredsson (91), Selanne (87), Forsberg (85)
31: Alfredsson (99), Mogilny (98), Stastny (97), Jagr (91), H.Sedin (89), Sundin (88)
32: [Jagr (106)], [Alfredsson (103)], Forsberg (95), Sundin (88), Bondra (87), Elias (86), Datsyuk (85), Mogilny (81), Fedorov (79)
33: Jagr (120), Alfredsson (107), Mogilny (99), Lang (96), Fedorov (95), [Sundin (88)], Datsyuk (87), Hossa (86), Bondra (85)
34: Jagr (97), Alfredsson (94), Kovalev (91), Sundin (89), VyKozlov (82), Fedorov (77)
35: Alfredsson (113), Selanne (90), Elias (87), Sundin (84), Lidstrom (79), Jagr (77)
36: Selanne (96), Sundin (94), VyKozlov (78), Alfredsson (79)
37: Alfredsson (88), Lidstrom (81), Larionov (64), Lang (63)
38: Larionov (78), Selanne (71), Lidstrom (64)
39: Alfredsson (71), Selanne (68), Jagr (67), Larionov (53), Lidstrom (52)
40: Selanne (97), Lidstrom (67), Larionov (54)
41: Selanne (73), Larionov (57), Lidstrom (44)
42: Larionov (53)


Last edited by Czech Your Math: 01-28-2013 at 09:58 AM.
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01-28-2013, 03:05 AM
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Nice work as always CYM.

Jagr is actually not as immortal as I thought first. He is the best of the bunch but not with the same margins as 5 Art Ross (4 consecutive) would suggest.

BTW, what is wrong with the year 28?

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01-28-2013, 03:09 AM
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Edit: Slept bad and probably missed something vital.

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01-28-2013, 10:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TAnnala View Post
Nice work as always CYM.

Jagr is actually not as immortal as I thought first. He is the best of the bunch but not with the same margins as 5 Art Ross (4 consecutive) would suggest.

BTW, what is wrong with the year 28?
I actually thought it confirmed his dominance, primarily his consistency at a very elite level for a long time.

First, looking at adjusted points by age for non-NA players:

From 22-28, the 4 times he led included 31 and 29 point margins (by far the largest margins from ages 18-41). He was second by 1 and 4 points to the career years of Ovechkin and Malkin. His injury in '97 hurt his ranking at age 24, but otherwise it was about on par with anyone (and in fact through 57 games it was Lemieux 91, Jagr 87 that year). Additionally, he leads at ages 33 & 34, and would likely have been at/near the top at age 32 as well. Using estimates for '05, that's 7 firsts, 4 seconds, 2 fourths and 3 fifths.

Now looking at adjusted points per 82 games, assuming 3/4+ of season played:

From 22-28, the 3 times he led included margins of 27, 26, and 25 point margins (the largest margins from age 18-39). He was second by 1 & 4 points to Ovechkin's two best years, and by 8 points to Malkin's career year. Again, he leads at ages 33 & 34, and would likely have been at/near the top at age 32 as well. Using estimates for '05, that's 6 firsts, 5 seconds, 2 thirds, 1 fourth and 3 fifths.

Another way to look at it:

Ages 20-24: Ovechkin 110 (114), Jagr 106 (113)
Ages 25-29: Jagr 117 (131), Selanne 106 (113)
Ages 30-35: Jagr 95 (97), Alfredsson 93 (101)

So take two years at age 18 & 19 which were basically as good as any non-NA forward except Kovalchuk... add Ovechkin's first 5 years in the league at ages 20-24... then take Selanne's main 5 year peak from ages 25-29, except 10-15% better... and add Alfredsson's amazing 6 year run at ages 30-35... then factor in 3 solid years in the KHL and a year-plus back in the NHL, which would probably compare to anyone at age 36-40 (considering his durability).

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01-28-2013, 12:27 PM
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TAnnala
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Czech Your Math View Post
I actually thought it confirmed his dominance, primarily his consistency at a very elite level for a long time.

First, looking at adjusted points by age for non-NA players:

From 22-28, the 4 times he led included 31 and 29 point margins (by far the largest margins from ages 18-41). He was second by 1 and 4 points to the career years of Ovechkin and Malkin. His injury in '97 hurt his ranking at age 24, but otherwise it was about on par with anyone (and in fact through 57 games it was Lemieux 91, Jagr 87 that year). Additionally, he leads at ages 33 & 34, and would likely have been at/near the top at age 32 as well. Using estimates for '05, that's 7 firsts, 4 seconds, 2 fourths and 3 fifths.

Now looking at adjusted points per 82 games, assuming 3/4+ of season played:

From 22-28, the 3 times he led included margins of 27, 26, and 25 point margins (the largest margins from age 18-39). He was second by 1 & 4 points to Ovechkin's two best years, and by 8 points to Malkin's career year. Again, he leads at ages 33 & 34, and would likely have been at/near the top at age 32 as well. Using estimates for '05, that's 6 firsts, 5 seconds, 2 thirds, 1 fourth and 3 fifths.

Another way to look at it:

Ages 20-24: Ovechkin 110 (114), Jagr 106 (113)
Ages 25-29: Jagr 117 (131), Selanne 106 (113)
Ages 30-35: Jagr 95 (97), Alfredsson 93 (101)

So take two years at age 18 & 19 which were basically as good as any non-NA forward except Kovalchuk... add Ovechkin's first 5 years in the league at ages 20-24... then take Selanne's main 5 year peak from ages 25-29, except 10-15% better... and add Alfredsson's amazing 6 year run at ages 30-35... then factor in 3 solid years in the KHL and a year-plus back in the NHL, which would probably compare to anyone at age 36-40 (considering his durability).

Look, I do get that Jagr was so dominant. It is just that i kind of expected that he has no competition, but he did lose to Ovechkin, Malkin and Selanne in prime years. So it kind of shows that Jagr wasn't immortal. That is the status he has kind of gotten to. He is still the best, clearly. So in that sense my thoughts about him has not changed. Sometimes we just tend to forget that even the mighty Jagr is sometimes beaten by others than Lemieux.

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01-28-2013, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
Pretty unleveled playing field by taking off Gretzky, Orr, Lemieux, and Howe, but also putting on Hull for USA. He was born in Canada, and he only lived in the US until he was 8. I know it's a popular debate and probably shouldn't be in this thread, but he's Canadian, IMO.
He was born in the Canada, but spent the first few years of his life in Chicago.

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