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*ALL* Luongo Talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals)

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Old
01-26-2013, 01:26 AM
  #726
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I think Canucks fans will be disappointed in the actual return for Luongo.

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01-26-2013, 01:27 AM
  #727
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Originally Posted by BayStBullies View Post
When the Leafs walk away; Luongo is a Canuck for the next decade. Don't kid yourselves with Gillis pretending there is a "mystery team". Then constantly crying and whining with remarks directly aimed at once single team.

Nonis is not budging; Gillis is asking for too much with no market for his asset. It's only a matter of time.

Either way, the Leafs are not as desperate as Vancouver. We're fine developing our youth and adding quality picks. Vancouver is hitting retirement; has empty cupboards; along with shooting themselves in the foot with a horrible decade long contract.

Trust me; we have thick skin. That doesn't shield stupidity.
This is where I always miss the line of argument: Apparently the canucks with 2 straight Presidents Trophies is the desperate franchise while the Leafs who haven't made the playoffs in nearly a decade and just fired their General Manager are not.

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01-26-2013, 01:29 AM
  #728
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Originally Posted by CpatainCanuck View Post
This is where I always miss the line of argument: Apparently the canucks with 2 straight Presidents Trophies is the desperate franchise while the Leafs who haven't made the playoffs in nearly a decade and just fired their General Manager are not.
No they are not. It's actually one of the most simple concepts to grasp. Really.

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01-26-2013, 01:29 AM
  #729
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Ashton, Colborne and the 1st?

The only problem Leaf fans would have with that is the 1st. Gillis is clearly demanding more than that, otherwise Luongo would be playing for the Leafs against the Rangers this Saturday night.

He's definitely demanding Kadri++ for Luongo but you would have to understand that it is not going to happen.

Kadri has a solid chance to be a 60-65 point #2C for the Leafs. If the Leafs were unwilling to trade him when Ron Wilson bounced him like a yo-yo, there is zero chance the Leafs trade him now that he's finally showing signs of breaking out under Carlyle.
Switch Ashton to Frattin or Finn or Biggs and you got a deal.

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01-26-2013, 01:30 AM
  #730
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I think Canucks fans will be disappointed in the actual return for Luongo.
I'm just hoping for a second/third line player, or a decent prospect.

Nothing near what most are expecting, we won't get more than that.

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01-26-2013, 01:30 AM
  #731
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That's all well and good but don't comment on the issue and then ignore it because you have nothing left/credible to say.


I think answered it in my post


Last edited by Beef Invictus: 01-26-2013 at 01:49 AM. Reason: flaming
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01-26-2013, 01:46 AM
  #732
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
I think answered it in my post, learn to read.
First... a comment on why you think Toronto should/wants to trade for him.

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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
The major reason for TOR to trade for Lu is to _make_the_playoffs_...
I reply with why it doesn't make sense and is infact somewhat of a contradiction. Second... a bunch of talk of Vancouver positing.

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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
People are acting like we want to send him to TOR, like we want to push Lu there, why? What difference does it make for Canucks fans where Lu ends up? He could go to another team, and it wouldn't make a lick of difference.


You don't want to try to make the playoffs? Cool. Move on. Done. On to the next. No hard feelings.


Gillis wants good roster player + good prospect + 1st. Why? Trade a star player for a few lesser assets. It's how trades go. Could be any team involved, Gillis will try to shoot for that package. Now, if some team were to give him an equal quality vet in return, say like a Shane Doan, that's an easy hockey trade. But most teams don't have that, so you ask for the package. All this is, is recognizing that you will not get an equal quality asset in return for Luongo. That's just the reality of the situation.
In no way shape or form did you comment on your original point. Like I said, it's all well and good but don't comment and then ignore glaring contradictions. In fact you just reiterated a completely close minded approach to the topic. It borders on sounding condescending or just straight up no insight on what other teams are looking for.

I get it, your prerogative seems to dance around issues to avoid either admitting misdirection or some form of bias - that truthfully may be cultivated by the never ending frustration of this very topic that we all have.

Either way I have a solution for our discussion since I'm tired of trying to make simple points get across and having Chapter 2 come back as the next response.

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01-26-2013, 01:48 AM
  #733
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Most of the Leaf fans seem to not want Luongo and I hope they don't get him. The old saying Be careful what you wish for you might just get it I think applies. Canucks can afford to keep Luongo all year if need be but I suspect a desperate team at least by the trading deadline will make a deal with the Canucks that includes more than players that can't even make a bad NHL roster or decent prospects/picks. Leafs don't want him- good. Funny how after the 1rst night of NHL all the laughing and jeers and proclamations of great goalies on the Leafs has changed. Schneider is maybe not a bad goalie? Luongo I would say is not too shabby either. He'll get a team to the playoffs- well most teams. Then it's a crapshoot where a hot goalie can carry a team. Luongo will be fine. I'm sure the Canucks will do fine in the trade and maybe the Leafs will end up 30th get MacKinnon and win the cup in 2014. Good Luck.

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01-26-2013, 01:56 AM
  #734
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Originally Posted by marty111 View Post
I would counter by saying that Gillis is going to trade Roberto Luongo not because he thinks Schneider is better, but because he thinks Schneider _could_ be better in a short time AND provide the Cancuks with a player who can help them compete for the cup beyond the shelf life of Luongo.

I think in essence that is why most Vancouver fans want a young quality player++ in return for Luongo because they also realize that such a player would be helpful for them long term... perhaps past the shelf life of the Sedins.

It is that very type of forethought that it seems you are suggesting the Leafs should _ignore_ so they can _pay up_ and try to make the playoffs with an aging Luongo.

Seems like a contradiction to me.
I think you are completely wrong. Gillis is keeping Schneider because he is one of the best goalies in the league right now. It would not surprise me if he's a Vezina trophy finalist this year. Ray Ferraro has commented that he believes that Schneider may be a generational talent.

Schneider helps them with both the present and the future.

I don't see any contradiction at all. I don't think that the Leafs should trade for Luongo. The only way this will go down is if Nonis feels that his job depends on him making the playoffs.

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01-26-2013, 02:00 AM
  #735
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People are acting like we want to send him to TOR, like we want to push Lu there, why? What difference does it make for Canucks fans where Lu ends up? He could go to another team, and it wouldn't make a lick of difference.


You don't want to try to make the playoffs? Cool. Move on. Done. On to the next. No hard feelings.


Gillis wants good roster player + good prospect + 1st. Why? Trade a star player for a few lesser assets. It's how trades go. Could be any team involved, Gillis will try to shoot for that package. Now, if some team were to give him an equal quality vet in return, say like a Shane Doan, that's an easy hockey trade. But most teams don't have that, so you ask for the package. All this is, is recognizing that you will not get an equal quality asset in return for Luongo. That's just the reality of the situation.
There aren't going to be many teams, if any, that will pay that price for Luongo, and Gillis isn't an idiot, he has to know that. This is all part of the negotiations right now and he's set his bar. He knows he won't finish there.

The only team that I can think of that *may* have interest in paying that kind of a price, would be the Islanders. It would involve the Canucks taking on DiPeitro's contract and buying him out using one of their amnesty buyouts. The Isles are also a team that is in good position to give up that kind of value in assets, especially if the Canucks are eating money as part of their deal (DiPeitro's buyout/Luongo's contract). They have a disgruntled top prospect who wants out, and several veteran options with money on their contracts making it easier to move out one (Okposo, Nielsen, Moulson, Visnovsky, Streit).

Might make sense for them to get a legitimate and established starter at this stage, given that they must be done with rebuilding by now, and they have several young players ready to contribute at the next level.

That's probably the only team I can think of that would have interest in Luongo at that price (granted it would come with a big salary buyout and/or eating salary). For the Isles there would be financial benefits as well, which a franchise like that will give value to buying out huge contracts, and taking on a contract where a lot of the money has been paid off... they're also a team that will never play at the salary cap anyways, so to have dead cap space, while paying less in $$ for it, would be a benefit for that team long-term.

Most other teams don't have the prospect depth and being at that stage where they're looking to get to the playoffs now consistently with a good young team on the rise... most teams also won't have the financial motivation to make a deal like this.

And who knows, maybe Luongo will waive his NTC to go to the Island - where he was first drafted and started his career. It's not far from Florida, and I'm sure his wife won't hate the Hamptons.

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01-26-2013, 02:02 AM
  #736
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I think you are completely wrong. Gillis is keeping Schneider because he is one of the best goalies in the league right now. It would not surprise me if he's a Vezina trophy finalist this year. Ray Ferraro has commented that he believes that Schneider may be a generational talent.

Schneider helps them with both the present and the future.

I don't see any contradiction at all. I don't think that the Leafs should trade for Luongo. The only way this will go down is if Nonis feels that his job depends on him making the playoffs.
I respect your opinion but we'll just have to see how Schneider pans out when he truly runs the show. I'm not sold that he would be the outright choice between him and Luongo for this year but I'd be willing to bet he will be for years to come.

Good luck this year, it could be the Nucks year especially if they stock up at the deadline.

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01-26-2013, 02:04 AM
  #737
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Originally Posted by Chaz McNulty View Post
I think you are completely wrong. Gillis is keeping Schneider because he is one of the best goalies in the league right now. It would not surprise me if he's a Vezina trophy finalist this year. Ray Ferraro has commented that he believes that Schneider may be a generational talent.

Schneider helps them with both the present and the future.

I don't see any contradiction at all. I don't think that the Leafs should trade for Luongo. The only way this will go down is if Nonis feels that his job depends on him making the playoffs.
Nonis isn't going to get fired any time soon. This organization is finally taking a more patient approach IMO.

I've got no problem suffering another year or two if it means being better in the long term.

Ideally, I'd like that Leafs to draft Fucale with a last first round pick acquired @ the deadline. The Leafs have tried free agent goalies in Euro leagues, UFA goalies, drafted goalies.

Clearly it can't all be the goalies fault. Leafs are learning to play in a new system, besides the hiccup against the Islanders they have been good. Every team lays an egg once in a while, no matter how good or bad they are.

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01-26-2013, 02:04 AM
  #738
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I think Canucks fans will be disappointed in the actual return for Luongo.
I dont think so. He is a solid goaltender with 5 years of solid play left in him. Someone will give us a decent return for him.

Canuck fans just have to become more realistic about it.

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01-26-2013, 02:06 AM
  #739
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Originally Posted by NFITO View Post
There aren't going to be many teams, if any, that will pay that price for Luongo, and Gillis isn't an idiot, he has to know that. This is all part of the negotiations right now and he's set his bar. He knows he won't finish there.

The only team that I can think of that *may* have interest in paying that kind of a price, would be the Islanders. It would involve the Canucks taking on DiPeitro's contract and buying him out using one of their amnesty buyouts. The Isles are also a team that is in good position to give up that kind of value in assets, especially if the Canucks are eating money as part of their deal (DiPeitro's buyout/Luongo's contract). They have a disgruntled top prospect who wants out, and several veteran options with money on their contracts making it easier to move out one (Okposo, Nielsen, Moulson, Visnovsky, Streit).

Might make sense for them to get a legitimate and established starter at this stage, given that they must be done with rebuilding by now, and they have several young players ready to contribute at the next level.

That's probably the only team I can think of that would have interest in Luongo at that price (granted it would come with a big salary buyout and/or eating salary). For the Isles there would be financial benefits as well, which a franchise like that will give value to buying out huge contracts, and taking on a contract where a lot of the money has been paid off... they're also a team that will never play at the salary cap anyways, so to have dead cap space, while paying less in $$ for it, would be a benefit for that team long-term.

Most other teams don't have the prospect depth and being at that stage where they're looking to get to the playoffs now consistently with a good young team on the rise... most teams also won't have the financial motivation to make a deal like this.

And who knows, maybe Luongo will waive his NTC to go to the Island - where he was first drafted and started his career. It's not far from Florida, and I'm sure his wife won't hate the Hamptons.
Great post by the way!

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01-26-2013, 02:06 AM
  #740
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Any chance the Leafs demoted Gardiner because he's going to Vancouver shortly?

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01-26-2013, 02:11 AM
  #741
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Originally Posted by NFITO View Post
There aren't going to be many teams, if any, that will pay that price for Luongo, and Gillis isn't an idiot, he has to know that. This is all part of the negotiations right now and he's set his bar. He knows he won't finish there.

The only team that I can think of that *may* have interest in paying that kind of a price, would be the Islanders. It would involve the Canucks taking on DiPeitro's contract and buying him out using one of their amnesty buyouts. The Isles are also a team that is in good position to give up that kind of value in assets, especially if the Canucks are eating money as part of their deal (DiPeitro's buyout/Luongo's contract). They have a disgruntled top prospect who wants out, and several veteran options with money on their contracts making it easier to move out one (Okposo, Nielsen, Moulson, Visnovsky, Streit).

Might make sense for them to get a legitimate and established starter at this stage, given that they must be done with rebuilding by now, and they have several young players ready to contribute at the next level.

That's probably the only team I can think of that would have interest in Luongo at that price (granted it would come with a big salary buyout and/or eating salary). For the Isles there would be financial benefits as well, which a franchise like that will give value to buying out huge contracts, and taking on a contract where a lot of the money has been paid off... they're also a team that will never play at the salary cap anyways, so to have dead cap space, while paying less in $$ for it, would be a benefit for that team long-term.

Most other teams don't have the prospect depth and being at that stage where they're looking to get to the playoffs now consistently with a good young team on the rise... most teams also won't have the financial motivation to make a deal like this.

And who knows, maybe Luongo will waive his NTC to go to the Island - where he was first drafted and started his career. It's not far from Florida, and I'm sure his wife won't hate the Hamptons.
I think the Canucks would have to get a Kings ransom to do this. They will always have the option of waiving him instead of trading him for an albatross contract. I'm sure he would get picked up pretty quick.

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01-26-2013, 02:13 AM
  #742
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Any chance the Leafs demoted Gardiner because he's going to Vancouver shortly?
Lol. You're funny.

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01-26-2013, 02:14 AM
  #743
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Originally Posted by NFITO View Post
There aren't going to be many teams, if any, that will pay that price for Luongo, and Gillis isn't an idiot, he has to know that. This is all part of the negotiations right now and he's set his bar. He knows he won't finish there.

The only team that I can think of that *may* have interest in paying that kind of a price, would be the Islanders. It would involve the Canucks taking on DiPeitro's contract and buying him out using one of their amnesty buyouts. The Isles are also a team that is in good position to give up that kind of value in assets, especially if the Canucks are eating money as part of their deal (DiPeitro's buyout/Luongo's contract). They have a disgruntled top prospect who wants out, and several veteran options with money on their contracts making it easier to move out one (Okposo, Nielsen, Moulson, Visnovsky, Streit).

Might make sense for them to get a legitimate and established starter at this stage, given that they must be done with rebuilding by now, and they have several young players ready to contribute at the next level.

That's probably the only team I can think of that would have interest in Luongo at that price (granted it would come with a big salary buyout and/or eating salary). For the Isles there would be financial benefits as well, which a franchise like that will give value to buying out huge contracts, and taking on a contract where a lot of the money has been paid off... they're also a team that will never play at the salary cap anyways, so to have dead cap space, while paying less in $$ for it, would be a benefit for that team long-term.

Most other teams don't have the prospect depth and being at that stage where they're looking to get to the playoffs now consistently with a good young team on the rise... most teams also won't have the financial motivation to make a deal like this.

And who knows, maybe Luongo will waive his NTC to go to the Island - where he was first drafted and started his career. It's not far from Florida, and I'm sure his wife won't hate the Hamptons.
NFITO you might be right here, but I really think that a team is going to get desperate at some point this season. Philadelphia and Washington are dark horses to watch for. Chicago has started strong, but have a definite need there, and they are a win now team. These 3 teams I think would pay 1 roster player + good prospect + 1st. Roster player won't be a star but will be solid.

Florida wants to make the playoffs. It's obvious that ownership will want to build on momentum, and seriously have a star player that will be extremely marketable for them. Just imagine some slogans Florida could use for the return of Luongo. They got many prospects too and there are some creative deals that could be worked out.

Then there is Toronto and Edmonton.

Who knows how this turns out, but there is solid value to be had if Gillis is patient.

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01-26-2013, 02:14 AM
  #744
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Any chance the Leafs demoted Gardiner because he's going to Vancouver shortly?
No. It's a conditioning stint due to the concussion he suffered a few weeks back. He should be back up in no time.

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01-26-2013, 02:23 AM
  #745
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NFITO you might be right here, but I really think that a team is going to get desperate at some point this season. Philadelphia and Washington are dark horses to watch for. Chicago has started strong, but have a definite need there, and they are a win now team. These 3 teams I think would pay 1 roster player + good prospect + 1st. Roster player won't be a star but will be solid.

Florida wants to make the playoffs. It's obvious that ownership will want to build on momentum, and seriously have a star player that will be extremely marketable for them. Just imagine some slogans Florida could use for the return of Luongo. They got many prospects too and there are some creative deals that could be worked out.

Then there is Toronto and Edmonton.

Who knows how this turns out, but there is solid value to be had if Gillis is patient.
If there's any truth in what Gillis is saying, the Isles may actually be that team. They do have a player (DiPeitro) who they need to figure out what to do with. Maybe the trade is waiting on showcasing him to see if they can simply move him (or dump his contract) elsewhere and pay less for Luongo?

I think Luongo would be a good fit in New York, and it gives that franchise a player they can market against Lundqvist. They can also easily give up that kind of value and not hurt their lineup.

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01-26-2013, 02:32 AM
  #746
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Originally Posted by BayStBullies View Post
When the Leafs walk away; Luongo is a Canuck for the next decade. Don't kid yourselves with Gillis pretending there is a "mystery team". Then constantly crying and whining with remarks directly aimed at once single team.

Nonis is not budging; Gillis is asking for too much with no market for his asset. It's only a matter of time.

Either way, the Leafs are not as desperate as Vancouver. We're fine developing our youth and adding quality picks. Vancouver is hitting retirement; has empty cupboards; along with shooting themselves in the foot with a horrible decade long contract.

Trust me; we have thick skin. That doesn't shield stupidity.
LMAO yep the Canucks are desperate, no prospects! Loafs-10 years with no playoffs, two first rounders for Kessel! Multiple GM''s Only original six team not to win a cup or make a appearance in the final since expansion 45 years ago!Vancouver- two Presidents trophy multiple divisional titles, two Art Ross winners, Hart trophy winner, Selke winner, Schnieder, Lack, Kassian, Jensen etc in cupboard or already playing, Coach of the year winner! Elder and 3 other NHL defence men signed to multi year contracts. Yep real desperate compared to Maple Jokes. Get real, if you don't have comments to make that actually have facts to back them up, why make yourself look foolish. The leafs may eventually be a decent team, the Canucks are a great team or have you not noticed that the road to the cup went through Vancouver the last three years, and four of the last six years. Is it any wonder Toronto fans are the laughing stock of the league when they make comments like yours. If and when the Make Believes win the cup or anything for that matter, maybe you will be taken seriously

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01-26-2013, 02:36 AM
  #747
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Originally Posted by NFITO View Post
If there's any truth in what Gillis is saying, the Isles may actually be that team. They do have a player (DiPeitro) who they need to figure out what to do with. Maybe the trade is waiting on showcasing him to see if they can simply move him (or dump his contract) elsewhere and pay less for Luongo?

I think Luongo would be a good fit in New York, and it gives that franchise a player they can market against Lundqvist. They can also easily give up that kind of value and not hurt their lineup.
Here's an interesting idea. What if Islanders retain half of the salary, Vancouver takes him. See how he plays. If he comes back and plays well, then you got a good backup at 2.25 for the rest of his career. Salary recapture program has no effect on his contract if he retires early either, since there is no variance in his contract. If he plays bad buy him out in 2014 and theoretically Canucks only need to pay 2/3 of 2.25 over the rest of the deal. In 2014 Diepetro has 7 years left so buy out would be 10.5 million. Eddie Lack can stay in minors and be called up anytime because there are no re-entry waivers anymore and will become an RFA in 2014. So either trade Lack, buyout or trade Dipetro 2.25 cap if a team is interested.

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01-26-2013, 02:45 AM
  #748
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If we are to believe Gillis' claim of a mystery team. I suspect it may be Washington. There are enormous expectations for that organization and I cannot imagine they would settle for a "down year." The question becomes what would be the cost. They do have a plethora of appealing prospects that would be interesting, in particular, wingers. While I doubt, I'd love to see Forsberg+salary dump.

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01-26-2013, 02:48 AM
  #749
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If we are to believe Gillis' claim of a mystery team. I suspect it may be Washington. There are enormous expectations for that organization and I cannot imagine they would settle for a "down year." The question becomes what would be the cost. They do have a plethora of appealing prospects that would be interesting, in particular, wingers. While I doubt, I'd love to see Forsberg+salary dump.
Brouwer
Neuvirth
Wilson

For

Luongo

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01-26-2013, 02:49 AM
  #750
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I dont think so. He is a solid goaltender with 5 years of solid play left in him. Someone will give us a decent return for him.

Canuck fans just have to become more realistic about it.
Yep. I agree completely, he will fetch a decent return and If he goes to a desperate team maybe more than decent. But you are right, too many Vancouver fans ignore reality. After all, Vancouver gave up Bertuzzi, Auld and Allen to get him, got back Lou in his prime and Krycek( misspelled). All of the players given up by Vancouver were serviceable, but only Bertuzzi had been a star, but was never the same after his bonehead mugging of Moore.
See when you're rational, I appreciate your posts.

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