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P.K. Subban Thread - MK VIII - 'Week-end of Angst' Edition

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01-26-2013, 01:57 PM
  #501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
I never said because he's an english canadian. He could be european, russian, chinese, mexican etc.. it would not change anything.

What I am saying is that he would be signed if he spoke french and grew up in Quebec.

See the difference? Can you honestly dispute this?

@GMolsonCHC #signsubban

Of course I can dispute this. Do the Maple Leafs overpay for Ontarians??? It's a business deal I see no reason why nationality should be a factor in this.


You just used this occasion to paint french quebecers as nasty nationalists. That is called bigotry.

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01-26-2013, 01:57 PM
  #502
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Originally Posted by 29dryden29 View Post
What does a contract have to do with skating on your own time with guys you have played with? Instead he skated with the Laffs and guys he didn't play with. These weren't team run workouts so it wasn't like he was doing this for the team. He did what HE wanted to do as a possible team mate that would leave a bad taste in my mouth knowing he didn't want to skate or workout with the rest of them.
Again, he lives in Toronto so he stayed in Toronto. He also played with Tomas Kaberle in the Toronto charity game so this whole idea that he hasn't played with any Montreal Canadiens players through the lockout should end oh... bout now?

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01-26-2013, 01:57 PM
  #503
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Originally Posted by JustAHabFan View Post
Reading RL's article made me upset at MB more and more.

"Il veut d’abord connaître qui est le vrai PK. Il veut savoir si son défenseur est un pro."

"MB wants to know who is the real PK. He wanted to know if his defenseman is a pro"

"Pourquoi ce dossier traîne-t-il toujours ? Est-ce que le Canadien attend que PK Subban exige une transaction, afin de ne pas se mettre les partisans à dos ? Le blâme tomberait ainsi sur le jeune défenseur et non sur Marc Bergevin.
C’est principalement là où la bataille se joue présentement. Selon plusieurs sources, même si l’offre du Canadien ne fait aucun sens pour lui, PK Subban n’exigera pas une transaction. Il ne veut pas quitter cette organisation et c’est à Montréal qu’il veut jouer."

"Why this issue is not resolved? Does the Canadiens wait for Subban to ask for a trade such that they will not upset their fans because the blame will be on Subban and not on Marc Bergevin.
The battle is focusing on that issue. From different source, even the Habs' offer is not making any sense for him, PK Subban does not ask for a trade. He does not want to leave the team and he wants to play for Montreal"

For those who said PK is above the team, you are totally wrong. It was MB who put himself above the team.
No one knows anything, really. It all sounds like pure conjecture from Lavoie. Neither you nor I nor Renaud, for that matter know anything about who's putting themselves ahead of whom.

Even the numbers that came out... what was it? 2.2 and 2.9 for 2 seasons? And Bergy has been sticking to that since last May?? Call me difficult, but that sounds like a pile of caca to me.

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01-26-2013, 01:58 PM
  #504
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
And Carlson is the closest comparable.

If Bergevin is sticking to his bridge contract and loses Subban because of that, it'll be the worst move since Peanut set back the organization for over 20 years.
I believe PK is worth 29 millions for 6 years. I Just believe it is best for PK to sign 2 years 5 m$ + 6 years at 6m$ after. That would give him 5 m$ more. My point is why PK does want to make his value increase and prove to the new coach and gm that he is not a problem for the team. By assuming more risk the player will gain more.

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Old
01-26-2013, 01:59 PM
  #505
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Originally Posted by 29dryden29 View Post
What does a contract have to do with skating on your own time with guys you have played with? Instead he skated with the Laffs and guys he didn't play with. These weren't team run workouts so it wasn't like he was doing this for the team. He did what HE wanted to do as a possible team mate that would leave a bad taste in my mouth knowing he didn't want to skate or workout with the rest of them.
Please provide a source. Never heard that one before. I know he skated with the Bulls, but besides that.

Seems to me like some more "Markov's knee is done for good" type of comment.

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01-26-2013, 02:00 PM
  #506
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Originally Posted by haburger View Post
no whats stupid is hiring someone based on the language they speak instead of actual abilty to do the job properly.same movie over and over in montreal.dont get me wrong i understand the importance of a bilingual gm,but has it worked in the last 20 years ?no.could geoff have hired a guy with brains and integrity that doesnt speak french ?yes.then hire him a freakin translator.lol.why this franchise handycaps itself decade after decade is very odd.and then the fans whine and complain cause the team is weak?if you want success you must hire the best man for the job,otherwise.............................
....go root for Toronto? Go ahead. You'll never get that issue there.

Fact is, in the market they play in, the Montreal Canadiens' coach is the most mediatized figure, he gets more airtime than the prime minister of Canada / Quebec, and the mayor of Montreal. So he needs to speak both languages. May be limitating, but that's what it is. The end.

And I'm not saying that the Habs coach being so important is a normal thing, but that's what it is here.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:00 PM
  #507
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
Whitesnake brought up the Martin Leclerc article, and I went ahead and read it and he hit the nail on the head :
http://blogues.radio-canada.ca/blogu...de-transition/
I'm sick and tired of hearing about "subban is not liked in the room". How do we know this? Which habs player has come out and said this to anyone in the media?

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01-26-2013, 02:00 PM
  #508
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Originally Posted by 29dryden29 View Post
What does a contract have to do with skating on your own time with guys you have played with? Instead he skated with the Laffs and guys he didn't play with. These weren't team run workouts so it wasn't like he was doing this for the team. He did what HE wanted to do as a possible team mate that would leave a bad taste in my mouth knowing he didn't want to skate or workout with the rest of them.
You always want to look at the negative, do you? Why don't you think about Subban does not want to be around teammates because does not want to be a distraction to his teammates. Look at the links in the previous few pages from French journalists and you know who is at fault in this whole mess. MB just want to show he is a hard to push around GM and he does not care about the consequences.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:01 PM
  #509
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Please provide a source. Never heard that one before. I know he skated with the Bulls, but besides that.

Seems to me like some more "Markov's knee is done for good" type of comment.
http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey...real-canadiens

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01-26-2013, 02:02 PM
  #510
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Nobody is suggesting they give him a blank check.

Subban could give a little sacrifice if he wants to but he's not obligated to. And we should remember this. If he wants to be paid what he's worth, then I think it's a reasonable position don't you?
It is a reasonable position but within the confine of the CBA. I just don’t think that Subban has reached an elite status yet so I think the Canadiens should not completely overlook the fact that he is a RFA with no rights to arbitration. That’s why I agree with Gorges btw.

Plus, as I mentioned, a short terms deal may also be beneficial to Subban: long terms deals sometimes result in a player playing with less urgency. So a short terms contract may help him become the player we all know he can be. And that would lead him to more $$$.

Sadly if Subban wants to bypass the CBA and act as if he was a UFA, he will have to sign an offer sheet or ask for a trade. That’s his rights.


PS Just for the record: I wrote "sadly" because I am a huge fan of PK.

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01-26-2013, 02:04 PM
  #511
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Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
....go root for Toronto? Go ahead. You'll never get that issue there.

Fact is, in the market they play in, the Montreal Canadiens' coach is the most mediatized figure, he gets more airtime than the prime minister of Canada / Quebec, and the mayor of Montreal. So he needs to speak both languages. May be limitating, but that's what it is. The end.

And I'm not saying that the Habs coach being so important is a normal thing, but that's what it is here.
not talkin bout the coach,i got no problem with that.i'm talking about the general manager.he's the guy who runs the team.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:04 PM
  #512
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Originally Posted by No Team Needed View Post
Again, he lives in Toronto so he stayed in Toronto. He also played with Tomas Kaberle in the Toronto charity game so this whole idea that he hasn't played with any Montreal Canadiens players through the lockout should end oh... bout now?
Great he played with one for one game instead of coming to town to be with almost the whole team. That makes him a great teammate.

Erik Cole lives in Carolina, he was here. Gionta lives in Jersey, he was here too. Gorges lives in BC doesn't he? He was here. Price was here a while he lives out west. Eller lives in Denmark and he was here until he signed in Europe.

So what's his excuse?

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01-26-2013, 02:04 PM
  #513
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PK lives in Toronto, so I can completely understand why he'd rather train there. MA Fleury was training in Montreal during the lockout, surely he must be a cancer to the Pittsburgh Penguins organization

I was wondering why the media makes such a big deal out of nothing, but it makes so much sense now; people eat it up

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:05 PM
  #514
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Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
....go root for Toronto? Go ahead. You'll never get that issue there.

Fact is, in the market they play in, the Montreal Canadiens' coach is the most mediatized figure, he gets more airtime than the prime minister of Canada / Quebec, and the mayor of Montreal. So he needs to speak both languages. May be limitating, but that's what it is. The end.

And I'm not saying that the Habs coach being so important is a normal thing, but that's wh

at it is here.

may be limiting???

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01-26-2013, 02:05 PM
  #515
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Please provide a source. Never heard that one before. I know he skated with the Bulls, but besides that.

Seems to me like some more "Markov's knee is done for good" type of comment.
They practiced at maple leaf practice facility, which is owned by city of toronto.
Was not a leafs practice, guys paid there own way to rent rink, while they were locked out.
Most players were from Leafs but lots of Toronto area guys skated too who play for other teams, subban being one of them.

It's not a big deal at all.
I know guys who went down for autographs, guys from 8-10 teams were there it's just half were leafs and subban was probably biggest name for non leafs.

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01-26-2013, 02:06 PM
  #516
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Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
"30 NHL players, including a dozen leafs players."

Yeah, but 29dryden29 isn't twisting anything around saying Subban trained with the Laffs. That's not what Subban did.

OMG, the pens should not sign Letang and trade him as he trains with Habs players in Quebec every summer... but like the Subban situation, he doesn't actually train with Habs players, Letang trains with about 30 NHL players, close to half of whom are Habs players.

Yeah, let's play with words and paint the situation differently than what it is.

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01-26-2013, 02:06 PM
  #517
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Originally Posted by Miguel Sanchez View Post
PK lives in Toronto, so I can completely understand why he'd rather train there. MA Fleury was training in Montreal during the lockout, surely he must be a cancer to the Pittsburgh Penguins organization

I was wondering why the media makes such a big deal out of nothing, but it makes so much sense now; people eat it up
He should have been at Southpointe training with the Penguins guys, absolutely!

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01-26-2013, 02:07 PM
  #518
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Originally Posted by 29dryden29 View Post
What does a contract have to do with skating on your own time with guys you have played with? Instead he skated with the Laffs and guys he didn't play with. These weren't team run workouts so it wasn't like he was doing this for the team. He did what HE wanted to do as a possible team mate that would leave a bad taste in my mouth knowing he didn't want to skate or workout with the rest of them.
First of all he did not skate with the Leafs team. There were Leaf players there along with players from other teams too.

How is he going to skate with other Habs players? So after practice the players are going to say hey lets go work some more with PK? This is Montreal. If PK was in this city he wouldn't be able to leave his house without being bombarded by fans. It would be a bigger distraction for him to be here.

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01-26-2013, 02:07 PM
  #519
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Originally Posted by TheCanasianfrasian View Post
I'm sick and tired of hearing about "subban is not liked in the room". How do we know this? Which habs player has come out and said this to anyone in the media?
funny how some his best buds off the ice are steven stamkos and john tavares.

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01-26-2013, 02:07 PM
  #520
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They practiced at maple leaf practice facility, which is owned by city of toronto.
Was not a leafs practice, guys paid there own way to rent rink, while they were locked out.
Most players were from Leafs but lots of Toronto area guys skated too who play for other teams, subban being one of them.

It's not a big deal at all.
I know guys who went down for autographs, guys from 8-10 teams were there it's just half were leafs and subban was probably biggest name for non leafs.
Yeah, I know. Many players from other teams do that too.

My beef is that he made it sound as though Subban TRAINED with the Leafs, which is false.

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01-26-2013, 02:08 PM
  #521
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according to this the cap's 70.2m for this year and then drops to 64.3m next year. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...rticle7029575/

it doesn't make sense they'd drop the cap for this season - the drop comes for next season.
Yes that's what I thought.. Looks like the other guy was mistaken and I was correct.

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01-26-2013, 02:10 PM
  #522
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i really cant believe we are still arguing about this.i never in a million years thought mb would pull this.now we are all fighting with each other instead of supporting.god what i would give to have just one,ONE year of no distractions.

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01-26-2013, 02:11 PM
  #523
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funny how some his best buds off the ice are steven stamkos and john tavares.
Wow, two more disrespectful, attitude injected bums I'd never want to see wear the CH

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01-26-2013, 02:11 PM
  #524
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Who to beleive ? It does notmake sense to have the same offer than 8 months ago in terms of $ figures.

But the two year bridge contract seems casted in concrete for Bergevin.

3,5 million per year would be just fine like Letang will make this year and next.

4 million would be sweet.

Both parties are playing their last cards.

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01-26-2013, 02:11 PM
  #525
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Explain to me why we spent 4M for Prust and Bouillon if we are in cap hell.
Because

1) It is already quite evident that getting an UFA (who are expensive) like Prust was a great move
2) Boullion in the past two games has been very good, adds grit to the back end and is not the worst signing
3) This whole PK wanting THAT much was a bit of a surprise to us all. Fair enough, MB should have signed him first, but for whatever reasons, the two sides didn't get around to it during UFA season. Bergevin had to make moves 1 and 2 with the assumption that PK would not all of a sudden have acquired all-star status.

The thing that I hope PK realizes is the bind that he puts this team in by demanding more. I'm sure it's been pointed out to him. By taking a 2 year deal for what is still IMO fair (3M), he does the team and himself a great service. Instead, it's me me me. I grant that he is worth it in the long run, but it's not ridiculous to ask him to do this two year deal and let us sort out the cap for the future. I'm really disturbed by the fact that his holiness is going to force us to get rid of players who could be helpful to us. People forget that PK does not by himself make the team win. He helps as a group so it's like adding one and subtracting two. 3.5M/year for 2 would be great, only cuz I now have very low expectations for how much PK is willing to be fair.

If he had signed a 3M/year contract for 2 years at the outset, nobody would be making statements like "PK really got lowballed!, or, "We got PK at a discount!" This is what we expected for him coming off his ELC. Once he pulled a L'oréal moment, people started defending his case since we don't want to lose him. I don't think anyone (or not too many at least) were predicting THIS in terms of PK's requests/demands before they happened.

Anyway, get it done. Enough is enough. I just dropped a ton on the game vs Boston on Feb 6th. He better be there. IF Bergeving is still offering 2.5 or 2.75/year, then yeah, he's being foolish, not cuz PK is a god, but because it's clear that PK will not accept it and increasing to 3-3.5 won't kill the organization...I hope.


edit: Re: Carbo's inside scoop. Meehan never said Carbo was wrong. Since it was a figure/attitude that looked bad on PK, he simply said "I don't know how Carbo could have access to such privileged info.", which is what an agent WOULD say in that situation. I'm not convinced Carbo was wrong.

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