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P.K. Subban Thread - MK VIII - 'Week-end of Angst' Edition

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:26 PM
  #551
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
So clearly, let's say PK has no choice but to accept this ridiculous offer. You can be absolutely SURE that he will ask then, REALLY, for Drew Doughty's money for 7-8 years in his next contract. He will feel as if he needs to recuperate that money he lost in this stupid bridge contract, hence the ridiculous amount he will be asking for, ridiculous but TOTALLY in his right to ask for it.

So then....without the bridge excuse, will surely come the "structural" excuse from Bergevin who will obviously find that this demand makes no sense, to which Subban will then demand another 2 years and then get the hell out as soon as possible.

People, EVEN if Subban signs the bridge contract, at the point we are now, it means so much that you will a Subban that will remember it and will make up pay at the end, whether it's cap wise, or whether it's by seeing him leave without getting anything in return.

That is exactly what Marc Bergevin wants. I am sure he does not mind paying the 6-7 m $ / year Subban will ask in 2 years if Subban prooves to be the player making the difference like Markov is right now.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:26 PM
  #552
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Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
But PK says the Habs are pretty much everything to him and says he wouldn't want to play for anyone else and loves the city. Yet, he is holding out for more money (Yes, just like the PA holding out, this is a hold out), and stayed far away from his teammates and the city during a lockout during which lots of his teammates, including many who's hometowns are farther away from Montreal than his, came to town and stayed here. So, why wasn't PK here during the lockout?
Your mentality is a big reason why people don't want to play for Montreal.

"Has his family in Toronto and trains there? Not loyal enough."
"Does anything on his own? What an individual. Not a team player."
"Will only converse over the summer with Habs players on Twitter? Too stuck up to give them a phone call."
"Won't play a charity game in Montreal because he's playing one in Toronto? Must want to be a Leaf then."

You're making something out of nothing. Congratulations. That must make you a real diehard.

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01-26-2013, 02:28 PM
  #553
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
If he agrees for 3,5, great but he deserves to be the third most paid defenseman on this team right now behind Marvov and Kaberle who have way more experience than him.
Your credibility took a big hit when you mentioned Kaberle. PK is behind Markov. Yes. PK behind Kaberle. At present, Not in a million year. PK behind a washed up veteran like Kaberle? It showed how much you know about hockey.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:28 PM
  #554
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This would explain a lot :

Quote:
LE CANADIEN TIENT-IL VRAIMENT À PK ?

Plusieurs joueurs, agents et dirigeants dans la LNH regardent ce dossier avec attention. De plus en plus, on me suggère que si le Canadien tenait vraiment à ses services, il y a longtemps que ce dossier serait réglé. Pourquoi par exemple ne pas repousser le problème et lui faire signer une entente d’une seule saison, surtout que PK Subban a droit à l’arbitrage cette année.

Pourquoi ce dossier traîne-t-il toujours ? Est-ce que le Canadien attend que PK Subban exige une transaction, afin de ne pas se mettre les partisans à dos ? Le blâme tomberait ainsi sur le jeune défenseur et non sur Marc Bergevin.

C’est principalement là où la bataille se joue présentement. Selon plusieurs sources, même si l’offre du Canadien ne fait aucun sens pour lui, PK Subban n’exigera pas une transaction. Il ne veut pas quitter cette organisation et c’est à Montréal qu’il veut jouer.
If that's the case then not only is our GM stupid but he's also gutless.

I can't believe habs would stoop that low however.

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01-26-2013, 02:28 PM
  #555
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
And that's why this makes no sense to me. This doesn't save money. I know more contracts come off the books in a few years...so why not free up even more space for when that time comes by locking in Subban now? We aren't spending anything until Gomez and Kaberle are off the books, and we have a few more free agencies coming up soon, like Desharnais.

We don't know how much Subban is asking for. But if he is willing to take 5 for 5 or whatever..how is that a bad thing? All he needs to do is break the 40 point barrier and you can guarantee he will ask for Doughty money if he's lowballed right now. Penny wise and dollar foolish.
exactly .it makes no sense because we may save a bit now but we will pay dearly later.in the end it will all be the same,except going this route we piss off one of our brightest young d men we ve had in a long long time.really i cant wait to hear mb's explanation of this situation.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:28 PM
  #556
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i really cant believe we are still arguing about this.i never in a million years thought mb would pull this.now we are all fighting with each other instead of supporting.god what i would give to have just one,ONE year of no distractions.
It's been 3 games. If this is how we start...


Threads that will go into multiple editions (which make me gag thinking them up):

- Time to trade Eller
- Markov vs. PK (if/when he resigns)
- Who's the real captain, Gorges or Gionta?
- Trade Plekanec!
- Subban and Cole fight in practice
- Subban and DD fight in practice (hmmm...media field day?)
- Chucky's sister allegedly involved with married man, Lars Eller
- Gomez scores 30 goals, we were fools to mismanage him (AK version as well...but that I will fully agree with)

If we can just keep winning, it will make all the distractions so much less interesting. I also wonder how much staging there's going to be for 24CH.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:29 PM
  #557
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Originally Posted by No Team Needed View Post
Your mentality is a big reason why people don't want to play for Montreal.

"Has his family in Toronto and trains there? Not loyal enough."
"Does anything on his own? What an individual. Not a team player."
"Will only converse over the summer with Habs players on Twitter? Too stuck up to give them a phone call."
"Won't play a charity game in Montreal because he's playing one in Toronto? Must want to be a Leaf then."

You're making something out of nothing. Congratulations. That must make you a real diehard.
The other guys did it. They were here. Or playing in Europe. So, are they too loyal, too good team players, too social and want too much to be a part of the team?

If it was good for Brian Gionta and Erik Cole, who are seasoned veterans in this league with cup rings, why wasn't it a good idea for PK?

Oh, and the don't want to play in Montreal thing is ********* too.

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01-26-2013, 02:29 PM
  #558
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
So clearly, let's say PK has no choice but to accept this ridiculous offer. You can be absolutely SURE that he will ask then, REALLY, for Drew Doughty's money for 7-8 years in his next contract. He will feel as if he needs to recuperate that money he lost in this stupid bridge contract, hence the ridiculous amount he will be asking for, ridiculous but TOTALLY in his right to ask for it.

So then....without the bridge excuse, will surely come the "structural" excuse from Bergevin who will obviously find that this demand makes no sense, to which Subban will then demand another 2 years and then get the hell out as soon as possible.

People, EVEN if Subban signs the bridge contract, at the point we are now, it means so much that you will a Subban that will remember it and will make up pay at the end, whether it's cap wise, or whether it's by seeing him leave without getting anything in return.
If his play stays consistent and even improves by all means he can ask away for that kind of money but for the time being he should take a deal that isn't ridiculous and get back on the ice. The longer this drags on the more likely he is traded or an offersheet comes in.

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01-26-2013, 02:29 PM
  #559
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Bergevin seems to be short term it's scary. Can't believe a guy like Dudley wouldn't use his influence on him to convince him that his way makes no sense whatsoever.
A poster like you with usually good common sense really beleive Bergevin is screwing up in that case ?

There is way too many unknowns to judge it.

We should all keep our heads cold.

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01-26-2013, 02:30 PM
  #560
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Time for Bergevin to wake the **** up. He's playing with fire low-balling PK like that if the recent rumours are true.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:31 PM
  #561
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Originally Posted by jrk View Post
That is exactly what Marc Bergevin wants. I am sure he does not mind paying the 6-7 m $ / year Subban will ask in 2 years if Subban prooves to be the player making the difference like Markov is right now.
so you wanna risk losing him?this is a massive misstep by mb.i could see his point if we had a young version of pk in the minorsbut we dont. there is no one else in our system who has the tools pk does.

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01-26-2013, 02:31 PM
  #562
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Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
The other guys did it. They were here. Or playing in Europe. So, are they too loyal, too good team players, too social and want too much to be a part of the team?

If it was good for Brian Gionta and Erik Cole, who are seasoned veterans in this league with cup rings, why wasn't it a good idea for PK?
Come on Phil, you are better than that. You are really missing the obvious. Gionta and Cole have young children, needed to get them in school.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:33 PM
  #563
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The other guys did it.
Yeah? And Subban isn't those guys.

This isn't a cult. It's a business organization. Subban is allowed to train wherever he pleases. This is "Carey Price is wearing a Washington Nationals hat" silly. This is "Saku Koivu knows how to speak French but doesn't do it enough in public" silly. Until NHL teams start paying players to train in their cities in the off-season, there's absolutely nothing hold him, other than your ridiculous ideals, to train in the city.

Drew Doughty didn't train with the Kings when he was waiting for his new contract. He has a Stanley Cup ring to show for it. Guess it doesn't mean **** then.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:34 PM
  #564
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If what RDS says is true, that offer is a joke.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:35 PM
  #565
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PK lives in Toronto, so I can completely understand why he'd rather train there. MA Fleury was training in Montreal during the lockout, surely he must be a cancer to the Pittsburgh Penguins organization

I was wondering why the media makes such a big deal out of nothing, but it makes so much sense now; people eat it up
Any issue with this is complete BS and somebody desperately grasping at straws.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:36 PM
  #566
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Your credibility took a big hit when you mentioned Kaberle. PK is behind Markov. Yes. PK behind Kaberle. At present, Not in a million year. PK behind a washed up veteran like Kaberle? It showed how much you know about hockey.
What I meant i that Kaberle has paidhis dues at NHL level with a long carreer and many succesful seasons point wise. And he is making "only" 4,2.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:36 PM
  #567
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
So clearly, let's say PK has no choice but to accept this ridiculous offer. You can be absolutely SURE that he will ask then, REALLY, for Drew Doughty's money for 7-8 years in his next contract. He will feel as if he needs to recuperate that money he lost in this stupid bridge contract, hence the ridiculous amount he will be asking for, ridiculous but TOTALLY in his right to ask for it.

So then....without the bridge excuse, will surely come the "structural" excuse from Bergevin who will obviously find that this demand makes no sense, to which Subban will then demand another 2 years and then get the hell out as soon as possible.

People, EVEN if Subban signs the bridge contract, at the point we are now, it means so much that you will have a Subban that will remember it and will make us pay at the end, whether it's cap wise, or whether it's by seeing him leave without getting anything in return.
If he plays with the same energy and passion and irons out some of his weaknesses (Giveaways, he's brutal at them, amongst others), he'll deserve MORE than Doughty's. His talent is not an issue for anyone.

His character is. And more specifically, he has to learn the world doesn't revolve around him. If he doesn't speak in the room or the music he likes doesn't play, it's ok.

He can be as much of a star as he wants on the ice, but his teammates have come out in the press to say his character could be overbearing at times. Just tone it down a little PK, still be you, but turn the volume down a little. And win Norris Trophies all you want.

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01-26-2013, 02:36 PM
  #568
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
A poster like you with usually good common sense really beleive Bergevin is screwing up in that case ?

There is way toomany unknows to judge it.

We should all keep our heads cold.
As someone mentioned before, the Snake has been around for a while and the majority of us really like to read what he think. MB is completely screwed up PK contract. As a new GM, he just want to put a stamp on the hockey club. He wants to show he is a GM that can not be pushed around. He choose PK contract to make his point. MB is just playing with fire here.

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01-26-2013, 02:36 PM
  #569
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At 2 years 2.5M. Bergevin shouldn't have a single person in his corner. What an insulting offer.

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01-26-2013, 02:37 PM
  #570
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But PK says the Habs are pretty much everything to him and says he wouldn't want to play for anyone else and loves the city. Yet, he is holding out for more money (Yes, just like the PA holding out, this is a hold out), and stayed far away from his teammates and the city during a lockout during which lots of his teammates, including many who's hometowns are farther away from Montreal than his, came to town and stayed here. So, why wasn't PK here during the lockout?
Oh give me a break.
We all know he grew up being a Habs fan, so it's only natural that he thinks the world of the Habs. That doesn't mean it is EVERYTHING to him.
And just because he 'loves' the city doesn't mean he would want to 'live' in the city. I love Hawaii, Tokyo, San Fran, etc. that doesn't mean I want to live there.

If the reason for him being in Toronto is because of family, will you accept that? Or is that not acceptable?

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01-26-2013, 02:37 PM
  #571
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Originally Posted by Capitaine Gionta View Post
If what RDS says is true, that offer is a joke.
Usually people on this board do not trust and beleive RDS...

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01-26-2013, 02:37 PM
  #572
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Come on Phil, you are better than that. You are really missing the obvious. Gionta and Cole have young children, needed to get them in school.
That is absolutely true. Hadn't thought of that. You're right on that one.

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01-26-2013, 02:38 PM
  #573
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PK is probably my favorite player, but I'm wondering about something.

I'm an old guy, so maybe my memory is a bit off, but as I recall last season, he seemed to have regressed for the first 2/3s of the season and then was really good after the AllStar break.

Do you guys have the same recollection? For example, was he a Molson Cup 3 star at all in any home games before the All Star break?

If I'm right, maybe that's a factor for Habs management...has Subban really been consistent enough to warrant a big payday at this time.

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01-26-2013, 02:38 PM
  #574
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What I meant i that Kaberle has paidhis dues at NHL level with a long carreer and many succesful seasons point wise. And he is making "only" 4,2.
Knuble has been in the league for a long long time. The Flyers should give him at least 5M then.

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Old
01-26-2013, 02:38 PM
  #575
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That is exactly what Marc Bergevin wants. I am sure he does not mind paying the 6-7 m $ / year Subban will ask in 2 years if Subban prooves to be the player making the difference like Markov is right now.
Every sane human being knows that Subban had ALREADY made the difference and that he WILL be the player that we mostly all think he will. Do you seriously think that half of a season this year and just 1 more season is needed to really know what PK is all about?

You might have a bridge contract when 2 things happen. When you didn't have a whole lot of time to evaluate the player in his ELC...or when the players has NO leverage whatsoever, whether he's a totally replaceable player or just didn't have a great 3 years after all. Subban was lights out in his 1st year he played in the AHL. He was dominant. Then, 1st year in the league, he was great....IN THE PLAYOFFS! Then, in somewhat of his sophomore season, he had 14 goals and a decent 38 points. And in the catastrophy season we had last year, the guy still was able to have the same number of points going from a -8 to a +9. OF COURSE, Price and Pacioretty accepted the 2-year contracts...WHAT THE **** DID THEY DO to demand more? Subban was nothing more but great during his ELC. He had some tough moments..no ****....Who the hell don't have tougher moments? So not only he's very good at what he does, not only he's THE ONLY prospect we have that comes close to what he does, he also brings the element of entertainment that this sport is also allowed to entertain. THIS GUY is in a class of his own and if I would be him, I'd be so offended right now.

And if the real reason is that Bergevin has to prove that he's tough or that he has to show the world that he's a man of his words and that everybody will need to go throught that process, well it tells me that this GM has no vision, thinks of how he looks FIRST and I'd then hate to play for this team. Sorry Bergevin, but if that's your goal, other players will not see as you're a man of principles, they'll see it as you're a dumb manager.

Again....this is all on IF'S. Let's hope he'd not dumb. Let's hope we'er totally off. Doesn't seem so though. But let's give him a chance to prove he's worth our time and patience.

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