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*ALL* PK Subban talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals) III

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Old
01-26-2013, 07:30 PM
  #201
Krishna
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AcadiaAxeMan View Post
Brandon Sutter +Despres + 1st for PK + Eller
You are really overrating Subban's value.

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01-26-2013, 07:30 PM
  #202
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I am a bit uncomfortable with the Toews comparison as far as Couturier's ceiling. I have always maintained that his upside is probably Patrice Bergeron. That's no knock as far as I'm concerned... I see Bergeron as the model for a 2C in the NHL who would be a 1C on about 10 teams.

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01-26-2013, 07:32 PM
  #203
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Originally Posted by AcadiaAxeMan View Post
Brandon Sutter +Despres + 1st for PK + Eller
HELL NO.

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Old
01-26-2013, 07:33 PM
  #204
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Originally Posted by ShotScore View Post
I wonder if Montreal would be willing to entertain the thought of deal for Subban to the Flyers for anyone not named Couturier and Schenn, plus picks/prospects.
Couturier has to be in it. We'll go shopping elsewhere without him.

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01-26-2013, 07:34 PM
  #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ginovegas View Post
schenn schen and a second
for
Subban, Kaberle and Moen
More like



PK Subban
Lars Eller



Brayden Schenn
Luke Schenn

And maybe some assortment of picks.

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Old
01-26-2013, 07:35 PM
  #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
I am a bit uncomfortable with the Toews comparison as far as Couturier's ceiling. I have always maintained that his upside is probably Patrice Bergeron. That's no knock as far as I'm concerned... I see Bergeron as the model for a 2C in the NHL who would be a 1C on about 10 teams.
They are very similar players.

Bergeron could score similar amounts if he was on the top line

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01-26-2013, 07:36 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by glenbuis View Post
Couturier has to be in it. We'll go shopping elsewhere without him.
Normally I would agree but Montreal's trade resume is laughably bad. And we have no way of gauging what Bergevin will do.

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01-26-2013, 07:37 PM
  #208
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Because .....

He gets PK and forward depth .....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
Why would Sather offer this?

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Old
01-26-2013, 07:39 PM
  #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AcadiaAxeMan View Post
He gets PK and forward depth .....
But gives up a better D man

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01-26-2013, 07:39 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by Petes2424 View Post
Toews was the captain of his team at 20 years old. He was a first line player on a Stanley Cup team at 22. Toews scored almost double the points at the same age. At 21 Toews became almost a point a game player and has never looked back.

That's some really heavy expectation.
If Couts turned out to be 90 % of Toews I'm in. Pretty good comparison actually.

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01-26-2013, 07:40 PM
  #211
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Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
Yes, 28 points in 31 games. Only about 70-75 points over an 82 game season....very, very far off from PPG on the best AHL team in the league. Flyers ought to just waive Couturier.
Nobody's saying that. Equating him with Toews is a bit much though. Equating him as a premier offensive talent is also a bit much

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01-26-2013, 07:40 PM
  #212
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"Like" button ....

works for me ... let's get this over with and get an asset PLAYING, instead of one sitting because HE is selfish!! There's No TEAM in PK! It's about HIM!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
More like



PK Subban
Lars Eller



Brayden Schenn
Luke Schenn

And maybe some assortment of picks.

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Old
01-26-2013, 07:40 PM
  #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
More like



PK Subban
Lars Eller



Brayden Schenn
Luke Schenn

And maybe some assortment of picks.
I'd do something like that

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Old
01-26-2013, 07:43 PM
  #214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petes2424 View Post
Nobody's saying that. Equating him with Toews is a bit much though. Equating him as a premier offensive talent is also a bit much
They've been used in completely different ways.

Toews got a ton of PP time and played with the best players on the team whereas Couturier didn't.

When you have a good team, your younger players almost always play on lower lines.

In Toews' rookie year, his team wasn't good

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Old
01-26-2013, 07:51 PM
  #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
Similar in maturity perhaps, but Pronger was infinitely superior at the same age Subban is now. In terms of value, they are not even kind of close.

Savard did not have single PPG season with the Habs. In his final three years in Chicago, he netted 131p/80, 82p/58 and 80p/60 points respective, whereas in Montreal he had 59p/70, 70p/77 and 50p/63.

That is a sharp decline. Respectable player or not, most analyst consider Chelios to Chicago was one of Montreal's worst trades. Therefore, your comparison is lacking.
You can try and twist things to suit your opinion all you want. Facts are facts..

Was Denis Savard not well over a pt a game player when the trade was made?

Did Pronger not have two arrests and was he not considered an immature player and underachiever in Hartford who may not ever reach his potential? All you have to do is google Pronger, immaturity and Hartford if you simply dont remember the time.

It doesnt matter what happened after the trades. It's worth. Worth has and always will be more for a young defender with tremendous upside to a forward unless that forward is premier. Im sure Detroit still kicks themselves for trading Oates for Federko or Klima, Graves and Joe Murphy for Jimmy Carson.... At the time, that's what the worth was. Didnt work out. Just as Savard declined in Montreal.

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01-26-2013, 07:52 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
Normally I would agree but Montreal's trade resume is laughably bad. And we have no way of gauging what Bergevin will do.
I think Bergevin is gonna be a keeper. He's played, won, been tutured by arguably the best brains in hockey. He has courage to make what could have been unpopular decisions. ( for example i dont think anyone could have predicted him telling someone he's paying 7 million to stay home ). He's dead set on the bridge contract which makes the best sense for the habs. I'm sure he's taking advantage of listening to offers while he can.

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01-26-2013, 07:54 PM
  #217
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That's Pacioretty we're talking about.

He'll probably be running in 2 days, and back on the ice by the beginning of next week.

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Old
01-26-2013, 07:55 PM
  #218
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Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
They've been used in completely different ways.

Toews got a ton of PP time and played with the best players on the team whereas Couturier didn't.

When you have a good team, your younger players almost always play on lower lines.

In Toews' rookie year, his team wasn't good
If you're a premier offensive player, you dont get used in a way that deters you from scoring. The game is still the same. Whoever scores more goals wins. If Couturier possessed the same skill set as Toews he wouldnt be playing on the fourth line last year. It's that simple. He may evolve into that type of guy. He's just not there today.

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Old
01-26-2013, 08:05 PM
  #219
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I love how people are adding Eller as a throw in. 6'2" 200+ lbs center with soft hands, 16 goals and was the 12th overall pick.

Paaaa-lease, they traded Halak for this guy and have been developing him for a couple years yet they're going to just toss him?


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Old
01-26-2013, 08:07 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by AcadiaAxeMan View Post
works for me ... let's get this over with and get an asset PLAYING, instead of one sitting because HE is selfish!! There's No TEAM in PK! It's about HIM!
I can't believe people are still saying this crap after PK is getting lowballed.

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Old
01-26-2013, 08:10 PM
  #221
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I can't believe people are still saying this crap after PK is getting lowballed.
Weeks said on Hotstove that the GM's he's talked to can't believe Montreal's tactic on this. PKs fault tho #blamesubban

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01-26-2013, 08:10 PM
  #222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
More like



PK Subban
Lars Eller



Brayden Schenn
Luke Schenn

And maybe some assortment of picks.
wouldnt work cap wise, plus Philly is getting to much

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Old
01-26-2013, 08:11 PM
  #223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petes2424 View Post
You can try and twist things to suit your opinion all you want. Facts are facts..

Was Denis Savard not well over a pt a game player when the trade was made?

Did Pronger not have two arrests and was he not considered an immature player and underachiever in Hartford who may not ever reach his potential? All you have to do is google Pronger, immaturity and Hartford if you simply dont remember the time.

It doesnt matter what happened after the trades. It's worth. Worth has and always will be more for a young defender with tremendous upside to a forward unless that forward is premier. Im sure Detroit still kicks themselves for trading Oates for Federko or Klima, Graves and Joe Murphy for Jimmy Carson.... At the time, that's what the worth was. Didnt work out. Just as Savard declined in Montreal.
Aye, but you are conveniently disregarding an extreme decline in productivity. Chelios nearly outscored him as a defenseman: 73pts in 80 games.

However, at your insistence. Allow us to compare Pronger to Subban when the former was first traded.

Chris Pronger
Career high 62 points and staggering +51
Hart Trophy
Norris Trophy
Two 50+ point seasons
Five 40+ point seasons
Seven 30+ point seasons

... do I even need to continue? PK cannot even fathom what Pronger accomplished, at least not right now.

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Old
01-26-2013, 08:13 PM
  #224
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I'd do something like that
I wouldn't Eller is a lot more than a throw in

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Old
01-26-2013, 08:14 PM
  #225
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Subban will haunt the Habs for years if hes traded to Philly... He would fit very well because of his intensity
I wonder if the Bruins would be interested, both Subban brothers together...

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