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The Leafs: Discuss the current team (not a tank thread)

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Old
01-27-2013, 02:34 AM
  #126
HellasLEAF
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Boy is this an important draft for Toronto. Hope we don't MESS IT UP anymore by continuing to win games then LOSE 2 or 3!!!

And when we do pick they better pick right!!

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Old
01-27-2013, 02:35 AM
  #127
rdawg1234
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
Adding support pieces to an elite core is alot easier to do than trying to aquire elite pieces . Also , you still need to give your elite kids time to mature and develop .
They still badly need a #1 D-man(schultz is a great 2nd pairing offensive guy) and a few more d-men on top of that. They still need a #1 Goalie(dubnyk doesnt seem like the guy), they still need a #2 C(at least IMO) as well as an actual bottom 6.

They also badly need size, their top 6 is extremely small and will get tossed by bigger teams,(Yakupov, Eberle, Gagner all around 5'10 180-190 RNH is also very lanky but he can build on his frame.)

Basically they're a great team on the powerplay, but have the opposite in prospects to us, we have a bright defensive future, while they've built purely on offense. A long way to go, IMO they may fluke into the playoffs this season, but are a couple years away from being a playoff team.

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01-27-2013, 02:45 AM
  #128
Kyle Doobas
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Originally Posted by Woll Smoth View Post
40+ years no cup
Coming up on 10 years of no playoffs.
5 Years of top 10 draft picks with almost nothing to show for it.

No patience.
5 games into the season, 2-3-0 record (same as the Rangers now btw) and it's the end of the ****ing world.

Have a cookie for your patience


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01-27-2013, 02:57 AM
  #129
hotpaws
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Originally Posted by rdawg1234 View Post
They still badly need a #1 D-man(schultz is a great 2nd pairing offensive guy) and a few more d-men on top of that. They still need a #1 Goalie(dubnyk doesnt seem like the guy), they still need a #2 C(at least IMO) as well as an actual bottom 6.

They also badly need size, their top 6 is extremely small and will get tossed by bigger teams,(Yakupov, Eberle, Gagner all around 5'10 180-190 RNH is also very lanky but he can build on his frame.)

Basically they're a great team on the powerplay, but have the opposite in prospects to us, we have a bright defensive future, while they've built purely on offense. A long way to go, IMO they may fluke into the playoffs this season, but are a couple years away from being a playoff team.
Hall has decent size and will fill out , RNH and Eberle don't play a physical game but are very skilled . Yaks a gritty player with decent size as well . I don't like Gagner either so a big 2nd line C would work great with what they have .

They have some bottom 6 guys but a few will need to be replaced to save some cash . They could trade Gagner and some other pieces to fill there needs .

They have some solid D prospects and overall they're not too bad at the NHL level but they do need a goalie . They really lucked out with Schultz going there , the kid looks like a stud ( at least in the offensive zone ) .

All in all they're in good shape as long as they continue to ride the kids and let them learn from there mistakes . The pieces they're missing arn't hard to find .

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Old
01-27-2013, 03:15 AM
  #130
TheDoubleDion87
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Patience my sheep, er, people....... patience.

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01-27-2013, 03:20 AM
  #131
mcleex
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Guys look at the bright side we are undefeated against all other states and provinces in North America except New York

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Old
01-27-2013, 03:25 AM
  #132
rdawg1234
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
All in all they're in good shape as long as they continue to ride the kids and let them learn from there mistakes . The pieces they're missing arn't hard to find .
yea and maybe if they made a decent trade or two.

gonna take a while to make the playoffs when most of your top talent on the team is 18-22.

the entire plan there is tank tank tank and draft high, not much else. Not a terrible plan, but it's an extremely slow plan when you dont make many trades.

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01-27-2013, 03:38 AM
  #133
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It definitely is crunch time. We're coming out of yet another lockout and this year will set our direction for the future.

Are we going to be the laughing stock of the league until another lockout comes?
Does Nonis have the balls to go full 'tank' mode and abandon short term fixes if we will continue the slide?
Are we prepared to admit Phaneuf and Kessel might not be the players that will lead us to the promise land?

Decisions, decisions...

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01-27-2013, 04:25 AM
  #134
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For every microscopic step forward the Leafs take, the rest of the league, it seems, takes a stride. Think of what we have, and what we don't have, and then compare that to the rest of the Eastern Conference, or, the rest of the league, if you're feeling particularly brave. We have almost nothing; objectively, we're one of the worst teams in the league, year in and year out. Without a bit of luck, I don't see us competing for a long, long time.

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01-27-2013, 04:48 AM
  #135
Jerkini
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Originally Posted by Nickolopolous View Post
For every microscopic step forward the Leafs take, the rest of the league, it seems, takes a stride. Think of what we have, and what we don't have, and then compare that to the rest of the Eastern Conference, or, the rest of the league, if you're feeling particularly brave. We have almost nothing; objectively, we're one of the worst teams in the league, year in and year out. Without a bit of luck, I don't see us competing for a long, long time.
I still think we're one legitimate goaltender away from being respectable. Think Curtis Joseph when signed here for that 98-1999 season. And from there, attracting talent to bolster the rest of our lineup becomes infinitely easier. Now i'm not suggesting Luongo is that guy, I think that ship has sailed long ago.. but when the best our goalies can hope to achieve is a .900 save percentage, you're not going anywhere.

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01-27-2013, 05:41 AM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Jerkini View Post
I still think we're one legitimate goaltender away from being respectable. Think Curtis Joseph when signed here for that 98-1999 season. And from there, attracting talent to bolster the rest of our lineup becomes infinitely easier. Now i'm not suggesting Luongo is that guy, I think that ship has sailed long ago.. but when the best our goalies can hope to achieve is a .900 save percentage, you're not going anywhere.
Sure, but even if that were true, we're still one quasi-superstar away from attracting talent, not from competing. Just look at the rosters of the teams we need to compete with; teams like New York, Pittsburgh, Tampa Bay, Philly, Boston, and so on, and you'll see that these teams—teams with infinitely more talent than we have—are still adding pieces because they're not good enough. So, not only do we need to get better—much, much better—but we need to do so quickly, and at the expense these teams, not in tandem with them. We've got the mindset that adding a player like Riley springs us ahead—but what about the four teams before us, that drafted ostensibly better players? What about the 5-10 teams after us that drafted players with just as much potential? It's all relative, and I think the outlook is much more bleak than Leafs fans want to admit.


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01-27-2013, 06:03 AM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Nickolopolous View Post
Sure, but even if that were true, we're still one quasi-superstar away from attracting talent, not from competing. Just look at the rosters of the teams we need to compete with; teams like New York, Pittsburgh, Tampa Bay, Philly, Boston, and so on, and you'll see that these teams—teams with infinitely more talent than we have—are still adding pieces because they're not good enough. So, not only do we to get better—much, much better—but we need to do so quickly, and at the expense these teams, not in tandem with them. We've got the mindset that adding a player like Riley springs us ahead—but what about the four teams before us, that drafted ostensibly better players? What about the 5-10 teams after us that drafted players with just as much potential? It's all relative, and I think the outlook is much more bleak than Leafs fans want to admit.
You're absolutely correct sir.

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Old
01-27-2013, 06:13 AM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Longshot View Post
I have a serious question. I'm not being sarcastic. And I'm not being flippant.

But, again - seriously - how many years does it take to conclude that it's not working with Kessel and Phaneuf as the focal points of your team?

I like Phil Kessel and I like Dion Phaneuf. I think both are excellent NHL players that would excel on good team. Just imagine Phaneuf on the Rangers. Or Kessel with the Kings. Wow, is what I think.

However, at some point does management not have to look at this situation and conclude it's not working with them as focal points? How long does it take to come to the conclusion that they both would be better off in support roles? And what happens when management does reach that conclusion? Is that when a full rebuild begins?
The rags look like the team BB said he was going to build here, no?

Starts from the net out, mobile D.

All the ten,pug stuff he said, oh ya and some skill.

Watching last nights game really emphasized how badly BB failed in that regard.

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01-27-2013, 06:33 AM
  #139
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Originally Posted by rdawg1234 View Post
Let's not underrate our players too much, I hate when fans treat other teams' players like gods and our owns like a bunch of garbage.

Lupul is up there when playing solid, not counting him JVR has huge potential(and has already started hot).

Dont get me wrong, we're in need of another piece or two, but I will really like our top 6 once we get that #1 C. And we'll really like our defense once Gardiner and Rielly reach their potential(as well as other guys like Finn, percy etc.)

We definitely should have MORE pieces by now, but we dont, however I wouldn't say our future is bleak, IMO we're a #1 G from playoffs, then a #1 C from deep contention, we have all the other pieces in our system.
Thats like saying i'm a piece or two away from being married.

All i need is the diamond ring and a women willing to marry me. LOL

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01-27-2013, 06:43 AM
  #140
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Originally Posted by rdawg1234 View Post
Question: When's the last time any team literally gutted it's core or high-end pieces and started over? I'm not talking a vet team with a bunch of 30+ year olds, I mean a team that sold off guys like Phaneuf, Grabo, Kessel, Lupul etc. all youngish guys with talent, just to start over? Has it EVER happened?

so why do people keep posting proposals like this?
Pitt,Wash,LA,CHI?

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01-27-2013, 06:45 AM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
Thats like saying i'm a piece or two away from being married.

All i need is the diamond ring and a women willing to marry me. LOL
OMG lmao .......one of the best yet!!!!! how long before simmons or cox use this line
only reason why there is even any hope this year is a shortened season ....in the real NHL world the leafs wee picked to be 12 -15 by most obsrvers
30 goal outta kessel wouldve been part pf that 'ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN " theory .....the goaltending against the ranger was very adequate .......the rest of this crap is brutal
u gotta rebuild this mess .......everyone should be on the block ,time for nonis to man up ,cut his burkie tie off ,and do his job ...

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Old
01-27-2013, 06:47 AM
  #142
Faltorvo
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Originally Posted by TheSilencer View Post
OP's clearly out to lunch. We have..
One of the best wingers in game - Kessel (he scores points, end of discussion)
One of the best second line centers in the game - Grabovski (he got back at Chara that one game, end of discussion)
#1 D - Phaneuf, A PPG winger sitting in the sidelines due to injury...

All of them under 28 (29 in lupul's case) in their prime and ready to roll. Future is bright.

Burke=genius...still mourning at the loss of the great one.
Drop the r from your user handle and practice it. End of discussion.

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01-27-2013, 06:50 AM
  #143
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Originally Posted by T M L View Post
You can thank Uncle Burke for that... might be the worst trade in the history of the franchise. So happy that arrogant American is the **** out of Toronto. Now its time to clean up the garbage he left.
It might go down as the most ill timed/ ill advised trades in leafs history.

As for worst?

NAW!

Even I won't go that far and I loathe the trade and BB.

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01-27-2013, 06:57 AM
  #144
Mowerman
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Add intelligent fans into the mix of things the Leafs are missing.

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01-27-2013, 07:13 AM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Frank Stallone View Post
5 games into the season, 2-3-0 record (same as the Rangers now btw) and it's the end of the ****ing world.

Have a cookie for your patience
As a fellow Norm Macdonald fan, I would love to agree with you (Norm fans should always stick together)...

But alas.. I entirely disagree.

The leaf have been terrible for almost ten years.
And for that entire time , there's been fans like you saying "don't over react, we just need patience!"

Sorry, but I think he team is just lousy and we should go for a high pick.

The Intelligent fans haven't been "over reacting" when they point out the truth about this pathetic team, they've simply been objective.

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Old
01-27-2013, 07:19 AM
  #146
Faltorvo
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Originally Posted by The Podium View Post
This fan base has gone full retard

What happened to all those fans who were going to be indifferent about this season because either route in the standings would be a bonus. What happened to those who said if we make the playoffs than great, but a top 5 pick would benefit us more. Obviously everyone who said that was ****ing ************. Calm the **** down, stop trying to sell off whatever valuable pieces we have for what are the worst possible returns.
I'm still here , what? you want me to gloat that we got blown out 2 games in a row and lost good leads?

You want me to talk about the resemblance between this team and Dorothy's 4 companions?

No heart , No courage, No brains and some of them are flat out dogging it?

Ya wanna know what retarded is?

Retarded is btchn at folks that are crying now, the ones that fooled themselves into false hope, regarding this team and thinking they are the same folks that have been preaching the so called "tank" all along.

For the record, selling off players for picks and prospects is a major spoke in the "tank" wheel.

Dion is 27, in todays NHL thats the average age, "in their prime" so to speak. Does he look like a 6.5m "in their prime" player to you?

Kessel is so one dimensional he makes flat blush, he makes lazy cowards feel brave and energized.

I can't think of a worse example you want to set for your teammates. Sorry guys, i just want to zoom around the ice (well , once i finally get back into game shape, you can't expect me to show up ready to play do you?, I'm your star, i get THE treatment, don't ya know.) and score points , i have a phat contract to sign soon, me needs ta get paid, me needs da O #s dawg.

You all others, you lesser likes, you do the hitting and back checking , the grunt work for grunt pay, i just want to zoom around and gets paid.

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Old
01-27-2013, 07:21 AM
  #147
legendinblue
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Five games, 20 games, doesn't matter. It's the same story all over again. We've been there before, not once. No band aids this time, we need a long term fix.

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Old
01-27-2013, 07:26 AM
  #148
Mojo19
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Typical "the sky is falling" and "deflate for Nate" type of attitude after back to back Leafs losses.
It doesn't help that they led both games either haha.



The effort definitely wasn't there last night. Our top line needs to start getting it done. Phil is almost invisible out there.

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Old
01-27-2013, 07:32 AM
  #149
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Seguin, Hamilton and Knight would be doing squat the way this team is put together. With the way some of these so called Leaf fans behave, Seguin would have been labelled a bust and run out of town in his terrible rookie season -- probably by the same fellas who continue, day in and day out, in criticizing Kessel. How many points does Seguin have so far this season? Must be a bust.

Kessel is a great player, the best player in the trade, we simply need more great players.
Hamilton is 6 years younger than PK and is out scoring him.Not that it matters one bit.

Seguin is 5 years younger and not poised to be a UFA in 1.5 seasons.

I think your the only one that thinks those 2 should be leading the team out of the basement at that tender age.

Kessel was brought here to lead this expedited re-tool, so far, that has not worked out.

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01-27-2013, 07:35 AM
  #150
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A complete rebuild, always was and still is, the best way to go to make Toronto into a perennial contender.

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