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01-27-2013, 05:18 PM
  #101
Stop Winnin
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Originally Posted by Guess What View Post
That's exactly the thing. The same guy with roughly the same group, the message can get pretty stale. The message may or may not be as strong as it used to be. When Tom Renney was fired and replaced by John Tortorella, the Rangers were a really... really... offensively lacking, maybe even close to abysmal team. Full of all grinders and soon Gaborik. Call me out in whether or not this is true, but it seems like the message that Torts was sending was a hell of a lot different. Players put much more effort in, and more jam and heart was shown. Could the Sabres have the same reaction to a new coach? Yeah. Do we know for sure? No. Main point is if I was big front office brass, I'd start searching for some options that could be a potential help.
No other organization would allow the status quo this organization has gone through, and I'm not even talking about this year.

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01-27-2013, 05:18 PM
  #102
Daz28
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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
LOL no. 4 conference finals, 1 cup final. They had 3 years of missing hte playoffs after Hasek left and Biron proved not to be starter material, and they had 2 years after management was too cheap to re-sign Briere. They've been "bad" (near the bottom of the conference) an entire one time during his career here.

This is what I mean by constant hyperbole.
There's a possibility that a good deal of their success has been literally on the backs of the league's best net-minder. When Miller is great, and well, Hasek, they're winners. I'm not saying they should be 4th seeds with Trefilov in net, but I think it's quite possible many of those years with an average goalie it would have been an under performing club. If we had Dan Ellis and Enroth most of those years, it would have been obvious, and this year, I think we'd be in the basement with that duo. Heck, with Miller and payroll beyond the cap the last few season, we're kinda crappy. I'm pretty sure extending these guys on their past success may be a mistake.

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01-27-2013, 05:19 PM
  #103
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G- Meh

B- This Season

U- Looking at our starting roster this year, it's the worst roster I can remember the sabres having since...10 years or so ago. It's so bad it gives me a headache.

We really need to make some moves for this team. Gerbe and Ennis have all the speed and skill in the world but lack size. They easily get knocked off the puck. I'm not ready to give up on this season yet, but something needs to be done to this roster. Without Vanek our offense looks anemic.

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01-27-2013, 05:20 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by umbertovanek View Post
Awesome! Where do you get Stiegl in the U.S.? Not my favorite Austrian beer, but better than most of this weak sauce dishwater North Americans don't feel embarrassed to call "beer".

G: -Foligno playing like Foligno in the third.
-Me being able to watch a game without losing too much sleep.

B: - Face offs
- Lazy ass Vanek. Didn't notice the ol' fatty the whole game

U: - Some of the whining around here. First four games: "Lindy needs to break up all lines outside VHP!" Todays game: "This constant line juggling keeps the team from building chemistry!"
I live in Vancouver, Canada. We have lots of import beer out here. I usually buy Stiegl by the case, reminds me of my time in Salzburg, but it is pricey...good deal today, about 2 bucks a can.

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01-27-2013, 05:20 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
Gee, good team and they finish 1st in the entire NHL. Bad team and they finish out of the playoffs a couple times.

Go figure.
Were you happy with a presidents trophy? I know I wasn't. This team has one of the highest salaries in the NHL. They are built to win yet they don't.

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01-27-2013, 05:21 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by sba View Post
No, people are tired of the same boring team, the same excuses and the constant "Why do they look like they don't give a flying **** tonight?"
the fact that this has been a constant question for the past 2+ years, despite there being a lot of turnover with the roster, is one of the biggest reasons ruff needs to go

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01-27-2013, 05:21 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daz28 View Post
There's a possibility that a good deal of their success has been literally on the backs of the league's best net-minder. When Miller is great, and well, Hasek, they're winners. I'm not saying they should be 4th seeds with Trefilov in net, but I think it's quite possible many of those years with an average goalie it would have been an under performing club. If we had Dan Ellis and Enroth most of those years, it would have been obvious, and this year, I think we'd be in the basement with that duo. Heck, with Miller and payroll beyond the cap the last few season, we're kinda crappy. I'm pretty sure extending these guys on their past success may be a mistake.
Welcome to hockey. Good goaltending wins games. Bad goaltending can lose them.

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01-27-2013, 05:22 PM
  #108
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I've always thought Ruff over-used his elite goalies (Miller and Hasek) and was undeserving of the praise he got here in Buffalo.... after the lock out he changed from a defensive game style to an offensive game style which was great at the time..... the rosters were made for those types..... the roster now isn't made for that and Ruff just looks bad.... Who is coaching the defense?? Because they are playing terribly. Who is coaching the forwards because it just seems they don't want it as hard as the other team. Ruff's scheme is failing is in the Sabres and his inability to change it has cost the Sabres the last few years.... just look at the most recent playoffs.

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01-27-2013, 05:23 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
Welcome to hockey. Good goaltending wins games. Bad goaltending can lose them.
So why doesn't lindy become a goalie coach since goalies are the only good we've had the past 15 years

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01-27-2013, 05:23 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
Were you happy with a presidents trophy? I know I wasn't. This team has one of the highest salaries in the NHL. They are built to win yet they don't.
During that season? Of course I was. They were winning more than any other team in the NHL. How could you not? Did you just not watch games during that regular season? There's a reason they say you should enjoy the ride while it's happening.

The playoffs are a different beast where anything can happen in a 7 game series, and contrary to popular opinion, the two playoff series with Ottawa from 05-07 were both very, very close series where both teams won one.

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01-27-2013, 05:23 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
Were you happy with a presidents trophy? I know I wasn't. This team has one of the highest salaries in the NHL. They are built to win yet they don't.
Try winning two in a row and then getting bounced in the first round....#canucks

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01-27-2013, 05:25 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by zbubble View Post
Speaking as a Bills fan that's missed the playoffs for 13 years now, the basement ain't all what it's cracked up to be.
I'm pretty sure w/o the infusion of Terry Pegula we'd be pretty close to where we're at with the Bills psychologically. Even with TP, it seems we may be heading in that direction(the love affair is wearing off as far as on ice product goes). Miller isn't getting any younger either, and his contract is coming up. Lose him, and I think whoever replaces him will pretty much be our Fitzpatrick.

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01-27-2013, 05:25 PM
  #113
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I'd love to see HBO 24/7 series with the Sabres and Ruff, it's too bad they didn't do it when we had the Winter Classic. Watching the Pitt/Philly series, it seemed like the players all loved their coach and bought into what they were saying, I feel like our players wouldn't express the same feelings towards Ruff. I really don't recall any players in the past 5 years giving Ruff any praise actually. The interviews at the end of last season made it seem like they weren't fond of him really. If your players don't believe in the coach then you have no chance at success.

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01-27-2013, 05:25 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
During that season? Of course I was. They were winning more than any other team in the NHL. How could you not? Did you just not watch games during that regular season? There's a reason they say you should enjoy the ride while it's happening.

The playoffs are a different beast where anything can happen in a 7 game series, and contrary to popular opinion, the two playoff series with Ottawa from 05-07 were both very, very close series where both teams won one.
Sure presidents trophies are nice but I'd take one cup over a hundred presidents trophies

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01-27-2013, 05:25 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheyAreGoodScaryGood View Post
So why doesn't lindy become a goalie coach since goalies are the only good we've had the past 15 years
Again with the ridiculously dumb hyperbole. The 05-06 and 06-07 teams were only good because of goaltending?

Fact is those Sabres teams under Hasek as well as the 09-10 team that won the division had solid team defenses that limited high quality chances. Goaltenders are an important piece, but they also can't do it all on their own.

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01-27-2013, 05:26 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
Again with the ridiculously dumb hyperbole. The 05-06 and 06-07 teams were only good because of goaltending?

Fact is those Sabres teams under Hasek as well as the 09-10 team that won the division had solid team defenses that limited high quality chances. Goaltenders are an important piece, but they also can't do it all on their own.
Millers had some good defences, but Hasek often did do it on his own

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01-27-2013, 05:27 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Beerz View Post
Or worse.
Sounds like you fit right in. You sure you're not Ruff?

We won't win anything without taking chances, but I'm glad you're smarter than us all and can prove us wrong.

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01-27-2013, 05:27 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
Welcome to hockey. Good goaltending wins games. Bad goaltending can lose them.
That's not what I said, I pretty much said they're successful when riding a Vezina goalie only. Even with the Vezina goalie's, still no cup, and only one appearance. What's NJ done with their Vezina goalie??

Hasek goes to DET, what happens?

If Millsie wants his cup, guess what might happen? Hopefully he can't put this scenario together.

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01-27-2013, 05:29 PM
  #119
Layne Staley
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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
Well, we won a president's trophy and have been near the leaders in points a couple of other times, so I would say we've been closer to elite more often than "bad".
No, no we are not closer to elite then bad, not even CLOSE.Without Hasek Lindy Ruff has won a total of 4 playoff rounds in 10 seasons.That is ****ing pathetic.FOUR PLAYOFF ROUND VICTORIES IN TEN SEASONS AFTER HASEK LEFT.The Cup winning team every year wins 4 playoff rounds and we are supposed to be happy with that amount spread over TEN ****ING SEASONS?!?

We were elite for just 2 seasons and that was with everything falling in place (luckily built roster,rule changes etc).Lindy Ruff is a loser coach, his best 2 years were arguably his first 2, and he had the best goalie in the history of the game during that time frame.You think Ruff is overly worried about his results?He knows damn well he is untouchable as long as "Papa" Pegula aka Ruff's biggest fan and his best buddy Darcy Regier are still around.He shows no emotion and has no ideas on how to fix this team.

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01-27-2013, 05:30 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Layne Staley View Post
No, no we are not closer to elite then bad, not even CLOSE.Without Hasek Lindy Ruff has won a total of 4 playoff rounds in 10 seasons.That is ****ing pathetic.FOUR PLAYOFF ROUND VICTORIES IN TEN SEASONS AFTER HASEK LEFT.The Cup winning team every year wins 4 playoff rounds and we are supposed to be happy with that amount spread over TEN ****ING SEASONS?!?

We were elite for just 2 seasons and that was with everything falling in place (luckily built roster,rule changes etc).Lindy Ruff is a loser coach, his best 2 years were arguably his first 2, and he had the best goalie in the history of the game during that time frame.
Again, we're talking about his entire career here, and yes, we have been FACTUALLY closer to elite more often than bad during his career here.

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01-27-2013, 05:31 PM
  #121
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Again, I'm not opposed to getting rid of Ruff. At the same time, the lengths the usual suspects are going to to downgrade what he's done in Buffalo is not something I'm going to just sit and not say anything about. It's petty.

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01-27-2013, 05:32 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by Fire Lindy View Post
I'd love to see HBO 24/7 series with the Sabres and Ruff, it's too bad they didn't do it when we had the Winter Classic. Watching the Pitt/Philly series, it seemed like the players all loved their coach and bought into what they were saying, I feel like our players wouldn't express the same feelings towards Ruff. I really don't recall any players in the past 5 years giving Ruff any praise actually. The interviews at the end of last season made it seem like they weren't fond of him really. If your players don't believe in the coach then you have no chance at success.
This is probably the closest you'll get:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yJkK...ature=youtu.be

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Old
01-27-2013, 05:33 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by indigoo View Post
Sounds like you fit right in. You sure you're not Ruff?

We won't win anything without taking chances, but I'm glad you're smarter than us all and can prove us wrong.
Pretty much. Taking chances is how teams win games even. Taking chances can result in either way, but staleness may very well be a problem here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daz28 View Post
That's not what I said, I pretty much said they're successful when riding a Vezina goalie only. Even with the Vezina goalie's, still no cup, and only one appearance. What's NJ done with their Vezina goalie??

Hasek goes to DET, what happens?

If Millsie wants his cup, guess what might happen? Hopefully he can't put this scenario together.
Hasek wins cups when he goes over, even though he was getting on in age. Brodeur has a rather nice collection, and 3 cups, could've been 4 if they came all the way back. NJ built around Brodeur, Stevens, Daneyko and Neidermayer. Lou and Lemaire, even Sutter did an amazing job keeping it together and almost being tops every year in the division and conference.

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01-27-2013, 05:34 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by jflory81 View Post
and yes, we have been FACTUALLY closer to elite more often than bad during his career here.
Because of his coaching and system?
Because Darcy has made the right moves?
Because he had top 3 or better goaltending?

Which of these 3 do you feel is most likely.
Which of these 3 would most drastically change the team if changed?

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01-27-2013, 05:37 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Daz28 View Post
Because of his coaching and system?
Because Darcy has made the right moves?
Because he had top 3 or better goaltending?

Which of these 3 do you feel is most likely.
Which of these 3 would most drastically change the team if changed?
I'm sorry, this is ridiculous. Everything that goes wrong is Ruff's fault, everything that has gone right in his tenure is because he was put in a great situation.

Whatever.

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