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Will the Detroit Red Wings be a powerhouse team again?

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Old
01-27-2013, 02:32 PM
  #26
Zetterberg4Captain
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Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
But Nashville was ALWAYS going to match. If teams didn't match them you'd see a bunch of offer sheets being handed out. Philly has tried this a few times and failed every time. They gain nothing by driving up Weber's contract to the Preds, they'll never play the Preds. I admire what they tried to do but its a waste of time.
They certainly didnt gain the player, weber, that they wanted too, but doing nothing definetly made sure they werent getting him

teams ahvent always matched, yes generally they do/will, but if the team is up against the cap or you price a player beyond that teams comfort level chances are decent they may not

i see what you're saying but to me, doing nothing is the only true waste of time

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01-27-2013, 03:28 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zetterberg4Captain View Post
They certainly didnt gain the player, weber, that they wanted too, but doing nothing definetly made sure they werent getting him

teams ahvent always matched, yes generally they do/will, but if the team is up against the cap or you price a player beyond that teams comfort level chances are decent they may not

i see what you're saying but to me, doing nothing is the only true waste of time
It's not a waste of time if not signing him to an offer sheet is the only likely way of getting him. everyone's best bet was for Weber to sign as short a deal as possible and test the UFA waters. Then either sign him during that summer, or see if Nashville would have been willing to move him at the deadline.

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01-27-2013, 03:33 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by mindfly View Post
For how long do you think the mediocrity will last? It's been 3½ years already (09/10 season) of pure "meh".

Do you think they will need to re-build as many of the current powerhouse teams have done... Sucking, getting high draft picks etc?

How do you see this unfold?

I remember "a few" seasons ago and you could be 90% sure that the wings would win a certain game. Now they're more or less a .500 team. How the mighty have fallen
Detroit was in first place in the league last year in February.... So

This team has its flaws but this is the first time I think we will struggle to be a contender without a decent amount of luck. People saying this has been happening for more than just this first couple weeks are lying to themselves. You can say there was slippage and they were heading here. But they were absolutely contenders and very large ones.

We will see how this team looks if it can ever get fully healthy. I don't think it will be big time contenders unless Smith and Kindl grow a lot.

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01-27-2013, 04:36 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
If teams didn't match them you'd see a bunch of offer sheets being handed out.
They don't get handed out because Devellano and the bosses have an "unwritten rule that you don't do that."

Straight from the horse's mouth, Heaton.

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01-27-2013, 04:40 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by icKx View Post
They don't get handed out because Devellano and the bosses have an "unwritten rule that you don't do that."

Straight from the horse's mouth, Heaton.
And they also don't get handed out because they always get matched.

The only player ever to sign an offer sheet and the other team not match was Dustin Penner. So sure, it's better than 'nothing' but it's a waste of time. It's like being unemployed and sending resumes to a place that has only hired one person in the past decade, better than nothing - still a waste of time.

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01-27-2013, 04:43 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
And they also don't get handed out because they always get matched.

The only player ever to sign an offer sheet and the other team not match was Dustin Penner. So sure, it's better than 'nothing' but it's a waste of time. It's like being unemployed and sending resumes to a place that has only hired one person in the past decade, better than nothing - still a waste of time.
We don't know that they would always be matched. There's not enough of a sample size because the gentleman's agreement stifles offers.

You can't extrapolate free market outcomes from monopoly behavior.

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01-27-2013, 06:55 PM
  #32
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There is no harm in trying to sign a Weber.
Weber would have been EXACTLY what we needed.
A big, talented, physical defenseman who shoots right and plays in every situation.

Maybe everyone knew Nashville would offer. But you gotta believe that Nashville thought twice.

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01-27-2013, 06:57 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by The Fading Captain View Post
There is no harm in trying to sign a Weber.
Weber would have been EXACTLY what we needed.
A big, talented, physical defenseman who shoots right and plays in every situation.

Maybe everyone knew Nashville would offer. But you gotta believe that Nashville thought twice.
what?

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01-27-2013, 07:04 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Zetterberg4Captain View Post
the philly weber offer sheet to me was a brillant attempt by Philly

had Nashville not matched the picks Phily would have given up have probably about a 1% chance of ever actually developing into the next Shea Weber, that is too say Nashville may have gotten a bunch of Martin Erats but no Shea Webers

Just look at detroits last 3 first round picks. I would trade all 3 in a heartbeat for Shea Weber without even thinking twice and thats basically what it amounts too.

Teams dont do it moreso for moral reasons whereby they all belong to the same boys club all wanting to win but not by stepping on each others toes, sometimes however, its ok to ruffle up those feathers
Nashville was never not going to match that though,especially after losing Suter

the Flyers would have been better off waiting and trying to get him in free agency,in reality all that offer sheet accomplished for Philly was screwing over their chances at Weber

it was an idiot move not a brilliant one

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01-27-2013, 07:14 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by The Fading Captain View Post
This team has very important and potentially difficult decisions to make on Howard and Flip.

What if these guys want $5M a year? Do you pay it?

How do you improve your D when you spend that kind of money?
Flip is a good player, and pretty valuable to this team. But one reason I would have loved both Nyquist and Tatar to have full seasons with the Wings is to get an idea if either guy could potentially come close to replicating Flip's production.

Say Tatar or Nyquist had a good year scoring and played responsible hockey in their own end- might make sense to promote that guy to Flip's spot, let another team pay Flip $5m+, and use that saved cap space (our favorite player ) on a UFA or, more likely, trade for a high priced D-man and absorb his salary.

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01-27-2013, 08:53 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
And they also don't get handed out because they always get matched.

The only player ever to sign an offer sheet and the other team not match was Dustin Penner. So sure, it's better than 'nothing' but it's a waste of time. It's like being unemployed and sending resumes to a place that has only hired one person in the past decade, better than nothing - still a waste of time.
Scott Stevens?
Brendan Shanahan?

I'm not in favor of offer sheets unless it's the kind of situation Montreal was in before buying out Gomez - a ~$4.75m, 2+ year deal to Subban would not have been matchable due to their cap issues for next year. Obviously that's no longer an option.

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01-27-2013, 09:52 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by mindfly View Post
Definition of powerhouse team of the NHL in 2013 is Chicago Blackhawks. Look at their top6 forwards and top4 D.
Six games into the season... Let's not give them the Cup just yet. Guys will get injured. Their top players will run cold eventually.

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01-27-2013, 11:14 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by joe89 View Post
But let's pretend we get those two additions I was talking about. I'll use the big dogs from last year's free agency.

Parise-Datsyuk-Filppula
Franzen-Zetterberg-Brunner

Suter-White
Kronwall-Smith/Ericsson

That'd look a lot like a top team. Basically Parise instead of Sammy/Bert and Suter instead of Quincey. Makes quite the difference. Then you could add a 4C at the deadline.
Oh Really?

Minny is 2-2-1 right now like us, with us beating them. So is Minny a top team?

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01-27-2013, 11:49 PM
  #39
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Oh Really?

Minny is 2-2-1 right now like us, with us beating them. So is Minny a top team?
Minnesota has Datsyuk and Zetterberg?

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01-27-2013, 11:50 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by redwings85 View Post
I personally think Detroit can be that powerhouse this year. They have the players (aside from the defense core that needs a bit of work). But the forward core for the wings is quite talented they really just need to utilize their strengths and play with heart and grit. They need to stop playing lazy hockey, and get back to the dominate selfs back in 02/08 even 09. Can their be improvements? Most certainly. But I see the improvements being players on the current roster an the performance given. Ill give it a few more games its only been 4 games I'm not going to press the panic button yet.

Really if you've seen the Chicago games they got a bit lucky to win 2/3 of the games. St. Louis again close calls on their behalf as well. Hell even the sharks have been **** lucky. This entire season from the get go has really been weird and wonky. This will settle very very soon and the "real" teams will show up soon.
This thread isn't optimistic; it's downright delusional.

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01-28-2013, 09:48 AM
  #41
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Few injuries, only 5 games played. Overall the play hasnt been that bad at all. I think they will be a potentional champ once again and wouldnt really worry at all if I was detroit fan.

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01-28-2013, 10:04 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by mindfly View Post
Powerhouse team is also a fully healthy Vancouver Canucks, San Jose Sharks, St.Louis Blues, Pittsburgh Penguins.
And besides the Penguins, who have not won in four years, none of those "powerhouse" teams you've listed have won a title recently.

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01-28-2013, 11:28 AM
  #43
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The Wings might have been the lone powerhouse the last 20 years. There is no powerhouse in this league today other than the Pens, who are a powerhouse in the making.

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01-28-2013, 01:04 PM
  #44
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The Wings might have been the lone powerhouse the last 20 years. There is no powerhouse in this league today other than the Pens, who are a powerhouse in the making.
Chicago has a great nucleus. Can they keep it together while adhering to the salary cap? The thing we are missing that both those franchises have is elite talent that is just coming into its prime. That will be our challenge going forward.

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01-28-2013, 01:06 PM
  #45
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And besides the Penguins, who have not won in four years, none of those "powerhouse" teams you've listed have won a title recently.
The Sharks are getting old quickly and look like those Sens teams that were brilliant during the regular season but never won a title. The Nucks are in that same position. The Blues are just coming into their own and have a great nucleus of young, high end talent.

Chicago and Pittsburgh are poised to be good for a long time so long as they can navigate the salary cap without losing too much talent.

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01-28-2013, 01:07 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by 14ari13 View Post
The Wings might have been the lone powerhouse the last 20 years. There is no powerhouse in this league today other than the Pens, who are a powerhouse in the making.
oilers are gonna have ALOT of firepower within the next few years

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01-28-2013, 02:07 PM
  #47
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Will the Detroit Red Wings be a powerhouse team again?
Will the sun ever burn out?

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01-28-2013, 02:56 PM
  #48
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Powerhouse teams are extinct. The cap has destroyed any chance of any team having a ton of talent. The Wings are now just another tadpole swimming in a pond of mediocrity and parity. Bettman's dream of a playoffs without the Wings will come true very soon. I won't be surprised if they are out of the playoff hunt in the next 2 weeks. Even if they tank which apparently they are doing, it will take years for any draft picks to become viable stars and for the Wings to get enough of them to be a contender. Trades and Free Agents are becoming increasingly rare just like the NFL. Even if trades are available to be made Detroit doesn't have the assets to acquire star quality talent unless it is just a side step. Nyquist and Tatar are not going to sweep in a save us. That notion is absurd. Apparently neither has been able to even outshine Dan Cleary and EARN a spot. The idea that Holland and Babs are holding these kids back in spite of them already being superstars who deserve a spot is ridiculous. They obviously don't believe they are ready to come up and make an impact and I trust their judgement. Welcome to the new NHL where every team sucks and every team gets to have the cup for a year.

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Old
01-28-2013, 03:12 PM
  #49
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The Sharks are getting old quickly and look like those Sens teams that were brilliant during the regular season but never won a title. The Nucks are in that same position. The Blues are just coming into their own and have a great nucleus of young, high end talent.

Chicago and Pittsburgh are poised to be good for a long time so long as they can navigate the salary cap without losing too much talent.
The Blues have a lot of very good talent, outside of Alex Pietrangelo and Tarasenko not much of it is elite. Hard working absolutely, But Oshie, Backes and Perron are unlikely to be true superstars.

Pittsburgh has the same playoff track record as us since making back to back finals. The Hawks are coming off two first round knock outs. They both have a ton of elite talent, but have had problems bringing it every night and have pulled fades the last couple of years. When they are on they are tough to beat, but they aren't on top of their games nearly as much as people want to believe.

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01-28-2013, 03:14 PM
  #50
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oilers are gonna have ALOT of firepower within the next few years
The Oilers are going to have to pay that talent and find a goaltender.

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