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P.K. Subban resigns with Montreal, Jan. 28 (post #1)

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Old
01-27-2013, 03:14 PM
  #551
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Wasn't he 5th last year?
4th last year. Also remember a ton of stuff about him not being top 3. The kid is a stud. And the best is he is so young.

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01-27-2013, 03:43 PM
  #552
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Id say Id think about it, not a definite. It's not very often you can get a franchise caliber defenseman and as we know the Flyers havent had the best success in developing them. Though i doubt Holmgren is crazy enough for a trade like that.
If anyone is crazy enough for stuff like this it is Homer.

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01-27-2013, 05:39 PM
  #553
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in the end

smart drafting and trading can lead us to the promised land. every hockey expert and their dog is handing the cup to chicago. not me, and my dog agrees. their was 1 slick move pulled in the offseason by san jose. trading for brad stuart from detroit. i need to contact my bookie and throw some $$$ on the sharks. and then their is the flyers. we trade for steve emminger. and to make it worse, washington drafts john calrson. john carlson could-should have fallen into our laps. i just hope we make the right decisions. the way luke schenn is playing is very pleasant. our injuries on d is worrysome.

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01-27-2013, 11:50 PM
  #554
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Outside of Voracek and B. Schenn, Giroux's play has been horrible. He looks disinterested at times. He frustration is obvious.

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01-27-2013, 11:59 PM
  #555
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Outside of Voracek and B. Schenn, Giroux's play has been horrible. He looks disinterested at times. He frustration is obvious.
Id be frustrated too if I was surrounded by what hes surrounded with. G is a playmaker, he needs guys around him that can either A. get him the puck, or B. when he gets someone else the puck, someone that can put it in the net. This team is in need of some serious offensive infusion. Lets face it, they have a team full of 3rd liners. I love Talbot, Schenn, Fedotenko, and guys like that. Championship teams need to have guys like that on their roster, but they also need a top 6 of guys that have offensive talent, which this team now lacks. Yes, they need Hartnell back, but they really need proven guys that can do things like score goals, break through the neutral zone with something resembling puck control, and adjust to smothering defense. As the team is put together now, they have no shot against any team that plays a tight-checking game (TB,NJ).

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01-28-2013, 12:50 AM
  #556
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Id be frustrated too if I was surrounded by what hes surrounded with. G is a playmaker, he needs guys around him that can either A. get him the puck, or B. when he gets someone else the puck, someone that can put it in the net. This team is in need of some serious offensive infusion. Lets face it, they have a team full of 3rd liners. I love Talbot, Schenn, Fedotenko, and guys like that. Championship teams need to have guys like that on their roster, but they also need a top 6 of guys that have offensive talent, which this team now lacks. Yes, they need Hartnell back, but they really need proven guys that can do things like score goals, break through the neutral zone with something resembling puck control, and adjust to smothering defense. As the team is put together now, they have no shot against any team that plays a tight-checking game (TB,NJ).
This. Use our first to draft a defenseman. Use necessary assets to get G a legit winger. Make a play for Corey perry.

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01-28-2013, 01:11 AM
  #557
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This. Use our first to draft a defenseman. Use necessary assets to get G a legit winger. Make a play for Corey perry.
Flyers don't have any unnecessary assets. They arrogantly spent a few years squandering them without thinking of the cumulative, long-term implications.

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01-28-2013, 05:28 AM
  #558
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Flyers don't have any unnecessary assets. They arrogantly spent a few years squandering them without thinking of the cumulative, long-term implications.
Right. If not for the Richards and Carter trades that brought in multiple pieces each, the reckless giveaway of picks and prospects that has been drying out this organization for years would have already forced a complete rebuild.

Homer bought some time opting for those two big trades, but we have now reached a point where there are no levers left to change the direction of this team.

You let Jagr and Carle walk? You better have something up you sleeve to compensate for the loss because you won't find an equal replacement in free agency and you don't have any pieces to trade for. Homer is with his back against the wall already!

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01-28-2013, 06:12 AM
  #559
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Originally Posted by mikedeej97 View Post
Id be frustrated too if I was surrounded by what hes surrounded with. G is a playmaker, he needs guys around him that can either A. get him the puck, or B. when he gets someone else the puck, someone that can put it in the net. This team is in need of some serious offensive infusion. Lets face it, they have a team full of 3rd liners. I love Talbot, Schenn, Fedotenko, and guys like that. Championship teams need to have guys like that on their roster, but they also need a top 6 of guys that have offensive talent, which this team now lacks. Yes, they need Hartnell back, but they really need proven guys that can do things like score goals, break through the neutral zone with something resembling puck control, and adjust to smothering defense. As the team is put together now, they have no shot against any team that plays a tight-checking game (TB,NJ).
This is a young team. They are counting on B. Schenn and Couturier taking the next step this year but both are suffering from the sophomore slump, just like Richards, Carter, and Giroux did before them. If you look at the teams that are having success out of the lockout, it is veteran teams like San Jose while teams like Edmonton and the Flyers are struggling. This teams "window" really doesn't open until next year at the earliest, but probably the year after when Schenn and Couturier are in their 4th year, traditional when players put it together.

As far as struggling against tight checking teams, a lot of blame goes to Laviolette. His record against the Rangers, Devils, and Lightening for three years now has stunk, whether it was with Richards, Carter, and Pronger or the current roster. He has not had an answer to their systems with the only change up was having the defensemen stall the puck as a protest against the 1-3-1. The trap has been around long enough now that any smart coach should be able to attack it.

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01-28-2013, 09:04 AM
  #560
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Originally Posted by Norm MacDonald View Post
Flyers don't have any unnecessary assets. They arrogantly spent a few years squandering them without thinking of the cumulative, long-term implications.
I didn't say unnecessary assets. I said necessary. Meaning whatever it takes to get perry.

Voracek, Cousins and a 2nd for an unsigned perry sounds good.

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01-28-2013, 09:39 AM
  #561
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Right. If not for the Richards and Carter trades that brought in multiple pieces each, the reckless giveaway of picks and prospects that has been drying out this organization for years would have already forced a complete rebuild.

Homer bought some time opting for those two big trades, but we have now reached a point where there are no levers left to change the direction of this team.

You let Jagr and Carle walk? You better have something up you sleeve to compensate for the loss because you won't find an equal replacement in free agency and you don't have any pieces to trade for. Homer is with his back against the wall already!
The Flyers went all in with Richards and Carter with the Pronger trade and failed. They then decided to rebuild last year. That takes time and patience. Trading any significant assets will be going all in again and then you have things like the Eminger trade, Carle trade and Pronger trades; all trades to acquire nhl now defensemen instead of drafting, developing, and living thru growing pains. Just think, if the Flyers were patient you could have John Carlson, Luca Sbisa, and John Moore in the system now. The Flyers are a borderline playoff team this year with a significantly brighter future if they can add a piece or two in the future without subtracting.

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01-28-2013, 10:15 AM
  #562
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Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
The Flyers went all in with Richards and Carter with the Pronger trade and failed. They then decided to rebuild last year. That takes time and patience. Trading any significant assets will be going all in again and then you have things like the Eminger trade, Carle trade and Pronger trades; all trades to acquire nhl now defensemen instead of drafting, developing, and living thru growing pains. Just think, if the Flyers were patient you could have John Carlson, Luca Sbisa, and John Moore in the system now. The Flyers are a borderline playoff team this year with a significantly brighter future if they can add a piece or two in the future without subtracting.
you cant say every young player homer drafts or gets, is going to be a superstar, they could end up like jvr for all we know. if these young players do nothing, they have to get rid of them to make this team better otherwise this team will end up the oilers and islanders.

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01-28-2013, 10:19 AM
  #563
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Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I didn't say unnecessary assets. I said necessary. Meaning whatever it takes to get perry.

Voracek, Cousins and a 2nd for an unsigned perry sounds good.
So giving up a young current top-6 winger (and former 7th overall pick), a second round pick who is developing just fine and a future 2nd for one player who may just walk away unsigned sounds good?

Yes, Perry is a real good player but the whole procedure sounds very risky to me.
What if he doesn't want to sign? What if he demands crazy money/terms?

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01-28-2013, 11:02 AM
  #564
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you cant say every young player homer drafts or gets, is going to be a superstar, they could end up like jvr for all we know. if these young players do nothing, they have to get rid of them to make this team better otherwise this team will end up the oilers and islanders.
You're right but what young players are doing nothing? B.Schenn had over 12 goals in the 2nd half last year and is struggling in a sophomore slump, which is very common. Same as Couturier. Voracek got fat during the lockout but was one of the teams best forwards in the playoffs. You wouldn't be getting the true value of these players back in a trade. At this point, the Flyers would have to make a Carter + for Kaberle like deal that was rumored years ago.

As far as the draft, not everyone does make it to be a superstar. But that is the only guarenteed place to get them. Few great players make it to free agency and as you saw last year, it is a crap shoot to get them. A no team is trading a great in their prime defensemen unless you break the bank in a trade offer, completely depleting the teams depth.

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01-28-2013, 11:17 AM
  #565
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So pretty sure Holmer will attempt to get PK, any scenario we can get him while keeping Couts ?

Brayden/Jake, Cousins, Gus ?

Or does Couts have to be included ?

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01-28-2013, 12:00 PM
  #566
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You're right but what young players are doing nothing? B.Schenn had over 12 goals in the 2nd half last year and is struggling in a sophomore slump, which is very common. Same as Couturier. Voracek got fat during the lockout but was one of the teams best forwards in the playoffs. You wouldn't be getting the true value of these players back in a trade. At this point, the Flyers would have to make a Carter + for Kaberle like deal that was rumored years ago.
ok, what makes you think schenn and courts are so better than malkin and crosby? if that's what you believe. you dont think maybe the high scoring stuff for one year was just a fluke, if not they should be tearing it up in the second season, there's no excuses, either you are good or you're not, right now, they are not good players.

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01-28-2013, 12:05 PM
  #567
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Something to keep in mind: Subban may have ready received various offer sheets on the hush-hush and we wouldn't know.

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01-28-2013, 12:09 PM
  #568
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Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
ok, what makes you think schenn and courts are so better than malkin and crosby? if that's what you believe. you dont think maybe the high scoring stuff for one year was just a fluke, if not they should be tearing it up in the second season, there's no excuses, either you are good or you're not, right now, they are not good players.
I might have missed it, but please point out where he said that. Their hitting a sophmore slump which happens to about 70% of the rookies.

Landeskog on the Aves has 1 goal in 4 games. They should trade him right? RNH has only 3 assists, he should be traded too right?

Who should trade all our young guys for?

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01-28-2013, 12:16 PM
  #569
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ok, what makes you think schenn and courts are so better than malkin and crosby? if that's what you believe. you dont think maybe the high scoring stuff for one year was just a fluke, if not they should be tearing it up in the second season, there's no excuses, either you are good or you're not, right now, they are not good players.
Claude Giroux only had 16 goals and 47 pts in his 2nd season. He is obviously not good and should have been traded back then.

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01-28-2013, 12:38 PM
  #570
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you cant say every young player homer drafts or gets, is going to be a superstar, they could end up like jvr for all we know. if these young players do nothing, they have to get rid of them to make this team better otherwise this team will end up the oilers and islanders.
He didn't say anything like that.

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01-28-2013, 04:07 PM
  #571
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**** it, we need subban.

Voracek, Laughton and a 1st for Subban.

then this next season

FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Corey Perry ($6.000m)
Danny Briere ($6.500m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Tye McGinn ($0.775m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Michael Handzus ($1.500m) / Tom Sestito ($0.666m)

DEFENSEMEN
Braydon Coburn ($4.500m) / P.K. Subban ($5.750m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.950m)
Bruno Gervais ($0.825m) /

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.667m)
Anton Khudobin ($0.975m)
BUYOUTS
Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,904,667; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $5,195,333

then when we need to re-sign Giroux and Couturier etc. you can Amnesty or trade Briere and Mez. Mez can be replaced.

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01-28-2013, 04:28 PM
  #572
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**** it, we need subban.

Voracek, Laughton and a 1st for Subban.
Doesn't do it.

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01-28-2013, 04:33 PM
  #573
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Doesn't do it.
Voracek, Laughton, Gostisbehere, 1st in 2013, 3rd in 2013

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01-28-2013, 04:46 PM
  #574
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No way I would give up Jake, Laughton and a first for Subban.

That's just nuts.

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01-28-2013, 05:02 PM
  #575
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No way I would give up Jake, Laughton and a first for Subban.
That's just nuts.
Really ? I would jump so quick on that deal, no chance Montreal does though.

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