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This team will not succeed as long as David Desharnais is a top 6 center.

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01-21-2013, 02:28 PM
  #276
habs03
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Originally Posted by Ginu View Post
How does that make any sense? We shouldn't move DD because we don't have any other good players for other lines? Is this a one-line sport?
Well ppl seem to be saying that DD is only good because he plays with Patches and Cole, and that leaves other plays to play with nobody. What I'm saying is why not try to add players to play with Plek and Eller instead of moving DD.

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01-21-2013, 02:28 PM
  #277
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Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
I'm not sure it really effects the rest of the line-up though. I don't think anyone can be sure because we don't know what he can do with say Bourque. I really think the 1st line should be split up so we can maybe win some games and so people can see that Desharnais can produce with other players - or maybe I'll get a rude awakening and realize he's not as good as I thought (although I don't believe that).

I like you're line-up, although, I'd really love to get Armstrong out of the line-up and add an offensive winger to the 3rd line. Unfortunately, we really don't have another offensive minded type player besides Gallagher. And it's hard to fit both him and Gally into the Top-9.

I think I'd shuffle all the wingers though. Pacioretty and Bourque, and then Bourque and Desharnais.


We still have one buyout left. Although that would be really harsh, obviously.

I'm betting Kaberle is more moveable though, assuming he puts up 35-points, than Gionta would be at 45-points.

As for trying Desharnais at wing? I'm fine with trying anyone at wing.. Galchenyuk, Plekanec, Desharnais, Eller.. so long as we can figure out our winger problem. I, personally, think we can win with Desharnais as a Top-6 center if we had the winger depth. We don't, so we need to try something. Gionta as a 3rd liner would actually look really good.
DD is an elite passer. He can pass on his backhand or fire cross-ice passes from his off-wing. It didn't hurt Cole to be on the right wing. He shoots left as well.

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01-21-2013, 02:29 PM
  #278
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Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
I think he means we should focus on fixing the Top-6 rather then getting rid of one of the productive pieces.
Yup.

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01-21-2013, 02:40 PM
  #279
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
You are exactly right. Good summary of another portion of my concerns. I don't know if size is necessarily what kept Pleks and Gio from playing well together, but something about it just kept them from turning into a consistently effective combination.
In the past two seasons 14 and 21 are +3 together and outshoot opponents by a 53-47 ratio. They get played as the teams top defensive line when together.

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Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
Wouldn't it be better to get rid of the 34-year old, 45-point, almost UFA, Brian Gionta who makes $5M instead of the young, RFA, still learning, very creative center who will probably cost us $3M at most?

IMO, Gionta is basically a mid level 2nd line RW, but would be better suited on the 3rd line on a winning club.

What this team needs is wingers. We have two top-6 caliber wingers. And only one of them are young.

If we could move Pleks, DD, or Eller for a really good Top-6 winger that's young, pull the trigger. Otherwise, don't let DD go because he'll make more than $1M or waive him like suggest earlier in this thread.

We can win with DD in the Top-6. We can't win (consistently) with 2 horrible top-6 wingers.
After 2009-10 gionta's PP scoring dried up but he's been the winger most consistently on the ice when the Habs have been out shooting and out scoring the opposition while being the team's top two-way winger. A guy that drives play to his extent is a top six winger on pretty much any team.

The collapse of the Habs 5 on 5 game last year, after the were very good to start, directly co incised with losing Gionta injury.

He might be expendable due to age but Gionya has been solid for the Habs.

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01-21-2013, 02:45 PM
  #280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Talks to Goalposts View Post
In the past two seasons 14 and 21 are +3 together and outshoot opponents by a 53-47 ratio. They get played as the teams top defensive line when together.



After 2009-10 gionta's PP scoring dried up but he's been the winger most consistently on the ice when the Habs have been out shooting and out scoring the opposition while being the team's top two-way winger. A guy that drives play to his extent is a top six winger on pretty much any team.

The collapse of the Habs 5 on 5 game last year, after the were very good to start, directly co incised with losing Gionta injury.

He might be expendable due to age but Gionya has been solid for the Habs.
Don't get me wrong, I like Gionta a lot. Always have.

Outshooting comes as no surprise though since Gionta is the modern day Jan Bulis, except a little better. Logo hunter.

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01-21-2013, 02:48 PM
  #281
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
In 10-11

6 of his goals where scored when tied, 5 were scored when team was trailing by 1 goal, 10 goals when team was only leading by 1, and 6 game winning goals.

21 of his goals were key situations.

in 09-10

6 goals when trailing by 1, 10 goals when the game is tied, 4 goals when leading by 1.

20 key goals in key

http://www.nhl.com/ice/player.htm?id...010&gameType=2

Yup non factor goals
Again, bring up stats all you want. I know what I see, Gionta is most of the time a non-factor. Atleast hes good defensively though. He's a third liner and should be playing on the third line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
I think he means we should focus on fixing the Top-6 rather then getting rid of one of the productive pieces.
Thing is we can't fix anything without A)Movig parts we dont want to move. B)Disband the first line.

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01-21-2013, 03:22 PM
  #282
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Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
Don't get me wrong, I like Gionta a lot. Always have.

Outshooting comes as no surprise though since Gionta is the modern day Jan Bulis, except a little better. Logo hunter.
He converts at about the same rate as Pacioretty and Plekanec. About average for a good forward. that you see him hit the logo a lot is mark of how many chances he generates.

That constant out shooting also leads to consistent out scoring.

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01-28-2013, 01:49 PM
  #283
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Canadiens will never win the cup with Desharnais playing on the top six and Desharnais cannot play on the bottom six.

Top two centers going forward must be Galchenyuk and Plekanec.

Desharnais will get his chance but the writing is on the wall for him.. he will go the same road as Ribiero... shipped out west to a team that needs a cheap second line center.

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01-28-2013, 02:26 PM
  #284
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Originally Posted by WakeUpNHL View Post
Canadiens will never win the cup with Desharnais playing on the top six and Desharnais cannot play on the bottom six.

Top two centers going forward must be Galchenyuk and Plekanec.

Desharnais will get his chance but the writing is on the wall for him.. he will go the same road as Ribiero... shipped out west to a team that needs a cheap second line center.
Cheap second line centre?

Ribeiro was Dallas #1 centre; him and Morrows were a great duo. Anyhow I fail to see the link between Desharnais and Ribeiro.

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01-28-2013, 02:30 PM
  #285
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Originally Posted by Kjell Dahlin View Post
Cheap second line centre?

Ribeiro was Dallas #1 centre; him and Morrows were a great duo. Anyhow I fail to see the link between Desharnais and Ribeiro.
Actually Modano was #1 Ribeiro's first 2 seasons in Dallas, then Brad Richards was the #1 guy until they let him go. Really Mike was their #1 center for 1 season and it was last year and they moved him this off season

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01-28-2013, 02:32 PM
  #286
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Does a team out west have the second coming of Janne Niinimaa?

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01-28-2013, 02:38 PM
  #287
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Canadiens will never win the cup with Desharnais playing on the top six! Galchenyuk and Plekanec must be 1 and 2. L. Eller must become a defensive specialist he has all the tools to exceed in that role. Carbo was a big scorer in the jr's and transformed into a defensive specialist to support Gainey. Eller needs to support Plek and take over that role. DD should be used every other game in a support role ...To build a powerhouse team you need guys that can step into the line up and help out! Gallacher is ready and Subban needs to be signed asap. Believe me! Markov will be the happiest habs when PK gets signed. Its all fun and games now but as the season moves along the hits are going to get harder and the defensive adjustments will get better.

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01-28-2013, 05:16 PM
  #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shawdowmaker View Post
Canadiens will never win the cup with Desharnais playing on the top six! Galchenyuk and Plekanec must be 1 and 2. L. Eller must become a defensive specialist he has all the tools to exceed in that role. Carbo was a big scorer in the jr's and transformed into a defensive specialist to support Gainey. Eller needs to support Plek and take over that role. DD should be used every other game in a support role ...
Do you really think Eller has those tools? I'm not sold either way. One thing a great checking center has is consistency. Work ethic is another. And better than average hockey sense/anticipation. Eller has good enough size and *usually* works pretty hard, etc... but... I'm not sure I've yet seen real indiciations of above-average hockey sense. He has good physical traits and some occaional flashes of skill/dangling ability, and it would be ideal for our current organizational depth if he did indeed become that idealized #3 center guy. But so far it's a little murky. I'm totally willing to be patient and am satisfied with Eller overall, don't get me wrong. Just not _convinced_ he's going to be the right man for the described job.

Whereas on-topic... I think Desharnais is pretty much as advertised. He can always do some top-6 work when called on. That can come in handy. Even if you sometimes have to stash him in other places on the roster. It's more up to him in that sense... if some other team comes along and wants to pay him proportionate to a larger role, he has to take that.

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05-09-2013, 10:31 PM
  #289
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05-09-2013, 10:35 PM
  #290
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Desharnais was able to lose the puck every time he had it, and was able to lose every single 1 on 1 battle, please ship him somewhere else.

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05-09-2013, 10:35 PM
  #291
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One Desharnais thread is enough.

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