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Coffey: "I'd consult the Pens Powerplay"

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Old
05-06-2011, 02:12 PM
  #51
HandshakeLine
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Coffey is as pure of an example of a player relying on his talents, and not head for the game, as you can get.

I don't think superstars are very good on the coaching front, as a whole.

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05-06-2011, 02:18 PM
  #52
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I don't think anyone with natural talent can be a good coach because they just can't relate.

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05-06-2011, 02:23 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTG32005 View Post
I don't think anyone with natural talent can be a good coach because they just can't relate.
See: Lemieux, Mario; Gretzky, Wayne.

It couldn't hurt to have Coffey come in and work with some players maybe during camp, but if they're serious about the power play (and it's starting to sound like they might be), I'd rather see a dedicated assistant brought in, instead of some famous Pens alumni.

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05-08-2011, 09:58 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by HandshakeLine View Post
See: Lemieux, Mario; Gretzky, Wayne.

It couldn't hurt to have Coffey come in and work with some players maybe during camp, but if they're serious about the power play (and it's starting to sound like they might be), I'd rather see a dedicated assistant brought in, instead of some famous Pens alumni.
This.

If Coffey wants to be in touh with the Pens and give some advice fom timte to time, great. It can't hurt. It's a good PR move IMO. Sadly, PR is not going to help this **** bag beer league pp. Someone needs to come in full time that can coach a pp. I love the Penguins coaching staff but not one of them should be even allowed to look at our PP.

I think the PP will be better next year. It has always seemed that the team has had an attitude of meh, whatever we have so much high end talent that it will work at some point. When we have Malkin and Crosby in the line up we haven't even had an above average pp for long periods of time. Going 1 for 34 or whatever the number was was the soul reason we lost to tb. That could be a good thing in the long run. It 100% has to be THE FOCUS this off season.

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05-08-2011, 11:49 AM
  #55
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Instead of ending each practice with the shootout, we should end each practice with a PP before going into the shootout.

Our PP is a prime example of relying solely on talent... there needs to be a system. This was evident once the talent was removed.

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05-08-2011, 11:51 AM
  #56
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But what about Mustache Man?!?

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05-08-2011, 09:42 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HandshakeLine View Post
Coffey is as pure of an example of a player relying on his talents, and not head for the game, as you can get.

I don't think superstars are very good on the coaching front, as a whole.
I disagree, Coffey had a really good head for the game as well as excellent vision at the point.


Even if you're talented quarterbacking a powerplay is probably the hardest thing in hockey to do. Anyone who as good it is good at it because of their smarts as well as their skills, because as we've seen with Letang plenty of guys with talent just can't do it.

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05-09-2011, 05:09 AM
  #58
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Screw that. Just sign him to be our pp qb and get Mario out there also.

Think I am crazy do you? Then answer this.
Do you think Coffey and Mario, as they are today, would have scored more pp pts than we did against Tampa yes or no. Im gonna go with yes.

All kidding aside, bring him in and let him work with Letang, Niskanen and Michalek.

Niskanen has a ton of potential. An outstanding skillset.

This team is in really good shape on defense other than a guy who can rush the puck and put fear in the other teams PK. We need a qb teams are afraid to pressure.

As far as ou pp goes, We pass around the perimeter too much. We need to do some crosses to guys attacking the slot from mid to point. Its too easy for teams to push everything to the boards and move around as we pass in a box shape. You have to make them fear that pass from the corner to the dman attacking the net or Malkin coming off the board for a feed in the high slot.

Instead we just pass the puck up the boards to the point. Over to the other point for either a shot thats easily blocked or a pass down low only to see a pass back to the point wash rinse repeat ad nauseam. Draw a square and thats how our passing goes on the pp. Its rather ridiculous.

Id rather even see someone set up behind the net with a square in front the way Gretzky used to set up. Mario did it also for a year or so in the late 80s. Was very effective from there. Malkin or Sid would do very well from behind the net.


Im watching San Joses pp against Detroit and its absolutely beautiful. They just attack the crease and keep the pk off balance. Get the puck outside. Move to points and then hit someone going to the net. Im amazed they havent scored more. Detroit dodged some bullets last night.


PS- I really do think Mario and Coffey even at their age would have scored at least 3 pts on the pp though. Mario really should work with the players some himself.

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05-09-2011, 11:39 AM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TravisUlrich View Post
It's probably different for powerplays but I always wonder how good talented players would be at coaching. Like I wounder if Gretzky was ever just like thinking to himself "Why didn't Saprikyn just sauce a blind-sighted bank pass off of boards from his backhand over two opponents' sticks? I mean c'mon, it's so obvious!"
Solid post

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01-28-2013, 07:43 PM
  #60
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Should we call up Coffey again? This time with a coaching offer?

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01-28-2013, 07:51 PM
  #61
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Would the coaching staff swallow its ego and allow this to happen?

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01-28-2013, 08:07 PM
  #62
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The Pens should consult the tape of the St Louis Blues this season.

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01-28-2013, 11:55 PM
  #63
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Speaking of swallowing pride..... with the personnel we have, we need to simplify the PP big time. It worked great when Crosby was out, and I'd be fine to allow the first unit with Malkin/Neal less time and create a unit around Crosby for the second.

We're forcing everything, playing stars out of position and inventing meaningless concepts such as 'Neal the QB Rover' in order to accommodate our big guns all being on the same unit. I understand why, but given their respective skill sets, preferences and tendencies, it is a BAD solution.

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01-29-2013, 12:04 AM
  #64
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Really?

The PP is one of the smallest problems on this team. 5th in the NHL last year, 4th in goals scored despite all the injuries. This year they have been fine for the most part, and statistically, even if a few attempts recently were frustrating. Work on turnovers, stopping with the stupid stretch passes that do not work, and for Christ's sake, please stop trying to pass your way out of the defensive zone so often, but walk the God damn puck out of the zone if the other team is sitting back waiting to intercept the pass. Then if you want to work on the PP be my guest.

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01-29-2013, 12:51 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
Really?

The PP is one of the smallest problems on this team. 5th in the NHL last year, 4th in goals scored despite all the injuries. This year they have been fine for the most part, and statistically, even if a few attempts recently were frustrating. Work on turnovers, stopping with the stupid stretch passes that do not work, and for Christ's sake, please stop trying to pass your way out of the defensive zone so often, but walk the God damn puck out of the zone if the other team is sitting back waiting to intercept the pass. Then if you want to work on the PP be my guest.
Then you haven't watched the first unit. Sorry to say. Getting a goal off a faceoff and Geno finding Dupuis (not the first unit) when the Rangers had just changed after nullifying our first unit does not speak of a working PP. Geno scoring on a bad angle shot off Crosby's pass was an argument in favor, but again it bears no resemblance to what you see from good PP's where you actually work a PK to create chances.

And last years PP is not this years PP. Its results were largely gotten in the absence of Crosby and Sullivan mattered.

If you go back a little further and see how we did with Sid and Malkin post-Gonchar, you will again see how we force things. Now you see that again, only the zone entries are even worse with Letang in particular looking lost (and Neal being straight up miscasted in his role) and Crosby is not up to speed yet, splaying high risk through the box passes to PK'ers feet with regularity.

Yes, we scored on the PP a plenty against the Flyers in a historically high scoring and PK inept series. So did New Jersey when they booted them afterwards. In any case, with Sid, Malkin and Neal the PP will always get some goals because the talent level is too high not to. But that doesn't mean that we're utilizing what should be a massive strength.

NB: I would love for Malkin, Sid and Neal to be on the first unit. But for that to be preferable, putting all our eggs in one basket, we need to find someone who can give the unit calm on one of the points and/or one who can give the unit balance on the left boards and/or someone who can proficiently give the unit a net front presence that Kunitz is and was always largely incapable of doing at a high level. Hence I say with the current roster, I prefer that our stars are split up to simplify what they do.


Last edited by Tender Rip: 01-29-2013 at 01:02 AM.
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Old
01-29-2013, 07:30 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTG View Post
The Pens should consult the tape of the St Louis Blues San Jose Sharks this season.
Fixed

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01-29-2013, 07:33 AM
  #67
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Yeah the Sharks PP is nasty. It is so dangerous.

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Old
01-29-2013, 07:51 AM
  #68
Le Magnifique 66
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Couldn't really hurt at this point, anything to get it going

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01-29-2013, 08:24 AM
  #69
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Here is my Penguins powerplay


Neal-Crosby-Malkin
Niskanen - Martin


And heres an explanation:
Kunitz is invisible. Whatever hes doing is not working. The biggest problem i note about the Penguins PP compared to other teams, is they always get pressure on the points. They're success depends on how well the points can dance around the defense. Kunitz is a big reason why, because he doesn't draw any defenders to him when he screens the goalie and hes never a passing option. I wish the old Holmstrom PP would die already, its not effective any more.

Letang is problem 2. When the defense gets pressured, he tends to make bad decisions. Granted, Malkin and Crosby are guilty of trying to force the issue too, but this team needs those two on its PP. Letang is expendable. In addition to turning over the puck, he can't hit the net and his decision-making is slow and plodding. Putting two reliable defensemen on the PP would give it some stability. Maybe work Letang in once the big three have gotten settled into their roles.

Having Neal, Malkin, and Crosby down low would force defenders to collapse around the net. This would give the points lots of time to move the puck around and allow for these guys to actually be creative. I like that Martin and Niskanen are there because i think both guys can pass at the speed needed to make this work. Niskanen seems to have a decent shot too.. and he can hit a one-timer.

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01-29-2013, 08:37 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shady Machine View Post
Yeah the Sharks PP is nasty. It is so dangerous.
"The Sharks have been doing something special, and itís not just a absolutely crazy high shooting percentage. The sharks are using 4 forwards, but instead of having someone like Pavs sit back in a D-man like role, theyíve given the green light for each Shark to occupy any position on the ice, including Boyle. Theyíre base setup is a revolving door between an umbrella (3 up high, 2 down low), and an overload (3 on the half wall). The interchange of players throughout the PP, from center back to defense, makes it nearly impossible for PKers to pickup where the passing lanes are. The primary job for PKers is to block shots, and get in passing lanes. If you canít predict where the passing lanes are, itís going to be really difficult to get into shooting lanes."

Between Crosby, Malkin, Neal, Letang, and a wet paperbag, there's no reason the Pens shouldn't be able to do something like this, it's certainly not a question of talent or ability.

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01-29-2013, 09:37 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by themethod7 View Post
Fixed
Both are equally dangerous.

I love how STL is setting up their powerplay. They gain and maintain the zone every single time.

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01-29-2013, 09:48 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTG View Post
Both are equally dangerous.

I love how STL is setting up their powerplay. They gain and maintain the zone every single time.
Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk are far better PP pointmen than Letang. They have three netfront options in Backes, Berglund and Stewart. And multiple skilled forwards who can work both sides of the ice.

We just don't have the personnel. Sid/Geno can't make a PP run properly on their own.

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01-29-2013, 09:54 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk are far better PP pointmen than Letang. They have three netfront options in Backes, Berglund and Stewart. And multiple skilled forwards who can work both sides of the ice.

We just don't have the personnel. Sid/Geno can't make a PP run properly on their own.
The entrance into the offensive zone to set the PP up has nothing to do with the personnel, IMO. It has everything to do with strategy, and we do have the personnel to gain the zone like they do. It's awesome stuff to watch.

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01-29-2013, 10:04 AM
  #74
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk are far better PP pointmen than Letang. They have three netfront options in Backes, Berglund and Stewart. And multiple skilled forwards who can work both sides of the ice.

We just don't have the personnel. Sid/Geno can't make a PP run properly on their own.
Yeah but the Pens just work the puck to the point and throw pucks on net. Thats as simple as it gets.

Look at the EDM PP before they got all of the first round picks. They would pick on a high defender and set up Horcoff's shot. It was a low level team making some high end plays and it was pretty sick to watch.

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01-29-2013, 10:05 AM
  #75
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The entrance into the offensive zone to set the PP up has nothing to do with the personnel, IMO. It has everything to do with strategy, and we do have the personnel to gain the zone like they do. It's awesome stuff to watch.
Letang can't gain the zone and set things up to save his life. Kunitz? Na. Neal isn't a fit playing the point. Which leaves Sid/Geno. A PK scheme can key in on them as the main puck carriers.

We don't have that guy who can reguarly gain the zone and set things up. Sullivan was that for us last year. The PP ran through Geno last year, but Sullivan was a huge part of our success. He was a calming presence at the point. We don't have that now and it's showing.

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