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Trade Rumours and Proposals: Part XXXIII

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Old
01-29-2013, 03:44 AM
  #226
Mephias
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Originally Posted by take a peak View Post
Maybe fun to float the idea to yourself but you really think phillips would be traded?

There is no chance.... none.... that he is traded.

He would not return much anyways.
Nope, not at all. I was definitely just throwing that out there for the sake of discussion.

Murray and the rest of the Sens organization clearly values player loyalty very highly -- which is definitely a plus. Not to mention Murray seems to love Phillips. So no, I definitely don't think the Sens will actually trade Phillips.

That being said, I really wouldn't mind moving him at the end of the season if there is a market for him like BonkTastic said. (I was really thinking about next season in my original post too; he's definitely neede until Cowen comes back.) Phillips has said that he wants to play beyond his current contract, and I just don't see that happening with the Sens.

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01-29-2013, 04:48 AM
  #227
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Originally Posted by ATdaisuki View Post
nope. we have gone over this.
andy is who we need, but not who we deserve. but we will keep him, because we have him.

did i do it right? seriously, we need him to mentor lehner. when/if lehner takes him over while he's still on contract, we'll have a killer duo. rumor has it we're targeting yannick weber. i don't know much about his game, but i think he's a puck mover? unfortunately, he may be our replacement for gonchar until ceci gets a shot. i am a huge andy fan, and if we trade him, i will be royally pissed.
Why don't we deserve him? Who deserves him more?

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Old
01-29-2013, 05:22 AM
  #228
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Originally Posted by Icelevel View Post
I'm going to go ahead and say it without thinking about it too much cause i'm pretty sure it is true.

There is no one you could trade anderson for that would give us a better chance to win every night than anderson.
Right now there is one.
The one.
Mr. Anderson.

I guess the question eventually will be can lehner + the return for anderson give us a better chance to win every night than anderson alONE. Maybe it is the question already. Maybe the answer is known. Maybe the answer is no, one. (maybe bishop will start tomorrow?)
While that IT IS a CRAZY thought. I agree as well. Anderson is the best there is for us. There are a dozen, maybe a dozen and a half top goalies in the NHL. Since we have got Anderson i don't know if ANY other goalie would have been as good in Ottawa as Anderson has been. Anderson might not be the best goalie in thew world. I don't know who is, but for this team... this pressing, high risk team, I don't think anyone could be better unless shown to be IN FACT.

It is funny because while around the league I don't hold Anderson second to anyone... Lehner.... If both of them were Sens goalies it would not worry me at all no matter who started a game.

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Old
01-29-2013, 05:52 AM
  #229
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Originally Posted by HavlatMach9 View Post
Anderson's GAA continues to climb each game. He's lost it.

Anderson is an under-appreciated player in the league partly because of how his days in Colorado ended. Not many realize that in Ottawa he's been putting up above average goaltending performance (which gives a chance to do well in the playoffs, a better chance than whoever returns in the trade). Goalies don't tend to return much either.
Not many realize that we've been getting above average goaltending from Anderson?

Huh?

All anyone would have to do is watch an Ottawa game to figure that out.

We don't make the playoffs last year without him.

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Old
01-29-2013, 06:15 AM
  #230
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Originally Posted by Mephias View Post
Strange thought: do we consider trading Phillips?

I know he gets off to slow starts, and will probably turn it up a notch after a few more weeks or so, but he's still clearly not the same player he was 4-5 seasons ago. I'm not sure the Senators plan on re-signing him after his current contract anyways with Boro/Wier ready to step in soon and a bunch of other decent-looking defense prospects in the pipes. The money saved could go towards an upper-tier Top 4 Dman as well.
I wanna say he has a no movement clause. It also seems like Murray is trying to build a reputation here for players, I think he retires here like Alfie Neil etc.

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Old
01-29-2013, 06:30 AM
  #231
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Originally Posted by BK201 View Post
I wanna say he has a no movement clause. It also seems like Murray is trying to build a reputation here for players, I think he retires here like Alfie Neil etc.
He has a no-move clause until Jan 1st, 2014. At that point, he can submit a list of 10 teams he can't be dealt to (becomes a limited NMC).

The fact that there is language in the contract that makes his NMC into a limited NMC leads me to believe that Murray has at least entertained the idea that trading Phillips could be a possibility. If trading Phillips was going to be some non-starter for Murray, he'd have just given him the full 3 years with a NMC.

I'm not saying Phillips being traded is a guarantee; far from it. I still think it's more likely he finishes this contract in Ottawa, but for anyone to say "it's never going to happen": well, I submit to you that yes, it could happen. The language is in his contract for a reason.

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Old
01-29-2013, 06:46 AM
  #232
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Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
Either would be depressing though, IMO. The way Bouwmeester is playing this year, with his $6.8mil cap hit, he's a tough pill to swallow.

I really don't want anything to do with any contract that was deemed "bad" in the old $70mil cap world. Those deals in the new, reduced cap next year are jumbo-sized salary cap poison-pills. Pretty much ties your hand in the UFA market by eating up so much free $... and with the cap going down, and with some teams still near the ceiling, it's going to be a buyer's market.

I'd rather not miss out on the upcoming UFA season: the Sens have positioned themselves to really be able to get some prime pieces at rates that will seem like great bargains compared to the past couple of years. I mean, look at Subban's contract - prices of players are going down. I really don't want anything to do with what will be hyper-inflated contracts for guys who couldn't even earn their payday in a $70 mil cap world, let alone a $64mil cap.
What if the Flames ate a chunk of the Boumeester deal? J-Bo around 4.0 looks really appealing

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01-29-2013, 07:28 AM
  #233
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Originally Posted by The Great Below View Post
What if the Flames ate a chunk of the Boumeester deal? J-Bo around 4.0 looks really appealing
Oh yeah, I forgot teams could do that now. They can eat 50%, right?

Jay-Bo's cap is $6.8, so half that is $3.4.



... I'd be interested in Jay-Bo at $3.4.

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01-29-2013, 08:10 AM
  #234
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I don't think Calgary has the depth to trade JBO in the first place let alone take on 1/2 his contract but I could be mistaken.

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Old
01-29-2013, 08:25 AM
  #235
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Originally Posted by Powdered Toast Man View Post
This whole notion that the players, any of them, care two ***** about the logo on the front of their sweater is nothing more than a myth perpetuated by both the players and the teams in order to milk the fans for as much as they can.
thats not true...at least not as a whole...there are lots of players who love their team..you think Gretzky didnt love the Oilers? or that Yzermen and Lidstrom didnt love the Red Wings?...its like someone loving the company they work at...you'll never find a company that everyone loves to work for...but they are there cause it pays well or they are to lazy to look for something else...but then there is the old guy(s) whos worked there for 30 years loyally cause he loves the company itself

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Old
01-29-2013, 08:39 AM
  #236
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I'm thinking a corps based around Karlsson, Methot & Cowen in the Top 4 and Wiercioch & Borowiecki in the mix; from the pool of Phillips & Benoit plus Gryba, Ceci, Vikstrand, Claesson, Sdao, we will be fine.

Gonchar as well could return us a D prospect or draft choice to add to the mix if we do not resign him. And who knows about Lundin until he plays.

We are actually quite well stocked in the system. I guess the big point is to let the development of the youngsters continue and be ready to add them to the mix when they are ready (ala Wiecioch, Borowiecki this year, Cowen last year). From what I hear Gryba is making heads turn and could be an interesting prospect next training camp.

Next year

Methot & Karlsson; Cowen and Wiercioch, Phillips & Borowiecki, Gryba sound like a possibility. Now if Phillips is to be traded, then it might be different.

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Old
01-29-2013, 08:55 AM
  #237
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Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
Either would be depressing though, IMO. The way Bouwmeester is playing this year, with his $6.8mil cap hit, he's a tough pill to swallow.

I really don't want anything to do with any contract that was deemed "bad" in the old $70mil cap world. Those deals in the new, reduced cap next year are jumbo-sized salary cap poison-pills. Pretty much ties your hand in the UFA market by eating up so much free $... and with the cap going down, and with some teams still near the ceiling, it's going to be a buyer's market.

I'd rather not miss out on the upcoming UFA season: the Sens have positioned themselves to really be able to get some prime pieces at rates that will seem like great bargains compared to the past couple of years. I mean, look at Subban's contract - prices of players are going down. I really don't want anything to do with what will be hyper-inflated contracts for guys who couldn't even earn their payday in a $70 mil cap world, let alone a $64mil cap.
We're going to need to tie up a lot of money just to hit the Cap floor. Unless you are melnyk money is a complete non-issue.

Greening 0.8 Spezza 7 Michalek 4.3
Silfverberg 0.9 Turris 1.4 Alfie 3
Zibanjead 1.5 Smith 0.7 Neil 2
JOB 0.65 Regin 0.8 Condra 0.65

Methot 3 EK 6.5
Cowen 1.2 Weircoch 0.875
Phillips 3 Boro 0.6

Anderson 3.1
Lehner 0.9


that's all guys under contract, Alfie with a $3 million deal.
the total?

$42.8 Million

That's $21 million under the cap and many millions under the cap floor.
Picking up Bouwmeester for very little would be great, all it might cost is money and its only for this year and next (and would get us to this year's cap floor). If he plays well we can resign him on a lesser deal as well.
I watched him a couple times this year, he can play. Its his contract that sucks not him.

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Old
01-29-2013, 09:04 AM
  #238
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Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
We're going to need to tie up a lot of money just to hit the Cap floor. Unless you are melnyk money is a complete non-issue.

Greening 0.8 Spezza 7 Michalek 4.3
Silfverberg 0.9 Turris 1.4 Alfie 3
Zibanjead 1.5 Smith 0.7 Neil 2
JOB 0.65 Regin 0.8 Condra 0.65

Methot 3 EK 6.5
Cowen 1.2 Weircoch 0.875
Phillips 3 Boro 0.6

Anderson 3.1
Lehner 0.9


that's all guys under contract, Alfie with a $3 million deal.
the total?

$42.8 Million

That's $21 million under the cap and many millions under the cap floor.
Picking up Bouwmeester for very little would be great, all it might cost is money and its only for this year and next (and would get us to this year's cap floor). If he plays well we can resign him on a lesser deal as well.
I watched him a couple times this year, he can play. Its his contract that sucks not him.
Turris will be making $3.5 million per for the next 5 years. You also paid all the RFAs and UFAs the same amount they're making this year. Expect at least a 10% raise for most. But yes, we will still be short. Although I don't think it will be $21 million.

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Old
01-29-2013, 09:33 AM
  #239
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Originally Posted by BankStreetParade View Post
Turris will be making $3.5 million per for the next 5 years. You also paid all the RFAs and UFAs the same amount they're making this year. Expect at least a 10% raise for most. But yes, we will still be short. Although I don't think it will be $21 million.
whoops, thanks.
the UFA's are Regin and Condra, so lets say add a million combined for those 2.
the RFA's are Boro and Weircoch go ahead add another million between them.
we're now at approx $19 million in Cap space. with JBO's contract (next year beign the last of his contract) we would be at approx $12 million in cap space.

That's enough flexibility to do anything we want.
JBO is the perfect target IMO and the more salary of his we take the better the deal for us, and his deal expires at the end of next year, great stopgap (perhaps the best one out there) and we could potentially resign him adding a high value asset for little.

IMO its a no brainer if we can swing the deal.

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Old
01-29-2013, 10:37 AM
  #240
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Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post

that's all guys under contract, Alfie with a $3 million deal.
You think Alfredsson would come back at $3 million? I doubt he is anything less than $4.5 million. He's not as good as he used to be, but he's still a top 6 winger and he still puts butts in the seats. I'd be stunned if they nickle and dime Alfredsson at this point.

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Old
01-29-2013, 10:51 AM
  #241
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Originally Posted by EJsens1 View Post
You think Alfredsson would come back at $3 million? I doubt he is anything less than $4.5 million. He's not as good as he used to be, but he's still a top 6 winger and he still puts butts in the seats. I'd be stunned if they nickle and dime Alfredsson at this point.
Well isn't he playing for 1 mil this season? I'm pretty sure IF he comes back then he would play for any amount.

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Old
01-29-2013, 10:55 AM
  #242
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No offense but Montreal is in a rebuild if they move a Subban they are going to want a Cowen coming back, not a Gonchar plus.

You may think in a rebuild you need to stock the shelves. But you do that by trading away older vets to win now teams, not by trading away young proven minute eating RFA's for another teams prospects.

If you move a good top 2 damn their ginna want something significant back.

And that's why we are never gonna get him.
It wasn't Gonchar +

The biggest piece we were given up was Cody Ceci (ever heard of him?)... Ceci is apparently worth a top-5 pick to the Sens, so it all depends on how the Habs value him

Then Da Costa, who is worth more than a 2nd round pick to us or any team, this guy is just too skilled and has a lot of potential to be traded for something like a 2nd round pick

I talked about it earlier but Pageau has value to them, they were very high on them (you can do some research if you want)

Gonchar was just for money purposes and to serve them as a stop gap, they don't mind having older players (would mesh well with Markov) and a guy like Gonchar could tutor Galchenyuk (like he did with Malkin). Also, despite what a portion of this clueless board thinks, Gonchar is not a scrub, not even close.

Like any trade talks all over the internet, this was speculation 100%. I don't know what I need to explain this but anyway. Maybe we didn't have the exact package Montreal would have been looking for but maybe no other team would have offered what they would have liked back... and if in the case that they needed to move Subban, it would have been an interesting package for them (Gonchar replaces Subban's offense this year, Ceci replaces Subban long term, plus they get Da Costa and Pageau as bonus... who aren't crap assets, no.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by guyzeur View Post
Kessel's experiment went bad because TML didn't expect to be a lottery team.

There are many examples that the team getting the best player end up with the most value in the trade.
Good point but it really depends on the context (Heatley)... They finally signed Subban but if the 2 parts couldn't have come to an agreement, things would have been much different

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01-29-2013, 11:01 AM
  #243
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God just drop the Sub ban talk already.

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Old
01-29-2013, 11:03 AM
  #244
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Subban re-signed, so kill that option.

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Old
01-29-2013, 11:06 AM
  #245
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You think Alfredsson would come back at $3 million? I doubt he is anything less than $4.5 million. He's not as good as he used to be, but he's still a top 6 winger and he still puts butts in the seats. I'd be stunned if they nickle and dime Alfredsson at this point.
Sort of beside the point isnt it?
$3 million was a placeholder more than anything, want to add $1.5 million go ahead - it doesnt change the premise. There is a ton of dough to play with for shortish term players making high salaries that could be of huge value to us at no cost other than money.

We have a real opportunity over the next year to really bolster our team, along with the many prospects cooking along.

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Old
01-29-2013, 11:25 AM
  #246
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Massive LOL to anyone who ever thought there was even a 1% chance the Sens would offer sheet or trade for Subban.

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Old
01-29-2013, 11:40 AM
  #247
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Well isn't he playing for 1 mil this season? I'm pretty sure IF he comes back then he would play for any amount.
Because Alfie is a stand up guy who is honouring the contract he signed. Assuming he comes back, he wouldn't play for 'any' amount. He might take a discount, but I expect the organization to pay him rightly and deservedly.

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01-29-2013, 11:44 AM
  #248
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Sort of beside the point isnt it?
$3 million was a placeholder more than anything, want to add $1.5 million go ahead - it doesnt change the premise. There is a ton of dough to play with for shortish term players making high salaries that could be of huge value to us at no cost other than money.

We have a real opportunity over the next year to really bolster our team, along with the many prospects cooking along.
I agree and I knew what you were getting at, but I was just making the point that some people are deluding themselves if they think Alfie will take a large pay cut for the 'good of the team' so to speak. Not implying you think that per say, but just making the point.

I agree that we have a real chance to spend some money, but that will be up to Melnyk obviously. I still think waiting until the next summer, where there are tons of free agents would be wise. Let our current crop of players develop some more, see where they fit in and who doesn't, then add a piece or two you think could push us over the top in the summer of 2014.

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01-29-2013, 12:03 PM
  #249
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Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
Either would be depressing though, IMO. The way Bouwmeester is playing this year, with his $6.8mil cap hit, he's a tough pill to swallow.

I really don't want anything to do with any contract that was deemed "bad" in the old $70mil cap world. Those deals in the new, reduced cap next year are jumbo-sized salary cap poison-pills. Pretty much ties your hand in the UFA market by eating up so much free $... and with the cap going down, and with some teams still near the ceiling, it's going to be a buyer's market.

I'd rather not miss out on the upcoming UFA season: the Sens have positioned themselves to really be able to get some prime pieces at rates that will seem like great bargains compared to the past couple of years. I mean, look at Subban's contract - prices of players are going down. I really don't want anything to do with what will be hyper-inflated contracts for guys who couldn't even earn their payday in a $70 mil cap world, let alone a $64mil cap.
For sure. I wouldn't want either.

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Old
01-29-2013, 12:07 PM
  #250
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From what I've seen of J-Bo, he's a slow-footed giveaway machine. He'd be crucified here.

Where are the stats guys to back this up? Oh, wait, Fuhr is the one pushing this idea.

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