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Is Alain Vigneault the worst coach in the NHL right now?

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Old
01-29-2013, 03:52 PM
  #301
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Originally Posted by freakydave View Post
Rome the guy who cheapshotted Horton & basically turned the Momentum against the Canucks.Yeah that was a great call.Ballard was mismanaged by AV from the day he arrived.
Only the media and random fans who have never played the game talk about some "event" as being a story book turning point. That isn't the reason they lost. A confluence of errors and mismanagement led to Vancouver's downfall, the key being Luongo.

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01-29-2013, 03:54 PM
  #302
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Originally Posted by freakydave View Post
Rome the guy who cheapshotted Horton & basically turned the Momentum against the Canucks.Yeah that was a great call.Ballard was mismanaged by AV from the day he arrived.
Doesn't change the fact using him the playoffs over Ballard was the better move for the team at the time. Ballard came in a looked poor.

Mis-used? Care to explain why Ballard looks so good right now in the same role AV's had him in all along?

Does AV get credit for that, or is it all on Ballard?
I assume your answer is AV gets credit, since you seem to believe he gets the blame for Ballard's poor play prior. Don't think you can have both ways can you.

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01-29-2013, 03:55 PM
  #303
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Originally Posted by Lonny Bohonos View Post
Gillis though has stated he doesnt want this.
That's the rest of the equation - AV is running the team in the way Gillis wants him to. Criticism of the coach at this level is equally strong criticism of the GM.

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01-29-2013, 03:59 PM
  #304
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Originally Posted by Henrik View Post
He's clueless most of the time and still have a job because of the Sedins, Schneider and Luongo.
Nobody is better in the business. If he got fired, other coaches would drop like a hot potato to make way for him.

You cant start a thread slandering a guy with no good facts or reasoning.

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01-29-2013, 04:01 PM
  #305
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
That's the rest of the equation - AV is running the team in the way Gillis wants him to. Criticism of the coach at this level is equally strong criticism of the GM.
And Gillis is in no way shape or form an absent manager. If anything he maybe a bit more controlling than you average manager.

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01-29-2013, 04:02 PM
  #306
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Hartley does seem to be a damn good coach so far. Most (if not all) Flames fans are thrilled to have him.
despite putting Baertchi on the 4th line? really?

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01-29-2013, 04:02 PM
  #307
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Originally Posted by Goldrunner View Post
You cant start a thread slandering a guy with no good facts or reasoning.
Especially by attempting to do so by using the Sedins as an example, when they were borderline second line players before AV built an approach/system around them to optimize their skills.

Nobody on the Canucks roster owes more to their accomplishments than the Sedins - AV & MG deserve tremendous credit for what they accomplished with them. I for one would LOVE to see what he could do with an enigmatic talent like Ovechkin's (cue Luongo to Washington rumor).


Last edited by Dado: 01-29-2013 at 05:12 PM.
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01-29-2013, 04:40 PM
  #308
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despite putting Baertchi on the 4th line? really?
Seguin played a lot there too, among others. Though Boston had deeper team.

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01-29-2013, 04:41 PM
  #309
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Going to have to do better than just saying he's clueless.

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01-29-2013, 04:46 PM
  #310
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Originally Posted by nowhereman View Post
Vigneault is top ten in the NHL in career wins, has two President's Trophies, a Jack Adams, a Stanley Cup Finals berth, and is the winningest coach in Canucks franchise history.

There are worse coaches.
You win this thread, I have to see anyone rebuttal that.

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01-29-2013, 04:47 PM
  #311
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There are times where I question Vigneault's player management and times where I wonder if he knows what the hell he's doing. But you can't deny that he's proven to be successful with the Canucks. For that I'm just gonna assume this is your basic fan wants coach fired thread.

Now Hockey's really back on

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01-29-2013, 04:53 PM
  #312
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Originally Posted by DL44 View Post
OR...

2006-2007: Won 1st round without any offence, lost the SCF champs
2007-2008: Did not qualify
200809: Won the 1st round, lost to the Hawks
200910: Won the 1st round, lost to the SCF champs
201011: Won 3 rounds in a run to gm 7 of the SCF
201112: lost in first round to the SCF champs
That's poor for the teams Gillis has constructed. They should have at least won 2 cups with the squads AV were given.

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01-29-2013, 05:01 PM
  #313
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Originally Posted by KaraLupin View Post
That's poor for the teams Gillis has constructed. They should have at least won 2 cups with the squads AV were given.
At LEAST

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01-29-2013, 05:01 PM
  #314
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Originally Posted by The Last Dynasty View Post
despite putting Baertchi on the 4th line? really?
In a game that they completely dominated, I'm not too worried about it.

The fact is, there's no one above him that he's beaten out for a spot. Lee Stempniak, aka The Whirling Dervish, has probably been Calgary's best forward so far, and he's probably the main guy that Bartschi is competing with.

Anyway it's still early. I have no problem with Bartschi being brought along slowly and being forced to earn his icetime, as long as he's not playing 4th line minutes for the entire season. I think Hartley is playing the long game on this one and so far I'm gonna trust his judgement.

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01-29-2013, 05:25 PM
  #315
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Originally Posted by Henrik View Post
He's clueless most of the time and still have a job because of the Sedins, Schneider and Luongo.
Schneider has a 0.885% or around there and a higher than 3.00GA. I wouldn't say he is making him look good right now.

AV seems stubborn to me as sometimes he will play older guys in certain situations than a young one.

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01-29-2013, 05:29 PM
  #316
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
Especially by attempting to do so by using the Sedins as an example, when they were borderline second line players before AV built an approach/system around them to optimize their skills.
Psst, when did the Sedins take over from the WCE? Hint, Crawford was the coach.

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01-29-2013, 05:35 PM
  #317
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Originally Posted by craigcaulks View Post
Psst, when did the Sedins take over from the WCE? Hint, Crawford was the coach.
They took over as the Sisters, with the WCE crumbling. It wasn't a coaching decision, it was a no-choice situation.

AV then turned them into Art Ross winners.


Last edited by Dado: 01-29-2013 at 05:36 PM. Reason: Improved wording.
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01-29-2013, 05:48 PM
  #318
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Originally Posted by Lonny Bohonos View Post
And Gillis is in no way shape or form an absent manager. If anything he maybe a bit more controlling than you average manager.
I think this is an important point. Because Gillis and AV have become friends, Gillis can give his input without the coach feeling like he's meddling. I have a feeling Gillis is the kind of guy that gets his fingers into every piece of the pie.

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01-29-2013, 05:53 PM
  #319
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Originally Posted by Champions of Nothing View Post
Does that make it a bad thing to win it?

The #1 seed in the playoffs has won the cup more often than any other team in history.
wrong

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01-29-2013, 05:57 PM
  #320
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
They took over as the Sisters, with the WCE crumbling. It wasn't a coaching decision, it was a no-choice situation.

AV then turned them into Art Ross winners.
I guess we should discount the general process of maturing. While no doubt the coaching staff pays a role in the on ice product, it is amusing to say the least to AV turned the Sedins into anything.

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01-29-2013, 05:57 PM
  #321
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I've been watching more canucks games and browsing their game day threads and it made me realize some things.

The amount of hate AV was getting was making my head spin. I would of taken him any day of the week over Renney.

I suppose thats the nature of the beast though.

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01-29-2013, 05:58 PM
  #322
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Originally Posted by DL44 View Post
OR...

2006-2007: Won 1st round without any offence, lost the SCF champs
2007-2008: Did not qualify
200809: Won the 1st round, lost to the Hawks
200910: Won the 1st round, lost to the SCF champs
201011: Won 3 rounds in a run to gm 7 of the SCF
201112: lost in first round to the SCF champs
Alas, we will never have an answer to a question like this -- great post.

I think the notion that he's the worst coach in the league is laughable. One does not advance to the Stanley Cup Finals, lose in the play-offs to the eventual Stanley Cup Champions, and win 2 consecutive President's Trophies if you're the worst. Next topic.

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01-29-2013, 06:01 PM
  #323
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Originally Posted by craigcaulks View Post
Psst, when did the Sedins take over from the WCE? Hint, Crawford was the coach.
Crawford's last year as coach, the WCE were 1-3 among Canuck forwards in overall icetime, ES icetime, PP icetime. The Sedins were 2nd PP, and were 6th and 7th among the team's forwards in ES icetime, behind the WCE, Kesler, and Cooke.

The Sedins didn't get top minutes with the Canucks until the next season, AV's first ad head coach.

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01-29-2013, 06:02 PM
  #324
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Originally Posted by flashy View Post
I've been watching more canucks games and browsing their game day threads and it made me realize some things.

The amount of hate AV was getting was making my head spin. I would of taken him any day of the week over Renney.

I suppose thats the nature of the beast though.
I'd say for MANY fans it is AV's inability to adjust to anything in the playoffs. We don't win series that we shouldn't win. We have no reaction to a turn in a series other than panic and confusion. (and perhaps having everyone just dump the puck out for 2 periods.)

Not all on the coach of course, but I think it's time for a change.

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01-29-2013, 06:03 PM
  #325
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Originally Posted by flashy View Post
I've been watching more canucks games and browsing their game day threads and it made me realize some things.

The amount of hate AV was getting was making my head spin. I would of taken him any day of the week over Renney.

I suppose thats the nature of the beast though.
For all the wonderful things about the internet being the great equalizer, it also has it's drawbacks. Giving the guy that sits there all game screaming "SHOOT. SHOOOT!!!!" whenever his team has the puck - no matter what the situation - the same voice as people that know what they're looking at when they watch a hockey game is one of those drawbacks.

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