HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Prospects
Notices

Prospects Discuss hockey prospects from all over the world and the NHL Draft.

C Mikhail Grigorenko - Quebec Remparts, QMJHL (2012 draft) III

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-29-2013, 04:43 PM
  #876
SergeConstantin74
Always right.
 
SergeConstantin74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,610
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Similar situations with Connolly and Niederreiter. It's why I'd like to see a revamp of the NHL-CHL agreement, but I don't know how that'd happen.
The best draft year in recent memory spent their entire 18yo season in junior... it doesn't seem like it hurt them!

SergeConstantin74 is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 04:45 PM
  #877
Xokkeu
Registered User
 
Xokkeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Frozen
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 4,382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
The best draft year in recent memory spent their entire 18yo season in junior... it doesn't seem like it hurt them!
Huh?

Xokkeu is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 04:45 PM
  #878
I am the Liquor
Registered User
 
I am the Liquor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Sunnyvale
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,230
vCash: 8345
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
The best draft year in recent memory spent their entire 18yo season in junior... it doesn't seem like it hurt them!
I agree. If they are not "plainly and obviously" ready, then it does no harm to finish out a half year of junior.

Burning off a year of his elc to boot, and for what? To play on the third and fourth lines getting minimal ice time?

I dont think that's a very good idea tbh.

I am the Liquor is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 04:48 PM
  #879
SergeConstantin74
Always right.
 
SergeConstantin74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,610
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOfNiagara View Post
I understand Rampart fans being upset that they are losing a talent young player, but why does this keep getting repeated? Regier himself said that no such promise was ever made or implied.
Regier said himself today that in October, Grigorenko was going back to the Q.

But Roy never said himself he got a confirmation from Regier.

SergeConstantin74 is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 04:50 PM
  #880
SergeConstantin74
Always right.
 
SergeConstantin74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,610
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Huh?
I meant 19yo, not 18.

The 2003 draft class spent their 19yo season in the CHL because of the previous lock out.

I'm not saying it's the case with Grigorenko, but bringing a player too fast in pro hockey hurt way more than letting him dominate another before taking the next step.


Last edited by SergeConstantin74: 01-29-2013 at 04:58 PM.
SergeConstantin74 is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 05:12 PM
  #881
MacOfNiagara
Blue&Gold from birth
 
MacOfNiagara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Niagara Falls
Country: United States
Posts: 2,700
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
Regier said himself today that in October, Grigorenko was going back to the Q.

But Roy never said himself he got a confirmation from Regier.
Of course he did, there was a lockout, so remaining in Sabres camp wasnt an option nor was the AHL.

Do you have a link? Do he say "even if the lockout ends he is going to the QMJHL?"

Because if he did then he has directly contradicted his earlier statement.

MacOfNiagara is online now  
Old
01-29-2013, 05:57 PM
  #882
Xokkeu
Registered User
 
Xokkeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Frozen
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 4,382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
I meant 19yo, not 18.

The 2003 draft class spent their 19yo season in the CHL because of the previous lock out.

I'm not saying it's the case with Grigorenko, but bringing a player too fast in pro hockey hurt way more than letting him dominate another before taking the next step.
Connolly probably should have stayed in Junior but I guess Tampa really didn't want him staying in Prince George.

Neidderreiter is a case that probably helps your point. He was a very good junior player, but his 70 points in 55 games didn't really indicate that he was above and beyond the level without question. Keeping him in the NHL with minimal ice time probably didn't do much good for him.

Grigorenko though, like Galchenyuk, seems to be more advanced than Nino was. He had a better point per game ratio as a draft eligible player than Nino did after being drafted. He's on a tremendous pace right now near 2 points per game in the Q. That's a bit of a step up from Niederreiter or Connolly

Xokkeu is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 06:01 PM
  #883
SergeConstantin74
Always right.
 
SergeConstantin74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,610
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Connolly probably should have stayed in Junior but I guess Tampa really didn't want him staying in Prince George.

Neidderreiter is a case that probably helps your point. He was a very good junior player, but his 70 points in 55 games didn't really indicate that he was above and beyond the level without question. Keeping him in the NHL with minimal ice time probably didn't do much good for him.

Grigorenko though, like Galchenyuk, seems to be more advanced than Nino was. He had a better point per game ratio as a draft eligible player than Nino did after being drafted. He's on a tremendous pace right now near 2 points per game in the Q. That's a bit of a step up from Niederreiter or Connolly
Grigorenko wasn't dominating in junior. It doesn't mean he won't be able to develop well in the NHL. But it's false to say he was dominating and didn't have anything left to learn there.

SergeConstantin74 is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 06:04 PM
  #884
SergeConstantin74
Always right.
 
SergeConstantin74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,610
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOfNiagara View Post
Of course he did, there was a lockout, so remaining in Sabres camp wasnt an option nor was the AHL.

Do you have a link? Do he say "even if the lockout ends he is going to the QMJHL?"

Because if he did then he has directly contradicted his earlier statement.

No, today Regier said if the NHL had started in October, Grigorenko was going back to the Q.

SergeConstantin74 is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 06:40 PM
  #885
Xokkeu
Registered User
 
Xokkeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Frozen
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 4,382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
Grigorenko wasn't dominating in junior. It doesn't mean he won't be able to develop well in the NHL. But it's false to say he was dominating and didn't have anything left to learn there.
We will just have to agree to disagree I think.

Xokkeu is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 07:11 PM
  #886
SergeConstantin74
Always right.
 
SergeConstantin74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,610
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
We will just have to agree to disagree I think.
You say he dominated by looking at his stats... I say he didn't by watching him play...

SergeConstantin74 is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 08:20 PM
  #887
Jussi
I am siege face
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Finland
Posts: 42,334
vCash: 612
Scored his first NHL goal moments ago.

Jussi is online now  
Old
01-29-2013, 08:27 PM
  #888
Cam98
Registered User
 
Cam98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,998
vCash: 500
just over 7min of icetime. so ima assume no pp time for grigs?

Cam98 is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 08:31 PM
  #889
Gigantor The Goalie
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: New London
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,680
vCash: 366
Congrats on Grigorenko on scoring his first NHL goal. For what I saw of him it seemed only a matter of time.

Gigantor The Goalie is online now  
Old
01-29-2013, 08:32 PM
  #890
Stop Winnin
TANK ON BOYS
 
Stop Winnin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Buffalo
Posts: 8,447
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam98 View Post
just over 7min of icetime. so ima assume no pp time for grigs?
He was benched by Lindy for some poor play, much to the vitrol of all Sabre fans, seemed to light a fire under his ass and came out better in the 3rd.

Stop Winnin is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 10:47 PM
  #891
Bure
Registered User
 
Bure's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Ottawa, Ontario
Country: Russian Federation
Posts: 3,133
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
You say he dominated by looking at his stats... I say he didn't by watching him play...
I watched him quite a bit, he looked bored imo. He was a top player in world juniors when it counted. I don't think he was giving it his all in junior. But hey that's just me.

Bure is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 11:08 PM
  #892
Xokkeu
Registered User
 
Xokkeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Frozen
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 4,382
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
You say he dominated by looking at his stats... I say he didn't by watching him play...
I used statistics for a simplistic comparison between three players. I saw him play a few times, probably not as much as you, but yet.... I still disagree with you.

Xokkeu is offline  
Old
01-29-2013, 11:15 PM
  #893
SergeConstantin74
Always right.
 
SergeConstantin74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,610
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bure View Post
I watched him quite a bit, he looked bored imo. He was a top player in world juniors when it counted. I don't think he was giving it his all in junior. But hey that's just me.
I don't think he's the kind of player who gets bored playing the game and trying to make it at the next level. It's having a poor opinion on someone. The way he acts and talks, he does look like he cares, like when he watched his junior team play last weekend.

SergeConstantin74 is offline  
Old
01-30-2013, 09:08 AM
  #894
Chainshot
Global Moderator
Give 'em Enough Rope
 
Chainshot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Costa Rica
Country: Costa Rica
Posts: 56,236
vCash: 500
Awards:
Seems the guys on the team really enjoy having him around, judging by the reaction on the ice and at the bench after he scored last night. Two guys went to separate refs looking for the puck, Foligno was bear-hugging him, and they were congratulating him en masse even well after the goal over at the bench.

__________________
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. - Aristotle
Chainshot is offline  
Old
01-30-2013, 09:45 AM
  #895
Tim Murray
HoF Turd Shiner
 
Tim Murray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 4,339
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
Seems the guys on the team really enjoy having him around, judging by the reaction on the ice and at the bench after he scored last night. Two guys went to separate refs looking for the puck, Foligno was bear-hugging him, and they were congratulating him en masse even well after the goal over at the bench.
That Foligno tackle scared the hell out of me. Grigs's knee was in a really awkward position when he went down but it slipped under his body and he didn't seem to notice.

Image this: He scores his first goal, gets tackled by a teammate and shreds his knee.

Tim Murray is offline  
Old
02-11-2013, 04:32 PM
  #896
BobDobolina
Registered User
 
BobDobolina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 3,440
vCash: 504
Healthy scratch last night.

Sure looks like they rushed him.

BobDobolina is offline  
Old
02-11-2013, 05:12 PM
  #897
1972
Registered User
 
1972's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,010
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobDobolina View Post
Healthy scratch last night.

Sure looks like they rushed him.

I wouldnt look to much into it, back to back games against the Bruins. Wanted to dress a tougher line up.

1972 is offline  
Old
02-11-2013, 06:30 PM
  #898
jfb392
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,102
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobDobolina View Post
Healthy scratch last night.

Sure looks like they rushed him.
Well, I don't know if the scratch really proves much.
As already mentioned, they probably wanted to go with a tougher lineup against Boston now that they have some of those types healthy.

With that being said, his play is not NHL level yet and yes, I think they rushed him.
There was no reason to waste a cheap year ($925,000) for half of a season when the team was going to be bad.
He's not capable of contributing much right now and it was pretty obvious if you watched him in the Q that this was going to be the case.
The poor decision making shouldn't come as a surprise though since it's the Sabres we're talking about, who are not familiar with having young skilled forwards.
The other center they picked two spots after Grigorenko has been holding down the 3rd and 4th line wing spots in the AHL and has had great success to the tune of two concussions.

jfb392 is offline  
Old
02-11-2013, 06:41 PM
  #899
Deevo
Registered User
 
Deevo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Country: Canada
Posts: 911
vCash: 500
It's hard to say if he's either rushed or being mishandled at this point. He hasn't had a chance to play with any skill on his wing (save a few PP's) thus far. He occasionally will make a sick backhand playmaking attempt to someone who "should" be in the right spot.

Kinda hard to make plays when sharing a line with the likes of Jochen Hecht, John Scott, Pat Kaleta, etc.

Deevo is offline  
Old
02-11-2013, 06:51 PM
  #900
tsujimoto74
Registered User
 
tsujimoto74's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Virginia
Country: United States
Posts: 8,666
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobDobolina View Post
Healthy scratch last night.

Sure looks like they rushed him.
I guess it would look like that if it meant anything, but it doesn't. Grigs had an assist on the game-winner the night before and was a + in each of his last 3. Ruff just wanted to give him a chance to watch the game from above now that he's played it a bit. Plenty of good players were healthy scratches as youngsters. Whether you agree with the process or not is a different question, but this is simply Ruff's way of acclimating him to the pro game.

tsujimoto74 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:58 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.