HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Colorado Avalanche
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Brian Burke

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-30-2013, 09:02 AM
  #26
Tralfamadore
Back down to earth
 
Tralfamadore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,281
vCash: 50
Brian Burke? Hell no. It's not a GM change we need it's a coaching change. Although, I'm sure Burke would show Sacco the door pretty quickly...

Tralfamadore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 09:30 AM
  #27
avsfan09
Registered User
 
avsfan09's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Nova Scotia
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,027
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_fan View Post
Which Sherman's trades have been good?

Maybe some trades worked for a very short time, but show me one that has worked for a long run.

This team is about to miss the playoffs yet another year which doesn't make Sherman a good GM at all.

Edit: All the players he trades for end up getting injured or leave the team.

Varly, Johnson, Mcginn/Sgarbossa, Downie(yes he got injured), Mueller was still better than Wolski it's not his fault he had concussions, Hunwick is useful, and Ryan O'byrne.

It's a little early but Varly and Johnson look like cornerstone pieces in this franchise. Downie will be a very interesting and versatile player. Sgarbossa could be a very good top six forward. I don't think he's made any awful trades, although I don't really understand the Liles trade.

avsfan09 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:01 AM
  #28
TheMobGoesWild
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Country: United States
Posts: 43
vCash: 500
Sherman has been fine. There is no need for them to try and woo Burke.

TheMobGoesWild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:01 AM
  #29
the_fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinDIF View Post
Which type of trade do you think Sherman should be making? We are in a re-build mode with a young group of players who hasn't reached their potential yet. We obviously aren't in a stage when we should make "big trades" which is exactly what Burke did wrong in Toronto. When he refused to accept they were in a re-build mode and did that Kessel trade instead of taking their very high picks themselves.
One obvious trade he should make is Stastny. It's safe to say he reached his potential, and his production has significantly dropped the last 2 years.

He should be traded while still has some value. 6.6 mill a year and no point production isn't gonna help this team in anyway,

Trade Stastny for what this team doesn't have which is a d-man. Good forwards are much easier to find than good d-men.

the_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:06 AM
  #30
avsfan09
Registered User
 
avsfan09's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Nova Scotia
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,027
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_fan View Post
One obvious trade he should make is Stastny. It's safe to say he reached his potential, and his production has significantly dropped the last 2 years.

He should be traded while still has some value. 6.6 mill a year and no point production isn't gonna help this team in anyway,

Trade Stastny for what this team doesn't have which is a d-man. Good forwards are much easier to find than good d-men.
Yeah he should definitely trade Stastny, Duchene and Mitchell would be a much better 1-2 punch.

avsfan09 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:21 AM
  #31
henchman24
#ImagineAvs
 
henchman24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_fan View Post
One obvious trade he should make is Stastny. It's safe to say he reached his potential, and his production has significantly dropped the last 2 years.

He should be traded while still has some value. 6.6 mill a year and no point production isn't gonna help this team in anyway,

Trade Stastny for what this team doesn't have which is a d-man. Good forwards are much easier to find than good d-men.
This trade is only obvious if we have ROR locked up and there are steps being made to repair the relationship. Otherwise our #2C would be one of: a #4C from the NYR last season, a player who looks overmatched at times as a 4th line center, or a 20 year old who isn't ready for that position at a NHL level.

henchman24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:21 AM
  #32
the_fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by avsfan09 View Post
Yeah he should definitely trade Stastny, Duchene and Mitchell would be a much better 1-2 punch.
I bet you Avs would have much more success with Duchene, Mitchell at center but with better d core, than that crappy d core (outside of EJ) with Stastny who doesn't do much to help the team anyway.

Trade Stastny, find a way to sign O'Reilly. Besides, like i said in my other post, it will be easier to find good forwards than d-men.

the_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:31 AM
  #33
mustela
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Country: Sweden
Posts: 289
vCash: 500
this is literally the worst idea i've ever seen on hf

mustela is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:32 AM
  #34
cgf
Registered User
 
cgf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 10,569
vCash: 500
Why?

cgf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:34 AM
  #35
the_fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by avsfan09 View Post
Varly, Johnson, Mcginn/Sgarbossa, Downie(yes he got injured), Mueller was still better than Wolski it's not his fault he had concussions, Hunwick is useful, and Ryan O'byrne.

It's a little early but Varly and Johnson look like cornerstone pieces in this franchise. Downie will be a very interesting and versatile player. Sgarbossa could be a very good top six forward. I don't think he's made any awful trades, although I don't really understand the Liles trade.
That's the only trade i can safely say was a good one and will pay off in long run when or if this organization puts together a solid team. Varly can be a top 10 or top 5 goalie playing for a solid team with solid D.

Mcginn is another average forward who will get you points every now and then, something the Avs have too much of. Too many streaky scorers and lack of consistent scorers.

Jones, Mcginn etc will go one hot streaks but at the same time they will go on very cold streaks where they are frustrating to watch.

Sgarbossa hasn't played a game in the NHL yet, way too early to say who and what he is going to be in the NHL.

I'm not sold on EJ yet, not that impressed with him so far, but i do think he needs a solid partner to reach his potential.

Downie is a good 3rd line forward who plays hard and can get you points, something every team needs unless he's taking stupid penalties, so ok, i'll give this trade a plus so far.

As far as Hunwick, O'byrne i'll put it this way. I'd get rid of everyone on that blue line except for EJ, simple as that.


Last edited by the_fan: 01-30-2013 at 10:42 AM.
the_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:43 AM
  #36
henchman24
#ImagineAvs
 
henchman24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_fan View Post
That's the only trade i can safely say was a good one and will pay off in long run when or if this organization puts together a solid team. Varly can be a top 10 or top 5 goalie playing for a solid team with solid D.

Mcginn is another average forward who will get you points every now and then, something the Avs have too much of. Too many streaky scorers and lack of consistent scorers.

Jones, Mcginn etc will go one hot streaks but at the same time they will go one very cold streaks where they are frustrating to watch.

Sgarbossa hasn't played a game in the NHL yet, way too early to say who and what he is going to be in the NHL.

I'm not sold on EJ yet, not that impressed with him so far, but i do think he needs a solid partner to reach his potential.

Downie is a good 3rd line forward who plays hard and can get you points, something every team needs unless he's taking stupid penalties, so ok, i'll give this trade a plus so far.

As far as Hunwick, O'byrne i'll put it this way. I'd get rid of everyone on that blue line except for EJ, simple as that.
So let me understand this correctly. The McGinn trade isn't a win by your standards?

We gave a a pending UFA that we were not going to resign and a 3rd/4th line winger for at worst a fringe 2nd/3rd line winger and a prospect who has top 6 potential. That trade is a win no matter how you look at it.

McGinn > Gali
Sgarbossa > 2 months of Winnik
Connolly = 7th round pick (I don't think Connolly amounts to anything)

henchman24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:53 AM
  #37
Hennessy
Blank Space
 
Hennessy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Östersund, Sweden
Country: United States
Posts: 6,785
vCash: 1100
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_fan View Post
I bet you Avs would have much more success with Duchene, Mitchell at center but with better d core, than that crappy d core (outside of EJ) with Stastny who doesn't do much to help the team anyway.

Trade Stastny, find a way to sign O'Reilly. Besides, like i said in my other post, it will be easier to find good forwards than d-men.
Yes, which is why so many teams in the league are struggling to find top 6 centers. There's just too many of them.

The Avs have been built around their strength down the middle. And right now there's still a lot of questions concerning that strength. Will Stastny rebound? Will Duchene pan out? Will O'Reilly even be a part of the team again? Once some of those questions are answered, then the Avs can look to cash in one of their centers for help elsewhere. But to blow that up at this point would be a mistake.

Hennessy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 10:57 AM
  #38
the_fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
So let me understand this correctly. The McGinn trade isn't a win by your standards?

We gave a a pending UFA that we were not going to resign and a 3rd/4th line winger for at worst a fringe 2nd/3rd line winger and a prospect who has top 6 potential. That trade is a win no matter how you look at it.

McGinn > Gali
Sgarbossa > 2 months of Winnik
Connolly = 7th round pick (I don't think Connolly amounts to anything)
It might be a win considering who they gave up to get Mcginn, although Winnik is off to a much better start for SJ than Mcginn for the Avs, so i'm not even sure if in fact it is a win. It's just a average trade to me.

This trade is not a impact trade, it's not a trade that will take the Avs to the next step or anything.

We are talking about Sherman, and what he has done so far to improve this team, and my answer is not much.

Improving this team to me means making the playoffs which they haven't done in the last two years, and i highly doubt they are going to make it this year.

the_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:02 AM
  #39
Bender
TheHockeyProspector
 
Bender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,948
vCash: 7658
Sounds like someone is desperate for updates from their GM.

That's not a reason to do this though.

When you consider that the Leafs "rebuild" started BEFORE ours and that we are way further ahead than they are right now, there's no way you can really consider Bryan Burke as a viable candidate for this position. We're fine with Sherman and the others.

Bender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:02 AM
  #40
the_fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hennessy View Post
Yes, which is why so many teams in the league are struggling to find top 6 centers. There's just too many of them.

The Avs have been built around their strength down the middle. And right now there's still a lot of questions concerning that strength. Will Stastny rebound? Will Duchene pan out? Will O'Reilly even be a part of the team again? Once some of those questions are answered, then the Avs can look to cash in one of their centers for help elsewhere. But to blow that up at this point would be a mistake.
You can have all the strength at center, you can have all the depth up front, even star wingers to play with solid centers, but if you have crappy d core you aren't going anywhere, just ask the Caps, or Oilers etc..

The real successful team is built from goalie, to D, then forwards.

the_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:13 AM
  #41
henchman24
#ImagineAvs
 
henchman24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_fan View Post
It might be a win considering who they gave up to get Mcginn, although Winnik is off to a much better start for SJ than Mcginn for the Avs, so i'm not even sure if in fact it is a win. It's just a average trade to me.

This trade is not a impact trade, it's not a trade that will take the Avs to the next step or anything.

We are talking about Sherman, and what he has done so far to improve this team, and my answer is not much.

Improving this team to me means making the playoffs which they haven't done in the last two years, and i highly doubt they are going to make it this year.
Winnik isn't off to a strong start with San Jose, he is with Anaheim though. San Jose lost Winnik for nothing. They got 2 things out of the deal Gali and a 2013 7th round pick.

This isn't an impact trade, nor was it meant to be. It was asset management. It is better to get something for a UFA that you have no plans on re-signing (especially when you are not a contender) than to get nothing at all for him. The Avs got great value out of that trade, and potentially the two best players in the trade.

henchman24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:25 AM
  #42
the_fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
Winnik isn't off to a strong start with San Jose, he is with Anaheim though. San Jose lost Winnik for nothing. They got 2 things out of the deal Gali and a 2013 7th round pick.

This isn't an impact trade, nor was it meant to be. It was asset management. It is better to get something for a UFA that you have no plans on re-signing (especially when you are not a contender) than to get nothing at all for him. The Avs got great value out of that trade, and potentially the two best players in the trade.
Technicalities.. doesn't matter who is he off to a good start with, the fact is that he is off to a better start than the guy he was traded for, but that really doesn't matter to me.

We can evaluate all the little details of Sherman's trades all we want, but the bottom line is this team can't make the playoffs, to me Sherman isn't doing his job period.

When listening to Avs interviews from management to players, they sound so full of themselves and very cocky. They make promises that they are going to be better, stronger, making the playoffs etc.. yet they seem to be worse every year.

After one win they make it sound like this team is the best team in the league, they talk about how they can win every game, then they go on losing the next few games where they don't even look like an AHL team.

When will Sherman realize this team needs some good d-men, when will he realize this team needs a better coach? who knows, maybe he realizes but his hands are tied and not much he can do about it, or maybe he's just not a good GM.

the_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:29 AM
  #43
RobinDIF
Reunite ROR & Landy!
 
RobinDIF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Stockholm
Country: Sweden
Posts: 4,288
vCash: 500
Winnik was a UFA.

Galiardi and McGinn was the RFA's of that trade. So it's more right to say that we traded Galiardi for him IMO.

And then Winnik(UFA) and a 7th for two prospects.

RobinDIF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:35 AM
  #44
henchman24
#ImagineAvs
 
henchman24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_fan View Post
Technicalities.. doesn't matter who is he off to a good start with, the fact is that he is off to a better start than the guy he was traded for, but that really doesn't matter to me.

We can evaluate all the little details of Sherman's trades all we want, but the bottom line is this team can't make the playoffs, to me Sherman isn't doing his job period.

When listening to Avs interviews from management to players, they sound so full of themselves and very cocky. They make promises that they are going to be better, stronger, making the playoffs etc.. yet they seem to be worse every year.

After one win they make it sound like this team is the best team in the league, they talk about how they can win every game, then they go on losing the next few games where they don't even look like an AHL team.

When will Sherman realize this team needs some good d-men, when will he realize this team needs a better coach? who knows, maybe he realizes but his hands are tied and not much he can do about it, or maybe he's just not a good GM.
It isn't a technicality when there was NO chance that we were going to resign Winnik. Also, we all know what Winnik is. He is a very good 3rd line winger who can kill penalties and has hands of stone. He is a 10-12g 15-18a sort of player. A hot streak can happen for any player. Hell, Sam Gagner scored 17% of his points in one game (23% in 2) last season, that doesn't make him Gretzky because he tied his record.

We all agree that this team needs to make a push for the playoffs, but when you lose 3 players out of your top 6/9 you are going to have a difficult time winning hockey games. Only 1 of those 3 is the fault of management, and that isn't 100% their fault.

The biggest issue on this team is defensemen, and there has been an effort to improve that area (EJ trade, Hejda signing). They just haven't panned out to what we all expect at the moment. When EJ finds his consistency, he will be great. Beyond that something needs to be done about the defense, and I'm sure by the end of the season we will be trading somebody for an upgrade at that position.

henchman24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:44 AM
  #45
Drij
Registered User
 
Drij's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,661
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyGod View Post
What is everyone's thoughts on bringing in Brian Burke and showing Sherman the door.

With the assets we currently have I think he could make this team a contender quickly.

Of coarse this would be under the assumption that we would be a fricken cap team again.

Would you be in favor of Burkie as our GM?
No way in hell do we need Burke. Burke is a bum.

Drij is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:45 AM
  #46
the_fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
It isn't a technicality when there was NO chance that we were going to resign Winnik. Also, we all know what Winnik is. He is a very good 3rd line winger who can kill penalties and has hands of stone. He is a 10-12g 15-18a sort of player. A hot streak can happen for any player. Hell, Sam Gagner scored 17% of his points in one game (23% in 2) last season, that doesn't make him Gretzky because he tied his record.

We all agree that this team needs to make a push for the playoffs, but when you lose 3 players out of your top 6/9 you are going to have a difficult time winning hockey games. Only 1 of those 3 is the fault of management, and that isn't 100% their fault.

The biggest issue on this team is defensemen, and there has been an effort to improve that area (EJ trade, Hejda signing). They just haven't panned out to what we all expect at the moment. When EJ finds his consistency, he will be great. Beyond that something needs to be done about the defense, and I'm sure by the end of the season we will be trading somebody for an upgrade at that position.
No, by technicalities i meant i made a mistake saying Winnik is off to a good start with SJ instead of the Ducks, i forgot he left SJ and you had to correct me.

Lets not use injuries as an excuse. Pens made the playoffs when both Malkin and Crosby were out with injuries.

Good teams will find a way, but you do need defense, goaltending, and very good coaching to over come injuries up front and make the playoffs.

Avs do have the goalie, but they don't have the defense nor the coaching to overcome injuries to their forwards.

But even without the injuries, this team can't make the playoffs. The coaching is awful, there is no specialty team system, or any system that this team can rely on to win enough games to make the playoffs.

And it's worth mentioning again, that D is just the worst d core in the league.

the_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:46 AM
  #47
Commander Enigma
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 4,396
vCash: 500
The existence of this thread is somewhat akin to someone seriously positing a question on a politics forum if John Boehner should have been considered as Obama's running mate.

Commander Enigma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:53 AM
  #48
henchman24
#ImagineAvs
 
henchman24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,745
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_fan View Post
No, by technicalities i meant i made a mistake saying Winnik is off to a good start with SJ instead of the Ducks, i forgot he left SJ and you had to correct me.
But you fail to understand that Winnik was in no way in the plans of what the Avs were going to do. If he wasn't traded, he would have signed with Anaheim anyway. His production from the beginning of the season on should have absolutely no impact on how the trade is viewed. If he had re-signed with San Jose, you could possibly argue that his further production could be included.

henchman24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 11:57 AM
  #49
Ivan13
Avs/Habs fan
 
Ivan13's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Zagreb
Country: Croatia
Posts: 13,487
vCash: 50
Burke working under the puppet master? Is this real life?

Ivan13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-30-2013, 12:04 PM
  #50
the_fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
But you fail to understand that Winnik was in no way in the plans of what the Avs were going to do. If he wasn't traded, he would have signed with Anaheim anyway. His production from the beginning of the season on should have absolutely no impact on how the trade is viewed. If he had re-signed with San Jose, you could possibly argue that his further production could be included.
I'm in no way concerned about losing Winnik or Galiardi. Do I want better wingers than McGinn or Jones on the Avs? Yes I do. If you ask me, I want someone like Kovalchuk on this team. But my main concern with this team is defense and coaching.

the_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:43 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.