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Райан О'Рейли: In Soviet Ontario Offer Sheets Sign You; Rayan's 3rd Thread

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:05 PM
  #26
S E P H
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Originally Posted by kenfury View Post
This really reminds me of the Mike Peca situation 10 years ago. Would Colarado be interested in a package consisting of say Ennis (2nd line C/W) + Choice of McNabb/Jerome Gauthier-Leduc (Top 2 d prospects) or more like a Myers for RoR+ ?

Also as a total aside when I lived on the east coast we called ham pepper and onion omelets westerns. When I moved to the west coast we called them Denver omelets. What are they called in Denver?
G T F O

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01-30-2013, 03:05 PM
  #27
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Well this new information, *IF TRUE, definitely changes things and puts the onus on management to either get it done or get something for him sooner rather than later.

*I'm just curious why we haven't heard about this AT ALL from any other media outlets whatsoever?? Wondering if Dater somehow got the WRONG information about this and it's DRAFTED players who DON'T SIGN 2 years after being selected can become UFAs instead of this now being carried over to RFAs??

Seems to me, if this was changed, we would have heard grumblings about this from NHL owners DURING the lockout about how much leverage they are losing with RFAs.


Last edited by Bender: 01-30-2013 at 03:16 PM.
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Old
01-30-2013, 03:08 PM
  #28
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Is there any more bi-polar beat reporter than Dater.

One week it's "Offer is fair. O'Reilly should sign" and next week it's "What are Avs management doing? They always screw up".

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:09 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Is there any more bi-polar beat reporter than Dater.

One week it's "Offer is fair. O'Reilly should sign" and next week it's "What are Avs management doing? They always screw up".
Funny, I thought the same thing.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:10 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
Well this new information, *IF TRUE, definitely changes things and puts the onus on management to either get it done or get something for him sooner rather than later.

*I'm just curious why we haven't heard about this AT ALL from any other media outlets whatsoever?? Wondering if Dater somehow got the WRONG information about his and it's DRAFTED players who DON'T SIGN 2 years after being selected can become UFAs instead of this now being carried over to RFAs??

Seems to me, if this was changed, we would have heard grumblings about this from NHL owners DURING the lockout about how much leverage they are losing with RFAs.
Yeah, It does seem a bit odd. We would have heard a lot more about RFA's signing two year deals in Russia with the intentions of coming back to the NHL to become UFA's at age 22-23. I can't see the owners ever agreeing to this.

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01-30-2013, 03:12 PM
  #31
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well. if nothing else. i've really enjoyed the thread titles for the RoR threads.

RoR for Ovechkin. Get it done! (sarcastic post, please no serious replies)

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:12 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Is there any more bi-polar beat reporter than Dater.

One week it's "Offer is fair. O'Reilly should sign" and next week it's "What are Avs management doing? They always screw up".
I like AD, but I agree that he does seem to go back and forth on this matter too much for my liking.

The two year rule is interesting. As others have noted, it is also interesting that only AD has reported it. It seems like a potentially massive loophole that the owners received the shaft on.

Imagine a Russian player Kulikov decides he will not sign a new deal as a RFA and simply plays in the KHL for two years, make large money, and then return to the NHL as a UFA at the age of 23 or 24. I have a hard time believing that the owners agreed to this loophole.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:13 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by S E P H View Post
G T F O
Please I would rather not give up McNabb but you have to give to get. I'm really not talking about specific players more along the lines of a framework.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:15 PM
  #34
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I guess there might be some stipulation that if you reach an impasse and the player can show the team isn't negotiating in good faith or some thing like that, that there might be some mechanic that kicks in.

But I remain very skeptical that O'Reilly would be able to become an UFA if Avs keeps offering him a fair contract. I think Dater needs to provide some source for this if that is his claim.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:16 PM
  #35
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Please I would rather not give up McNabb but you have to give to get. I'm really not talking about specific players more along the lines of a framework.
Dude, if you do your research, you'd know we want nothing whatsoever to do with McNabb.

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01-30-2013, 03:16 PM
  #36
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Please I would rather not give up McNabb but you have to give to get. I'm really not talking about specific players more along the lines of a framework.
McNabb put our player Hishon in the hospital and he hasn't played since.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:17 PM
  #37
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Please I would rather not give up McNabb but you have to give to get. I'm really not talking about specific players more along the lines of a framework.
McNabb elbowed Hishon, having Hison miss 1.5 year of hockey at this point. He's not a popular guy around here.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:21 PM
  #38
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None of those situations are even close to being analogous to this. Bruno wasn't even offered a contract and Lappy got more money elsewhere. Both of these guys were older players and Avs were going younger.

Avs wanted to sign Hendricks to a two-way contract and when he didn't want that he was let go, but let's not pretend he was some super asset Avs screwed up here. Hendricks wasn't offered a contract by a single team that summer and was a camp invite with Caps.
I was only attempting to post a list of the people who left for various reasons.

Yes the Avs didn't offer a contract to Bruno, but reports were that he wanted to stay.

Lappy wanted to stay, but the Avs wouldn't budge on their offer.

The basis was that the Avs have a perceived value of these players, and won't budge on that perceived value. Whether that's fair or not to the player, that's always a case by case basis.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:30 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
McNabb elbowed Hishon, having Hison miss 1.5 year of hockey at this point. He's not a popular guy around here.
Ahh.. I understand. I forgot you guys had Hishon. That was a bit of a dirty hit. It is not like he lead with his elbow or anything...

Seriously though, what do you call the omelet in Denver?

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01-30-2013, 03:32 PM
  #40
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It's a bit more clear on why he wouldn't even consider signing a team's offer sheet, right?

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:32 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by kenfury View Post
Ahh.. I understand.

Seriously though, what do you call the omelet in Denver?
I've always known it as a Denver omelette, but have also seen it called Southwestern or Western (only back east have I seen it that way).

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:34 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by RockLobster View Post
I was only attempting to post a list of the people who left for various reasons.

Yes the Avs didn't offer a contract to Bruno, but reports were that he wanted to stay.

Lappy wanted to stay, but the Avs wouldn't budge on their offer.

The basis was that the Avs have a perceived value of these players, and won't budge on that perceived value. Whether that's fair or not to the player, that's always a case by case basis.
No doubt you could make the case for Avs would have been better off keeping some of the players they have let go, but I don't see how you can make the case that Avs have this history of being unreasonable and creating conflict with players over negotiations like Dater tries to do.

Disagreeing about the value of a player is perfectly normal and not an act of hostility. From either side. I don't think Avs are malicious here and I don't think O'Reilly is either. I do think them not being able to get a deal done reflects poorly on both sides here, when it's obvious there is a compromise to be reached. But I don't think it reflects poorly on either of them on a personal level, just as businessmen.

There is a fine line between being principled and being stubborn and it does seem, from the outside, that both sides are very close to being on the wrong side of it here.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:36 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
It's a bit more clear on why he wouldn't even consider signing a team's offer sheet, right?
Not really. Holding out for 2 seasons just to get to UFA status just screams that he could be a poisonous player to deal with like a Radulov (fair or unfair holding out for that long makes a player look very bad). After that he still wouldn't get the big deal he is looking for. Something more like a 1 year 3m deal, and if he did well possibly a long extension. That is a lot of risk to take, just to get a better deal. The only way he wouldn't lose a bunch of money on that deal is if he played in the KHL, which might further sour his stock.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:40 PM
  #44
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It's a bit more clear on why he wouldn't even consider signing a team's offer sheet, right?
If you are referring to the two year rule that Dater is reporting, I would say it is no less clear. I don't think what he is reporting is accurate.

The owners would still be proceeding in a lockout over such a rule.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:43 PM
  #45
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I'm certain Dater is WRONG AGAIN on this, we'd of heard so much of a stink about this during the lockout, it wouldn't even have been funny.

This is what I found by digging a bit:

A potential stumbling block, however, is that by missing an entire NHL season, the player still wouldn’t be any closer to UFA status or arbitration status, as HNiC’s Glenn Healy recently noted in discussing the current contract negotiations of O’Reilly and Montreal Canadiens defenseman P.K. Subban.


http://spectorshockey.net/blog/could...-rfa-holdouts/

Not a big fan of Healy but I'm pretty sure he knows more about the CBA than Dater.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:50 PM
  #46
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It's a bit more clear on why he wouldn't even consider signing a team's offer sheet, right?
No, it is not. Even if Dater is correct (I have my doubts), O'Reilly would be willing to sit out two full seasons just to become an UFA? What kind of contract does he think he'll get at that time? Him and/or his agent appear to be very delusional.

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01-30-2013, 03:51 PM
  #47
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That panic stricken Dater.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:58 PM
  #48
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that can't be true. how the hell can a player sit out two years and reach UFA by not accruing any service time.
but if ROR wants to sit out two years and play chicken i say the Avs call his bluff and make his ass lose two years of his career.
he'll cost himself more money this way.

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Old
01-30-2013, 03:59 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
It's a bit more clear on why he wouldn't even consider signing a team's offer sheet, right?
If what Dater says is true, it's clearer why he signed a two year deal in Russia. And if I'm not tin-foil worthy right now, he deserves to be shipped out of town - preferably to Long Island.

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Old
01-30-2013, 04:00 PM
  #50
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Paul Ranger had to wait until now to sign anywhere because TB wouldn't trade his rights, I can't imagine O'Reilly will wait 6 years.

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