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Phoenix LXIX: Thread of LXIX

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Old
01-30-2013, 05:26 PM
  #876
Glacial
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I'm surprised how many posts this topic has generated. About time for chapter 70 in this epic. Will LXX even last to February 1st?

LXX? Hmmm. LXXing one's wounds?

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01-30-2013, 05:31 PM
  #877
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Originally Posted by CasualFan View Post
Whatever JIG came up with, it sure doesn't seem to be appealing to the league. But, they're out of time, which might motivation for the league to accept this last best offer, even if it's a gum and duct tape plan.

Unless, maybe, the new Glendale council will enjoy the soft glow and smooth tones of Gary B as much as the old council did...
Gary B in Frank Sinatra voice:

"Strangers in the Night,
Exchanging glances,
Strangers in the Night,
What were the chances?
That we'd be needing a bigger subsidy from youuuuu"""

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Old
01-30-2013, 05:31 PM
  #878
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Originally Posted by viper0220 View Post
I don't know what to believe anymore, Leburn is saying they move the Coyotes to Seattle and give expansion teams to Toronto and Quebec City. Daly is saying there is no plans for expansion and I though that if the Coyotes moved they could move to Quebec City.
IMHO, it goes without saying that the league will make the most money through expansion fees from Toronto + Quebec versus Toronto + Seattle. That's one of the reasons why they're doing everything in their power to prop the Coyotes up until Seattle (or another US market) is ready for relocation.

I think it's safe to assume the league has two scenarios with regards to expansion/relocation:
  • Plan A. -> Expand into Toronto and Quebec in the next 5 years once both arenas are completed (say $400-500 million in Toronto/$250-300 million in Quebec); relocate Phoenix or another struggling team (if necessary) to Seattle.
  • Plan B. -> Relocate Phoenix to Quebec for next season (if necessary) and play out of Colisée until new arena is ready; expand into Toronto and Seattle (say $400-500 million in Toronto/$150-200 million in Seattle).
Ideally, the league wants to roll with Plan A, as this nets them the most money via expansion fees and this option avoids the optics of the NHL having to move two teams to Canada from struggling Southern US markets over the past three seasons (Atlanta and Phoenix). Plan A can take effect over the next 5+ years; whatever time it takes for these new markets to build new arenas.

IF things don't work out in Phoenix, Plan B may have to go into effect over the summer. This is a rushed approach, à la Atl -> Wpg, with the added complications of having to play out of an antiquated arena for a couple seasons until the new arena in Quebec is complete. All signs out of Quebec point to this happening with whatever Colisée upgrades that have taken place/been put on hold (similar to what True North went through with minor upgrades to the MTS Center a year or so before they had the team back -> 2nd press box level, upgraded ice plant, team practice facility, etc).

As was the case with Winnipeg, Quebec has been told to "get ready" through relocation or expansion. It's up to Jamison and the COG to decide whether it's the former or the latter.


Last edited by ahplk: 01-30-2013 at 05:42 PM.
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01-30-2013, 05:32 PM
  #879
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I assume no word today, right?
No, nothing I can find. Just googled it. Up to the minute. Nada as of 4:31PM MST.

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01-30-2013, 05:33 PM
  #880
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Originally Posted by CasualFan View Post
Bettman is aboard Ice Force One... circling over LA now, waiting to get the all clear to land in Glendale, make the big announcement during the game tonight...
Casual, I think you're following the wrong plane.


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01-30-2013, 05:37 PM
  #881
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Originally Posted by viper0220 View Post
I don't know what to believe anymore, Leburn is saying they move the Coyotes to Seattle and give expansion teams to Toronto and Quebec City. Daly is saying there is no plans for expansion and I though that if the Coyotes moved they could move to Quebec City.
If they move the team to Seattle, I'm not giving the NHL a single penny until Quebec City gets a team. That means I will cancel my Center Ice subscription and rely on streams to watch the Pens.

It would make no sense to give them the team NOW when they have no suitable temporary venue and the construction of their arena hasn't started yet. Key Arena isn't a suitable hockey arena.

What would make sense if the Coyotes are to move is:

- Move the team to Quebec City.
- Expand to Seattle and Markham when their arenas are ready.

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01-30-2013, 05:45 PM
  #882
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Originally Posted by David_99 View Post
Casual, I think you're following the wrong plane.

Aren't you... barking up the wrong tree? Unless the Coyotes will be going to Catalina Island! Due to being an offshore island, it falls outside the Kings & Anaheim's territory. The Catalina Coyotes! With a population of 3700, there's more than enough people there to pack the house.

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01-30-2013, 05:51 PM
  #883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by howlinhockey View Post
to be fair Im responsible for about 300. I like to poke and create a stir but a few of you went over the line.

As far as future destinations I believe Seattle and their NBA combo will get the next relocation...just hope not us.

Toronto north and Quebec City will get the next 2 franchise expansions as the NHL will charge them a hefty fee to come in. My thoughts echoed by NHL media types who feel even stronger about this. Seattle has been my thought. The rest Not my original idea
Seattle, if it does, WILL BE two different owners, same arena, it's not needed to bring the NBA to Seattle/SODO

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01-30-2013, 05:52 PM
  #884
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Originally Posted by howlinhockey View Post
As far as future destinations I believe Seattle and their NBA combo will get the next relocation...just hope not us.... Toronto north and Quebec City will get the next 2 franchise expansions as the NHL will charge them a hefty fee to come in. My thoughts echoed by NHL media types who feel even stronger about this. Seattle has been my thought. The rest Not my original idea
It would certainly make a lot more sense to maximize revenues and profitability for the entire league, all 30 teams to receive unencumbered Expansion Fee's from Southern Ontario & Quebec, no question about that. Fact is, we really dont know what the destination might or might not be should Jamison fail to close, extension refused, announcement made by Jamison & the NHL tomorrow or Friday "still working on it" until the lights dim, last game of the truncated season over. Maybe they can cut a deal with the new Council, including an out clause, lowered Arena Management Fee, franchise is portable within 36-49mnths if targets arent met (coinciding with the opening of brand new facilities in Quebec & Seattle come 2015). Anythings possible if this deal craters. Not the end of the World. Birth of a new reality. Never give up hope Coyote fans.

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01-30-2013, 05:53 PM
  #885
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Originally Posted by ahplk View Post
IMHO, it goes without saying that the league will make the most money through expansion fees from Toronto + Quebec versus Toronto + Seattle. That's one of the reasons why they're doing everything in their power to prop the Coyotes up until Seattle (or another US market) is ready for relocation.

I think it's safe to assume the league has two scenarios with regards to expansion/relocation:
  • Plan A. -> Expand into Toronto and Quebec in the next 5 years once both arenas are completed (say $400-500 million in Toronto/$250-300 million in Quebec); relocate Phoenix or another struggling team (if necessary) to Seattle.
  • Plan B. -> Relocate Phoenix to Quebec for next season (if necessary) and play out of Colisée until new arena is ready; expand into Toronto and Seattle (say $400-500 million in Toronto/$150-200 million in Seattle).
Ideally, the league wants to roll with Plan A, as this nets them the most money via expansion fees and this option avoids the optics of the NHL having to move two teams to Canada from struggling Southern US markets over the past three seasons (Atlanta and Phoenix). Plan A can take effect over the next 5+ years; whatever time it takes for these new markets to build new arenas.

IF things don't work out in Phoenix, Plan B may have to go into effect over the summer. This is a rushed approach, à la Atl -> Wpg, with the added complications of having to play out of an antiquated arena for a couple seasons until the new arena in Quebec is complete. All signs out of Quebec point to this happening with whatever Colisée upgrades that have taken place/been put on hold (similar to what True North went through with minor upgrades to the MTS Center a year or so before they had the team back -> 2nd press box level, upgraded ice plant, team practice facility, etc).

As was the case with Winnipeg, Quebec has been told to "get ready" through relocation or expansion. It's up to Jamison and the COG to decide whether it's the former or the latter.
I continue to not understand the difference in the markets.

If QC is worth 250 - 300 as an expansion fee, are they not worth 250 - 300 now, as a sale and relocation?? Why is that different?

If Seattle is worth 150 - 200 as an expansion, they can't be worth any more as a sale and relo, right?

So, how does the league come out with more money if they "Save QC for expansion"?

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01-30-2013, 05:56 PM
  #886
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ESPN says Jamison won't purchase team, there is "another group" that will.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/88...ording-sources

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01-30-2013, 06:00 PM
  #887
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Originally Posted by MNNumbers View Post
I continue to not understand the difference in the markets.

If QC is worth 250 - 300 as an expansion fee, are they not worth 250 - 300 now, as a sale and relocation?? Why is that different?

If Seattle is worth 150 - 200 as an expansion, they can't be worth any more as a sale and relo, right?

So, how does the league come out with more money if they "Save QC for expansion"?
People are watching what they believe to be a Seattle group overpaying for the Sacramento Kings by probably $50 million in cash / $80-90 million in valuation. Of course, I'm betting numbers have already been whispered to "those who matter."

(Fresh out of Catalina jokes)

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01-30-2013, 06:00 PM
  #888
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Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
ESPN says Jamison won't purchase team, there is "another group" that will.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/88...ording-sources
another group ??

OMG

It's a Never Ending Story !!!!!!!!!

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01-30-2013, 06:02 PM
  #889
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Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
ESPN says Jamison won't purchase team, there is "another group" that will.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/88...ording-sources
Ahhhh!!!! The revolving door continues to spin round and round.

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Old
01-30-2013, 06:03 PM
  #890
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Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
ESPN says Jamison won't purchase team, there is "another group" that will.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/88...ording-sources
Oh FFS. Are we saying another "white knight" bites the dust in the desert

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01-30-2013, 06:03 PM
  #891
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Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
ESPN says Jamison won't purchase team, there is "another group" that will.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/88...ording-sources
Ohhhh this is so utterly predictable.

Principal investors are Covering TheNHLsAss and Please KeepBuyingTickets.

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01-30-2013, 06:03 PM
  #892
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Wow... One nut caused all of these pages. 14 since I was last on. Every old argument rehashed in a 300 post nostalgia marathon.

Geezus

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01-30-2013, 06:05 PM
  #893
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Burnside has been the NHL's flag waver from the beginning on this, but passing this latest line of crap on from Bettman's office is just embarrassing. So very embarrassing.

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01-30-2013, 06:05 PM
  #894
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Originally Posted by rt View Post
Nailed it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
ESPN says Jamison won't purchase team, there is "another group" that will.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/88...ording-sources
Close enough.

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Old
01-30-2013, 06:06 PM
  #895
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Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
ESPN says Jamison won't purchase team, there is "another group" that will.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/88...ording-sources
Ooooo. Some substance. This whole thread's been junk food snacks to date. Let me guess, the name of this "other group" is PKP?

Burnside... wasn't that an admiral or general in the Civil War?

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01-30-2013, 06:07 PM
  #896
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People are watching what they believe to be a Seattle group overpaying for the Sacramento Kings by probably $50 million in cash / $80-90 million in valuation. Of course, I'm betting numbers have already been whispered to "those who matter."

(Fresh out of Catalina jokes)
Rename the team "The ****ing Catalina Wine Mixers"

POW! PO-POW-POW!

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01-30-2013, 06:08 PM
  #897
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Originally Posted by JimAnchower View Post
ESPN says Jamison won't purchase team, there is "another group" that will.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/88...ording-sources
oh come on.

another 'another' group???

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01-30-2013, 06:08 PM
  #898
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Phoenix LXX: Day One

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01-30-2013, 06:09 PM
  #899
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Burnside... wasn't that an admiral or general in the Civil War?
Indeed, Ambrose Burnside was. Think the term "sideburns" were named after him.

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01-30-2013, 06:10 PM
  #900
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This is beyond a big joke. MOVE THE TEAM.

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