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Paul Kelly says QC & Toronto to get expansion teams; Daly disputes assertion

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Old
01-30-2013, 05:17 PM
  #126
Ryan34222
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Originally Posted by G Dawg View Post
So now attendance matters? You just argued that it didn't matter; only sell-outs did? So which is it?

Better work on your trolling game before you step up to the G Dawg.
i'm arguing that Toronto's attendance isnt great yes.

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01-30-2013, 05:26 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Ryan34222 View Post
i'm arguing that Toronto's attendance isnt great yes.
No you aren't. You just said that even though Toronto had the #1 and #2 highest attended UFC events in all of 2011 and the #3 highest North American event in 2012, it didn't matter because the most recent event didn't sell-out. So, by your argument, being #1 isn't good enough. If it doesn't sell-out 100% of the time, it's a flop. And by that logic, the Yankees, the Knicks, the Rangers, the Giants, and the Jets are all flops. Man, New York teams must be in real trouble.

Now you are trying to switch to another argument because you lost that one.

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01-30-2013, 06:05 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by G Dawg View Post
No you aren't. You just said that even though Toronto had the #1 and #2 highest attended UFC events in all of 2011 and the #3 highest North American event in 2012, it didn't matter because the most recent event didn't sell-out. So, by your argument, being #1 isn't good enough. If it doesn't sell-out 100% of the time, it's a flop. And by that logic, the Yankees, the Knicks, the Rangers, the Giants, and the Jets are all flops. Man, New York teams must be in real trouble.

Now you are trying to switch to another argument because you lost that one.
lost what arguement? that Toronto has great attendance because the UFC drew 18000 and than 16000? im certainly not arguing about NY being great but its certainly better than Toronto

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01-30-2013, 06:24 PM
  #129
Confucius
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Originally Posted by Ryan34222 View Post
lost what arguement? that Toronto has great attendance because the UFC drew 18000 and than 16000? im certainly not arguing about NY being great but its certainly better than Toronto
How about 1.4 million over 18 days.

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Old
01-30-2013, 06:48 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by DyerMaker66 View Post
Bingo: He's revealing what he wants to be revealed in the way he wants you to hear it. Just like when they basically denied the Thrashers were moving until the day before it happened.
If you knew how to read bettmanese you knew the team was gone before the season's half point.

Bettmanese is easy to read. Try to make sense of what Bernie Ecclestone says and you'll see that Bettman is still pretty straightforward.

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01-30-2013, 07:13 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Ryan34222 View Post
lost what arguement? that Toronto has great attendance because the UFC drew 18000 and than 16000?
You argued that Toronto didn't have good UFC attendance. You were proven wrong, so you changed your argument to focus on sell-outs. You were once again proven wrong with that argument, so you switched back to the attendance argument (where you had already been proven wrong).

The G Dawg has got your number, breh. He's got you running in circles.

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Old
01-30-2013, 07:47 PM
  #132
No Fun Shogun
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Not for nothing, but I'm expecting the NHL to deny that they're interested in expanding as late as a few minutes before they officially announce an expansion.

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01-30-2013, 07:51 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by tony d View Post
If the NHL does expand I doubt it will go to 2 Canadian cities. I think you'll see NHL expansion to 2 of Quebec City, Houston, Seattle, Las Vegas or Kansas City.
Kansas City is like Dallas Lite. They add nothing that Houston doesn't add, and then some.

And Las Vegas definitely isn't happening. That market's been hammered by the recession more than just about any city in the nation and they have zero arena prospects on the horizon.

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01-30-2013, 08:12 PM
  #134
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There will be future expansion but my guess is not for a whille because with half the NHL's teams lossing money & just comming off a nasty lockout I don't think the NHL. is in any shape to expand right now . So my guess is the NHL. might expand by 4 teams in about 10 years when the NHL. can pull there heads out there ***** & get there act together until that happens the closes we are going to see to expansion is relocations & there are plenty of teams ripe for relocation .

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Old
01-30-2013, 08:21 PM
  #135
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Think about people:

I bet that many of you who grasp at this expansion idea are the same people who likely think that the Coyotes will be relocated. If there is a relocation to, and many people believe, Quebec City, then there won't be an expansion to Quebec City. And if there's no expansion to QC, then the 2nd possible expansion site, wherever it might be, hasn't even been confirmed to be in process of getting ready for an NHL team yet. So depending on what happens in Phoenix, I'd say that you should all just hold your horses.

Besides, the 4-Division alignment proposal didn't directly have diddly to do with expansion, it had to do with trying to fit Quebec City in an Eastern alignment in case the Coyotes had to be relocated.

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01-30-2013, 08:25 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by No Fun Shogun View Post
Kansas City is like Dallas Lite. They add nothing that Houston doesn't add, and then some.
Implying what? A growing youth base that plays hockey in the winter and soccer in the summer? Population growth based around tech and medical? Silicon Prairie is happening here, hell, I'm part of it. I have a stupid disposable income that I'm willing to waste on hockey and plenty of others are as well. Cerner keeps on expanding and god knows what else Google and partners have planned for us.

The potential for the city is on the up and up when it comes to a winter months sport. The crossover with Sporting KC would be beneficial, probably increase revenues. I'm telling you right now that if someone took a chance, brought in a team that was a winner, they would succeed because this city is so starved for winners. Need proof? Just look at KC Wizards to Sporting Kansas City rebrand and new stadium. We're hardly Dallas Lite sweetheart.

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01-30-2013, 08:31 PM
  #137
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Kansas city had a franchise in early 70's so there is some knowledge of the game at top level they've had a ahl team for years.They have the soccer team an nfl team.They have Team Tom Watson but I want to exclude the baseball team because its been over a decade since they have had a real team maybe when they had George Brett.

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01-30-2013, 08:52 PM
  #138
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I really don't want to see anymore teams at this point. I want to see more NHL teams with more offensive depth before I want to see any expansion team in the NHL.

And to those in favor, why would you want more teams when all that's going to do is make it less likely your team wins the cup?

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01-30-2013, 08:55 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by NeelyWasAWarrior View Post
I really don't want to see anymore teams at this point. I want to see more NHL teams with more offensive depth before I want to see any expansion team in the NHL.

And to those in favor, why would you want more teams when all that's going to do is make it less likely your team wins the cup?
Oh sure now you mention that, where were you in 67.

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01-30-2013, 09:05 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by G Dawg View Post
You argued that Toronto didn't have good UFC attendance. You were proven wrong, so you changed your argument to focus on sell-outs. You were once again proven wrong with that argument, so you switched back to the attendance argument (where you had already been proven wrong).

The G Dawg has got your number, breh. He's got you running in circles.
Actually sir Dawg I'm still waiting on the proof about Toronto having great attendance.

I don't see how selling 18000 and 16000 to UFC events is proof either when Max seating I believe is 19+

It's a bad trend
50000
18000
16000
The shine is wearing off of UFC events. Attendance Should be down to the 13-14000 for the next UFC event.

You can pm me if you like cuz I feel the mods will be handing out infractions soon if we keep this up.

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01-30-2013, 09:12 PM
  #141
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The Coyotes hav e an arena that only a few years old.

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01-30-2013, 09:13 PM
  #142
Ryan34222
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Originally Posted by NeelyWasAWarrior View Post
And to those in favor, why would you want more teams when all that's going to do is make it less likely your team wins the cup?
Well not exactly. I don't have a team so adding a team in Hamilton would actually improve my favourite teams chances.
Also, and I'm speaking for the Leafs fans here. Can you actually get lower than 0 percent chance of winning cup?

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01-30-2013, 09:21 PM
  #143
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I think there are two lies being told here.

Lie #1: The NHL won't expand. I'm sure the owners have heavily considered two more teams, but the US economic downturn the past four years created a less than ideal situation for expansion. It will happen eventually.

Lie #2: The idea that Kelly was informed exactly where the NHL would expand doesn't seem credible to me. The league has always accepted bid proposals for new teams, to be reviewed and decided by the owners. That the owners had already decided on two locations without arenas seems terribly unlikely, not to mention a violation of basic business principles.

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01-30-2013, 09:22 PM
  #144
No Fun Shogun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSmokingPun View Post
Implying what? A growing youth base that plays hockey in the winter and soccer in the summer? Population growth based around tech and medical? Silicon Prairie is happening here, hell, I'm part of it. I have a stupid disposable income that I'm willing to waste on hockey and plenty of others are as well. Cerner keeps on expanding and god knows what else Google and partners have planned for us.

The potential for the city is on the up and up when it comes to a winter months sport. The crossover with Sporting KC would be beneficial, probably increase revenues. I'm telling you right now that if someone took a chance, brought in a team that was a winner, they would succeed because this city is so starved for winners. Need proof? Just look at KC Wizards to Sporting Kansas City rebrand and new stadium. We're hardly Dallas Lite sweetheart.
Significantly smaller population base, significantly smaller corporate presence, significantly less money, etc.

So yeah, Kansas City is Houston Lite when it comes to the NHL. They add nothing that the Houston doesn't also bring to the table by a significantly greater margin.

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01-30-2013, 09:35 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Ryan34222 View Post
Actually sir Dawg I'm still waiting on the proof about Toronto having great attendance.

I don't see how selling 18000 and 16000 to UFC events is proof either when Max seating I believe is 19+
The last Toronto event was the 3rd most attended UFC even in North America for all of 2012. What part of that are you "not seeing"?

You were proven wrong. Using incorrect numbers and refusing to accept you were wrong won't change anything. It's nice to see that you've reverted to the sell-out argument once again though. The G Dawg literally has you spinning around and around and around.

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01-30-2013, 09:48 PM
  #146
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Not for nothing, but Kelly doesn't really seem to be the kind of guy to tell a lie just for the heck of it.

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01-30-2013, 09:48 PM
  #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan34222 View Post
Actually sir Dawg I'm still waiting on the proof about Toronto having great attendance.

I don't see how selling 18000 and 16000 to UFC events is proof either when Max seating I believe is 19+

It's a bad trend
50000
18000
16000
The shine is wearing off of UFC events. Attendance Should be down to the 13-14000 for the next UFC event.

You can pm me if you like cuz I feel the mods will be handing out infractions soon if we keep this up.
well the ACC can't hold 50,000

that was at skydome


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01-30-2013, 10:16 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by No Fun Shogun View Post
Significantly smaller population base, significantly smaller corporate presence, significantly less money, etc.

So yeah, Kansas City is Houston Lite when it comes to the NHL. They add nothing that the Houston doesn't also bring to the table by a significantly greater margin.
Yes but it's north of dallas, not south, it's expansion into more northern tv markets, combined with lesser competition from other sports is a big bonus.

Also if the team does fail, it can be branded as the place is too small to support a team, if houston fails, it'll be the 3rd major population center in the sunbelt to loose a team.

That kind of failure could really ruin the sport in southern areas.

Granted I think houston is gonna be first to get a team, I just think KC is far better.

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01-30-2013, 10:18 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by G Dawg View Post
The last Toronto event was the 3rd most attended UFC even in North America for all of 2012. What part of that are you "not seeing"?

You were proven wrong. Using incorrect numbers and refusing to accept you were wrong won't change anything. It's nice to see that you've reverted to the sell-out argument once again though. The G Dawg literally has you spinning around and around and around.
Serious question, do you wear a raptors jershey, and a BJs hat often, I think I recognize you from somewhere no joke.

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Old
01-30-2013, 10:28 PM
  #150
DJ Omnimaga
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Originally Posted by MoreOrr View Post
If there is a relocation to, and many people believe, Quebec City, then there won't be an expansion to Quebec City.
But again, back in the 80's and 90's the Nordiques attendance was at least 1000-1500 higher than the Jets. If Winnipeg could sellout 13K season tickets in 4 minutes in 2011, then maybe Quebec could support 2 new teams?

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