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Was/Fla proposal

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Old
12-14-2003, 05:34 AM
  #1
EroCaps
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Was/Fla proposal

To Was: Jokinen

To Fla: Zubrus

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Old
12-14-2003, 06:02 AM
  #2
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Interesting...but I'd rather have Jokinen.


Maybe Viktor Kozlov for Zubrus might be more appealing.

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Old
12-14-2003, 06:41 AM
  #3
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Are you suggesting change for the sake of change? why would either team do that? both of those guys are showing they can reach their potential and be dominant players in the years to come. I would think both teams want to build around that foundation rather than swapping it out and trying to create chemistry with new pieces all over again.

NO CHANCE!

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12-14-2003, 06:54 AM
  #4
EroCaps
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I should have added that adding Jokinen would supplant the production of either Bob Lang, or Nylander, once traded or lost to free agency.

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12-14-2003, 09:04 AM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
I should have added that adding Jokinen would supplant the production of either Bob Lang, or Nylander, once traded or lost to free agency.
Now you have confused me. Wouldn't Jokinen's production, currently 11g 7a 18pts, be replacing Zubrus's production, currently 10g 10a 20pts??? Zubrus may be listed as a wing but has been playing center all season in place of the injuried Nylander. So..they are in fact interchangable in that way.

How can Jokinen pick up slack left by a departed Robert Lang if he can't completely replace the departed Dainius Zubrus?
the trade just makes no useful sense.

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Old
12-14-2003, 12:51 PM
  #6
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Jokinen is also the captain of the Panthers and their most vocal leader in and out of the dressing room.

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Old
12-15-2003, 05:16 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
To Was: Jokinen

To Fla: Zubrus

keep dreaming

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Old
12-15-2003, 09:28 AM
  #8
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Maybe over the summer

I would have made this trade if I was the Caps, but Jokinen is not having a very good year after last seasons breakout. Zubrus is on a 26 goal pace and 50+ points, close to the same as Jokinen. They're about the same age, Zubrus is a little bigger, Jokinen is a little more expensive. I don't see either team looking to make this deal.

This trade is a wash to me.

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Old
12-15-2003, 09:52 AM
  #9
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Hmm lets see...

Jokinen scored 30 goals last year....made the all-star game...played on a line with Heatley and Jagr....23 year old...all around game...captained a Mike Keenen coached team.

And we're still waiting for Zubres to break out....

Is it just me that thinks the Panthers get *****?

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Old
12-15-2003, 10:01 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frolov
And we're still waiting for Zubres to break out....

You must not be watching many Capitals games... Zubrus is breaking out as we speak.

...regardless, this trade makes absolutely zero sense from either side.

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Old
12-15-2003, 10:18 AM
  #11
txpd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frolov
Hmm lets see...

Jokinen scored 30 goals last year....made the all-star game...played on a line with Heatley and Jagr....23 year old...all around game...captained a Mike Keenen coached team.

And we're still waiting for Zubres to break out....

Is it just me that thinks the Panthers get *****?
maybe its just me, but the last time i looked Zubrus was out scoring Jokinen.
can we look at the actual numbers for some clarification?
Jokinen born 12.5.78 6.3 215lbs
Zubrus born 6.16.78 6.4 225lbs

Jokinen 426 games 82 goals 170 pts. one season over 30 pts. two seasons with more than 10 goals up to this year.
Zubrus 515 games 89 goals 236 pts. 3 seasons over 30 pts. 4 seasons
with over 10 goals.

This season Zubrus is producing as much and as often as Jokinen.
other than his 36 goals last season Jokinen has not proved himself to be a better player than Zubrus. That includes this year. After the big breakout year, a third of the way thru this season Zubrus has 20 pts in 30 games to Jokinen's 18pts in 31 games.

Explain to me where Jokinen is a better player than Zubrus, much less a much better player??

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Old
12-15-2003, 10:28 AM
  #12
Frolov
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd
maybe its just me, but the last time i looked Zubrus was out scoring Jokinen.
can we look at the actual numbers for some clarification?
Jokinen born 12.5.78 6.3 215lbs
Zubrus born 6.16.78 6.4 225lbs

Jokinen 426 games 82 goals 170 pts. one season over 30 pts. two seasons with more than 10 goals up to this year.
Zubrus 515 games 89 goals 236 pts. 3 seasons over 30 pts. 4 seasons
with over 10 goals.

This season Zubrus is producing as much and as often as Jokinen.
other than his 36 goals last season Jokinen has not proved himself to be a better player than Zubrus. That includes this year. After the big breakout year, a third of the way thru this season Zubrus has 20 pts in 30 games to Jokinen's 18pts in 31 games.

Explain to me where Jokinen is a better player than Zubrus, much less a much better player??
Zubrus has allways been 2nd teir on his team thus facing 2nd teir defenseman. He plays on a team full of offensive talent.

Jokinen was put on the 1st line his rookie year. He had all kinds of presure on his back. He failed at first but under Mike he started reaching his potential. He's the main threat on his team and always faces 1st teir defenseman. If Jokinen had Jagr, Lang, Bondra to take the attention off him, he would score more. When he was on a line with Jagr, he had what 4 points in the allstar game?

I've watched both of them play. Zubrus shows signs of briliance while Jokinen is dominent every time he's on the ice. Most nights he doesnt end up on the score sheet but he always makes him self dangerous.

I happen to like the Caps and I consider them my 2nd favorite team so you can't say that I'm biased either.

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Old
12-15-2003, 10:53 AM
  #13
txpd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frolov
Zubrus has allways been 2nd teir on his team thus facing 2nd teir defenseman. He plays on a team full of offensive talent.

Jokinen was put on the 1st line his rookie year. He had all kinds of presure on his back. He failed at first but under Mike he started reaching his potential. He's the main threat on his team and always faces 1st teir defenseman. If Jokinen had Jagr, Lang, Bondra to take the attention off him, he would score more. When he was on a line with Jagr, he had what 4 points in the allstar game?

I've watched both of them play. Zubrus shows signs of briliance while Jokinen is dominent every time he's on the ice. Most nights he doesnt end up on the score sheet but he always makes him self dangerous.

I happen to like the Caps and I consider them my 2nd favorite team so you can't say that I'm biased either.
you are making excuses. the truth is that stuff cuts both ways. 2nd line players dont get prime defensive players against them nor do they get prime ice time either. Jokinen gets primary touches on the Panthers power play. that means most power play goals will have at least an assist for Jokinen on them. While Lang, Gonchar and Jagr get those touches in Washington. no easy assist points for being one of the guys passing the puck around the perimeter on a power play. Jokinen gets those because he is a first line player on his team.

Jokinen's 18pts are 2nd on his team. Zubrus's 20 pts are 4th on his team. He has to work harder to get his points than does Jokinen in some situations.

Yea he had 4 pts in an allstar game. Playing with Jagr...whoopie.

if you think that Jokinen is a dominant player and Zubrus is second tier, thats your opinion. the results of their careers so far don't back you up.

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Old
12-15-2003, 11:02 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd
you are making excuses. the truth is that stuff cuts both ways. 2nd line players dont get prime defensive players against them nor do they get prime ice time either. Jokinen gets primary touches on the Panthers power play. that means most power play goals will have at least an assist for Jokinen on them. While Lang, Gonchar and Jagr get those touches in Washington. no easy assist points for being one of the guys passing the puck around the perimeter on a power play. Jokinen gets those because he is a first line player on his team.

Jokinen's 18pts are 2nd on his team. Zubrus's 20 pts are 4th on his team. He has to work harder to get his points than does Jokinen in some situations.

Yea he had 4 pts in an allstar game. Playing with Jagr...whoopie.

if you think that Jokinen is a dominant player and Zubrus is second tier, thats your opinion. the results of their careers so far don't back you up.
Or maybe it's because I watched Jokinen fail at age 18 and I'm realy happy now that he's succeeding.......

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Old
12-15-2003, 11:44 AM
  #15
Jeff Shafer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd
you are making excuses. the truth is that stuff cuts both ways. 2nd line players dont get prime defensive players against them nor do they get prime ice time either. Jokinen gets primary touches on the Panthers power play. that means most power play goals will have at least an assist for Jokinen on them. While Lang, Gonchar and Jagr get those touches in Washington. no easy assist points for being one of the guys passing the puck around the perimeter on a power play. Jokinen gets those because he is a first line player on his team.

Jokinen's 18pts are 2nd on his team. Zubrus's 20 pts are 4th on his team. He has to work harder to get his points than does Jokinen in some situations.

Yea he had 4 pts in an allstar game. Playing with Jagr...whoopie.

if you think that Jokinen is a dominant player and Zubrus is second tier, thats your opinion. the results of their careers so far don't back you up.
Jokinen is our Captain and will never be traded for Zubrus EVER since Jokinen is one of our best players he will prolly not get traded considering his age, leadership, and his overall game. The career numbers are missleading for Jokinen because he has only really started playing like an allstar only 1 1/4 seasons ago.

overall it's just a stupid trade that would never happen

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Old
12-15-2003, 12:12 PM
  #16
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Viktor Kozlov - 2003 FLA 27games 7g 12a 19pts -3 on 73 shots

This guy is one of the best passers in the game and has one of the best wrist shots in the NHL. He's finally learning to shoot more and would probably BLOSSOM on a line with Jagr and Lang (since Jagr is obviously going no where with his inflated contract!)

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Old
12-15-2003, 01:26 PM
  #17
txpd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffshaf
Jokinen is our Captain and will never be traded for Zubrus EVER since Jokinen is one of our best players he will prolly not get traded considering his age, leadership, and his overall game. The career numbers are missleading for Jokinen because he has only really started playing like an allstar only 1 1/4 seasons ago.

overall it's just a stupid trade that would never happen
except for the guy that started this thread, no one is suggesting that jokinen be traded for zubrus.

btw...where in the dictionary is the word "prolly"??

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Old
12-15-2003, 01:28 PM
  #18
txpd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlaPanthers7
Viktor Kozlov - 2003 FLA 27games 7g 12a 19pts -3 on 73 shots

This guy is one of the best passers in the game and has one of the best wrist shots in the NHL. He's finally learning to shoot more and would probably BLOSSOM on a line with Jagr and Lang (since Jagr is obviously going no where with his inflated contract!)
so..the capitals trade a guy with 20 pts off the 2nd line for a guy with 19 pts to add to the first line that doesnt need him?

the capitals are no more trading zubrus than the panthers are trading jokinen.

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