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Habs lose 5-1, I watched the UFC at TVA Sports instead of half of the game.

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Old
01-31-2013, 04:14 PM
  #201
Alexdaman
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Originally Posted by dutchy29 View Post
well it was bound to happen, we ran up against a hot goalie, first real good team we faced all season, the boys didn't have their best. Our overall defensive game was to blame for this one IMO, defensman making low percentage pinch plays trying to force the forecheck, i think that style works against teams with less talent but when you meet a strong offensive team it can kill you....not too mention no Price to bail you out. Lets move on, at least the door is wide open to get PK back, and Patches get well soon. go habs.
System was good, problem is that only the Plek line did a good enough job to get scoring chances. White's penalty came at a crucial moment in the game and when facing the #1 PP team in the league it's no big surprise we got scored on. Budaj will need to come back stronger when he gets another shot. PK will replace Bouillon on the PP and that's going to be a game changer.

Ottawa didn't outplay us that much at 5 on 5, they basically went into shut down mode in the 3rd.

What we need to be a playoffs contender this year is...

#1 DD, Cole, Eller/Pacioretty/Moen/... To have good shots on net and play more confidently.

#2 To have an healthy D core that can improve the team's transition game and keep the PP strong.

#3 Price needs to keep what he's doing and be more alert when he plays games where he gets less shots on goal i.e game vs Winnipeg. Budaj to come out with a few strong games to keep the pressure off Price.

#4 Gradual evolution of Galchenyuk and Gallagher to hopefully by the end of the season be able to play 20mins per game.

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01-31-2013, 04:56 PM
  #202
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ah, wouldn't be a southernhab post without the ad hominem!
Love it. An ad hominem complaining about an ad hominem.


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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
God forbid you would ever look to place even a fraction of the blame on anybody who's taken a fighting major in his career, let alone the almighty Ryan White.

Budaj didn't have a good game, obviously - it happens. I can forgive a player having a bad game more easily than I can forgive someone mouthing off the to the ref and taking two penalties that led directly to two goals being scored against us.

If Therrien really wants to preach accountability, then White should be sitting.


White will not be the leading goal scorer for the Habs. If he is, then we are in real trouble. That is not his job.

That 4 minute penalty on White was a **** call. Everyone knows it and yet, after the game, the calls for the removal of White grow and grow.

Next, it will be Prust who gets called for a penalty where the other team scores and people will be calling for Prust to be benched. And then Moen.

It amazes me that the default mode for a lot of Habs fans is still stuck in the Gauthier era of pacifism. Do not fight back. Take it. Do not stand up for your teammates.

Two games ago, does anyone remember Desharnais standing up and getting in the face of Antropov who is twice as tall as him? Why did he do it this season and not last season?

Simple. Prust and White bring a dynamic that has been missing in Montreal for so long that it is now looked down upon as aberrant behavior...........standing up for yourself and standing up for your teammates.

The Canadiens are a better team with White in the lineup than when he is out (how soon everyone forgets the quality of play last season when White was injured ). Aggressive play is to be rewarded and encouraged, not vilified.

And no one can control what a referee calls as a penalty.

So should we become cynical and "blame" White for the loss last night and demand that he be benched? If we do, then can we call for Emelin to be benched because he took a penalty in the first period..........lost opportunity to score a goal.

And do we call for Bourque to be benched because he took two minor penalties?

The Habs did not play a good game as a team last night. And Budaj sucks ass as a goalie.

Now back to the White bashing.

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01-31-2013, 05:00 PM
  #203
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Have the Habs been playing a passive PK system all season?

Personally, I'm not a big fan of that style of penalty killing.

With Price back there, it probably works quite well, as he's stellar, but otherwise you're often giving up free uncontested shots.
They overload and try to out man opponent when the puck is along the boards and collapse when the puck is high and try to block. Not sure why they thought it was a good idea to change last season's stellar PK but so far every PP has looked great against it.

Outside of adding Prust and Markov being added, I don't think there needed to be change in the skaters and style used.

2011/2012:
Plekanec/Gionta/Eller/Moen
Gorges - Subban

I'd like to see for 2012/2013:
1st unit
Plekanec - Prust
Gorges - Subban

2nd unit
Eller - Moen
Markov - Emelin

Subs = Gionta/Bouillon/Armstrong/White

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Old
01-31-2013, 05:10 PM
  #204
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I have to defend Ryan White from these knee-jerky reactionarys...

White as we all know is a fiery and emotional guy, and he plays with an edge. He gives his all out there all the time. He got called for a BS penalty, that's obvious. He got angry and he took it out on the official. That was his only mistake here. He needs to know when to cool it and realize he can dislike a call but that cursing a ref out wont change what happened. Now people want him benched because they feel he cost the Habs a game. Well no, the PP had it's chances for us and we couldnt help White out at all by doing anything good on the PK. It was just an off night for the team. We were up by a goal and could have added to the lead but failed to do so. It happens.

Look, we are mostly winning games here and came off a 4 win stretch, after having placed last the season past. Sometimes we are going to lose. You don't bench a guy like White who wears his emotions on his sleeve after making one mistake. No other team has done that and they've had emotional players...all Therrien needs to do here is talk to White, tell him that he loves the passion he plays with and to continue that way, but to know when to bite his tongue, especially towards the officials. White already realizes his error. If he were to continue doing this after being talked to, then perhaps give him a game to think about it up in the press box. But White still deserves to play.

Ask yourselves this: Is White playing hard and giving his best effort? The answer is yes.

Is White playing well and doing everything he is supposed to be doing? The answer to that is again, yes.

So basically, you bench a guy for playing poorly or for not giving his all and being lazy, but you do not bench a guy who made a mistake but is playing his heart out and playing well.

White is doing everything you could ask of him. You dont bench him and try to neuter him and tone him down. These players are not as good when shackled that way.

Also it makes no sense to replace him on the 4th line by others such as Eller or another skilled type of player. Firstly, how does that help the team by taking away an energy line, and how does Eller get better by being on the 4th line? He doesn't fit that role, and these guys need to be given roles to succeed.

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01-31-2013, 05:15 PM
  #205
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Originally Posted by Mynameismark View Post
I have to defend Ryan White from these knee-jerky reactionarys...

White as we all know is a fiery and emotional guy, and he plays with an edge. He gives his all out there all the time. He got called for a BS penalty, that's obvious. He got angry and he took it out on the official. That was his only mistake here. He needs to know when to cool it and realize he can dislike a call but that cursing a ref out wont change what happened. Now people want him benched because they feel he cost the Habs a game. Well no, the PP had it's chances for us and we couldnt help White out at all by doing anything good on the PK. It was just an off night for the team. We were up by a goal and could have added to the lead but failed to do so. It happens.

Look, we are mostly winning games here and came off a 4 win stretch, after having placed last the season past. Sometimes we are going to lose. You don't bench a guy like White who wears his emotions on his sleeve after making one mistake. No other team has done that and they've had emotional players...all Therrien needs to do here is talk to White, tell him that he loves the passion he plays with and to continue that way, but to know when to bite his tongue, especially towards the officials. White already realizes his error. If he were to continue doing this after being talked to, then perhaps give him a game to think about it up in the press box. But White still deserves to play.

Ask yourselves this: Is White playing hard and giving his best effort? The answer is yes.

Is White playing well and doing everything he is supposed to be doing? The answer to that is again, yes.

So basically, you bench a guy for playing poorly or for not giving his all and being lazy, but you do not bench a guy who made a mistake but is playing his heart out and playing well.

White is doing everything you could ask of him. You dont bench him and try to neuter him and tone him down. These players are not as good when shackled that way.

Also it makes no sense to replace him on the 4th line by others such as Eller or another skilled type of player. Firstly, how does that help the team by taking away an energy line, and how does Eller get better by being on the 4th line? He doesn't fit that role, and these guys need to be given roles to succeed.
Great post.

That is how O'Byrne was ruined here in Montreal. Make a mistake.....not because of poor effort......simply a mistake......and get press boxed.

How did that work out for O'Byrne?

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01-31-2013, 05:30 PM
  #206
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Great post.

That is how O'Byrne was ruined here in Montreal. Make a mistake.....not because of poor effort......simply a mistake......and get press boxed.

How did that work out for O'Byrne?
Not too well at all. Hopefully we'll realize that this new culture the Habs are implementing is going to bring about games like this where that kind of stuff happens. The thing is though, it's this new style of aggressive play that has been helping the Habs get closer as a team and play better. We wont win them all, but we'll never be able to call them out for coasting much.

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01-31-2013, 05:52 PM
  #207
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Are people still harping on White? He took a penalty, calm the hell down.

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01-31-2013, 05:54 PM
  #208
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I don't think White will get benched. Or scratched.

I do believe he'll get an earful; but not be left out. Like you said, he buys into the system and gives him ******* 110% everytime. You want to keep these.

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01-31-2013, 06:09 PM
  #209
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
I don't think White will get benched. Or scratched.

I do believe he'll get an earful; but not be left out. Like you said, he buys into the system and gives him ******* 110% everytime. You want to keep these.
At the same time, if he makes dumb plays like that every day, a message should be sent.

Nobody is saying put White on a tight leash. He should play on the edge. But he also is still learning himself, and he's more useful to us if he uses his brain from time to time instead of as a mindless fighter. I wouldn't rush him to the bench as punishment but he's been doing this a lot and needs to pick it up for face a consequence.

It's funny how some of you want Therrien to have a tight leash on most of the team, but anyone who fights gets a free pass to play dumb. What kind of message does that send?

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01-31-2013, 06:31 PM
  #210
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I was at the game and was watching White as he got called...the moment he slammed that stick on the ice the ref immediately gave him the technical. He wasn't even looking at him. The ref was looking at him over his shoulder and was begging to give him one. Everybody yaps and will say stuff but you slam your stick on the ice you are asking for it. The refs made some bad calls and had Montreal's PP clicked this game could have been over after the 1st period. Personally, I thought the slashing call of Turris on Markov, the dreaded reaching one handed slap, was a joke that Markov sold well.

Budaj was great and had no chance on 3 of those goals. I think that Montreal has more toughness but anyone can throw them, I still think they lack team toughness. I think it is something that they will adapt by mid-season as Therrien likes his hockey tough but having Prust, White, etc...does not automatically make you tough. It is how the rest of the team plays as a unit that makes you tough to play against. Guys like Bourque, the rookies, Cole, these guys have to buy in to this new attitude and have it ingrained in your style. They are going in the right direction though.

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01-31-2013, 06:49 PM
  #211
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We were psychologically out of the game even without those dumb penalties by White.

1. Neil fighting Prust turned the game around. You look at Neil now THIS is an intimidating guy, this is the guy that can turn it around for any team. Habs kept defending themselves all night.

2. Nevermind that we have Gorges that can take care of himself, nevermind that Cube does too and he hits, nevermind that we have Emelin that can hit, in defensive mode they become kittens. That's why we have had trouble on the PK. Guys go in front of the net and we go into panic mode and they do what they want. On the opposite side, I don't even know half the Sens D, yet last night we had players trying to get close to their goalie and their D would take their heads off.

3. We see the real face of DD in games like this, watch how in the NHL you're supposed to lock up a player of this stature, Sens were pushing him pretty quickly, taking him out of the game. That's what happens when he doesn't have two big strong dudes doing all the work.

All in all we finally faced real opposition. And we crumbled. But this Habs team is a work in progress since most of it is new. But if we want to go further, we need a whole different D core.

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01-31-2013, 06:52 PM
  #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
We were psychologically out of the game even without those dumb penalties by White.

1. Neil fighting Prust turned the game around. You look at Neil now THIS is an intimidating guy, this is the guy that can turn it around for any team. Habs kept defending themselves all night.

2. Nevermind that we have Gorges that can take care of himself, nevermind that Cube does too and he hits, nevermind that we have Emelin that can hit, in defensive mode they become kittens. That's why we have had trouble on the PK. Guys go in front of the net and we go into panic mode and they do what they want. On the opposite side, I don't even know half the Sens D, yet last night we had players trying to get close to their goalie and their D would take their heads off.

3. We see the real face of DD in games like this, watch how in the NHL you're supposed to lock up a player of this stature, Sens were pushing him pretty quickly, taking him out of the game. That's what happens when he doesn't have two big strong dudes doing all the work.

All in all we finally faced real opposition. And we crumbled. But this Habs team is a work in progress since most of it is new. But if we want to go further, we need a whole different D core.
Whole different D core?
Markov-Emelin
Gorges-Subban

Is more than a good start. Once Tinordi and Ellis break out of Hamilton we will be loving it.

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01-31-2013, 06:57 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by Nicko999 View Post
This will always be the best Antichambre video... everytime I watch it, I cannot stop laughing. It's just the way Bergie laugh that makes me laugh as well.

Maybe that's why our PK sucks because Therrien listened to Bergie?

I miss the block shots by Gill.

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01-31-2013, 07:01 PM
  #214
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Whole different D core?
Markov-Emelin
Gorges-Subban

Is more than a good start. Once Tinordi and Ellis break out of Hamilton we will be loving it.
What I mean is that they are soffff in defensive mode. And that is a big reason why we have trouble on the PK. In that match only Gorges did a decent job on the PK. The others were panicking like crazy and were easily shoved away by players in front of the net causing traffic.

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01-31-2013, 07:04 PM
  #215
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Maybe that's why our PK sucks because Therrien listened to Bergie?

I miss the block shots by Gill.
Just saw this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0KBDfiVEeS0

Kinda nice to hear some things MB said, he still says it today.
For example, he and Coach Mike still say that "If there is effort, mistakes are acceptable, but if there is no effort, then mistakes aren't acceptable"

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01-31-2013, 07:05 PM
  #216
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Are people still harping on White? He took a penalty, calm the hell down.
He just cost us the Stanley Cup




Montreal was playing pretty lazy in that second I doubt they were going to win anyway. Now the coaches know that they need to fix the PK because it is playing very poorly.

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01-31-2013, 07:11 PM
  #217
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He just cost us the Stanley Cup




Montreal was playing pretty lazy in that second I doubt they were going to win anyway. Now the coaches know that they need to fix the PK because it is playing very poorly.
PK will fix the PK. Or at least i think that was one of his biggest
contributions last year.

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01-31-2013, 09:27 PM
  #218
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Love it. An ad hominem complaining about an ad hominem.
touché!

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01-31-2013, 09:46 PM
  #219
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Lol, and what are you going to do? Kick her ass?

Snap? Lose it? Head-fake, followed with a flurry to the solar plexus?
Lol no. Although my friend came really really close to punching her. The girls bf pulled told her to sit down and we told our friend to shut up and thankfully that was pretty much the end of it.


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02-01-2013, 03:42 AM
  #220
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
At the same time, if he makes dumb plays like that every day, a message should be sent.

Nobody is saying put White on a tight leash. He should play on the edge. But he also is still learning himself, and he's more useful to us if he uses his brain from time to time instead of as a mindless fighter. I wouldn't rush him to the bench as punishment but he's been doing this a lot and needs to pick it up for face a consequence.

It's funny how some of you want Therrien to have a tight leash on most of the team, but anyone who fights gets a free pass to play dumb. What kind of message does that send?
You do know there are other ways of sending a message?

And this had nothing to do with "fighting". White plays on the edge, upsets the opposition and give all he's got most of the time.

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02-01-2013, 07:15 AM
  #221
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I fell asleep on the couch watching that game.

I was drooling a little when I woke up, it must have brought me in some kind of near comatic space.

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02-01-2013, 08:50 AM
  #222
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What I mean is that they are soffff in defensive mode. And that is a big reason why we have trouble on the PK. In that match only Gorges did a decent job on the PK. The others were panicking like crazy and were easily shoved away by players in front of the net causing traffic.
Yeah, only Gorges did a decent job on the PK. Who is that other guy who was really good on the PK for Montreal last season? What was his name. He was a PK guy for us. PK guy...

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02-01-2013, 09:33 AM
  #223
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Yeah, only Gorges did a decent job on the PK. Who is that other guy who was really good on the PK for Montreal last season? What was his name. He was a PK guy for us. PK guy...
PekKa Rinne?

He's on Nashville.

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