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Prospect Talk PART V

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Old
01-28-2013, 09:47 AM
  #851
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So you think Petrov can average a point a game in the NHL on the 3rd line like Ullstrom almost is (4 points in 5 games), yet he can only average half a point a game in the KHL ? Yes I agree that Petrov MAY have a higher offensive potential then Ullstrom, but, Ullstrom is already proving it in the NHL.
I wouldn't pay much attention to Petrov's KHL stats. His style of play really fits smaller, North American ice.

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01-28-2013, 10:43 AM
  #852
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petrov is never coming over.

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01-28-2013, 11:14 AM
  #853
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petrov is never coming over.
I second that. The kid has undeniable talent, however, there is a reason why Kirill dropped in the draft. Most everyone knew that Petrov was not going to come to NA. Not a bad gamble with the middle round selection, but I just do not see Petrov coming over.

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01-28-2013, 11:17 AM
  #854
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Originally Posted by scott99 View Post
So you think Petrov can average a point a game in the NHL on the 3rd line like Ullstrom almost is (4 points in 5 games), yet he can only average half a point a game in the KHL ? Yes I agree that Petrov MAY have a higher offensive potential then Ullstrom, but, Ullstrom is already proving it in the NHL.
Wouldn't see why not.

His and Ullstrom's style of play is quite similar come to think of it. I mean, with the way they march and do things along the boards and even how they carry the puck, they've got some things in common. Petrov, at least in doing so in the KHL, looks more refined, thicker and harder to separate from the puck (and I write that fully aware of how surprisingly well David has maintained puck possession thus far).

I wouldn't put much weight on the exact point production comparisons with the KHL. I mean he was playing against a lot of NHL-caliber competition and with guys who all had a normal training camp heading into the season. Ullstrom has been playing AHL hockey and is now going up against a number of players who, put simply, weren't active during the lockout. Our guys who weren't active haven't exactly looked awesome either, so...

Anyhow, I'm pretty sure that if just about anyone here at the boards were to watch a dozen or so of Kazan's games, they'd likely come to a conclusion similar to mine. I mean Petrov just looks really confident and well, a bit like a bull out there this season. Doesn't look like a kid anymore, but rather a man playing a man's game. And heck, despite the meanial 11-8-19 in 41 games, his (3rd) line does get PP time, PK time and has been out on the ice at times when something is on the line (late, up by a goal or even down by a goal).

But it's all a bit moot - just gotta hope he comes over at some point and ends up being a big boost.

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01-28-2013, 11:21 AM
  #855
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Is it simply a money thing with buying Petrov out? If our scouts like him enough would it be reasonable to suspect that we'll make him a nice offer to come over in time for the Brooklyn move?

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01-28-2013, 11:26 AM
  #856
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Why not? He's doing it playing with Aucoin and McDonald. Once he gets bumped up into the top-six(which I'm pretty sure will happen) his numbers could get even better.

If Okposo eventually gets dropped from that top line, Ullstrom has to be the top candidate at this point to get his spot. I wouldn't be surprised if Ullstrom blows up when that happens(ala Moulson, Parenteau). The kid is a real deal prospect. He's proving that now.

I'm so glad Ullstrom's hard work is turning into meaningful NHL Production so quickly. I'm also happy that Islander fans now get to see him perform and are beginning to understand what kind of talent he has. I was basically laughed at/dismissed prior to the start of the season for suggesting Ullstrom get a shot on Tavares line. Now it's not such a ridiculous notion. I'm sure there are still a lot who feel Ullstrom is a 3rd liner, but that typecast seems to be fading, and rightfully so. He has a long way to go, but I have no doubts that if he can get his playing time he will continue to produce at a high level.

This sort of thing happens far more frequently to players who are brought along at their own pace. He's a 23 almost 24 year old rookie with tons of Experience in SEL, WJC, and AHL. Anyone think Ullstrom would be doing this good as a 19 year old kid without most of that experience?

For me it's obvious that Matt Donovan is the next one that will get called up and enjoy great success fairly quickly in the NHL (Same Draft Year as Ullstrom) and has played several years in NCAA, WJC, And AHL with same level of success as Ullstrom. I look forward to watching Donovan in the AHL ALl-Star Game tonight (that should be his final non NHL achievement).

I can't help but wonder where Bailey would be if the Islanders had the same development plan for him and made him earn his way and pile up Junior and AHL accomplishments before letting him step on the Ice.

Rueffner can shove it. He's an AGENT, not an NHL scout or player development personnel. Would he rather his client enjoy success and participate in an AHL All-Star game on his road to eventual NHL Stardom, or struggle to score goals in the NHL allowing his client to go multiple seasons without being an impact player? Oh wait, he gets paid a lot more if his client struggles in NHL. Never mind.

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01-28-2013, 11:30 AM
  #857
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Is it simply a money thing with buying Petrov out? If our scouts like him enough would it be reasonable to suspect that we'll make him a nice offer to come over in time for the Brooklyn move?
He probably likes playing in Russia, and if he plays in North America he'll want a guarantee of an NHL spot. Not sure how the Isles feel but I'd like to see what he has in the AHL first.

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01-28-2013, 11:42 AM
  #858
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Why not? He's doing it playing with Aucoin and McDonald. Once he gets bumped up into the top-six(which I'm pretty sure will happen) his numbers could get even better.

If Okposo eventually gets dropped from that top line, Ullstrom has to be the top candidate at this point to get his spot. I wouldn't be surprised if Ullstrom blows up when that happens(ala Moulson, Parenteau). The kid is a real deal prospect. He's proving that now.
if you think so. lets talk in may.

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01-28-2013, 11:42 AM
  #859
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He probably likes playing in Russia, and if he plays in North America he'll want a guarantee of an NHL spot. Not sure how the Isles feel but I'd like to see what he has in the AHL first.
He's almost 23 and has been playing games in the KHL since he was 19. Not much he's going to learn in the AHL that he hasn't already in the KHL. If he came over a couple of years ago, it's a different story, but he;s had over 2 full seasons, and will have a third next year in the KHL. Earliest he would come over is at age 24 with a half decade of experience in the KHL, if he wants to come over, he'll be an NHL player.

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01-28-2013, 11:49 AM
  #860
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Well, Canadiens fans waited a long time for Alexei Emelin to come over. Now he is a pretty good player for them...

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01-28-2013, 11:53 AM
  #861
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Well, Canadiens fans waited a long time for Alexei Emelin to come over. Now he is a pretty good player for them...
Played for the same KHL team too.

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01-28-2013, 11:53 AM
  #862
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Is it simply a money thing with buying Petrov out? If our scouts like him enough would it be reasonable to suspect that we'll make him a nice offer to come over in time for the Brooklyn move?
couple things to address in your post. firstly, according to the nhl-khl moa, a team cannot buyout a player's contract, but a player may buyout his own contract. secondly, the best the isles can do is offer a max rookie contract which is dwarfed by what he could make in the khl.

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01-28-2013, 11:58 AM
  #863
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Is it simply a money thing with buying Petrov out? If our scouts like him enough would it be reasonable to suspect that we'll make him a nice offer to come over in time for the Brooklyn move?

I think this is the first season, of a 2 yr KHL deal for Petrov. He'll be a ufa in 2014.

No need to buy out his KHL contract.
I guess it'll come down to whether his mother's heath has improved and how much he likes playing for his KHL team.

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01-28-2013, 12:00 PM
  #864
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Originally Posted by InformTheMasses View Post
I'm so glad Ullstrom's hard work is turning into meaningful NHL Production so quickly. I'm also happy that Islander fans now get to see him perform and are beginning to understand what kind of talent he has. I was basically laughed at/dismissed prior to the start of the season for suggesting Ullstrom get a shot on Tavares line. Now it's not such a ridiculous notion. I'm sure there are still a lot who feel Ullstrom is a 3rd liner, but that typecast seems to be fading, and rightfully so. He has a long way to go, but I have no doubts that if he can get his playing time he will continue to produce at a high level.

This sort of thing happens far more frequently to players who are brought along at their own pace. He's a 23 almost 24 year old rookie with tons of Experience in SEL, WJC, and AHL. Anyone think Ullstrom would be doing this good as a 19 year old kid without most of that experience?

For me it's obvious that Matt Donovan is the next one that will get called up and enjoy great success fairly quickly in the NHL (Same Draft Year as Ullstrom) and has played several years in NCAA, WJC, And AHL with same level of success as Ullstrom. I look forward to watching Donovan in the AHL ALl-Star Game tonight (that should be his final non NHL achievement).

I can't help but wonder where Bailey would be if the Islanders had the same development plan for him and made him earn his way and pile up Junior and AHL accomplishments before letting him step on the Ice.

Rueffner can shove it. He's an AGENT, not an NHL scout or player development personnel. Would he rather his client enjoy success and participate in an AHL All-Star game on his road to eventual NHL Stardom, or struggle to score goals in the NHL allowing his client to go multiple seasons without being an impact player? Oh wait, he gets paid a lot more if his client struggles in NHL. Never mind.
I've always been a pretty big Ullstrom fan, but I'd be lying if I said I expected him to be this good so far this year.

That said, I get what you are saying about prospects developing at their own pace, but for the most part a top-5 or 10 pick(Nino, Strome, Reinhart, etc.) take less time to develop than 4th rounders(Ullstrom). Just look at Hickey. He's all of 2 months older than Ullstrom, yet he is considered a bust while Ullstrom is considered a prospect who was brought along correctly. Draft position definitely plays a huge part.

All I know is that 2008 draft is shaping up to be a huge success. I know some are down on Bailey, but I'm still a pretty big supporter of his. I like his 2-way game and I still think his offensive upside is pretty big. Hamonic has been an obvious stud. Martin is already a quality role-player that every NHL team would love to have. Donovan looks to be developing nicely and I wouldn't be surprised to see him eventually stick this year. Poulin has been a little shaky but still has #1 upside. Now Ullstrom is proving to be one of our better NHL forwards and could(probably should) get a full-time spot in our top-6. Petrov is obviously a wild-card, but if he eventually comes over this draft becomes even better.

I couldn't be happier with the way that draft is turning out. Now maybe some people will reserve judgement on the '09, '10, '11 and '12 drafts(LotteryForLife... I'm talking to you).

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01-28-2013, 12:03 PM
  #865
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I think this is the first season, of a 2 yr KHL deal for Petrov. He'll be a ufa in 2014.

No need to buy out his KHL contract.
I guess it'll come down to whether his mother's heath has improved and how much he likes playing for his KHL team.
By that time we'll probably know a lot about Bailey/Okposo/Grabner/Ullstrom/Nino/Kabanov, etc. If a couple of them flop we can push hard to bring him over. If not... let him stay in the KHL for all I care or trade his rights to a desperate team.

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01-28-2013, 12:38 PM
  #866
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All I know is that 2008 draft is shaping up to be a huge success. I know some are down on Bailey, but I'm still a pretty big supporter of his. I like his 2-way game and I still think his offensive upside is pretty big. Hamonic has been an obvious stud. Martin is already a quality role-player that every NHL team would love to have. Donovan looks to be developing nicely and I wouldn't be surprised to see him eventually stick this year. Poulin has been a little shaky but still has #1 upside. Now Ullstrom is proving to be one of our better NHL forwards and could(probably should) get a full-time spot in our top-6. Petrov is obviously a wild-card, but if he eventually comes over this draft becomes even better.

I couldn't be happier with the way that draft is turning out. Now maybe some people will reserve judgement on the '09, '10, '11 and '12 drafts(LotteryForLife... I'm talking to you).
You forgot Spurgeon, who's turning out to be a damn good NHL defenseman, albeit for another organization. It's funny because I remember the experts applauding the draft but referencing Ness, Trivino, Toews the most, with of course Petrov and Bailey also getting tons of ink.

These things take time to play out. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I think letting teenagers (18,19) play in the NHL is a mistake for 99.99999% of the palyer population. Yoy say top 5 or 10 in each draft? I think most would agree with you, but I just don't see it proving out that way. Depending on the draft year there may be anywhere from 1-3 guys (maybe more in a SPECIAL year) that can make the jump and have success in year 1 or 2 post draft. And if they can't have success right off the bat why rush them?

Nino, by the end of this year will have made his claim, that he performed well in AHL and is potentially ready for a big roll in NHL (took 3 years)

Tavares, Special Generational talent #1 overall (VERY atypical, the exception not the rule) Ready off the bat.

Strome and Nelson are getting close but it will end up being either 3 or 4 years since time of draft for them to have made the progression.

And while Okposo may have been rushed a little bit (perhaps an extra year at college or Bridgeport would have given him more experience/confidence) which could have meant less learning and watching him try and develop in NHL games, which would have been good for him. Though it was an expedited process bordeline rush job, he handled it well.

For Bailey, we will never know. That's the frustrating part of it all. He was just tossed out there off the bat, and never thown a life vest. Until it came down to the last day he was eligible to get sent down (Game 159) without clearing waivers in attempt to send hima message... Guess what if you have to send a message to a 21 year old in Game 159... you waited too long. I'll never understand how/why they handled Bailey this way.

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01-28-2013, 12:46 PM
  #867
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Originally Posted by InformTheMasses View Post
You forgot Spurgeon, who's turning out to be a damn good NHL defenseman, albeit for another organization. It's funny because I remember the experts applauding the draft but referencing Ness, Trivino, Toews the most, with of course Petrov and Bailey also getting tons of ink.

These things take time to play out. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I think letting teenagers (18,19) play in the NHL is a mistake for 99.99999% of the palyer population. Yoy say top 5 or 10 in each draft? I think most would agree with you, but I just don't see it proving out that way. Depending on the draft year there may be anywhere from 1-3 guys (maybe more in a SPECIAL year) that can make the jump and have success in year 1 or 2 post draft. And if they can't have success right off the bat why rush them?

Nino, by the end of this year will have made his claim, that he performed well in AHL and is potentially ready for a big roll in NHL (took 3 years)

Tavares, Special Generational talent #1 overall (VERY atypical, the exception not the rule) Ready off the bat.

Strome and Nelson are getting close but it will end up being either 3 or 4 years since time of draft for them to have made the progression.

And while Okposo may have been rushed a little bit (perhaps an extra year at college or Bridgeport would have given him more experience/confidence) which could have meant less learning and watching him try and develop in NHL games, which would have been good for him. Though it was an expedited process bordeline rush job, he handled it well.

For Bailey, we will never know. That's the frustrating part of it all. He was just tossed out there off the bat, and never thown a life vest. Until it came down to the last day he was eligible to get sent down (Game 159) without clearing waivers in attempt to send hima message... Guess what if you have to send a message to a 21 year old in Game 159... you waited too long. I'll never understand how/why they handled Bailey this way.
I wasn't necessarily saying top draft picks should play in the NHL right away, but they generally seem to make it by the age of 20 if they are legit. Ullstrom was a later pick so he was brought along at a slower pace. Obviously it has paid off. But a kid like Hickey who was taken 4th overall was brought along at a similar pace, yet he was just placed on waivers.

Like I said before though, I'm still a Bailey fan. The kid has so much talent, and for all the heat he's taken over the years he has successfully developed a sound 2-way game during that time. If the offense comes around, which it has shown signs that it very well could, he can still be a special player. Obviously he had no business being in the NHL as an 18 year old kid, but he still has a chance to become the player he was drafted to be.

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01-28-2013, 12:54 PM
  #868
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How is Kabanov looking coming back from his injury? I don't expect him to be playing out of this world but does he look rusty?

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01-28-2013, 01:01 PM
  #869
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How is Kabanov looking coming back from his injury? I don't expect him to be playing out of this world but does he look rusty?
Yes. He looks rusty. Very quiet. To be expected. Pretty serious injury, missed a lot of time. He needs to get his legs back. Honestly Brock Nelson is just getting his legs back and he didn't miss nearly as much time.

Also, Bridgeport looks a little different with Hamonic, Ullstrom, Cizikas, McDonald getting called back up and Sundstrom being out with an injury. They are playing a lot of lesser players, and the chemistry just isn't there.

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01-28-2013, 08:21 PM
  #870
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Yes. He looks rusty. Very quiet. To be expected. Pretty serious injury, missed a lot of time. He needs to get his legs back. Honestly Brock Nelson is just getting his legs back and he didn't miss nearly as much time.

Also, Bridgeport looks a little different with Hamonic, Ullstrom, Cizikas, McDonald getting called back up and Sundstrom being out with an injury. They are playing a lot of lesser players, and the chemistry just isn't there.
Kabby comes back and Sundstrom goes down, damn, sounds like the Islanders. What happened to Sundstrom anyway ? He was having a great first Pro season.

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01-30-2013, 04:03 PM
  #871
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Wednesday Afternoon

Edmonton 4, Kootenay 2-Reinhart, + 1.

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01-31-2013, 01:07 AM
  #872
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Brenden Kichton Season Highlights up to date





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svXsHq3o7TY


Last edited by Homeland Security: 01-31-2013 at 09:17 AM. Reason: embed YT
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01-31-2013, 05:56 AM
  #873
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Brenden Kichton Season Highlights up to date

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svXsHq3o7TY
Hey, these look familiar.

Nice compilation though.

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01-31-2013, 09:00 AM
  #874
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I wouldn't pay much attention to Petrov's KHL stats. His style of play really fits smaller, North American ice.
Somebody needs to tell Petrov that.

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02-01-2013, 06:12 AM
  #875
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Thursday

Sudbury 4, Niagara 1-Strome, 1 goal (25), + 1, Graham, 1 assist, even.

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