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Oilers lose 3-2 in the SO - We Needed a Bigger Boat

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Old
02-01-2013, 02:37 PM
  #326
GreatKeith
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I'm not sure if anyone pointed this out yet but we did manage to score 2 ES goals...

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Old
02-01-2013, 02:38 PM
  #327
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Originally Posted by Gord View Post
Remember how his first season went? 7 points. and didn't it take 6 years until he broke the ppg plateau?

whenever anyone gets down on a young talented player, (for example starting threads 3 games into the year asking if we should have drafted someone else than Yak) they should have to learn about Joe Thornton and patience in the development of a player.
I sure remember Joe back then...a tall, skinny kid that was the perfect exhibit of how some players should be allowed to play at the AHL level prior to the age of 20. He was way too good to go back to junior as an 18 year old, but woefully lost and shellshocked when thrown to the NHL wolves.

He got it together once he grew into his body a bit more and frankly gained some maturity to handle the NHL lifestyle, but it took a few years. We need to be cognizant of that.

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Old
02-01-2013, 02:42 PM
  #328
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Put me in the RNH defenders camp. Yes his offensive timing is a little off, but he is rounding out his game nicely. He isn't being sheltered as much by Krueger as he was by Renney as is a +2 playing some pretty tough minutes. Last night he held is own against Joe Thornton.

Also, he is only 19! A lot of these more cerebral, playmaking centers who like to slow down and control the play like Thornton and H. Sedin take longer to develop than other types of players. I'd say RNH is way ahead of the curve so far.

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Old
02-01-2013, 02:46 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by nofool6110 View Post
If they started now...

We would play...

Vancouver...
Good.

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Old
02-01-2013, 02:48 PM
  #330
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Originally Posted by Puritania View Post
Calgary dead last makes me smile. Although I'm sure CP has convinced themselves it's nothing to worry about.
I wonder (but not enough to go to that site). Some of them, at least, must be thinking MacKinnon right now.

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Old
02-01-2013, 02:52 PM
  #331
awesomo
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im loling at people who think RNH is playing poorly. Hes not scoring right now but everything else is pretty damn good.

best out of all the kids

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Old
02-01-2013, 02:54 PM
  #332
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Problem is, people are expecting Nuge to be Gretzky or something.

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02-01-2013, 02:56 PM
  #333
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Originally Posted by WeridAl View Post
This line of reasoning would fine if Renney did it for half the season and just for some of the rookies like RNH, but he didn't. He relied too much on Horcoff, Smyth, and Jones in the important situation for the full year. He should have been placing Eberle and Hall in critical situations, instead of sheltering them.
Ok: why?

I mean, he leaned heavily on the kids to provide offense by giving them cherry zone assignments, tons of PP times. You think he should have thrown them to the wolves right away before they had a chance to develop some confidence? Glad you aren't the coach.


Last edited by Moose Coleman: 02-01-2013 at 03:03 PM.
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Old
02-01-2013, 02:59 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by The Great Ones View Post
Problem is, people are expecting Nuge to be Gretzky or something.
I'll settle for Datsyuk.

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Old
02-01-2013, 03:26 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by Asher View Post
I'll settle for Datsyuk.
Yeah, I'm seeing some kind of Datsyuk-Sakic hybrid. Not sure he has enough razzle-dazzle for Datsyuk but it's early yet.

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Old
02-01-2013, 03:28 PM
  #336
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Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
I hope Calgary rallies. A nice late push to take them to 12th place would be fantastic.
Or 9th.

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Old
02-01-2013, 04:06 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
It wasn't just the Sharks. It's been the story all year, with an exception in Phoenix.
Because they play such ugly hockey on terrible ice, they might as well be playing ball hockey.

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Old
02-01-2013, 06:46 PM
  #338
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pros and Cons View Post
Eberle does not require confidence to keep scoring. He is confident.
Most of the other players just may need the confidence of scoring a game winner on a shoot-out attempt
I never mentioned anything regaurding confidence. Even if so.. that would not be logical seeing how the shootout is for real points.

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02-01-2013, 06:49 PM
  #339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oil Gauge View Post
If percentages don't lie then what are they telling you?

last year
Player Team Pos Home: S G S% GDG Road: S G S% GDG Total: S G S% GDG 
1 Sam Gagner EDM C 4 4 100.0 0 5 2 40.0 1 9 6 66.7 1 
2 Ales Hemsky EDM R 3 1 33.3 1 3 2 66.7 0 6 3 50.0 1 
3 Ryan Nugent-Hopkins EDM C 4 1 25.0 1 1 1 100.0 1 5 2 40.0 2 
4 Shawn Horcoff EDM C 1 1 100.0 0 2 0 0.0 0 3 1 33.3 0 
5 Jordan Eberle EDM R 6 2 33.3 0 6 1 16.7 0 12 3 25.0 0 
6 Taylor Hall EDM L 2 1 50.0 1 2 0 0.0 0 4 1 25.0 1 

They tell me that last year RNH was better.
What is 'Eberle's' total shootout percentages overall.. not just last seasons. Also; Look how Ebs dominates in the game when we's alone against the opposing goalie.

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Old
02-01-2013, 08:26 PM
  #340
alanschu
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Originally Posted by Moose Coleman View Post
That doesn't follow. Just because it works now, doesn't mean it would have then.
Never mind that the success now could be a result of how things were done last year.

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Old
02-01-2013, 10:10 PM
  #341
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Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
What is 'Eberle's' total shootout percentages overall.. not just last seasons. Also; Look how Ebs dominates in the game when we's alone against the opposing goalie.
Eberle is 33.3% in shootouts in his career. Which is what Gagner was before he missed his attempt last night.

It should be noted that a shootout attempt is a different beast than a breakaway. Mentally and emotionally things are different for both the goalie and the shooter.

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:07 PM
  #342
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That was an excellent game and effort by all.

Game Grade B

Well coached and the system execution was high level, that was playoff hockey.

That game is an example of what will take us to and through the playoffs this year, we were on equal footing for over 60 mins with the best team in the NHL right now.

The shootout and Dubbys 60 minute performance was scary, it showed how easily the Sharks could shoot high and destroy Dubynk, all night they were targeting him in the same places every time he was on his knees and he could not adjust, they didnt overexploit our defenses they simply had the book on Dubby and repeated the same dynamic over and over sucessfully. Maybe we need to see a small quick goaltender if this keeps up, players can get to new shooting positions with better quality officiating which we are seeing leaguewide right now and maybe change is needed.

Freddy Chabot needs to back off and let the players decide what to do in the shootout, it isnt a task that can be controlled via statisticly catalysed tactics or it would have been done that way eons ago. This statistical addiction needs an intervention, first I read about Darkhorse being involved and then I read that Chabot is exerting statisticly catalysed tactics on an integral part of todays NHL game like the shootout and I get very very nervous. Looks like there is trouble in the Henhouse to me. The Oilers need to recognise the seriously limited applications of statistical analysis and stop trying to inject it into their organisation like they have been doing, the value of this data is one dimensional and doesnt warrant very much system attention or application.

Our shootout looked mechanical and impotent our shooters creativity was obviously handcuffed, horrible. They simply kept abusing Dubnyk up high, we didnt get Chabots intervention where we needed it in support of Dubynk pre-shootout or we would have seen the results, instead we got it in detriment to our shootout where we saw negative results. In every instance save two the application of statisticly catalysed tactics will hurt the system and the team. The Oilers need to re-view where they are applying their resources and find a new realtime analytical asset to incorporate, because what they are trying is not working at all, it may be the way the league is trending but stats based analysis is compromised by proxy, there is a very limited application and upside to implementing stats based data into the systems structure and executuon.

We needed support for Dubby after the 2nd goal up high , it was apparent they were shooting from the same positions very early on, where was Freddy when we needed him? Reviewing his stats preparing for the shootout?

And we needed to let our shootout specialists just do their jobs as they know best how to do, at the beginning of a game Chabot can post a list of opposition goaltenders weaknesses and strengths as per his analysis but thats where his input must cease and desist or it will hurt the systems integrity. We cannot exert compromised stats based pressure on our shootout men, we need to exert only peripheral influence in the form of a posted list of options, no more indirect pressure than that, let the players decide how they implement the data just as they decide how to utilise practise policys, trust them more.If we do these things we will avoid all the BadMedicine out there.

Overall the SJ game was very well executed and hopefully is a sign of things to come during this years playoffs when we need to potentially take SJ out of the equation.


Last edited by BadMedicine*: 02-01-2013 at 11:13 PM.
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Old
02-01-2013, 11:14 PM
  #343
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RNH and Gagner also just clean missed their shots. Shelf was there for Gagner and he put it damn near over the glass, and RNH had Niemi swimming but missed half an open net. I don't think Niemi made contact at all with either.

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:19 PM
  #344
Tedi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BadMedicine View Post
That was an excellent game and effort by all.

Game Grade B

Well coached and the system execution was high level, that was playoff hockey.

That game is an example of what will take us to and through the playoffs this year, we were on equal footing for over 60 mins with the best team in the NHL right now.

The shootout and Dubbys 60 minute performance was scary, it showed how easily the Sharks could shoot high and destroy Dubynk, all night they were targeting him in the same places every time he was on his knees and he could not adjust, they didnt overexploit our defenses they simply had the book on Dubby and repeated the same dynamic over and over sucessfully. Maybe we need to see a small quick goaltender if this keeps up, players can get to new shooting positions with better quality officiating which we are seeing leaguewide right now and maybe change is needed.

Freddy Chabot needs to back off and let the players decide what to do in the shootout, it isnt a task that can be controlled via statisticly catalysed tactics or it would have been done that way eons ago. This statistical addiction needs an intervention, first I read about Darkhorse being involved and then I read that Chabot is exerting statisticly catalysed tactics on an integral part of todays NHL game like the shootout and I get very very nervous. Looks like there is trouble in the Henhouse to me. The Oilers need to recognise the seriously limited applications of statistical analysis and stop trying to inject it into their organisation like they have been doing, the value of this data is one dimensional and doesnt warrant very much system attention or application.

Our shootout looked mechanical and impotent our shooters creativity was obviously handcuffed, horrible. They simply kept abusing Dubnyk up high, we didnt get Chabots intervention where we needed it in support of Dubynk pre-shootout or we would have seen the results, instead we got it in detriment to our shootout where we saw negative results. In every instance save two the application of statisticly catalysed tactics will hurt the system and the team. The Oilers need to re-view where they are applying their resources and find a new realtime analytical asset to incorporate, because what they are trying is not working at all, it may be the way the league is trending but stats based analysis is compromised by proxy, there is a very limited application and upside to implementing stats based data into the systems structure and executuon.

We needed support for Dubby after the 2nd goal up high , it was apparent they were shooting from the same positions very early on, where was Freddy when we needed him? Reviewing his stats preparing for the shootout?

And we needed to let our shootout specialists just do their jobs as they know best how to do, at the beginning of a game Chabot can post a list of opposition goaltenders weaknesses and strengths as per his analysis but thats where his input must cease and desist or it will hurt the systems integrity. We cannot exert compromised stats based pressure on our shootout men, we need to exert only peripheral influence in the form of a posted list of options, no more indirect pressure than that, let the players decide how they implement the data just as they decide how to utilise practise policys, trust them more.If we do these things we will avoid all the BadMedicine out there.

Overall the SJ game was very well executed and hopefully is a sign of things to come during this years playoffs when we need to potentially take SJ out of the equation.
Who is accusing who of over analyzing things here??

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:22 PM
  #345
Tedi
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Originally Posted by syz View Post
RNH and Gagner also just clean missed their shots. Shelf was there for Gagner and he put it damn near over the glass, and RNH had Niemi swimming but missed half an open net. I don't think Niemi made contact at all with either.
Exactly, Niemi was lucky on both.

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Old
02-02-2013, 12:00 AM
  #346
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Originally Posted by awesomo View Post
im loling at people who think RNH is playing poorly. Hes not scoring right now but everything else is pretty damn good.

best out of all the kids
Best out of all the kids? I wouldn't go that far just yet. His puck handling really needs to improve, that's really the only flaw i see in his game.

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Old
02-02-2013, 12:23 AM
  #347
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Originally Posted by StephenHAWKING View Post
Best out of all the kids? I wouldn't go that far just yet. His puck handling really needs to improve, that's really the only flaw i see in his game.
If you include Eberle... he's not even close. But if you're just talking the 1st overalls... then yeah, I still don't think so. Not that he's chopped liver or anything... and I think he will see a ton of development in the next couple years.

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Old
02-02-2013, 09:38 AM
  #348
AM
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Ok: why?

I mean, he leaned heavily on the kids to provide offense by giving them cherry zone assignments, tons of PP times. You think he should have thrown them to the wolves right away before they had a chance to develop some confidence? Glad you aren't the coach.
Yes, he made a lot of well reasoned coaching decisions.

Course the arm chair guys just look at the scoreboard to figure out how things are going.

Currently the pillows are plump.

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Old
02-06-2013, 07:58 AM
  #349
fuswald
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Yes, he made a lot of well reasoned coaching decisions.

Course the arm chair guys just look at the scoreboard to figure out how things are going.

Currently the pillows are plump.
I see Dubnyk playing better and as a team offense worse defense better. Weird with the players we have. Should be piling on the goals.

So far don't see much better coaching. Different style though for sure. Better than Renny I suppose but nothing special. Mactavish did better with a WAY worse team. Krueger doesn't seem to match player / line skill sets to the opposition instead doing things by the book. Maybe because it is a shortened season he doesn't want to wear anybody out or something. Except overtime. Then his combos get mighty weird.

End result better because Khabibulin not in goal.

I see this from my La-z-boy.


Last edited by fuswald: 02-06-2013 at 08:09 AM.
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