I honestly can't believe that this is such a story. Does anyone actually hope that the habs win just so they can see subban and price high 5 each other?
It's a story because Therrien made it a story. I don't think anyone around the league was complaining about the triple low five.
It's a story because Therrien made it a story. I don't think anyone around the league was complaining about the triple low five.
I don't think so. Therrien banned a certain post game celebration for what he believes in. I looked at the so called "story", then chuckled a little bit, and moved on.
Much to my surprise, there are 13 pages on it!
I'd like to know about things that actually matter, like when is subban returning to the lineup...
It's a story because Therrien made it a story. I don't think anyone around the league was complaining about the triple low five.
Is anyone going to complain about the lack of a"triple low five" ?
What's could be wrong with changing how a team celebrates ?
It's got to be one of the smallest changes a coach can introduce.
And people wonder why hockey has difficulty attracting an audience. Stupid but whatever. I do find it amusing how some have accused it as being "played out," you know, because the fan salute has never been done to death before.
The whole way the team is treating PK is weird. They really seem to be trying to put him in his place. "I want to make him a better person" "You have to respect the fans"... what's up with that? And the club went out of its way to sign him at a low short contract. Then his teammates are lukewarm about him coming back. And him being held out of the lineup right now just seems like some kind of lesson to me...
Not sure what it is that's going on in the dressing room or why PK is being singled out but it sure as hell seems as though his team is trying to undermine him though. Maybe there are things going on that we don't know about but this sure seems like a strange way to be treating a player that you are looking to as a cornerstone of your future.
Whatever they're trying to do I hope it works because I'm not sure what's broken here and I don't know what it is they're actually trying to fix. I'm still surprised PK signed the contract we put in front of him.
This isn't just about a low five... something bigger is going on behind the scenes. Why announce this publicly?
I think people are reading a little too much into the PK thing actually.
I see nothing wrong.
I was all for a long term deal now. I made this very clear before. But, the only intelligent and realistic conclusion I was able to come up with on the insisting of a low cap bridge deal was that management doesn't want to put PK in a pressure position.
I think they want to take a step back with PK because they identified some flaws, on the ice. They don't want to put him on the ice for 25min as #1. They rather him play as a 2nd pairing, perfect his things, and dominate weaker opponents. If all goes well, then he'll get more responsibilities.
But if you paid PK 5M right away, there's no way you could make him play as a back up role.
I think the reason they insisted on this deal was to protect him from unnecessary pressure. I mean, nothing else makes sense really. I don't buy this financial philosophy BS (Bergevin has never been a GM, and in Chicago they had no problem with giving big deals after their ELC), I just don't think they want to publicly say they want to protect PK.
I think the same thing is going on with the triple low five. Michel Therrien worked in the media over here. He knows exactly the criticism PK gets. He can see his ex-colleagues talk crap about PK. Say this or that. I mean really, it seems the media was on a mission to completely discredit PK. I'm sure he's heard some of them (perhaps behind the cameras, or maybe even in front, I just don't remember) talk about this triple low five. I believe he wants to stop all bad press going PK's way, and simply not give any ammo to this crazy media here.
So again, I think it goes back to protecting his best asset. I don't buy this ''we want to be modest'' crap, doesn't make any sense, otherwise stop all fist pumps after scoring too, or screaming. Doesn't add up.
I think this is all about taking away, little by little, the bad press PK has been getting, and changing the image of this over the top flamboyant kid, to a more mature, strong, reliable, top NHL Dman.
What's the problem. It's a friggin high five flipped on it's head. Are they also gonna ban skating by your bench and high fiving all your teammates when you score?
I think that's more insulting to the opposition as you usually have to pass close to their bench first, and they have to sit there looking stupid while sirens are blaring and music is blasting and the whole arena is jumping up and down with a proverbial "In your FACES, A-holes!!!" cheer directed at the other team. At least this is done when the other team is already in the dressing room.
at the end of the day, it's no different than a pat on the back or a handshake....it's just that PK and Price do it with a little flair. Fake-god forbid we allow a little personality to seep through.
NHL = No Humour League (I know this is the Habs decision, but it's getting as bad as the No Fun League now)
Is anyone going to complain about the lack of a"triple low five" ?
What's could be wrong with changing how a team celebrates ?
It's got to be one of the smallest changes a coach can introduce.
Have you ever been at the Bell Centre when the Habs win (granted, that was a rarity last season) right before they do the triple low five? Fans love it. Those two players love it. Why should the coach dictate how players celebrate if they're not even offending anybody? Don Cherry doesn't even have a problem with it. But you know who does? The folks at L'Antichambre.
And finally, if you're gonna ban it, why make it public? Why not quietly tell both PK and Carey to quit doing the celebration? He's the coach of the Montreal Canadiens, you'd think he'd know that everything and anything Habs-related is blown way out of proportion. And yes, I know how silly it is that we're 13 pages into this topic. I'll stop now.
It's so dumb to be mad over an inoffensive celebration. They're not even taunting the opposing team, just high-fiving each other, it's not much different from when two players tap each other's helmet or ass. I don't see why doing it means you're not humble or whatever.
First thought is that I almost hope the Habs lose tomorrow so at least the threads are somehow pertinent.
I don't particularly like a banning of a celebration that is pretty benign compared to others going on in the league.
I admit that I kind of enjoyed it, but in retrospect it is likely because every time we saw it, the Habs won.
Addressing the "Team first" element, well, this particular celebration excluded all but two players. Not inconsistent. Unnecessary perhaps, but hardly inexplicable.
The whole contract thing, PK not being reintroduced in the line up immediately, the various quotes in the medias about making PK a better person, the banning of the triple low 5 it all adds up to something.
Obviously Therrien and Bergevin want to fix something. But is that something broken ? Have they correctly identified the problem ? Is Subban really the problem.
Ultimately I don't give a crap how they do things, but it better work.
The whole contract thing, PK not being reintroduced in the line up immediately, the various quotes in the medias about making PK a better person, the banning of the triple low 5 it all adds up to something.
Obviously Therrien and Bergevin want to fix something. But is that something broken ? Have they correctly identified the problem ? Is Subban really the problem.
Ultimately I don't give a crap how they do things, but it better work.
It destroys the appearance of a mini-clique within the locker room. Not there is necessarily a clique between P.K and Price, but it does emphasize the "WE" over the "I", which a team does need.
It destroys the appearance of a mini-clique within the locker room. Not there is necessarily a clique between P.K and Price, but it does emphasize the "WE" over the "I", which a team does need.
Part of being a team is embracing the personalities on it, not trying to make everybody conform into something they're not. Carbo tries stupid team building exercises as well and look how that turned out.
Less media exposure for Subban, less distraction for the team.
Less media exposure for Subban, maybe more focus to what the coach is trying to teach him?
Subban has still some learning to do. He took responsabilities when not ready because our defense was so weak. He took bad habits but again who was to correct them when he was our best defenseman? He had no role model to emulate, no Markov, nothing. Luckily for him, he enjoys his job and did survive this crisis.
Coach Guy Boucher had a hard time with him with the Bulldogs. Maybe Coach Therrien can shelter him from the media and high responsabilities so he can grow up steadily as a player.
And people wonder why hockey has difficulty attracting an audience. Stupid but whatever. I do find it amusing how some have accused it as being "played out," you know, because the fan salute has never been done to death before.
This is why the NHL will always trail the other big 3. Hockey is just too rigid and plain to ever be big IMO. Anything with personality is called NFL or NBA.
I have loved watching guys like Roenick, Hull, Hextall, Roy, etc...
LOL @ growing a fringe sport with no personality. The on ice product isn't that great to begin with.
Less media exposure for Subban, less distraction for the team.
Less media exposure for Subban, maybe more focus to what the coach is trying to teach him?
Subban has still some learning to do. He took responsabilities when not ready because our defense was so weak. He took bad habits but again who was to correct them when he was our best defenseman? He had no role model to emulate, no Markov, nothing. Luckily for him, he enjoys his job and did survive this crisis.
Coach Guy Boucher had a hard time with him with the Bulldogs. Maybe Coach Therrien can shelter him from the media and high responsabilities so he can grow up steadily as a player.
Then why even draft the guy? Habs are not a big personality franchise. They should just stick to drafting robots.
do we want a short flashy career a la Ovechkin with tons of highlights but alas no team success?
or
do we want Subban to be more a team player a la Crosby and hopefully some more team success?
Sure in the short term, for fans it is much more fun to watch Subban do high five, low five, yapping, etc. But I would say, the long term goal should be to win a Stanley Cup or at least have a legit chance for one. Subban has all the tools to become the next general at defense.
do we want a short flashy career a la Ovechkin with tons of highlights but alas no team success?
or
do we want Subban to be more a team player a la Crosby and hopefully some more team success?
Sure in the short term, for fans it is much more fun to watch Subban do high five, low five, yapping, etc. But I would say, the long term goal should be to win a Stanley Cup or at least have a legit chance for one. Subban has all the tools to become the next general at defense.
Patrick Kane is every bit the showoff and 10x the doucher that Subban is. Somehow still won the cup. Your inferences aren't backed up by anything substantial.
do we want a short flashy career a la Ovechkin with tons of highlights but alas no team success?
or
do we want Subban to be more a team player a la Crosby and hopefully some more team success?
Sure in the short term, for fans it is much more fun to watch Subban do high five, low five, yapping, etc. But I would say, the long term goal should be to win a Stanley Cup or at least have a legit chance for one. Subban has all the tools to become the next general at defense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by habtastic
Just for argument's sake, would you pick:
a) Lots of personality and the Habs sucking perenially, but ratings high, tons of Roenick-Roy quips, etc., cool post-game rituals that the fans eat up like candy...but again, Habs suck?
or
b) Removing the triple low five (which is apparently the embodiment of PK's entire personality and without it he will be a boring nobody) and the Habs becoming a disciplined, team-first, zero-conflict team with a shot at the cup (I know I'm reaching here, but I'm talking about tending towards the future)?
Note that these are extremes and without the triple low 5, we will still have lots of personality to go around. I cannot believe this is even a big deal and FTR, my facebook timeline pic for the last year has been...yup, Price and PK doing the triple low 5.
False Dilemma
Definition:
A limited number of options (usually two) is given, while in reality there are more options. A false dilemma is an illegitimate use of the "or" operator.
Putting issues or opinions into "black or white" terms is a common instance of this fallacy.
