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Old
02-02-2013, 09:36 AM
  #826
gleanerguy
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Not saying there will be a "masterpiece rebuild." There's a systematic process that is designed to make them competitive every night...be a team that, if they work hard, play their system and get good goaltending, they will be competitive and in position to win enough games to contend for 3-4-5-6...be in the mix with Moncton and X and PEI for one of those playoff spots...consistently, every year. And some year, when all the breaks go their way, perhaps win a championship. Certainly having veterans quit and having three guys hurt in a car accident are not part of the plan. But some of the guys he's brought in over the past couple of years can play: Groenheyde can play. Poulin can play. Sanza and Bonneau can play. Not making excuses...they're 3-23 and have been painful to watch by times this season. They'll be better next year -- perhaps not ready to make giant strides forward, because, even if you are successful in bringing in eight recruits -- which represents more than a third of the roster -- they'll need time to acclimatize and adjust to the AUS level, which is often better than even the best recruits realize at first. But I think Ryan is the right guy. He's taken on projects like this before and rebuilt them successfully and I'm sure that was part of the attraction of hiring him at STU in the first place...they probably could have gotten somebody with a flashier record and more glamourous credentials. They elected to go with a guy who has followed this map before. It's not a quick fix, unfortunately. And the rest of the league isn't going to stand by and watch you do it either -- everybody's in the business of trying to get better.

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02-02-2013, 09:58 AM
  #827
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Originally Posted by gleanerguy View Post
Not saying there will be a "masterpiece rebuild." There's a systematic process that is designed to make them competitive every night...be a team that, if they work hard, play their system and get good goaltending, they will be competitive and in position to win enough games to contend for 3-4-5-6...be in the mix with Moncton and X and PEI for one of those playoff spots...consistently, every year. And some year, when all the breaks go their way, perhaps win a championship. Certainly having veterans quit and having three guys hurt in a car accident are not part of the plan. But some of the guys he's brought in over the past couple of years can play: Groenheyde can play. Poulin can play. Sanza and Bonneau can play. Not making excuses...they're 3-23 and have been painful to watch by times this season. They'll be better next year -- perhaps not ready to make giant strides forward, because, even if you are successful in bringing in eight recruits -- which represents more than a third of the roster -- they'll need time to acclimatize and adjust to the AUS level, which is often better than even the best recruits realize at first. But I think Ryan is the right guy. He's taken on projects like this before and rebuilt them successfully and I'm sure that was part of the attraction of hiring him at STU in the first place...they probably could have gotten somebody with a flashier record and more glamourous credentials. They elected to go with a guy who has followed this map before. It's not a quick fix, unfortunately. And the rest of the league isn't going to stand by and watch you do it either -- everybody's in the business of trying to get better.
I agree that STU hired the right guy in Troy Ryan. I know some very smart hockey people on the selection committee who were ecstatic to land Troy. I just don't think folks should write this awful season off as a foundation building year or part of a sytematic process when this outcome could make things worse in the future. Even with some of the bad luck you mentioned (other teams also had some bad luck), nobody ever expected this bad of a performance. Bottoming out and rebuilding in the Maritime League is a completely different ballgame where bad seasons are compensated by high draft picks and bottoming out teams have the luxury of trading graduating players for young up and comers and more draft picks. Bottoming out in the CIS just makes it more difficult to recruit and retain quality players.

This offseason is going to be a huge one for STU. Ryan's going to have to scratch and claw to land several quality recruits. Not an easy task given some of the handcuffing he has received from the university. Last year the talk was that the new facility would bring in tons of great recruits. Sure there were a couple of good ones (where would they be without Groenheyde?) but I'd say overall a very mediocre class. This spring is going to be a harder sell given the horrendous record.

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02-02-2013, 11:31 AM
  #828
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If you watch my webseries about RMC, you can see how the coach Troy Ryan beat out in the final 2 selections operates. Adam Shell applied and made it to the end before Troy got selected.

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02-02-2013, 11:38 AM
  #829
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Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
I agree that STU hired the right guy in Troy Ryan. I know some very smart hockey people on the selection committee who were ecstatic to land Troy. I just don't think folks should write this awful season off as a foundation building year or part of a sytematic process when this outcome could make things worse in the future. Even with some of the bad luck you mentioned (other teams also had some bad luck), nobody ever expected this bad of a performance. Bottoming out and rebuilding in the Maritime League is a completely different ballgame where bad seasons are compensated by high draft picks and bottoming out teams have the luxury of trading graduating players for young up and comers and more draft picks. Bottoming out in the CIS just makes it more difficult to recruit and retain quality players.

This offseason is going to be a huge one for STU. Ryan's going to have to scratch and claw to land several quality recruits. Not an easy task given some of the handcuffing he has received from the university. Last year the talk was that the new facility would bring in tons of great recruits. Sure there were a couple of good ones (where would they be without Groenheyde?) but I'd say overall a very mediocre class. This spring is going to be a harder sell given the horrendous record.
Everything you have said above is fair and expresses some of my own "fears" quite well.

I think Troy had higher expectations for this team than this, I know I did. But moving forward he will have to show recruits that there is light at the end of the tunnel, he will have to land a few good guys early and maybe have them bring friends - package deals - and stick to quality. Hard thing is that he needs quanity too.

I don't think any of us has the magic answer. My answer is that Iam betting on Troy to pull them through. He is our best shot and I think he can do it. It isn't going to be easy, it isn't always going to go as planned but nothing ever does. Stick to the plan, make the changes that need made and get the support from above to implement it.

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02-02-2013, 12:26 PM
  #830
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I think the impact of the new rink is vastly overrated. The new rink was an advantage simply compared to the old rink. The weight room, the dressing room...they're on par, perhaps a bit better than most in the AUS (I have no point of reference other than UNB), but to most recruits from major junior organizations, the facilities would be either about what they have come from, or perhaps below -- newer, shinier, maybe, but not "Wow, sure I'll sign!" stuff. Take, as an example, the London Knights -- 9,000 seat building in the downtown. Saint John -- 7,000 seat building in the downtown. I assume the infrastructure of weight room, dressing room, player lounge are much the same. So, as far as Fredericton is concerned, the Grant-Harvey is great...it's new, it's got great curb appeal. But the only "advantage" as far as STU is concerned is, it's not the LBR.

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02-02-2013, 02:38 PM
  #831
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Exactly...I am sure when a recruit is making up his mind as to where he is going to play/live for the next 4 or 5 years the rink is pretty far down the list.

I know it's easier said than done but I feel if they could just somehow land that one elite recruit (ie/ one of the top overagers in the country) who is up to the task and wants to be part of the turnaround and realizes it is is going to take some time...that one guy they can build the whole program around, can change the entire culture, and make other potential recruits take notice...things will start to fall into place after that. When was the last time they have had a legitimate AUS all-star type of guy...McAllister??

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02-02-2013, 03:13 PM
  #832
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Exactly...I am sure when a recruit is making up his mind as to where he is going to play/live for the next 4 or 5 years the rink is pretty far down the list.

I know it's easier said than done but I feel if they could just somehow land that one elite recruit (ie/ one of the top overagers in the country) who is up to the task and wants to be part of the turnaround and realizes it is is going to take some time...that one guy they can build the whole program around, can change the entire culture, and make other potential recruits take notice...things will start to fall into place after that. When was the last time they have had a legitimate AUS all-star type of guy...McAllister??
Or they could get a group of guys who played together in the past and want to reunite. If they could get a pipeline for grads of a particular team then that would make recruiting a whole lot easier.

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02-02-2013, 03:27 PM
  #833
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Or they could get a group of guys who played together in the past and want to reunite. If they could get a pipeline for grads of a particular team then that would make recruiting a whole lot easier.

Yup, you always hear how the best recruiters are the players themselves. Some of UNB's best players in recent memory all played for Windsor. Under Ryan, STU has recruited a couple players from London.

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Old
02-03-2013, 12:52 PM
  #834
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Originally Posted by gleanerguy View Post
I think the impact of the new rink is vastly overrated. The new rink was an advantage simply compared to the old rink. The weight room, the dressing room...they're on par, perhaps a bit better than most in the AUS (I have no point of reference other than UNB), but to most recruits from major junior organizations, the facilities would be either about what they have come from, or perhaps below -- newer, shinier, maybe, but not "Wow, sure I'll sign!" stuff. Take, as an example, the London Knights -- 9,000 seat building in the downtown. Saint John -- 7,000 seat building in the downtown. I assume the infrastructure of weight room, dressing room, player lounge are much the same. So, as far as Fredericton is concerned, the Grant-Harvey is great...it's new, it's got great curb appeal. But the only "advantage" as far as STU is concerned is, it's not the LBR.
I agree the rink is not an advantage over other teams, but the rink is a huge advantage over what they had. it doesnt matter how many people in Fredericton that remember rum row, or remember the battle of the hill game back in 2002, 1994, 1987, New Guys coming in would only visually see the rink for what it was and what it didnt have, history meant nothing to them. Even the battle of the Hill at this point means nothing, so in university Hockey this newer facility means a lot to be back on a even playing field with the other AUS teams in that regard.

The Last players I remember for STU to cause any fear when they were out on the Ice by being a constant scoring threat, were Kyle McAllister and Justin Bowers. As far as Defenseman go probably Nick Theriault cause of his Shot and the defenseman I cant think of his name of hand that played for the 07 Canada university games team???

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02-03-2013, 03:40 PM
  #835
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I would guess Anthony Butera, not the ex-pro guy.

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02-03-2013, 09:01 PM
  #836
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I agree the rink is not an advantage over other teams, but the rink is a huge advantage over what they had. it doesnt matter how many people in Fredericton that remember rum row, or remember the battle of the hill game back in 2002, 1994, 1987, New Guys coming in would only visually see the rink for what it was and what it didnt have, history meant nothing to them. Even the battle of the Hill at this point means nothing, so in university Hockey this newer facility means a lot to be back on a even playing field with the other AUS teams in that regard.

The Last players I remember for STU to cause any fear when they were out on the Ice by being a constant scoring threat, were Kyle McAllister and Justin Bowers. As far as Defenseman go probably Nick Theriault cause of his Shot and the defenseman I cant think of his name of hand that played for the 07 Canada university games team???
Your points about the new arena are exactly what I was thinking. The LBR (as much as I love the old barns) may have been viewed as a bush league facility by potential recruits.

Ian Turner is I believe the defenceman you are referring to.

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02-03-2013, 09:54 PM
  #837
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Both of them were in Turino in '07. Turner was not as good as Butera, IMHO.

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02-04-2013, 03:07 PM
  #838
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CIS allstar dman Dan Pteston

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Both of them were in Turino in '07. Turner was not as good as Butera, IMHO.
Although both were good,NOT as good as Danny Preston,CIS allstar dman.

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Old
02-24-2013, 03:59 PM
  #839
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Did anyone catch the AUS female hockey on the weekend? Terrible! We have been trashing Eagles and questioning Ryan. What is going on with this team. All kinds of recruiting dollars, a bench full of coaching staff and out of the winners circle again this year! Great goalie, and some very good players, but what is happening with the coaching. People say they have come along way. Well Dal is suspended, UNB folded, MTA does not even get money for hockey sticks, St Marys won one game last year and beat us this year...time for a coaching change here folks!

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02-24-2013, 04:26 PM
  #840
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Did anyone catch the AUS female hockey on the weekend? Terrible! We have been trashing Eagles and questioning Ryan. What is going on with this team. All kinds of recruiting dollars, a bench full of coaching staff and out of the winners circle again this year! Great goalie, and some very good players, but what is happening with the coaching. People say they have come along way. Well Dal is suspended, UNB folded, MTA does not even get money for hockey sticks, St Marys won one game last year and beat us this year...time for a coaching change here folks!
I'm not commenting specifically on what you have said above because you are just stirring up trouble but I am so frustrated with yesterdays game that I have to comment.

The SMU coach completely out coached Peter, IMO. It wasn't that the game was out of reach or that SMU was so much better (not even close) but it came down to our powerplay sucking eggs. It didn't score a goal in over a month, specifically Jan 13th. The thing is that it never changed, no in game adjustment, no new players put out there to send a message, nothing. Just repeat, repeat, repeat.

SMU had no fear and were borderline gooning it up (for the women's game) in the second and third period. They were being so physical and STU didn't have an answer for it. They knew the PP sucked going in and we knew (I knew anyway) that SMU was the most penalized team and that the PP was going to be huge for us to win or as the case is, lose. I felt horrible for our three seniors that gave their all to the program.

Frustrating Frustrating Frustrating Frustrating

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02-25-2013, 05:50 AM
  #841
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Yeh, pretty much a yearly event, that this guy is out coached. I guess because it is female hockey, and no one really cares. Hobbs carried the team back in the days when there was only X to contend with, but we are funded enough now that it is time we stop losing to a new team every year. perhaps after ten years we need this guy to step aside?

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02-25-2013, 09:39 AM
  #842
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Not about to go very far down this road, but in my observation, the girls on the team swear by "this guy." He's given 11 years to the program, he brought in an impressive rookie crop -- two of which, Emily Ryan and Emily Francis, were injured for the second half, which had a direct bearing on the production on the power play. We talked to him after the two games directly before the playoff tournament and mentioned concerns about the power play. He said he felt they were getting pucks toward the net more often, they just weren't going in. Not sure if that was the character of the pp against Saint Mary's or not -- didn't see the game.
But are you going to throw him under the bus because of a dormant pp. No. Perhaps if Blackmore is still around next fall, you bring her on as an assistant coach and give her pp responsibilities. But to gas a guy who is as committed as Peter Murphy is would be a HUGE mistake.

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02-25-2013, 04:57 PM
  #843
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Yes, perhaps Kayla could coach. Wouldn't want to replace a guy with an 11 year losing streak. Perhaps he would be the center piece for our wall of fame.

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02-25-2013, 09:06 PM
  #844
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So, if they had won the semi over Saint Mary's and wound up losing to a powerful StFX team in the final, would you still be calling for Murphy's head? Probably not. So you want to blow up 11 years of building the program to where it is -- into a new building, well thought of in the community -- essentially because they lost one hockey game? Outing alert: Cookie Cutter is really Harold Ballard.

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02-26-2013, 04:52 AM
  #845
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No, I am saying that this is a heavily funded AUS team that has grown over the past few years from when it was not funded much at all. Similar to where most teams in Women's hockey that are still not funded and it continues to flounder, to a different team(s) each year. It now needs a coach to go beyond that. Alert...Gleanerguy is really Walt Disney!

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02-26-2013, 08:17 AM
  #846
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If by floundering, you mean finishing in second place in the Conference, moving into a new building, hosting the CIS championship tournament next year, developing players and people like the two-time student/athlete/community service winner, and using your profile in the community to support initiatives like support for the Canadian breast cancer foundation, mental health issues and for a little girl with a major brain disease, and hearing people the calibre of defender Courtney Fox saying he treats you like a daughter....you're right. Fire that (part time) guy because they lost the semi-final in the AUS championship. Good idea, Harold.

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02-28-2013, 02:54 PM
  #847
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It's apparent cookiecutter has an axe to grind, but won't come straight out and admit it and instead chooses to use an anonymous bully pulpit to undermine the coach. Explain the truth behind your vendetta. Obviously you think you, or someone close to you, have been wronged at some point and are lashing out. Enough with the passive aggressive ***** bull ****. Out with it.

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Old
02-28-2013, 08:50 PM
  #848
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maybe she's related to Rantfather.....

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Old
03-01-2013, 05:25 AM
  #849
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Where's Dale when you need him?

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03-01-2013, 09:57 AM
  #850
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maybe she's related to Rantfather.....
that's what I was thinking, maybe his wife or daughter ranting on the women's team.

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