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Redmond & Postma > Hainsey & Clitsome?

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Old
02-03-2013, 12:20 AM
  #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GermanJetsFan View Post
Why the ******* should we trade Buff instead of Hainsey
It's about the assets we have in place and how they fit together over time. I don't think we should trade Hainsey or Buff now. However, as of now on the right side we have Buff, Bogo, Trouba, Redmond, and Postma, who look like they have the ability to play in the NHL. On the left side we have Enstrom, Hainsey, and Stuart with only Kulda in the pipe looking like a possible (and who knows if we ever see him again).

Therefore if we trade Hainsey we have to gamble on being able to resign/trade for someone exactly like him in the offseason. With Buff though, if management felt they could acquire a really good piece for him in a year or two, I believe we have the pieces to replace him organically.

IF (a fairly large if in my opinion) management thinks Kulda can step in and play at Hainsey's level fairly quickly then by all means, send him on his way.

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02-03-2013, 01:45 AM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gholas View Post
Doesn't matter that they're a better combo, Jets management isn't smart enough to make that decision, BTW Oduya is the Hawks best D right now. LOL

Hainsy Stuart Clitsome Wellwood will retire Jets
Wait a second. You're implying that getting a 2nd and 3rd rounder for a bottom pairing defenseman who was a pending UFA was a bad move by Jets management?

I don't even know how to refute or even comment on that second part...

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02-03-2013, 01:52 AM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
Wait a second. You're implying that getting a 2nd and 3rd rounder for a bottom pairing defenseman who was a pending UFA was a bad move by Jets management?

I don't even know how to refute or even comment on that second part...
Forgot the part about how we probably didn't know whether or not they even asked him if he'd re-sign or if he was financial within team budget.

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Old
02-03-2013, 07:15 AM
  #79
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Y'all realize Hainsey is 38th in the league average TOI?

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02-03-2013, 12:57 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
Wait a second. You're implying that getting a 2nd and 3rd rounder for a bottom pairing defenseman who was a pending UFA was a bad move by Jets management?

I don't even know how to refute or even comment on that second part...
the picks are only as good as the Jets make them. if they continue to typecast w/ 6'2 WHL forwards then i highly doubt they'll be better than Oduya, but that's just me.

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02-03-2013, 02:06 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by almostawake View Post
Y'all realize Hainsey is 38th in the league average TOI?
Pretty similar to our GAA rank. Good thing there's only 30 teams.

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02-03-2013, 02:13 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by almostawake View Post
Y'all realize Hainsey is 38th in the league average TOI?
Doesnt matter how much ice time you get, when you cant do anything with it.

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02-03-2013, 02:33 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
Wait a second. You're implying that getting a 2nd and 3rd rounder for a bottom pairing defenseman who was a pending UFA was a bad move by Jets management?

I don't even know how to refute or even comment on that second part...
It was a good trade. You don't keep a 3.5million dollar 5th defenseman on the roster. You can't afford to in a cap world.

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02-03-2013, 03:04 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigZ65 View Post
Pretty similar to our GAA rank. Good thing there's only 30 teams.
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Woodballs View Post
Doesnt matter how much ice time you get, when you cant do anything with it.
He's playing way more minutes than he should be, mostly partnered with guys that need to be sheltered.

And despite that he still has the best +/- among defencemen on the Jets.

If the Jets had another defenceman of his quality to pair with him, it wouldn't be an issue. But for now our entire defensive corp is in over it's head.

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02-03-2013, 03:47 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bottleCAPS View Post
the picks are only as good as the Jets make them. if they continue to typecast w/ 6'2 WHL forwards then i highly doubt they'll be better than Oduya, but that's just me.
Getting two picks for Oduya > getting 18 more games out of Oduya and risk getting nothing for him. I highly doubt Oduya would've been a decisive factor the a playoff push. If there's anything Chevy should be blamed for, it's knowing that Bogosian would be out for an extended period and not addressing the depth issue.

Of course it's true the picks are only as good as the Jets make them, but an asset is an asset. For all we know, one or both of those picks could be used as part of a deadline swap.

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02-03-2013, 03:51 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
Getting two picks for Oduya > getting 18 more games out of Oduya and risk getting nothing for him. I highly doubt Oduya would've been a decisive factor the a playoff push. If there's anything Chevy should be blamed for, it's knowing that Bogosian would be out for an extended period and not addressing the depth issue.

Of course it's true the picks are only as good as the Jets make them, but an asset is an asset. For all we know, one or both of those picks could be used as part of a deadline swap.
Technically he *could* of tried/be trying... we don't know...
Not succeeding we can blame him for (sort of)...

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02-03-2013, 04:12 PM
  #87
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This thread is beyond ridiculous.
I've avoided it all along because anyone who tries to inject some logic and reason (Jet, Garret) just get totally ignored, while the people who think Hainsey sucks talk amongst themselves while completely ignoring anyone who disagrees with them.

#Hainsey4lyfe

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02-03-2013, 04:31 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
Getting two picks for Oduya > getting 18 more games out of Oduya and risk getting nothing for him. I highly doubt Oduya would've been a decisive factor the a playoff push. If there's anything Chevy should be blamed for, it's knowing that Bogosian would be out for an extended period and not addressing the depth issue.

Of course it's true the picks are only as good as the Jets make them, but an asset is an asset. For all we know, one or both of those picks could be used as part of a deadline swap.
a fair retort.

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Old
02-03-2013, 05:41 PM
  #89
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It sounds funny, but if you deal Hainsey now, you probably are giving up on the season. Because we have nobody in the system to replace him with (I'm assuming Bogo is already back) and he's #4/5 with Bogo active. Time is passing fast in this shortened season. OTOH, if Hainsey stays and becomes a free agent, and we finish out of the playoffs, we all may be calling for the GMs head.

All I'm saying is that I think some GMs are going to make 'cross the Rubicon' decisions early this year. That may mean Hainsey goes or maybe even Buff for a first rounder (would you do that?).

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02-03-2013, 07:03 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nothing Is New View Post
It sounds funny, but if you deal Hainsey now, you probably are giving up on the season. Because we have nobody in the system to replace him with (I'm assuming Bogo is already back) and he's #4/5 with Bogo active. Time is passing fast in this shortened season. OTOH, if Hainsey stays and becomes a free agent, and we finish out of the playoffs, we all may be calling for the GMs head.

All I'm saying is that I think some GMs are going to make 'cross the Rubicon' decisions early this year. That may mean Hainsey goes or maybe even Buff for a first rounder (would you do that?).
I for one, would not trade Buff straight up for a 1st round pick. This team needs Big Buff's production to be successful as we can see with his current absence. Besides, I see Buff easily being worth a top 10 pick and perhaps an additional asset, but I doubt any team gives that up for him.

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02-03-2013, 07:07 PM
  #91
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OK, this is how we'll do this. Buff for the Schenns, trade Hainsey and Stuart for 1sts, sign Smid in the offseason, bring back Kulda, trade all our picks for the first over all, draft Mackinnon, and bring up Trouba.

To start next season we have:

Kane - Mackinnon - Wheeler
Ladd - Schenn - Little
Poni - Burmi - Antropov
Wright - Schief - Machacek

Smid - Bogo
Enstrom - Postma
Kulda - Trouba

Pavalec
Montoya

Done. Get on it Chevy.

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02-03-2013, 07:36 PM
  #92
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I'd never trade Buff for a 1st rounder alone. He's worth waaaaay more than that IMO.

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02-03-2013, 08:35 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Stej View Post
I'd never trade Buff for a 1st rounder alone. He's worth waaaaay more than that IMO.
Tonnes more. Just have to look at what other kinds of players have gone for 1sts. Buffs an all star and one of the top point getting d men. And he's on a decent contract.

I don't see buff getting dealt until bogo and trouba are ready to take over.

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02-03-2013, 09:28 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Huffer View Post
Tonnes more. Just have to look at what other kinds of players have gone for 1sts. Buffs an all star and one of the top point getting d men. And he's on a decent contract.

I don't see buff getting dealt until bogo and trouba are ready to take over.
I see what you did there

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Old
02-06-2013, 01:29 AM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garret9 View Post
Hainsey would garner more than a 3rd... after all Hainsey is worth more than Oduya (or Stuart) and remember what we got for Oduya. Also remember there is a high price on D-men right now as everyone wants to shore up their depth. We kind of ***** CHI for Oduya so my guess is we'd get similar value for Hainsey (haha involuntary acts of is censored).

Hainsey is on average a #4 on most teams, results-wise. Stuart, Postma, Redmond and Clitsome are not. Most scouts put Postma and Redmond's ceiling as above average #4s or low #3s...
The only time Ron would look "lost" to a lot of people, is that some don't realize that Noel buries Hainsey in the defensive zone because he trusts Hainsey there, which in turn pushes everyone else into the offensive zone making their job that much easier to minimize defensive threats and maximize there offensive chances... ie: Noel's usage of Hainsey will tend to make Hainsey look worse and the rest better defensively then they actually are because Hainsey tends to be in the defensive zone all the time.

Personally what I'd do until one of Byfuglien or Bogosian returns:
Enstrom - Postma
Hainsey - Redmond
Stuart - Clitsome
You could use these lines similarly to how Noel already prefers to use his defense. Postma can create offense with Enstrom. Redmond isn't as good as Bogosian but he's a very good decision maker which is why I'd like him on the second to be the puck mover for that pair. Stuart can be a sturdy partner for Clitsome and can (hopefully) teach/guide Clitsome to minimize his errors.

Then when Byfuglien returns you can do:
Enstrom - Byfuglien
Hainsey - Postma
Stuart - Redmond
Clitsome
You then would split the match-ups for the 2nd and 3rd pair. If Noel wants to use his usual match-ups, then switch Postma and Redmond (which I'm kinda 50/50 on right now).

Then when Bogosian returns you can do:
Enstrom - Byfuglien
Hainsey - Bogosian
Stuart - Redmond/Postma
Clitsome - Redmond/Postma
And questions about our defensive depth all of a sudden disappear.

Then (if Scheifele stays up and Miettinen returns) you can package Wellwood and Clitsome for an upgrade some where... or better yet add in Hainsey and see if you can get a LHD who is young with potential (AKA a LHD version of Postma/Clitsome) (quantity for quality seems to work in HFBoards land haha)


To answer your Q though.
Overall: Hainsey > Redmond = Postma > Clitsome
Offense: Postma > Redmond > Hainsey > Clitsome
Defense: Hainsey >> Redmond > Postma > Clitsome
I love everything about this post... thanks

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