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Old
02-03-2013, 08:11 PM
  #101
AslanRH
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I am more interested in the potential for finding defensive help through RFAs this offseason than the UFAs. See some teams like StL and NYR having some salary cap issues with a few contracts to sign. Not thinking offer sheets, but either the RFAs may be available for a trade, or a solid Dman who the RFA will replace could pop up. Doubt we'll get much from the UFA market defensively, but the buy outs, RFA signings, and cap hits could open some possibilities.

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02-04-2013, 02:57 AM
  #102
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I am more interested in the potential for finding defensive help through RFAs this offseason than the UFAs. See some teams like StL and NYR having some salary cap issues with a few contracts to sign. Not thinking offer sheets, but either the RFAs may be available for a trade, or a solid Dman who the RFA will replace could pop up. Doubt we'll get much from the UFA market defensively, but the buy outs, RFA signings, and cap hits could open some possibilities.
St. Louis currently has the lowest payroll in the league (I know, but it's true). They won't be giving anyone up of consequence anytime soon. The Rangers already got rid of their big albatross contract on defense (Redden) and the rest of still young and relatively cheap.

But I agree, it may take a trade to get quality blueline talent to supplement EJ. I'd guess if any team is getting ready to divest talent pretty soon, it's Calgary. Thing is...I really, really don't want the Avs to trade with a division rival, and CERTAINLY not that one.

I still think a guy worth taking a look at is Yannick Weber. Again, I'm not the biggest fan, but he's only 23 and making less than a million on his current deal, and he'll be an RFA this offseason. He's the odd man out in Montreal...I would think we could find SOMETHING Bergevin could use. Besides, the last Montreal blueline reject we traded for turned out pretty well for us.

And actually, there are some decent options out there via UFA this offseason. I think Mark Streit would be a great addition.

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02-04-2013, 03:14 AM
  #103
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And actually, there are some decent options out there via UFA this offseason. I think Mark Streit would be a great addition.
Couldn't agree more. Streit would be an excellent addition for us and would instantly be our best defenceman alongside EJ. I wonder if PAP can have a word and persuade him to come on over!

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02-04-2013, 03:16 AM
  #104
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As much as people think PL will be around forever, I can only think that Sakic is being groomed to take the job sooner than later......and I think his impact on the team is being felt already. I would not be shocked to see Sakic named President as soon as this summer...and at the latest in 2014.

PA was a Sakic signing. I would be he had his say in signing Zanon and Mitchell as well. Both those signings look good thus far and the PA signing could be the best the UFA signings.

As far as Sherman goes, arguably he should have gotten more for Liles, but I think he was under a ton of pressure to trade his contract. The Johnson-Stewart trade is clearly still up for debate, but that is still years in the making. The McGinn and Downie trades were at the worst good deals for the Avs. The Anderson trade was one of necessity, even though Anderson has excelled, so has Elliott, just not with the Avs sadly. Point being, his (and his staffs) talent analysis has been spot. Drafting has also been good, though the higher picks do help. Mueller and Flash were both great trades based on the talent that was brought in....what happened to both was to a certain extent unforeseeable.

Honestly the O'Reilly situation is the first thing I think Sherman has totally misjudged and bungled...and up until now the contracts Sherman has signed have been good to great value wise with players.

Name a horrible contract that Sherman has signed that is holding the Avs back from bringing in a better player or will cause them to lose a player in the future....or a horrible trade he has made? If Matt Hunwick is the worst you can do, on both fronts, well...

Not everything he has done has been a home run, but he has done a ton with an ownership group that is constantly cutting him off at the knees.

Only other things you can really "blame" Sherman for is not being able to name his own coaches and not being able to unlock the purse strings....both of which are frankly out of his hands.

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02-04-2013, 09:55 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Drury_Sakic View Post
As much as people think PL will be around forever, I can only think that Sakic is being groomed to take the job sooner than later......and I think his impact on the team is being felt already. I would not be shocked to see Sakic named President as soon as this summer...and at the latest in 2014.

PA was a Sakic signing. I would be he had his say in signing Zanon and Mitchell as well. Both those signings look good thus far and the PA signing could be the best the UFA signings.

As far as Sherman goes, arguably he should have gotten more for Liles, but I think he was under a ton of pressure to trade his contract. The Johnson-Stewart trade is clearly still up for debate, but that is still years in the making. The McGinn and Downie trades were at the worst good deals for the Avs. The Anderson trade was one of necessity, even though Anderson has excelled, so has Elliott, just not with the Avs sadly. Point being, his (and his staffs) talent analysis has been spot. Drafting has also been good, though the higher picks do help. Mueller and Flash were both great trades based on the talent that was brought in....what happened to both was to a certain extent unforeseeable.

Honestly the O'Reilly situation is the first thing I think Sherman has totally misjudged and bungled...and up until now the contracts Sherman has signed have been good to great value wise with players.

Name a horrible contract that Sherman has signed that is holding the Avs back from bringing in a better player or will cause them to lose a player in the future....or a horrible trade he has made? If Matt Hunwick is the worst you can do, on both fronts, well...

Not everything he has done has been a home run, but he has done a ton with an ownership group that is constantly cutting him off at the knees.

Only other things you can really "blame" Sherman for is not being able to name his own coaches and not being able to unlock the purse strings....both of which are frankly out of his hands.
Until more comes out I don't think we can judge that situation yet. My opinion right now is that both parties have a lot of fault, but we don't know the whole story right now (and we may never know).

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02-04-2013, 02:38 PM
  #106
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Until more comes out I don't think we can judge that situation yet. My opinion right now is that both parties have a lot of fault, but we don't know the whole story right now (and we may never know).
I don't think it's erroneous to say that a team with more than $16 million in cap space is bungling things when they can't sign their best player from last year when Dallas and Montreal managed to do so with relatively little difficulty. I refuse to believe that O'Reilly and his agent are demanding outrageous sums of money. This is negotiation as always, and as of right now, the Avs aren't negotiating. At all. And they are in NO position to do that right now.

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02-04-2013, 03:09 PM
  #107
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Funny how Dater has a podcast and fills it with random bloggers and fanboys. You would think a beat writer covering this team for almost 20 years would be able to feature better resources.
As long as funny also means 'very sad'.

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02-04-2013, 03:16 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Av-merican View Post
I don't think it's erroneous to say that a team with more than $16 million in cap space is bungling things when they can't sign their best player from last year when Dallas and Montreal managed to do so with relatively little difficulty. I refuse to believe that O'Reilly and his agent are demanding outrageous sums of money. This is negotiation as always, and as of right now, the Avs aren't negotiating. At all. And they are in NO position to do that right now.
If the dam is leaking, its easy to stick your finger into stop it, but that is not a long term solution.

The Avs ARE in a position to stand firm
1) It seems to be a fair market offer
2) RoR will not take this team to a cup THIS year
3) Long term viability hinges on continuing to offer responsible contracts due to the number of young players on this team who will be in similar situations over next few years and the need to hold money for valuable FA signings that will compliment the core of the franchise over the next many years.

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02-04-2013, 03:27 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Aslanrh View Post
If the dam is leaking, its easy to stick your finger into stop it, but that is not a long term solution.

The Avs ARE in a position to stand firm
1) It seems to be a fair market offer
2) RoR will not take this team to a cup THIS year
3) Long term viability hinges on continuing to offer responsible contracts due to the number of young players on this team who will be in similar situations over next few years and the need to hold money for valuable FA signings that will compliment the core of the franchise over the next many years.
The organization owes it to paying fans like us to ice the best team they possibly can year in, year out. That doesn't mean they have to spend to the cap every year, but they can very easily address their glaring depth problems up front. They just won't.

No, they do not have the luxury of standing firm. They do not have the luxury of just throwing a season away. We deserve better. I'm not expecting a Cup run, but as I've stated before, I want to see this team make a major step TOWARD being a Cup contender. You can't do that without last season's best player.

I'm not asking them to just throw money at O'Reilly, but I refuse to believe that the player and his agent are the ones who are demanding exorbitant amounts and saying "take it or leave it." He left the KHL to get medical attention, but he likely also left because he was reasonably confident a deal could get worked out. Thing is, the Avs aren't talking.

Whatever the case, I want this situation resolved. Yeah, I wish he would've just signed the 5-year deal that was on the table and showed up to play after the lockout. In fact I'm rather surprised he didn't. But IMO the Avs are the ones screwing up here, and I fear they--and by default, us--are going to come and regret this increasingly ugly situation.

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02-04-2013, 04:20 PM
  #110
AslanRH
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Originally Posted by Av-merican View Post
The organization owes it to paying fans like us to ice the best team they possibly can year in, year out. That doesn't mean they have to spend to the cap every year, but they can very easily address their glaring depth problems up front. They just won't.

No, they do not have the luxury of standing firm. They do not have the luxury of just throwing a season away. We deserve better. I'm not expecting a Cup run, but as I've stated before, I want to see this team make a major step TOWARD being a Cup contender. You can't do that without last season's best player.

I'm not asking them to just throw money at O'Reilly, but I refuse to believe that the player and his agent are the ones who are demanding exorbitant amounts and saying "take it or leave it." He left the KHL to get medical attention, but he likely also left because he was reasonably confident a deal could get worked out. Thing is, the Avs aren't talking.

Whatever the case, I want this situation resolved. Yeah, I wish he would've just signed the 5-year deal that was on the table and showed up to play after the lockout. In fact I'm rather surprised he didn't. But IMO the Avs are the ones screwing up here, and I fear they--and by default, us--are going to come and regret this increasingly ugly situation.
I am frustrated too, and do feel the dialog should always be open, but I also do not want to be a fan in two years on the "O'Reilly is an overpaid 2C-3C center! Can't believe our FO were idiots and signed that deal!" HF Thread.

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02-04-2013, 04:45 PM
  #111
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I am frustrated too, and do feel the dialog should always be open, but I also do not want to be a fan in two years on the "O'Reilly is an overpaid 2C-3C center! Can't believe our FO were idiots and signed that deal!" HF Thread.
That won't happen, not with a guy who works as hard both on and off the ice as he does. And this isn't a situation like Myers in Buffalo, where a guy has one great season (in that case, his rookie year) and they give him Zdeno Chara money. The Avs will get good value out of the contract no matter what, even if he doesn't ever produce more than 50-60 points a season. There's so much he does that doesn't show up on a scoresheet.

And IMO, those "OMG he's overpaid" threads/comments are largely ridiculous. Stastny has been one of the best players on this squad since 2006. It's not his fault that the Avs now-fired GM couldn't see what the rest of us could and realized that he had a very good player, but not a potential superstar. All I ask is that when a player gets a long-term commitment from the organization, is that he shows up and proves their faith in him right. Stastny has done that for the most part. It's now up to David Jones to do it.

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Old
02-04-2013, 05:30 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Aslanrh View Post
I am frustrated too, and do feel the dialog should always be open, but I also do not want to be a fan in two years on the "O'Reilly is an overpaid 2C-3C center! Can't believe our FO were idiots and signed that deal!" HF Thread.
I don't want to be on that thread either, but i have a feeling that, in a not too distant future, we'll be on the "_ _ _ _ _ _ _ is an overpaid bum! Can't believe our FO were idiots and traded O'Reilly for him!" HF Thread.

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02-04-2013, 05:32 PM
  #113
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I don't want to be on that thread either, but i have a feeling that, in a not too distant future, we'll be on the "_ _ _ _ _ _ _ is an overpaid bum! Can't believe our FO were idiots and traded O'Reilly for him!" HF Thread.
Now THAT I could see.

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Old
02-04-2013, 07:21 PM
  #114
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Quit bad mouthing me you jerks

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