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If the season goes down the tubes, who's the first to go?

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Old
02-03-2013, 05:40 PM
  #51
Halpysback
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thats four games starting with the pens. so, if the caps win 5 or 6 of the 8 pts...then what? are you assuming the caps lose to the pens? are you saying that it doesnt matter if they beat the pens?

@breakaway...yes ribeiro playing like he is could bring a late first round pick, which is a marginal shot at an top 6/top 4 player. that assumes the caps are missing the playoffs at the deadline and i wouldnt assume that.
Or a shot at moving up/packaging for good young player.

Or a shot at a John Carlson.

Yeah who needs that.

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02-03-2013, 05:40 PM
  #52
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Caps need a coach like Ken Hitchcock who can analyze the game very well and turnaround teams to the playoffs. I think Oates would be the first to go (than possibly McPhee).

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02-03-2013, 08:26 PM
  #53
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The first thing to go may be any semblance of an offensive attack. When you give up more than 3 per game, Hunter hockey is never far behind.

Will GM upgrade at G, pull a roster trade shakeup, or blame the obvious short camp new systems new coach its not my fault blah blah blah.

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02-03-2013, 08:36 PM
  #54
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Caps need a coach like Ken Hitchcock who can analyze the game very well and turnaround teams to the playoffs. I think Oates would be the first to go (than possibly McPhee).
We had exactly that in Dale Hunter.

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02-03-2013, 09:00 PM
  #55
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We had exactly that in Dale Hunter.
And contrary to popular opinion Hunter was great

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02-03-2013, 09:05 PM
  #56
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The first thing to go may be any semblance of an offensive attack. When you give up more than 3 per game, Hunter hockey is never far behind.

Will GM upgrade at G, pull a roster trade shakeup, or blame the obvious short camp new systems new coach its not my fault blah blah blah.
I've always thought it would be an easier rout for the Caps to become a defensive power. The goalie is there with Hotlby (I dont care what the rest of you panicky types say), the D is getting there with Carlson, Alzner and Orlov, time to build the D around these guys. In the meantime, OV, Backstrom, Kuz and Forsberg can amply provide enough offense up front.

If the season goes down the tubes, time to turtle.

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02-03-2013, 09:25 PM
  #57
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I've always thought it would be an easier rout for the Caps to become a defensive power. The goalie is there with Hotlby (I dont care what the rest of you panicky types say), the D is getting there with Carlson, Alzner and Orlov, time to build the D around these guys. In the meantime, OV, Backstrom, Kuz and Forsberg can amply provide enough offense up front.

If the season goes down the tubes, time to turtle.
Had we retained Hunter, had him go a bit more offensive (which I think he'd have done long term but only focused on the defensive side since that's all he had time to) and filled out the roster with higher end hunterhockey guys I really think we could have won the cup this year or at least made a legitimate run for the finals.

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02-03-2013, 10:44 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCupFantasy View Post
Relying on two unproven non-NA players to 1) actually come over, and 2)actually play well enough to be in the top 6? Just a tad risky.
forsberg wants to be here next season..

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02-03-2013, 11:21 PM
  #59
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We had exactly that in Dale Hunter.
I miss Dale.

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02-04-2013, 07:23 AM
  #60
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Can anyone name another NHL head coach that QUIT and was not in danger of being fired, was not retiring, was not moving on to another NHL job, and was not doing anything other than walking away from the team?

Let's say, in the last 40 years...?

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02-04-2013, 08:13 AM
  #61
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They didn't need Dale.

They need an experienced hand at the till. Not 3 new coaches running the show. None with ANY NHL experience.

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02-04-2013, 08:38 AM
  #62
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Can anyone name another NHL head coach that QUIT and was not in danger of being fired, was not retiring, was not moving on to another NHL job, and was not doing anything other than walking away from the team?

Let's say, in the last 40 years...?
He was basically "retiring."

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02-04-2013, 09:05 AM
  #63
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I wonder the real reason Dale bailed. Missing the farm and family, not cut out for city life, we can all understand that. Heck, JJ drove him to games.

But maybe there was more to it than that.

Maybe he discovered it was not going to be easy to win a cup with the team George constructed. The locker room lacking a voice, leaders. A spine. It may have been his young tenders. Dale knew he had to support them to make this work, but in doing so, lost the support of his fans. You. Who knows, but I think he saw a red flag he didn't like. It may be George. You want to retain Wideman at the TDL? Then Wideman you will get.

George had no idea that Dale would us turn defensive. Maybe one day George will realize there was a method to Dale's madness. Ovi not out for an ENG attempt, really?

Did George look in the mirror and realize all the complaints about Dale could all be traced back to the flaws in the team he constructed? Doubtful. But maybe.


Last edited by RandyHolt: 02-04-2013 at 09:11 AM.
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Old
02-04-2013, 09:10 AM
  #64
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forsberg wants to be here next season..
Sure, I understand he may want to be here. That doesn't mean he's a lock to be an NHL top-6 player next season, much less a lock to make the team.

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02-04-2013, 09:20 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
I wonder the real reason Dale bailed. Missing the farm and family, not cut out for city life, we can all understand that. Heck, JJ drove him to games.

But maybe there was more to it than that.

Maybe he discovered it was not going to be easy to win a cup with the team George constructed. The locker room lacking a voice, leaders. A spine. It may have been his young tenders. Dale knew he had to support them to make this work, but in doing so, lost the support of his fans. You. Who knows, but I think he saw a red flag he didn't like. It may be George. You want to retain Wideman at the TDL? Then Wideman you will get.

George had no idea that Dale would us turn defensive. Maybe one day George will realize there was a method to Dale's madness. Ovi not out for an ENG attempt, really?

Did George look in the mirror and realize all the complaints about Dale could all be traced back to the flaws in the team he constructed? Doubtful. But maybe.
I think it's a bit much work than what he was looking towards. Not saying he doesn't put in the time in Juniors, but he has things his way, and less pressure on him. He has his guys there, and if they're guys he doesn't like, he can get rid of them.

I also think that when it came down to it, putting in the time and dealing with a lot of problems in the NHL wasn't his thing.

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02-04-2013, 09:43 AM
  #66
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I agree, but I will say Ted has shown he will spend money. I'm not sure he will in the future though. I don't think I've ever seen an owner so completely clueless about hockey. I remember back when he bought the team how happy I was Abe was gone. Someone joked about getting one of Illitch's kids to buy the team. I laughed at the idea , but at the same time thought interesting idea.

Go Caps!

Yeah, I give full credit to Ted for his willingness to pay the players. He wants the team to win. He just doesn't have the gumption to make it happen.

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02-04-2013, 09:49 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
I wonder the real reason Dale bailed. Missing the farm and family, not cut out for city life, we can all understand that. Heck, JJ drove him to games.

But maybe there was more to it than that.

Maybe he discovered it was not going to be easy to win a cup with the team George constructed. The locker room lacking a voice, leaders. A spine. It may have been his young tenders. Dale knew he had to support them to make this work, but in doing so, lost the support of his fans. You. Who knows, but I think he saw a red flag he didn't like. It may be George. You want to retain Wideman at the TDL? Then Wideman you will get.

George had no idea that Dale would us turn defensive. Maybe one day George will realize there was a method to Dale's madness. Ovi not out for an ENG attempt, really?

Did George look in the mirror and realize all the complaints about Dale could all be traced back to the flaws in the team he constructed? Doubtful. But maybe.

Randy, you must listen to the 980 interview McPhee did right before the season started. It was HEAVILY implied that George went to Dale after the playoff run and said I want more offense from you, and Dale told him he wants to stick with the system. I believe this is why McPhee got rid of Dale. Not because he wanted to go back to his farm or his team.

Personally I would love to see what Dale could do with a roster constructed with the types of players he wants. He got our guys to respond to him like no other coach has done. It was incredible.

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Old
02-04-2013, 10:43 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by tycoonheart View Post
Randy, you must listen to the 980 interview McPhee did right before the season started. It was HEAVILY implied that George went to Dale after the playoff run and said I want more offense from you, and Dale told him he wants to stick with the system. I believe this is why McPhee got rid of Dale. Not because he wanted to go back to his farm or his team.

Personally I would love to see what Dale could do with a roster constructed with the types of players he wants. He got our guys to respond to him like no other coach has done. It was incredible.
Interesting, Dale and George may well have butted heads, pulled out the missing the family excuse, and off he trucked back to Peoria.

It sounds like George is in denial. I am sure he heard enough negative feedback from the fans over the team going to a boring style, and suspect he felt he better make it known. I want more offense too, it's not my fault! Along the lines of coach speak just out work'em!

Now Oates comes in, and from day one includes in every sentence about bringing more offense, that it is going to be founded in solid defense.

So that's two coaches that felt the team is best founded in defense. If he gives his coaches lemons, he shouldn't be complaining to the media when they make lemonade.

Ironically perhaps, he let's Semin walk, almost insuring Oates focuses on D first since we can't win shootouts.

We are giving up 3+ a game and it is early. The young tenders show signs, and then regress. What is a new coach going to do to fix that... send them to Hershey? A new coach knows he will not have a long leash like a young G does.

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02-04-2013, 11:00 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Chimaera View Post
I think it's a bit much work than what he was looking towards. Not saying he doesn't put in the time in Juniors, but he has things his way, and less pressure on him. He has his guys there, and if they're guys he doesn't like, he can get rid of them.

I also think that when it came down to it, putting in the time and dealing with a lot of problems in the NHL wasn't his thing.
Yeah i too suspect it was not just one thing. While he clearly had an eye to coach the caps, the time he came on board was very difficult. Following Bruce and all his success, was not easy. Pressure to win now, with Ovi maybe past his peak.

Coupled with the other stars shine having dulled too, Nick and Semin off their peaks. Green seemingly in the middle of trying to reinvent his game amid numerous injuries. That's the core he had to work with, backed with inconsistent G play.

Loosing the ability to be a GM may be something that irked him. While even I was annoyed that Wideman got so much playoff time, Dale had no choice but to roll with George's guys, Aucoin, Sarge, Beagle etc. A coach must have faith in his GM and his players, right?

I wonder if Dale would have been a better GM than coach.

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02-04-2013, 11:13 AM
  #70
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And contrary to popular opinion Hunter was great
Hunter quit.

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02-04-2013, 11:29 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
Yeah i too suspect it was not just one thing. While he clearly had an eye to coach the caps, the time he came on board was very difficult. Following Bruce and all his success, was not easy. Pressure to win now, with Ovi maybe past his peak.

Coupled with the other stars shine having dulled too, Nick and Semin off their peaks. Green seemingly in the middle of trying to reinvent his game amid numerous injuries. That's the core he had to work with, backed with inconsistent G play.

Loosing the ability to be a GM may be something that irked him. While even I was annoyed that Wideman got so much playoff time, Dale had no choice but to roll with George's guys, Aucoin, Sarge, Beagle etc. A coach must have faith in his GM and his players, right?

I wonder if Dale would have been a better GM than coach.
I wonder that, too. Admittedly have not checked for myself - is he responsible for putting the Knights' roster together or is that his brother's job?

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02-04-2013, 11:45 AM
  #72
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I wonder that, too. Admittedly have not checked for myself - is he responsible for putting the Knights' roster together or is that his brother's job?
The Hunters run the organization as a family, so it's just really group scouting.

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02-04-2013, 12:23 PM
  #73
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Dale was relying heavily on his assistants here. Not unlike how the Hunters like to run things, collectively. Unlike Bruce who compartmentalized coaching. Evason, you and you alone have full control of the PK etc.

Maybe George's vision didn't blend in well with Dale and his assistants. Dale knew Semin was a goner not to be replaced, and was being told to be more offensive. Semin seemed to respond well to Dale and suspect was not thrilled to know he was a goner.

Dale never struck me as a quitter and him gone so soon says a lot to me about the problems that this team faces. He may well have been given an ultimatum, run the team my way, or quit. Yeah, no thanks George. I am outta here.

I wonder how the direction of the team would have changed if Dale was named GM instead of coach. Ink Wides for 6M for the win!


Last edited by RandyHolt: 02-04-2013 at 12:37 PM.
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Old
02-06-2013, 08:12 AM
  #74
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IDK who the first to go will be. The season isn't necessarily down the tubes yet, although headed there quickly, but someone will have to "go" when Laich gets back. And someone else will have to go because Hillen and Orlov I don't think are far behind. Although Hillen could go on waivers for all I care.

So I say Hamrlik will be the first and for his sake I hope he is. After coming off a strong performance in the playoffs I don't think he's gotten much of a look. His second half of the season was good but he seems to be the scapegoat for new coaches when things go wrong.

When the season is gone...........

Could definitely get something nice for Ribeiro. If he loves Washington that much there's a chance he comes back. He's not a young guy though and he'll be looking for that "retirement" contract.

And Poti will go.

From the core group. Maybe Schultz - he's gotta be considered core, right? LOL

One of four right handed d-men could go. Carlson, Green, Orlov and throw Kundratek in there now.

IDK who else. Oates and the coaching staff but it won't happen.

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02-06-2013, 08:32 AM
  #75
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IDK who the first to go will be. The season isn't necessarily down the tubes yet, although headed there quickly, but someone will have to "go" when Laich gets back. And someone else will have to go because Hillen and Orlov I don't think are far behind. Although Hillen could go on waivers for all I care.

So I say Hamrlik will be the first and for his sake I hope he is. After coming off a strong performance in the playoffs I don't think he's gotten much of a look. His second half of the season was good but he seems to be the scapegoat for new coaches when things go wrong.

When the season is gone...........

Could definitely get something nice for Ribeiro. If he loves Washington that much there's a chance he comes back. He's not a young guy though and he'll be looking for that "retirement" contract.

And Poti will go.

From the core group. Maybe Schultz - he's gotta be considered core, right? LOL

One of four right handed d-men could go. Carlson, Green, Orlov and throw Kundratek in there now.

IDK who else. Oates and the coaching staff but it won't happen.
Orlov and Kundratek are both left handed shots.

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