HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

Eller

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-04-2013, 12:42 PM
  #76
Andy
Registered User
 
Andy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,721
vCash: 500
A centre who couldn't make it on the wings in Montreal but was shipped off and did well as a centre elsewhere: Grabovski.

Just because you have examples of players that have done it, doesn't mean it's generalizable.

Eller hasn't found a role because he hasn't been given a role under Therrien. He's in limbo because Therrien hasn't made a spot for him. Eller had no problem finding a role last year getting tough opposition, being defensively responsible, playing extremely well on the PK and putting up points in a 3rd line shutdown/puck possession role. He filled that rolled excellently. Stop bouncing him around, put confidence in him and he'll do well. Eller filled his "role" on the wing quite well in Buffalo, yet Therrien still decided to take him out of it (yes, Pacioretty returning is a good reason). Roles start with the coach, Eller has shown his tools, up to the man behind the bench to allow the player to use them properly.

Andy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 12:47 PM
  #77
Kjell Dahlin
Registered User
 
Kjell Dahlin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Québec, Québec
Posts: 1,998
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
A centre who couldn't make it on the wings in Montreal but was shipped off and did well as a centre elsewhere: Grabovski.

Just because you have examples of players that have done it, doesn't mean it's generalizable.

Eller hasn't found a role because he hasn't been given a role under Therrien. He's in limbo because Therrien hasn't made a spot for him. Eller had no problem finding a role last year getting tough opposition, being defensively responsible, playing extremely well on the PK and putting up points in a 3rd line shutdown/puck possession role. He filled that rolled excellently.
He is in limbo because Gallagher and Galchenyuk surpassed him in the depth chart. Plus, Prust also became a lock on 3rd.

As I already mentioned, if Eller keeps playing like he did Saturday, he will force himself back in the lineup. Maybe on wings though.


PS a quick note regarding Grabovski: his big head is what shipped him out of town. Eller seems to have a good work ethic and attitude.

Kjell Dahlin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 12:50 PM
  #78
Andy
Registered User
 
Andy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,721
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjell Dahlin View Post
He is in limbo because Gallagher and Galchenyuk surpassed him in the depth chart. Plus, Prust also became a lock on 3rd.

As I already mentioned, if Eller keeps playing like he did Saturday, he will force himself back in the lineup. Maybe on wings though.
Only because Therrien decided it. It's not like Eller played an entire season and was crap in comparison to the other two players, Therrien made up his mind after 1 game. In fact Therrien made up his mind in the summer when he insisted that Eller would be used on the wings.

Give Eller a role and he will fill it. Keep bouncing him around and he'll look like a player that bounces around. When given the 3rd line centre role, he filled it. When given the winger role the last few games, he was starting to fill it. What role Eller has is up to the coach, but Therrien already made up his mind after one game. Sounds very similar to what Martin did with Sergei, O'Byrne, D'agostini etc etc yet people aren't complaining for what Therrien has done.

Andy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 01:03 PM
  #79
Kjell Dahlin
Registered User
 
Kjell Dahlin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Québec, Québec
Posts: 1,998
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Only because Therrien decided it. It's not like Eller played an entire season and was crap in comparison to the other two players, Therrien made up his mind after 1 game. In fact Therrien made up his mind in the summer when he insisted that Eller would be used on the wings.

Give Eller a role and he will fill it. Keep bouncing him around and he'll look like a player that bounces around. When given the 3rd line centre role, he filled it. When given the winger role the last few games, he was starting to fill it. What role Eller has is up to the coach, but Therrien already made up his mind after one game. Sounds very similar to what Martin did with Sergei, O'Byrne, D'agostini etc etc yet people aren't complaining for what Therrien has done.
You don't have to convince me that Eller is a good player but right now, with everyone healthy and especially against tough teams like Boston, finding him a spot is a hard task. As I mentioned in another thread, depth does imply sending a good player in the press box. And yes, Eller is a good player.

The only thing Eller can do is keep on working hard, wait for an opening, as a C or on wings, and force himself back in the lineup.

Btw I would agree with you IF the team was losing games.

Kjell Dahlin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 01:14 PM
  #80
jwolf
Registered User
 
jwolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 573
vCash: 500
If Eller is going to be put in a position to succeed, the only spot I see him in is on the DD line. Perhaps something like this:

Bourque - Plek - Gionta
Pacioretty - DD - Eller
Cole - Chuckie - Gally
Moen - Prust - Armstrong/White

I could theoretically see him on the 3rd line with the kids as well, but I get the feeling MT wants a vet with them. All things being equal - barring any injuries - Eller might have to content himself with 4th line minutes.

He's starting to play well... Let's see what happens.

jwolf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 01:25 PM
  #81
LarsEller
Registered User
 
LarsEller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Copenhagen
Country: Denmark
Posts: 140
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwolf View Post
If Eller is going to be put in a position to succeed, the only spot I see him in is on the DD line. Perhaps something like this:

Bourque - Plek - Gionta
Pacioretty - DD - Eller
Cole - Chuckie - Gally
Moen - Prust - Armstrong/White

I could theoretically see him on the 3rd line with the kids as well, but I get the feeling MT wants a vet with them. All things being equal - barring any injuries - Eller might have to content himself with 4th line minutes.

He's starting to play well... Let's see what happens.
Switch DD with eller and white instead of Armstrong and im Loving that lineup

LarsEller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 01:27 PM
  #82
idk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 348
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Only because Therrien decided it. It's not like Eller played an entire season and was crap in comparison to the other two players, Therrien made up his mind after 1 game. In fact Therrien made up his mind in the summer when he insisted that Eller would be used on the wings.

Give Eller a role and he will fill it. Keep bouncing him around and he'll look like a player that bounces around. When given the 3rd line centre role, he filled it. When given the winger role the last few games, he was starting to fill it. What role Eller has is up to the coach, but Therrien already made up his mind after one game. Sounds very similar to what Martin did with Sergei, O'Byrne, D'agostini etc etc yet people aren't complaining for what Therrien has done.
You're quite right - the problem with Eller is that he doesn't have a role on the team. But as quick as you are to blame Therrien for that, Lars (and the situation the team is in) should also take some of the blame.

Lars is not better than any of out top six. You might get some debate on Bourque - Lars had a better season last season, but Bourque looked really good in camp and brings some things (physicality) that Eller doesn't. Bourque is also more of a Therrien type player, so like it or not Bourque is going to get that last top six spot. So already he's being relegated as a third line role at the best. Now he might have been a good fit on an offensive third line, but even that's not working for him because Therrien has decided to make that line our "young guys" line. You may agree or disagree with that strategy, but Gallagher-Galchenyuk are producing great results for a third line. Galchenyuk is third among all rookies in points, and Gallagher is fifth (and playing two to four minutes less a night then their competition to boot). So why not replace Prust with Eller (after all - Eller's young too - three young guns > two)? Because that line won't work with Eller on it. Both Gallagher and Galchenyuk are younger and faster than a lot of the guys they're matched up with. But they're not fully physically developed yet. The way to stop them is to play them physical. Prust on that lines gives them a little bit of backup, so if things get rough there's someone there to sort it out.

That leaves the fourth line. And Eller looked okay between Moen and Armstrong but, let's be frank. That's not the kind of game he excels at. That's why White is there. Because Eller does not fit real well.

I feel bad about Lars. He's a talented kid who's only faults are not being good enough at 23 to break into our top six and not being young enough to line up with Galchenyuk. As a fill in he's done excellent - a testament to his talent, but short of extended injury I just don't see him fitting in anywhere long term this season.

idk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 01:32 PM
  #83
Andy
Registered User
 
Andy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,721
vCash: 500
How should Lars take the blame when the coach decided his role after 1 game. I'd understand if half the season was done and Eller crapped the bed, but Therrien decided no role for lars after the first game, where he wasn't even the worst player on the ice.

Andy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 01:44 PM
  #84
yianik
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,871
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by idk View Post
You're quite right - the problem with Eller is that he doesn't have a role on the team. But as quick as you are to blame Therrien for that, Lars (and the situation the team is in) should also take some of the blame.

Lars is not better than any of out top six. You might get some debate on Bourque - Lars had a better season last season, but Bourque looked really good in camp and brings some things (physicality) that Eller doesn't. Bourque is also more of a Therrien type player, so like it or not Bourque is going to get that last top six spot. So already he's being relegated as a third line role at the best. Now he might have been a good fit on an offensive third line, but even that's not working for him because Therrien has decided to make that line our "young guys" line. You may agree or disagree with that strategy, but Gallagher-Galchenyuk are producing great results for a third line. Galchenyuk is third among all rookies in points, and Gallagher is fifth (and playing two to four minutes less a night then their competition to boot). So why not replace Prust with Eller (after all - Eller's young too - three young guns > two)? Because that line won't work with Eller on it. Both Gallagher and Galchenyuk are younger and faster than a lot of the guys they're matched up with. But they're not fully physically developed yet. The way to stop them is to play them physical. Prust on that lines gives them a little bit of backup, so if things get rough there's someone there to sort it out.

That leaves the fourth line. And Eller looked okay between Moen and Armstrong but, let's be frank. That's not the kind of game he excels at. That's why White is there. Because Eller does not fit real well.

I feel bad about Lars. He's a talented kid who's only faults are not being good enough at 23 to break into our top six and not being young enough to line up with Galchenyuk. As a fill in he's done excellent - a testament to his talent, but short of extended injury I just don't see him fitting in anywhere long term this season.
Unfortunately this is the truth of the reality. I like Eller and I dont think he is being given a chance to see what he can do because that would mean he lines up with skill players, but those lines are full. Last year I was annoyed when the AK-Eller-Moen line was broken up because Eller was producing with the skilled AK. This year its hard to fault MT because the top 3 lines make sense. However, maybe against a less physical team you play Eller with the Gallys and see how it goes, or at home where you can line match better. For sure give him some PP time,as MT did against Ottawa.

yianik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 02:00 PM
  #85
DuklaNation
Registered User
 
DuklaNation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,827
vCash: 500
This situation reminds me of Andrew Ladd. Only a trade allowed him to get more ice time to show what he was capable of.

DuklaNation is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 02:08 PM
  #86
S Bah
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: victoria bc
Country: Wales
Posts: 4,570
vCash: 50
It certainly is a nice situation having depth at center,again,as the Habs always had in the past.

S Bah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 02:09 PM
  #87
fufonzo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,522
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to fufonzo Send a message via MSN to fufonzo
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwolf View Post
If Eller is going to be put in a position to succeed, the only spot I see him in is on the DD line. Perhaps something like this:

Bourque - Plek - Gionta
Pacioretty - DD - Eller
Cole - Chuckie - Gally
Moen - Prust - Armstrong/White

I could theoretically see him on the 3rd line with the kids as well, but I get the feeling MT wants a vet with them. All things being equal - barring any injuries - Eller might have to content himself with 4th line minutes.

He's starting to play well... Let's see what happens.
I actually really like that lineup. I think Cole would be a perfect mentor for the kids. He's also big and strong so he can help support them physically too.

fufonzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 02:19 PM
  #88
Habtchum*
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,726
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
How should Lars take the blame when the coach decided his role after 1 game. I'd understand if half the season was done and Eller crapped the bed, but Therrien decided no role for lars after the first game, where he wasn't even the worst player on the ice.
Actually, Eller's role is as the 3rd line center. Just happened that Galchenyuk did way better than expected and took it...for the moment.

I am pretty sure the Habs were not expecting that TWO rookies would make it. + The arrival of Prust (much needed) and Armstrong (less needed)

Eller and Leblanc are the ones who have been most screwed up by this situation.

Habtchum* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 02:34 PM
  #89
Joe Cole
Registered User
 
Joe Cole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Montreal
Posts: 3,185
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
Actually, Eller's role is as the 3rd line center. Just happened that Galchenyuk did way better than expected and took it...for the moment.

I am pretty sure the Habs were not expecting that TWO rookies would make it. + The arrival of Prust (much needed) and Armstrong (less needed)

Eller and Leblanc are the ones who have been most screwed up by this situation.
I agree Eller is a third line center. The problem is not Galchenyuk, it is Plekanec and Desharnais.

Galchenyuk will displace one of the top two centers next year, and Eller has the best profile out of all four of them to be a third line center.

Hopefully he and the Habs can wait around until Galchenyuk can handle the role of top 2 center quickly enough.

Joe Cole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 04:01 PM
  #90
Mrb1p
Registered User
 
Mrb1p's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Citizen of the world
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,870
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Eller is milquetoast and needs to re-invent himself to stay in the NHL. The team needs a player that can play in all zones and win key faceoffs, that's a need I see Eller possibly filling. Otherwise, Ryan White may step up and make Eller completely redundant.

At that point he'll be reduced to an obscure answer to a trivia question about Jaro Halak.
Ryan freaking White ?

I love the kid.. But what ??????????????

Mrb1p is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 04:05 PM
  #91
overlords
Global Moderator
Jack Arse
 
overlords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Trolling Brian Wilde
Posts: 26,129
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrb1p View Post
Ryan freaking White ?

I love the kid.. But what ??????????????
Earl is still mad about Halak. Don't mind him.

__________________



"overlords is one of my favorite people on this entire site." - Hfboards
overlords is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 04:07 PM
  #92
domdo345
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,104
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Cole View Post
I agree Eller is a third line center. The problem is not Galchenyuk, it is Plekanec and Desharnais.

Galchenyuk will displace one of the top two centers next year, and Eller has the best profile out of all four of them to be a third line center.

Hopefully he and the Habs can wait around until Galchenyuk can handle the role of top 2 center quickly enough.
I know galchenyuk progress quickly, but I really really doubt he will displace one of Plek or DD next year. Maybe by the end of the year, but my guess would be in 2-3 years.

domdo345 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 04:10 PM
  #93
Mrb1p
Registered User
 
Mrb1p's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Citizen of the world
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,870
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by domdo345 View Post
I know galchenyuk progress quickly, but I really really doubt he will displace one of Plek or DD next year. Maybe by the end of the year, but my guess would be in 2-3 years.
DD is already pretty much redundant right now...

Mrb1p is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 04:14 PM
  #94
domdo345
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,104
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrb1p View Post
DD is already pretty much redundant right now...
you say so but 2 sets of coaches and managements with completely different mentality say and act otherwise...

I mean, DD isnt the second coming of Marty St-Louis but he's getting underrated alot around here.

domdo345 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 04:27 PM
  #95
Agnostic
11 Stanley Cups
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,923
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrb1p View Post
Ryan freaking White ?

I love the kid.. But what ??????????????
Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
Earl is still mad about Halak. Don't mind him.
Don't know why I would reply to this but ...

White seems better on faceoffs than Eller, a key ingredient to a 3rd line skillset . He's tougher , and if Eller's top end production is 16 goals I think White can match that.

So, as I said, if Eller doesn't develop beyond a ok offensively ok defensively unspecialized player he's replaceable, and the replacement is already on the team.

Agnostic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 04:35 PM
  #96
OneSharpMarble
Registered User
 
OneSharpMarble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,203
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwolf View Post
If Eller is going to be put in a position to succeed, the only spot I see him in is on the DD line. Perhaps something like this:

Bourque - Plek - Gionta
Pacioretty - DD - Eller
Cole - Chuckie - Gally
Moen - Prust - Armstrong/White

I could theoretically see him on the 3rd line with the kids as well, but I get the feeling MT wants a vet with them. All things being equal - barring any injuries - Eller might have to content himself with 4th line minutes.

He's starting to play well... Let's see what happens.
Cole isn't a LW, you put him there you might aswell trade the guy. Eller on Galchenyuks wing is a better idea but then you miss out on Prust protecting the kids.

OneSharpMarble is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 04:43 PM
  #97
Habaddict
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 827
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Only because Therrien decided it. It's not like Eller played an entire season and was crap in comparison to the other two players, Therrien made up his mind after 1 game. In fact Therrien made up his mind in the summer when he insisted that Eller would be used on the wings.

Give Eller a role and he will fill it. Keep bouncing him around and he'll look like a player that bounces around. When given the 3rd line centre role, he filled it. When given the winger role the last few games, he was starting to fill it. What role Eller has is up to the coach, but Therrien already made up his mind after one game. Sounds very similar to what Martin did with Sergei, O'Byrne, D'agostini etc etc yet people aren't complaining for what Therrien has done.
I'm not at all certain that Therrien has decided anything about Eller's place
on the depth chart. The next time one of the top ten forwards sit out, for
whatever reason, it could as easily be Gallagher as Eller. Although, I agree that
Eller's ability to play more than one role makes him likely to be used in more
than one role.
But I will be surprised if Eller sits in favor of some forth liner. And I certainly
don't think the habs are going to trade Eller to find more playing time for the
forth line.

Habaddict is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 05:12 PM
  #98
Habaddict
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 827
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Don't know why I would reply to this but ...

White seems better on faceoffs than Eller, a key ingredient to a 3rd line skillset . He's tougher , and if Eller's top end production is 16 goals I think White can match that.

So, as I said, if Eller doesn't develop beyond a ok offensively ok defensively unspecialized player he's replaceable, and the replacement is already on the team.
Why ?

As in why do you think that White is better than Eller on face-offs? The only
thing we know about it, is that Eller did take more face-offs, against better
opponents.

Also why do you think that 16 goals is Eller's ceiling? But White, who
is older, and has never had more than 2 in a season is going to surpass that.
Is it because Eller lacks the offensive skills that White brings?

And if you are arguing that White is going to learn to play defense as well
as Eller, I think he has a long way to go.


Last edited by Habaddict: 02-04-2013 at 05:37 PM.
Habaddict is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 08:05 PM
  #99
MasterDecoy
Carlos Danger
 
MasterDecoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Beijing
Posts: 9,724
vCash: 1707
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Eller is milquetoast and needs to re-invent himself to stay in the NHL. The team needs a player that can play in all zones and win key faceoffs, that's a need I see Eller possibly filling. Otherwise, Ryan White may step up and make Eller completely redundant.

At that point he'll be reduced to an obscure answer to a trivia question about Jaro Halak.
yeah... no.

MasterDecoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2013, 11:51 PM
  #100
Guy Caballero
Registered User
 
Guy Caballero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,851
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Desharnais-Eller-Cole
Bourque-Plekanec-Gionta
Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Gallagher
Prust-White-Moen
This is getting a lot of love for some reason, but I disagree. You don't break up a good line to fix a bad line, and in this case you're doing it twice, since the DD line is now getting hot.

Guy Caballero is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:23 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.