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Visnovsky Drama Part III (Mod Warning Post #575)

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02-04-2013, 12:44 PM
  #576
BKeschhh
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Visnovsky has had many 50+ point seasons with a few teams, but struggled a bit offensively last year. How do you guys think he will fair this year on the Islanders with them playing well?

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02-04-2013, 01:09 PM
  #577
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Originally Posted by BKeschhh View Post
Visnovsky has had many 50+ point seasons with a few teams, but struggled a bit offensively last year. How do you guys think he will fair this year on the Islanders with them playing well?
He's more than a little long in the tooth, but still skilled. If he plays in about 38 games and has his attitude corrected, I'd guess somewhere between 15 to 20 points or so, maybe more if he brings his 'A-game' and doesn't pout.

I can't say speak for his honesty or his attitude, though - those of us who've been Islanders fans long enough have seen too many people come here and stink it up - Karpovtsev, Rolston, and Muller come to mind. Taking the legality of the trade to an arbitrator and voicing a desire to simply not return to the NHL both don't really give us too much ground to believe he'll pitch much effort, so whether we'll get a usable sliver of the game he brought during his good years in on the west coast or Karpovtsev 2.0 remains to be seen.

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02-04-2013, 01:10 PM
  #578
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Originally Posted by BKeschhh View Post
Visnovsky has had many 50+ point seasons with a few teams, but struggled a bit offensively last year. How do you guys think he will fair this year on the Islanders with them playing well?
Not sure. I always have severe doubts about players over 35 maintaining their abilities from year to year.

The other problem is team chemistry. The core of the power play has been there for over a year with JT, Moulson, Streit and Frans. The only change was Boyes replacing Parenteau. Lubo may or not be better than Streit or Frans but sometimes the sums of the parts do not translate to the same value as the unit.

With no training camp and Lubo coming in after the season has started he has deprived the coaching staff of the chance of having him learn the system first. As with any in season trade there is an adjustment system to new players and a new system. He should be on the second power play unit with Hamonic until we see if the unit will eventually work better with him. Unfortunately this is a very short season and we'll probably never know what he could have accomplished if he had came right over.

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02-04-2013, 01:59 PM
  #579
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Not sure. I always have severe doubts about players over 35 maintaining their abilities from year to year.

The other problem is team chemistry. The core of the power play has been there for over a year with JT, Moulson, Streit and Frans. The only change was Boyes replacing Parenteau. Lubo may or not be better than Streit or Frans but sometimes the sums of the parts do not translate to the same value as the unit.

With no training camp and Lubo coming in after the season has started he has deprived the coaching staff of the chance of having him learn the system first. As with any in season trade there is an adjustment system to new players and a new system. He should be on the second power play unit with Hamonic until we see if the unit will eventually work better with him. Unfortunately this is a very short season and we'll probably never know what he could have accomplished if he had came right over.
Funny thing....the best players the first few games didn't know "the system."

They just played hockey.

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02-04-2013, 02:25 PM
  #580
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Funny thing....the best players the first few games didn't know "the system."

They just played hockey.
Granted that guys like Aucoin and Strait played extremely well because they just played hockey. They are guys that are showing a lot of hustle also because they are "hungry" players. I'm not that sure Lubo really wants to be here.

Players that know the system and were in physical shape like Frans, Grabner, Hamonic, MacDonald along with players who know the system from Bridgeport like Ullstrom and McDonald also played well.

Hockey is a game of trust and if you know where Streit or Frans are on the ice it's more efficient than not being sure of where a new person will be.

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02-04-2013, 04:04 PM
  #581
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Quote:
Originally Posted by original islander View Post
Granted that guys like Aucoin and Strait played extremely well because they just played hockey. They are guys that are showing a lot of hustle also because they are "hungry" players. I'm not that sure Lubo really wants to be here.

Players that know the system and were in physical shape like Frans, Grabner, Hamonic, MacDonald along with players who know the system from Bridgeport like Ullstrom and McDonald also played well.

Hockey is a game of trust and if you know where Streit or Frans are on the ice it's more efficient than not being sure of where a new person will be.
Listen at the end of the day the guy is a professional athlete. No matter what, everyone has pride. He will play 100% because of this. Lets throw in the fact that he "might" be playing for a contract next year with the Isles or another NHL team. Or even a KHL team. The better he plays the more money he will make. End of story! I think his attitude is poor, but I also think he will help this team starting the second he laces up his skates for the NY Islanders.

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02-04-2013, 04:07 PM
  #582
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Listen at the end of the day the guy is a professional athlete. No matter what, everyone has pride. He will play 100% because of this. Lets throw in the fact that he "might" be playing for a contract next year with the Isles or another NHL team. Or even a KHL team. The better he plays the more money he will make. End of story! I think his attitude is poor, but I also think he will help this team starting the second he laces up his skates for the NY Islanders.
I agree.

Vis is saying how great it would be, to make the playoffs. I expect he'll work hard when he gets here.

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02-04-2013, 04:18 PM
  #583
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Originally Posted by mhs8hockey View Post
Listen at the end of the day the guy is a professional athlete. No matter what, everyone has pride. He will play 100% because of this. Lets throw in the fact that he "might" be playing for a contract next year with the Isles or another NHL team. Or even a KHL team. The better he plays the more money he will make. End of story! I think his attitude is poor, but I also think he will help this team starting the second he laces up his skates for the NY Islanders.
I thought Kirk Muller would play hard, I thought Ryan Smyth would do his best and I thought that Brian Rolston would thrive. Only Smyth played his best. It is naive to not be concerned about Lubo's effort. He may give his best or he may just finish out the contract. We don't know what will happen and he has given this fan base little reason to trust that his heart is in it.

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02-04-2013, 04:46 PM
  #584
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What does he gain by not giving 100% though? Doesn't help us make the playoffs and certainly doesn't help him get dealt to a contender come the deadline if we are, once again, on the outside looking in...

I'm not worried about his compete level whatsoever...

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02-04-2013, 05:04 PM
  #585
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What does he gain by not giving 100% though? Doesn't help us make the playoffs and certainly doesn't help him get dealt to a contender come the deadline if we are, once again, on the outside looking in...

I'm not worried about his compete level whatsoever...
I'm not saying that he will or won't compete hard because we can't know what's inside his heart. I simply brought up the possibility when another poster pointed out that a couple of players that don't know our system were our best players in the early games.

My response was meant to indicate that I felt that guys like Aucoin and Strait's play was a direct of their hustle and that I'm not sure that Lubo has the same desire or motivation. After all he has given the impression that he would like to play elsewhere just as he did to Edmonton when he was traded from LA.

If anyone is interested you can look up his stats on yahoo. I don't know how to provide links when posting on the phone. But when you look at them you will noticed his numbers in Edmonton were not as good as in LA and Anaheim where he was geographically happy. Granted he was banged up, but still cause for concern.

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02-04-2013, 05:34 PM
  #586
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The isles were correct in not letting him play any games with slovan.

For all they know, buying the plane ticket and all the crap he said to the media was just to sucker the isles into giving him permission to play with slovan. How many times has this guy's story changed already?

You have to be a sucker to believe anything he says until he ACTUALLY reports.

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02-04-2013, 05:40 PM
  #587
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He still has other family members that could need "surgery"....

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02-04-2013, 07:28 PM
  #588
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I'm not worried about his compete level whatsoever...
That's because you expect him to act like an adult. The "I don't like the situation, so I'm not gonna try" mentality is a kid's way of thinking. So, it's reasonable to expect that since Vis is an adult, he would have an adult way of approaching things. The problem is that Vis has yet to exhibit that he's capable of acting like an adult. So far he's acted like some people who suggest that it's proper to get paid but not try to do a good job because you don't like your boss.

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02-04-2013, 07:33 PM
  #589
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...not playing at his best only makes his situation worse. His chances to see any playoff action takes a big blow and, if he really does want to be Elsewhere, playing like crap is not going to have other teams looking to acquire him...so I just don't see him cutting off his nose to spite his face.

I think he's going to play really well for us and this whole mess will be long forgotten soon thereafter...

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02-04-2013, 07:39 PM
  #590
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I am keeping an open mind for the first few games because I have no other choice.

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02-04-2013, 07:47 PM
  #591
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...can't put it any better than that...

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02-04-2013, 07:52 PM
  #592
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...not playing at his best only makes his situation worse. His chances to see any playoff action takes a big blow and, if he really does want to be Elsewhere, playing like crap is not going to have other teams looking to acquire him...so I just don't see him cutting off his nose to spite his face.

I think he's going to play really well for us and this whole mess will be long forgotten soon thereafter...
There's a difference between intentionally dogging it and not being motivated.

If a player's being forced to play somewhere just to fulfill his contract so he can go elsewhere next season, the odds of him putting his heart into it and giving it 100% are slim to none.

Think about it if you have a project at work you don't want to do that was forced on you. Is it going to be your best work? Hell no.

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02-04-2013, 08:00 PM
  #593
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I am keeping an open mind for the first few games because I have no other choice.
Who said that? Vis? Snow?


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02-04-2013, 08:17 PM
  #594
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There's a difference between intentionally dogging it and not being motivated.

If a player's being forced to play somewhere just to fulfill his contract so he can go elsewhere next season, the odds of him putting his heart into it and giving it 100% are slim to none.

Think about it if you have a project at work you don't want to do that was forced on you. Is it going to be your best work? Hell no.
...not if he'd like to get traded to a contender if and when the wheels come off...

...and if I thought that aforementioned project gave me a better chance of getting promoted and or provided an opportunity to show another employer just how valuable I could be, I'd give it all I had and then some.

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02-04-2013, 08:22 PM
  #595
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There's a difference between intentionally dogging it and not being motivated.

If a player's being forced to play somewhere just to fulfill his contract so he can go elsewhere next season, the odds of him putting his heart into it and giving it 100% are slim to none.

Think about it if you have a project at work you don't want to do that was forced on you. Is it going to be your best work? Hell no.
Well I guess Nabakov is the ostracized example of that? The guy had no choice but to play for the Islanders, next thing you know when the guy finally throws on the sweater he becomes our best chance between the pipes night in and night out.

Keep in mind, if Viz plays well enough and the Islanders get a few phone calls, the guy might get his wish and get shipped off the Island.

You never play uninspired. You risk injury, you risk your reputation and you risk being able to further your career.

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02-04-2013, 08:44 PM
  #596
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Eh, I think you guys are totally off the mark with this. In the end it is still a sport and everyone knows it is no fun to lose. Nobody will intentionally dog it. They may not form bonds in the lockerroom or show a vested interest in their teammates as people, BUT he won't dog it. There is no way. I'm not saying he's going to be great, but if he doesn't preform well it won't be because he isn't competing. You just can't make it as a professional athlete in today's world without a high compete level inside you and that doesn't go away. That's why the friggin guy is still playing hockey at this age. Same with Nabby.

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02-04-2013, 09:07 PM
  #597
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...and if I thought that aforementioned project gave me a better chance of getting promoted and or provided an opportunity to show another employer just how valuable I could be, I'd give it all I had and then some.
There you go again with that thinking like an adult thing.

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02-04-2013, 09:28 PM
  #598
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There's plenty of time to get on him if he indeed comes here and "dogs it" Rich...I don't have the energy to assume that's going to be the case and get pissed as a result.

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02-04-2013, 09:57 PM
  #599
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...not if he'd like to get traded to a contender if and when the wheels come off...

...and if I thought that aforementioned project gave me a better chance of getting promoted and or provided an opportunity to show another employer just how valuable I could be, I'd give it all I had and then some.
Based on his crappy attitude and his unwillingness to go play so far, it's highly highly unlikely he's the kind of person who can put their heart into something they don't want to do.

Generally when people are forced to do something they don't want to do, it's not going to be their best effort.

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02-04-2013, 10:17 PM
  #600
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There's plenty of time to get on him if he indeed comes here and "dogs it" Rich...I don't have the energy to assume that's going to be the case and get pissed as a result.
But what some people are saying is, just because he isn't dogging it doesn't mean he is still giving his maximum effort. For instance staying extra at practice to work on stuff (with a teammate or coach) or watch extra video, or help a teammate who might be struggling.

Just going through the motions (Rolston) and really being a team player and trying to perfect your craft (JT91) are two totally different things.

Obviously we all hope he comes in here and crushes it. Who knows, maybe he'll feel rejuvenated with a young/hungry team looking to take a next step. The islanders don't have a lot of star power, if the isles can make any sort of run, I'm sure you'll see a lot of pundits claim Lubo's presence had a lot to do with it.

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