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*ALL* Luongo Talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals)

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02-04-2013, 04:31 PM
  #576
Syckle78
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Read back in the thread for my posts that don't involve yourself (or syckle who made a similar call).


I've told you that your perception is flawed. I've called you out on your interpretations of markets, to which you admitted it is impossible to know. Maybe you're just seeing my posts related to you?


WSH wasn't seriously on the radar before Gillis's visit. Now if they weren't on the radar prior to his visit, and the market looked bleak otherwise, what does that say about the perception of the market?
What are you going on about? Everything on this subforum is nothing but speculation on perceptions. No one really knows anything and when we do( or think we do) we are basing it on some writers speculation on perceptions. So I guess my question is what the heck is the difference between market speculation and anything else we speculate on?

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02-04-2013, 04:32 PM
  #577
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I'm no NHL GM, but I'm not sure they make decisions on 7 game samples.
Of course they don't.

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02-04-2013, 04:34 PM
  #578
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
I'm no NHL GM, but I'm not sure they make decisions on 7 game samples.
7 games! That's a long term view.
On this thread it's based on one game sample sizes.
If Schneider has a bad game the Canucks should trade him. If Reimer has a good one the Leafs are all set.
If Luongo gets a shut out his value skyrockets.

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02-04-2013, 04:37 PM
  #579
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
What are you going on about? Everything on this subforum is nothing but speculation on perceptions. No one really knows anything and when we do( or think we do) we are basing it on some writers speculation on perceptions. So I guess my question is what the heck is the difference between market speculation and anything else we speculate on?


It's the difference between and informed opinion and one that is woefully misinformed. Why do some posters seem much better than others on here? If everyone is speculating upon speculation, how is it that these posters distinguish themselves among the flock? Better speculators? Or maybe they have a knack for amalgamating information, sifting through the detritus, and presenting a learned and rationally objective argument?


The informed opinion is much more valid. I wouldn't have scoffed at the notion of "tha marketa she's a shrinkingaa" had it been backed by something more informed, more reasoned through multiple sources and objective information, than just "that's my perception guy". But then I've seen that argument again and again over a ton of Luongo threads, and you guys are new it seems.

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02-04-2013, 04:39 PM
  #580
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Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
7 games! That's a long term view.
On this thread it's based on one game sample sizes.
If Schneider has a bad game the Canucks should trade him. If Reimer has a good one the Leafs are all set.
If Luongo gets a shut out his value skyrockets.


Luongo went from zero to hero in 7 games. Memories are short. He's played like this for years.

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02-04-2013, 04:42 PM
  #581
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Luongo went from zero to hero in 7 games. Memories are short. He's played like this for years.
Agreed. Now if only he could figure out how to miss October every year he'd be all set.
Seriously though this is the best I've seen him play at the start of the season for a while. With a 700 game resume though I doubt that many GM's are basing their views on such a short term.

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02-04-2013, 04:47 PM
  #582
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
It's the difference between and informed opinion and one that is woefully misinformed. Why do some posters seem much better than others on here? If everyone is speculating upon speculation, how is it that thyese posters distinguish themselves among the flock? Better speculators? Or maybe they have a knack for amalgamating information, sifting through the detritus, and presenting a learned and rationally objective argument?


The informed opinion is much more valid. I wouldn't have scoffed at the notion of "tha marketa she's a shrinkingaa" had it been backed by something more informed, more reasoned through multiple sources and objective information, than just "that's my perception guy". But then I've seen that argument again and again over a ton of Luongo threads, and you guys are new it seems.
Because some people are capable of using common sense and others are not. Some people are able to step back and look at the big picture and use deductive reasoning to come to a logical conclusion.

No one is claiming to have inside information. No one is claiming to know exactly how this will play out. However one of the easiest things for sports fans to do i determine the market for a particular player. Its basically comes down to common sense everytime.

If you have a problem with me not backing IP my claim of a small market without a full report with sources too bad. You seem to be the only one that can't seem to grasp the market size that is on you.

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02-04-2013, 04:50 PM
  #583
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Because some people are capable of using common sense and others are not. Some people are able to step back and look at the big picture and use deductive reasoning to come to a logical conclusion.

No one is claiming to have inside information. No one is claiming to know exactly how this will play out. However one of the easiest things for sports fans to do i determine the market for a particular player. Its basically comes down to common sense everytime.

If you have a problem with me not backing IP my claim of a small market without a full report with sources too bad. You seem to be the only one that can't seem to grasp the market size that is on you.
Especially for goaltending. Even moreso for goaltenders on giant contracts. I mean, you could list all 30 teams and the incumbents that make them unlikely to move assets for Luongo, but the assumption is that anyone posting is familiar with rosters around the league.

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02-04-2013, 04:52 PM
  #584
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Because some people are capable of using common sense and others are not. Some people are able to step back and look at the big picture and use deductive reasoning to come to a logical conclusion.

No one is claiming to have inside information. No one is claiming to know exactly how this will play out. However one of the easiest things for sports fans to do i determine the market for a particular player. Its basically comes down to common sense everytime.

If you have a problem with me not backing IP my claim of a small market without a full report with sources too bad. You seem to be the only one that can't seem to grasp the market size that is on you.



Yup, it's on me. But you forget, had you bandied this about in this thread for a time, I'm damn near sure somebody else would have called you on it. It just so happened to be me, and here we are.


A lot of people claim to have common sense. Isn't always the case. So in your common sense opinion, which teams are possible for Luongo. Describe what a good market is, a medium level market, and a poor market, and how Luongo fits in. I'm intrigued to hear the rationale.

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02-04-2013, 04:53 PM
  #585
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I think if Lou gets traded that Nucks will have to take some salary back.

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02-04-2013, 05:15 PM
  #586
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Whitney is a healthy scratch!

This is it! I hope he can play center!

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02-04-2013, 05:15 PM
  #587
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Yup, it's on me. But you forget, had you bandied this about in this thread for a time, I'm damn near sure somebody else would have called you on it. It just so happened to be me, and here we are.


A lot of people claim to have common sense. Isn't always the case. So in your common sense opinion, which teams are possible for Luongo. Describe what a good market is, a medium level market, and a poor market, and how Luongo fits in. I'm intrigued to hear the rationale.
Ugh had a long post typed out and lost it. /facesmash

II lets try to make it simple.

Lets say Lu is a top ten goalie that eliminated about a third of the teams right off the top. No team with another top ten goalie is going to give up valubable assets for a marginal upgrade on net.

Then we have the young building teams. To me this would be Oilers etc most of the lottery teams and top ten draft teams from last year. Again you lose another third of the league or so.

This leaves a small portion of the league that is both close enough to contend and needs a goalie. this fits this? Chicago,maybe Washington, and then end a couple tweeners like Florida and Toronto. There isn't a big market out there, there is a reason why its the small handful of teams bring discussed ad nauseum. Its common sense and not hard to figure out.

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02-04-2013, 05:21 PM
  #588
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Ugh had a long post typed out and lost it. /facesmash

II lets try to make it simple.

Lets say Lu is a top ten goalie that eliminated about a third of the teams right off the top. No team with another top ten goalie is going to give up valubable assets for a marginal upgrade on net.

Then we have the young building teams. To me this would be Oilers etc most of the lottery teams and top ten draft teams from last year. Again you lose another third of the league or so.

This leaves a small portion of the league that is both close enough to contend and needs a goalie. this fits this? Chicago,maybe Washington, and then end a couple tweeners like Florida and Toronto. There isn't a big market out there, there is a reason why its the small handful of teams bring discussed ad nauseum. Its common sense and not hard to figure out.
You eliminated Edmonton when it's fairly common knowledge the are interested.

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02-04-2013, 05:25 PM
  #589
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
You eliminated Edmonton when it's fairly common knowledge the are interested.
Why would Gillis trade a top goaltender to a division rival?

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02-04-2013, 05:25 PM
  #590
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You eliminated Edmonton when it's fairly common knowledge the are interested.
According to who?

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02-04-2013, 05:26 PM
  #591
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Imagine if Luongo wins the vezina this year. Think about what that would do to his value.

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02-04-2013, 05:27 PM
  #592
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Quote:
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Why would Gillis trade a top goaltender to a division rival?
Who could resist a Paajarvi/Omark package?

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02-04-2013, 05:27 PM
  #593
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Quote:
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Imagine if Luongo wins the vezina this year. Think about what that would do to his value.
At that point would it not just make sense to keep him (if it doesn't already)?

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02-04-2013, 05:28 PM
  #594
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Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
Imagine if Luongo wins the vezina this year. Think about what that would do to his value.
Imagine if he posted 16 shutouts en route to a Stanley Cup and a Conn Smythe. Think of all the draft picks we'd get for him then!

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02-04-2013, 05:28 PM
  #595
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Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Ugh had a long post typed out and lost it. /facesmash

II lets try to make it simple.

Lets say Lu is a top ten goalie that eliminated about a third of the teams right off the top. No team with another top ten goalie is going to give up valubable assets for a marginal upgrade on net.

Then we have the young building teams. To me this would be Oilers etc most of the lottery teams and top ten draft teams from last year. Again you lose another third of the league or so.

This leaves a small portion of the league that is both close enough to contend and needs a goalie. this fits this? Chicago,maybe Washington, and then end a couple tweeners like Florida and Toronto. There isn't a big market out there, there is a reason why its the small handful of teams bring discussed ad nauseum. Its common sense and not hard to figure out.
This isn't the case though. Luongo is a top 3 goalie right now. By "right now", I mean this season so far, aswell as recent seasons (nominated for Vezina in 2011, means he's top 3). So the rest of your post isn't that persuasive.

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02-04-2013, 05:31 PM
  #596
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According to who?
Clearly you're new to the LU threads.

Tambellini was questioned and he didn't deny....not going to dig it up for you.

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02-04-2013, 05:31 PM
  #597
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Why would Gillis trade a top goaltender to a division rival?
Good point. Some GMs wont even trade within the conference to a rival which may make it impogor a Chicago deal. Also could eliminate the ducks whom I think would make sense if Hiller again faulters.

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02-04-2013, 05:34 PM
  #598
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Originally Posted by Co Ho View Post
This isn't the case though. Luongo is a top 3 goalie right now. By "right now", I mean this season so far, aswell as recent seasons (nominated for Vezina in 2011, means he's top 3). So the rest of your post isn't that persuasive.
Never said where in the top ten he slotted in. Point is if you have a top ten why would you give up assets for another top ten goalie?,

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02-04-2013, 05:35 PM
  #599
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Why would Gillis trade a top goaltender to a division rival?
In order to maximize his own return.

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02-04-2013, 05:38 PM
  #600
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Never said where in the top ten he slotted in. Point is if you have a top ten why would you give up assets for another top ten goalie?,
The top 10 changes on a yearly basis, Bryz was top 3 recently, same with Thomas, but things occur that change that (age, new system/team, injuries, personalities and locker room issues, etc.)
The point you're making doesn't take into account fluctuations and other factors for the goaltenders and where they rank in the league.

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