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Alain Vigneault Discussion - Part 3

View Poll Results: Do you want AV fired?
Yes, get rid of him now. 70 46.36%
Yes, but only if we get knocked out of the 1st/2nd round of the playoffs. 46 30.46%
No. 35 23.18%
Voters: 151. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
02-04-2013, 11:23 PM
  #51
arsmaster
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12 out of 18 possible points. Missing two top 6 forwards.

Can we call 'this' the end of the 'start' and call this a good start to the season under AV yet?

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02-04-2013, 11:24 PM
  #52
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That was one of the worst games I've seen the Canucks play. Preceded by the worst game they played this season. Both resulted in wins, but I'm really hoping this is rust because AV has not gotten this team going at all.


He did some things I liked this game with switching the lines, but the play all over is just abysmal.

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02-04-2013, 11:24 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
12 out of 18 possible points. Missing two top 6 forwards.

Can we call 'this' the end of the 'start' and call this a good start to the season under AV yet?

Statistically, yes you can. Best start under his tenure here. Play wise... ugly.

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02-04-2013, 11:25 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Statistically, yes you can. Best start under his tenure here. Play wise... ugly.
I know. The post was a bit of a jab directed at you LOL.

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Old
02-04-2013, 11:26 PM
  #55
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statistically, yes you can. Best start under his tenure here. Play wise... Ugly.
panic panic panic panic panic panic panic

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Old
02-04-2013, 11:38 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Lonny Bohonos View Post
On my phone now but this is essentially what i wanted to bring up. Never mind that a team may also fire its coach of its "under performing" and when it starts to play to the level it should play at, its under a new coach whether or not that coach had any significant impact on performance. Heck the act of changing in and of itself may have some impact. Regardless of the individual coaches abilities.

Any study ive been able to find has pretty much shown changing a coach rarely if ever affects a teams performance.
2009 Penguins? Their performance improved dramatically after the switch from Therrien to Bylsma. That's at least one team that took off after a coaching change.

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02-04-2013, 11:44 PM
  #57
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2009 Penguins? Their performance improved dramatically after the switch from Therrien to Bylsma. That's at least one team that took off after a coaching change.
There were also other factors like Sergei Gonchar being hurt and coming back, IIRC.

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02-04-2013, 11:46 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Meteor View Post
2009 Penguins? Their performance improved dramatically after the switch from Therrien to Bylsma. That's at least one team that took off after a coaching change.
LA kings last year.

How much of that is due to the new coach or the act of changing a coach vs a team playing to the level they should have or were capable of?

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02-05-2013, 02:51 AM
  #59
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So Vigneault throws his starter under the bus last year by starting Schnieder.

Now he's back to begging Luongo to save his bacon this year by making him the starter again.

And people defend french coach? Really?

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Old
02-05-2013, 02:58 AM
  #60
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Question for me is: do you try and bring in a guy who has shown to be elite at every other level and has risen through the ranks at a rapid pace? Someone like Jon Cooper who is in Tampa's system? Is that risk worth it? I don't know but if we don't make a dent in the playoffs this year, I think you have to ask that question and seriously consider the answer.

To me, AV was never an elite coach, at any level. IMO you should take that risk in the hopes that you might be picking up the next "generational" coach. By the time guys like that make the NHL, they very rarely become available again.

Cooper is also a BC-native, born in Prince George, so that's another plus... kind of... right?
If we have another lackluster exit this postseason I'm all for giving this guy a shot. Obviously right now there's no reason to panic though.

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02-05-2013, 03:19 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Question for me is: do you try and bring in a guy who has shown to be elite at every other level and has risen through the ranks at a rapid pace? Someone like Jon Cooper who is in Tampa's system? Is that risk worth it? I don't know but if we don't make a dent in the playoffs this year, I think you have to ask that question and seriously consider the answer.

To me, AV was never an elite coach, at any level. IMO you should take that risk in the hopes that you might be picking up the next "generational" coach. By the time guys like that make the NHL, they very rarely become available again.

Cooper is also a BC-native, born in Prince George, so that's another plus... kind of... right?
I remember his name was brought up on this board last year, but I wonder what kind of system he would coach, or has been coaching at least.

The more adaptable the better, of course. Has he been utilizing the 1-3-1 so far in the AHL, assuming Tampa and Norfolk employ the same system?

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02-05-2013, 04:07 AM
  #62
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That had to be one of the strangest time-outs i've ever seen tonight. AV says nothing, randomly stares at the ice with a bored look on his face, and then we score.
Apparently this was one time where not coaching was the best strategy.

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02-05-2013, 12:11 PM
  #63
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Major point of time-outs in hockey is rest. The players know what they have to do, besides 3 seconds into puck drop, everything has changed - in hockey, the best laid plans of mice and men always go awry.

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02-05-2013, 12:13 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by sticknrink View Post
So Vigneault throws his starter under the bus last year by starting Schnieder.

Now he's back to begging Luongo to save his bacon this year by making him the starter again.

And people defend french coach? Really?
Uhh. What?

Maybe your narrative simply doesn't match the facts here..

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Old
02-05-2013, 12:15 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by sticknrink View Post
So Vigneault throws his starter under the bus last year by starting Schnieder.

Now he's back to begging Luongo to save his bacon this year by making him the starter again.

And people defend french coach? Really?

Mmmmm. Bacon.

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Old
02-05-2013, 05:33 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanuck View Post
I remember his name was brought up on this board last year, but I wonder what kind of system he would coach, or has been coaching at least.

The more adaptable the better, of course. Has he been utilizing the 1-3-1 so far in the AHL, assuming Tampa and Norfolk employ the same system?
I was under the impression he was more offensive type coach. Tampa fans think he gets maximum value out of his guys, a lot of average guys overperform for him.

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02-05-2013, 05:35 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sticknrink View Post
So Vigneault throws his starter under the bus last year by starting Schnieder.

Now he's back to begging Luongo to save his bacon this year by making him the starter again.

And people defend french coach? Really?
the alternative would be agreeing about something with you. i'll take FC (french coach) any day of the week

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Old
02-05-2013, 05:52 PM
  #68
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I was under the impression he was more offensive type coach. Tampa fans think he gets maximum value out of his guys, a lot of average guys overperform for him.
I would have thought that too when looking at Guy Boucher's teams. The 1-3-1 is supposed to be very defensive after all, no? Yet in other places I have heard his system being described as 'high-risk, high-reward'. Strange.

But then if he's really as good as he seems, he should have no problem adapting either way.

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Old
02-05-2013, 06:24 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by sticknrink View Post
So Vigneault throws his starter under the bus last year by starting Schnieder.

Now he's back to begging Luongo to save his bacon this year by making him the starter again.

And people defend french coach? Really?
This is just about the worst post i've seen today...congrats.

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Old
02-05-2013, 09:21 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
To me, AV was never an elite coach, at any level.
What do you have to do to be an elite coach?

2011 was one of the best coaching jobs you'll ever see. That team was not a juggernaut but they played like it in the regular season and then played well until game 7 of the Stanley Cup final. The talent level of our team is not as high as people think... AV has a lot to do with that.


Last edited by Scurr: 02-05-2013 at 11:44 PM.
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02-05-2013, 09:35 PM
  #71
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This is just about the worst post i've seen today...congrats.
Yeah - and everything is better with bacon.

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Old
02-05-2013, 11:22 PM
  #72
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I'm a little concerned by, I think it was Dan Sedin's comments after the oilers win. Talking about how it's a road game and sometimes they aren't really giving it as much as they should- something kinda like that. Seriously, what the hell? AV needs to fire this team up if they're saying stuff like that publically.

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Old
02-05-2013, 11:46 PM
  #73
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I'm a little concerned by, I think it was Dan Sedin's comments after the oilers win. Talking about how it's a road game and sometimes they aren't really giving it as much as they should- something kinda like that. Seriously, what the hell? AV needs to fire this team up if they're saying stuff like that publically.
I don't think its possible to "give it all" or "100%" in an normal NHL season, This one is even more congested.All though he probably shouldn't say it. In every sport teams pick games they want to win. Having a Great home record and say .500 on the road is usually the plan. You could see the difference between the Chicago game and the Oil game. Chicago they had a clear game plan that was executed very well. They controlled the pace of the game and made sure they weren't out skilled. Against the Oil they seemed to let the kids play the game they wanted to, we seem to be content trying to play there game. I don't think they think there a threat. if it cam close to losing the division to them I think well turn up, play a checking game like when we out hit teams 45 to 10, at the moment there,s no point.

Edit. Also why i think Burr was with the twins in that game, they were happy to play a looser speed game.

Also I don't think its the coaches job to motivate "fire up"players. these guys are well paid pros, and were probably told to do exactly what they did.


Last edited by Stories Tales Lies: 02-05-2013 at 11:51 PM.
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Old
02-06-2013, 12:20 AM
  #74
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Edit. Also why i think Burr was with the twins in that game, they were happy to play a looser speed game.
This was a mid-game adjustment so I'm not convinced that they were content with letting the Oilers play their game.

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02-06-2013, 12:29 AM
  #75
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This was a mid-game adjustment so I'm not convinced that they were content with letting the Oilers play their game.
I don't see why mid game would change things. Could have been the plan the whole time or they wanted to see how Kass would do in a run and gun type situation, and decided to change players instead of a whole game plan. Just my opinion, between the last two games they played a completely different game. They would never let the blackhawks play like they let the Oil play.

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