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07-02-2006, 05:37 PM
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interesting bit of info I just found

Waddel told the Atlanta Journal that his team was 1 of 5 teams that exceeded the cap last year and as a result they, Atlanta, will have $1M in salary applied to their cap number this coming season. I don't know who the other 4 teams are and what their cap penalty number will be.

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07-02-2006, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER View Post
Waddel told the Atlanta Journal that his team was 1 of 5 teams that exceeded the cap last year and as a result they, Atlanta, will have $1M in salary applied to their cap number this coming season. I don't know who the other 4 teams are and what their cap penalty number will be.
is that all the punishment is?? i'm assuming it would increase with repeat offenders but if that is all that is an absolute joke...

nj right now sits at $39 mil and still needs to sing 7 players including gionta, gomez, martin, hale and white. they could easily be $10 mil over the cap after signing those guys especially if any of them opt for arbitration (ie gionta & gomez)...but the assumption being made is that lou would have to get below $44 mil before the season starts.

if the 'punishment' for not getting below the cap is a $1 mil cap hit next year than what is stopping him from going into the season with a $50 mil payroll so he can keep everyone?? he is taking a $7 mil cap hit this year thanks to malakhov and mogilny so a $1 mil cap hit is nothing

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07-02-2006, 05:57 PM
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ya that is nothing, but if its for each 2 million over its a 1 million buck hit the next year, that would have somemore teeth to it, or even a straight up 1 million buck hit for each million over. Anything less then that, there would be no point in having a salary cap

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07-02-2006, 05:59 PM
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The article wasn't clear as to whether

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR469 View Post
is that all the punishment is?? i'm assuming it would increase with repeat offenders but if that is all that is an absolute joke...

nj right now sits at $39 mil and still needs to sing 7 players including gionta, gomez, martin, hale and white. they could easily be $10 mil over the cap after signing those guys especially if any of them opt for arbitration (ie gionta & gomez)...but the assumption being made is that lou would have to get below $44 mil before the season starts.

if the 'punishment' for not getting below the cap is a $1 mil cap hit next year than what is stopping him from going into the season with a $50 mil payroll so he can keep everyone?? he is taking a $7 mil cap hit this year thanks to malakhov and mogilny so a $1 mil cap hit is nothing
the amount, $1M, was the amount they were over, thus that is what is applied to the following year, or if they were $500T over the penalty was double. I think we all thought that it had to be remedied immediately. It did say that NJ was over, but that was due in some part by Elias injury. It was clear though that atlanta was going to have $1M tacked on to their total salaries, effectively lowering their spendable cap by the same $1M.

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07-02-2006, 06:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER View Post
the amount, $1M, was the amount they were over, thus that is what is applied to the following year, or if they were $500T over the penalty was double. I think we all thought that it had to be remedied immediately. It did say that NJ was over, but that was due in some part by Elias injury. It was clear though that atlanta was going to have $1M tacked on to their total salaries, effectively lowering their spendable cap by the same $1M.
Ha the Devils cap # might be lower then that 37 million starting point after the contracts of malakov and moginly...and could be worse next year as well if they go over again, which is going to happen one way or the other it seems with the players they have left to sign...Lou has done some miracles though so I wont count him out until the season starts...

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07-02-2006, 06:11 PM
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I'd like Gomez on the Rangers if he doesn't sign or if he does opt for arbutration, maybe in the future, but then again Elais re-signed so he'll probably stay.

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07-02-2006, 06:15 PM
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The Devils # won't be lower this year b/c they went over the cap legally when Elias was on the IR. The author of that article even identifies the Devils was one of the three teams who went over b/c a player as on the IR.

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07-02-2006, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER View Post
the amount, $1M, was the amount they were over, thus that is what is applied to the following year, or if they were $500T over the penalty was double. I think we all thought that it had to be remedied immediately. It did say that NJ was over, but that was due in some part by Elias injury. It was clear though that atlanta was going to have $1M tacked on to their total salaries, effectively lowering their spendable cap by the same $1M.

Here's the article.


New Jersey is mentioned, but will not be penalized because it was an injury overrage. Atlanta and another team not mentioned get penalized because of bonuses.

NHL INSIDER

Thrashers among teams over salary cap
Five teams spent more than $39 million last season

By JOHN MANASSO
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Published on: 06/30/06

Five teams including the Thrashers went over the NHL's inaugural salary cap limit of $39 million in 2005-06.

NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly did not identified the teams during a briefing last Saturday at the NHL draft but the Thrashers were one of two teams to spend over the limit.

In their case, it was because of the $1.75 million performance bonus paid to winger Peter Bondra at season's end that will count against the Thrashers' cap in the neighborhood of about $1 million towards next season's limit, which was formally announced on Tuesday as being $44 million with a $28-million bottom limit.

Three other teams went over because of an injury exception that is allowed for teams with players on the long-term injured reserve list (Patrik Elias' injury put New Jersey over).

Thrashers general manager Don Waddell has said repeatedly this offseason that he would not be nearly as close to the cap for 2006-07 as he was for the previous year.

He also said the Atlanta Spirit ownership group's legal issues with partner Steve Belkin have not affected how he has had to do his job.

"No issues from my end," he said.

And as for recent ownership meetings to set his budget, he said, "We're still working on it."

One area in which the team's bottom line could get a nice lift is from the NHL's revenue sharing plan, a result of the new CBA for which the owners fought so hard that they canceled the 2004-05 season. Twelve teams will receive re-distribution of revenue.

Daly revealed that the team with the lowest revenue - speculated by many to be Nashville - will receive $12.5 million this season.

"We're assuming we're one of the 12," Waddell said. "We haven't been notified yet because they haven't finished those numbers yet. We were just in the [NHL board of governors meeting on Wednesday] and they said they hoped by the middle of the July they'll have it to each team. We'll be toward the bottom of that one. The bottom eight to 12 range there."

Waddell said he thought such a large cash infusion would be a "one-year" situation because the league's revenues were so much larger than expected.

(The revenue increases were so large, Daly said, that the players will receive bonus checks in the fall. The players receive 54 percent of revenues under the CBA and as Daly put it, "It's not just a limit, it's a guarantee. As it turned out, we underestimated" the revenues.)

Said Waddell of the Thrashers' anticipated portion of the revenue sharing: "Any time you can get money like that, that you can get to the bottom line, anything helps."


No more bonus deals


Having gone through one season with a player Bondra having bonuses on his contract, Waddell said it's not something he is eager to do again; namely with Scott Mellanby. Under the new CBA, the only players eligible for bonuses are players on entry-level contracts, players who are 35 and older (like Mellanby) and players who have played 400 games or more and have missed 100 days because of injury the previous season (but only if they sign a one-year contract).

The problem with offering bonuses is that they all count against a team's salary cap until it is impossible for the player to fulfill them. Thus, Bondra's $2.9 million in possible bonuses all of which involved the team's ability to make the playoffs all counted against the cap until the final day of the season when the team was eliminated from the playoffs.

Thus, even though $1.15 million of those bonuses went unpaid, they affected Waddell's ability to make a move at times during the season.

"It's something we prefer to stay away from now that we've been through it," Waddell said.

The new CBA also eliminates option years on contracts.


Quotable


"As an organization, we're pretty happy to see him out of the division. No disrespect to Todd Bertuzzi, but he only plays 20 minutes per game and [Roberto] Luongo plays 60 minutes."

- Thrashers coach Bob Hartley on Florida's trade of goalie Roberto Luongo and Lukas Krajicek to Vancouver in exchange for Todd Bertuzzi, Brian Allen and Alex on Friday.

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07-02-2006, 06:24 PM
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Again, I say it was not wholly clear

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nittel16 View Post
The Devils # won't be lower this year b/c they went over the cap legally when Elias was on the IR. The author of that article even identifies the Devils was one of the three teams who went over b/c a player as on the IR.
I wouldn't read it one way or the other. Yes NJ was over due to Elias' health, but the article was not clear that they weren't over as well for other infractions. I'm asking for clarification.

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07-02-2006, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER View Post
I wouldn't read it one way or the other. Yes NJ was over due to Elias' health, but the article was not clear that they weren't over as well for other infractions. I'm asking for clarification.
Bill Daly didnt mentioned the other team. Could be New York for we know...

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07-02-2006, 06:54 PM
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Appreciate the reprint.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Machoking2003-04 View Post
Here's the article.


New Jersey is mentioned, but will not be penalized because it was an injury overrage. Atlanta and another team not mentioned get penalized because of bonuses.

NHL INSIDER

Thrashers among teams over salary cap
Five teams spent more than $39 million last season

By JOHN MANASSO
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Published on: 06/30/06

Five teams including the Thrashers went over the NHL's inaugural salary cap limit of $39 million in 2005-06.

NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly did not identified the teams during a briefing last Saturday at the NHL draft but the Thrashers were one of two teams to spend over the limit.

In their case, it was because of the $1.75 million performance bonus paid to winger Peter Bondra at season's end that will count against the Thrashers' cap in the neighborhood of about $1 million towards next season's limit, which was formally announced on Tuesday as being $44 million with a $28-million bottom limit.

Three other teams went over because of an injury exception that is allowed for teams with players on the long-term injured reserve list (Patrik Elias' injury put New Jersey over).

Thrashers general manager Don Waddell has said repeatedly this offseason that he would not be nearly as close to the cap for 2006-07 as he was for the previous year.

He also said the Atlanta Spirit ownership group's legal issues with partner Steve Belkin have not affected how he has had to do his job.

"No issues from my end," he said.

And as for recent ownership meetings to set his budget, he said, "We're still working on it."

One area in which the team's bottom line could get a nice lift is from the NHL's revenue sharing plan, a result of the new CBA for which the owners fought so hard that they canceled the 2004-05 season. Twelve teams will receive re-distribution of revenue.

Daly revealed that the team with the lowest revenue - speculated by many to be Nashville - will receive $12.5 million this season.

"We're assuming we're one of the 12," Waddell said. "We haven't been notified yet because they haven't finished those numbers yet. We were just in the [NHL board of governors meeting on Wednesday] and they said they hoped by the middle of the July they'll have it to each team. We'll be toward the bottom of that one. The bottom eight to 12 range there."

Waddell said he thought such a large cash infusion would be a "one-year" situation because the league's revenues were so much larger than expected.

(The revenue increases were so large, Daly said, that the players will receive bonus checks in the fall. The players receive 54 percent of revenues under the CBA and as Daly put it, "It's not just a limit, it's a guarantee. As it turned out, we underestimated" the revenues.)

Said Waddell of the Thrashers' anticipated portion of the revenue sharing: "Any time you can get money like that, that you can get to the bottom line, anything helps."


No more bonus deals


Having gone through one season with a player Bondra having bonuses on his contract, Waddell said it's not something he is eager to do again; namely with Scott Mellanby. Under the new CBA, the only players eligible for bonuses are players on entry-level contracts, players who are 35 and older (like Mellanby) and players who have played 400 games or more and have missed 100 days because of injury the previous season (but only if they sign a one-year contract).

The problem with offering bonuses is that they all count against a team's salary cap until it is impossible for the player to fulfill them. Thus, Bondra's $2.9 million in possible bonuses all of which involved the team's ability to make the playoffs all counted against the cap until the final day of the season when the team was eliminated from the playoffs.

Thus, even though $1.15 million of those bonuses went unpaid, they affected Waddell's ability to make a move at times during the season.

"It's something we prefer to stay away from now that we've been through it," Waddell said.

The new CBA also eliminates option years on contracts.


Quotable


"As an organization, we're pretty happy to see him out of the division. No disrespect to Todd Bertuzzi, but he only plays 20 minutes per game and [Roberto] Luongo plays 60 minutes."

- Thrashers coach Bob Hartley on Florida's trade of goalie Roberto Luongo and Lukas Krajicek to Vancouver in exchange for Todd Bertuzzi, Brian Allen and Alex on Friday.
Again, while NJ is mentioned as for having gone over because of Elias' injury, the article, nor Waddel says whether NJ went over for some other issue, such as the M&M&M situation. It does not name the other 4 teams. So for anyone to say NJ or anyone else is not one of the 4 other teams is inaacurate. I'm not saying they are, but we all know there were issues and Daly has the final say, not Lou. remeber NJ made a bunch of player moves at the deadline. You have to have room. I am surprised though that say NJ was over and had no room for example, that the NHL would have allowed the transactions to happen. The fact that they did would lend support that they had room. But then you consider what happened to Atlanta and it makes you wonder. Did not that situation exist? Why did not the NHL require Atlanta to immediately resolve the issue. That is the gray area, no?

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07-02-2006, 06:56 PM
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Doubtful

Quote:
Originally Posted by Machoking2003-04 View Post
Bill Daly didnt mentioned the other team. Could be New York for we know...
we were nowhere near the cap all year long. We were several million under. The problem I assume has to deal with teams at or need the cap that had younger, or older players, that had bonus clauses. Granted Prucha and Lundqvist might have had such clauses, I don't know, but I doubt they were for several million apiece if they did.

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07-02-2006, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Machoking2003-04 View Post
Bill Daly didnt mentioned the other team. Could be New York for we know...
we know it wasn't the rangers cause the rangers weren't even close to the cap...at the trade deadline we had $5 mil in cap space left and didn't use it.

the teams in question are the teams that were just barely under the cap and then maybe had some kind of bonus bump them over the top

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07-02-2006, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER View Post
I wouldn't read it one way or the other. Yes NJ was over due to Elias' health, but the article was not clear that they weren't over as well for other infractions. I'm asking for clarification.
It's really not too likely to be NJ. In addition to Elias' number lowering due to him being on IR half the year, Malakhov, Mogilny, and McGillis' contracts were call cut in half (at least) b/c they were either suspended or put on the farm team. Matvichuk also had a stint on the IR.

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07-02-2006, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER View Post
Again, while NJ is mentioned as for having gone over because of Elias' injury, the article, nor Waddel says whether NJ went over for some other issue, such as the M&M&M situation. It does not name the other 4 teams. So for anyone to say NJ or anyone else is not one of the 4 other teams is inaacurate. I'm not saying they are, but we all know there were issues and Daly has the final say, not Lou. remeber NJ made a bunch of player moves at the deadline. You have to have room. I am surprised though that say NJ was over and had no room for example, that the NHL would have allowed the transactions to happen. The fact that they did would lend support that they had room. But then you consider what happened to Atlanta and it makes you wonder. Did not that situation exist? Why did not the NHL require Atlanta to immediately resolve the issue. That is the gray area, no?
It's only TWO teams! One being Atlanta, the other being unknown as of now. The three other teams went over legally. If NJ or PHI went over w/ other infractions, they would listed in the same boat as Atlanta.

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07-02-2006, 08:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nittel16 View Post
1It's only TWO teams! One being Atlanta, the other being unknown as of now. The three other teams went over legally. 2If NJ or PHI went over w/ other infractions, they would listed in the same boat as Atlanta.
Your first point is correct. It's right there in the article: "the Thrashers were one of two teams to spend over the limit."

Your second point is not however. The Devils or Flyers would not be listed as being in the same boat as Atlanta because "NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly did not identified [sic] the teams during a briefing last Saturday at the NHL draft."

The reporter could not report who else was inthe boat with Atlanta because Daly did not reveal it. It could be NJ, Philly, or any of the other teams that were really riding close to the cap. Using Atlanta as a template, we might look for teams that gave contracts with performance bonuses.

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07-02-2006, 09:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
Your first point is correct. It's right there in the article: "the Thrashers were one of two teams to spend over the limit."

Your second point is not however. The Devils or Flyers would not be listed as being in the same boat as Atlanta because "NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly did not identified [sic] the teams during a briefing last Saturday at the NHL draft."

The reporter could not report who else was inthe boat with Atlanta because Daly did not reveal it. It could be NJ, Philly, or any of the other teams that were really riding close to the cap. Using Atlanta as a template, we might look for teams that gave contracts with performance bonuses.
My guess for the second team would be Toronto - didn't they have a few incentive laden contracts w/ Allison & Lindros?

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07-03-2006, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
Your first point is correct. It's right there in the article: "the Thrashers were one of two teams to spend over the limit."

Your second point is not however. The Devils or Flyers would not be listed as being in the same boat as Atlanta because "NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly did not identified [sic] the teams during a briefing last Saturday at the NHL draft."

The reporter could not report who else was inthe boat with Atlanta because Daly did not reveal it. It could be NJ, Philly, or any of the other teams that were really riding close to the cap. Using Atlanta as a template, we might look for teams that gave contracts with performance bonuses.
Just saw an addition post that said that Spector is saying that NJ may be one of the teams. I asked someone else who is suppose to know someone in the NHL and they didn't think NJ was one of the penalized teams. That would really sux. With White's signing, which I thought was very good, they are at $41,679M according to the NHLPA site. If they got smacked for going over there is noway they can sign Gomez, Gionta, Hale & Martin. Now might be a good time to put in an offer sheet on either Gionta or Gomez.

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07-03-2006, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
Your first point is correct. It's right there in the article: "the Thrashers were one of two teams to spend over the limit."

Your second point is not however. The Devils or Flyers would not be listed as being in the same boat as Atlanta because "NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly did not identified [sic] the teams during a briefing last Saturday at the NHL draft."

The reporter could not report who else was inthe boat with Atlanta because Daly did not reveal it. It could be NJ, Philly, or any of the other teams that were really riding close to the cap. Using Atlanta as a template, we might look for teams that gave contracts with performance bonuses.
The author, though, mentions the Devils as one of the other three teams. I would assume Philly was too, b/c of the sheer amt. of injuries they had, and the mid-season acquisition of Nedved, and the addition of guys like Gauthier.

And ATLANTARANGER, the nhlpa has the wrong cap hit listed for Elias and Madden. Elias' cap hit is $6M, even though he is making $7.5M. Madden is really at $2.93M.

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